The Miley Cyrus VMA fallout may have died down substantially over the past week, but it’s not over yet by a long shot. Miley’s recharging herself and will be back with new “shocking” antics to promote a tour. In the meantime, this brand of controversy is nothing new. I really think The Oatmeal comic summed it up best about pop-star refurbishment. You know, the whole “I am wrought with emotion! Oh hey look at my butt cheeks” act. The music industry may have nearly gasped its last breath a few years ago, but acts like Miley infuse new life into the machine. Miley thinks this is all about her, but it’s really not. The next big pop star will have to go even further than Miley’s antics, which is a depressing thought.
Like most celebrities, Rashida Jones has some thoughts on Miley. Rashida isn’t one to mince words — remember when she told John Travolta to come out? She later apologized. Now Rashida has gone on a little Twitter rant about Miley. Rashida never mentions Miley by name, but we all know who she’s talking about here. These tweets are in reverse chronological order:
Rashida has a definite point. The race to get one’s kit off and nakedly straddle a wrecking ball has grown into a ridiculous monster. I do love that women can make just as much money singing pop tunes as the men can. The question remains — why do the girls have to take their clothes off to do it when the dudes stay fully dressed? Furthermore, why does Katy Perry look like the smart one for making millions while keeping her clothes on? Besides Adele, Katy is the only recent pop star with (some) lasting power who hasn’t disrobed fully to sell her music.
With that said, Rashida’s manner of phrasing makes me uncomfortable. Don’t get me wrong — I understand what Rashida’s getting at, but it does bother me that she’s using “wh-re” as a descriptor. I think the mere use of that word does open the discussion to one of “slut shaming,” and avoiding that accusation is important. Because once someone yells “slut shaming,” all bets of civilized discussion are out the door.
Photos courtesy of WENN
You can be a man or woman and still act like a wh*re. Wh*res come in all shapes sizes colors creeds and genders.
Yup. Either way, whores of every gender and color are messing the world up! Is it still slut-shaming if you’re talking about men and women? That term is so stupid, it removes any kind of personal responsibility ppl should have for themselves and each other, all to protect slutty (read: dangerous) antics. Since when did constructive, protective criticism become shaming? Words mean nothing anymore.
Thank you!! I’ve been scratching my head all along going, “slut shaming??” Is it really politically incorrect now as well to call out a slut?
It’s become a buzz phrase for shutting down discussions, that’s for sure. It’s unfortunate, because the word does have merit and purpose but like the term bullying – it’s getting ridiculously overused and misapplied.
Hold on a minute. Do you remember why the term “slut shaming” came up in the first place? There is a good reason for it to exist. And to the other poster who replied here, it is not calling people “sluts”–the expression is conveying the point of view of others who think its ok to guilt trip people for acting in a way perceived as slutty. It isn’t showing support of use of the word “slut.”
Maybe it is getting overused. I dont have a strong opinion about it one way or another, and i don’t know if i really care for the term myself. But just like words such as “racism,” it exists for a reason. Don’t throw the baby out with the bath water.
If anyone wants to make the world a better place by teaching others, it does much better to change the only person you can indefinitely change, ourselves. Young people will not hide who they are anymore, it’s been this way since decades before I was born, to live up to judgement of outdated standards and morals. If yanyone wants to help the world or others, they need to be the example of what the world needs, to trust, help and understand each other, not judge and criticize.
I’m gonna be called out here but oh well. I totally agree that girls/women should not be “slut shamed” for actions that are “perceived slutty.” But where is the line between perceived and actually down in the dirt slutty? Where as a society can we say, “Damn, girl, you have crossed the line and no human being in his or her right mind can EVER respect you if you don’t get it together”??? You hear the story of a young high school girl who got wrapped up with the wrong boy & said boy told the school about something personal. Suddenly, because the girl maybe showed him her breasts or let him “go all the way” or whatever, she is destroyed by the other girls in the school. Maybe the mothers of the other kids jump on the bandwagon. Maybe – as we HAVE seen – that poor kid freaking cannot stand the real “slut shaming” and (I have shed so many tears over these stories) she hangs herself in her closet or something equally horrible. We need to reach out to the horrors of bullying and slut shaming that destroys women. It can happen to young women and older women alike, of course. But there is a difference in my mind between “perceived” whore/slut type behavior (which is generally just being a woman enjoying what we pretty much all enjoy and getting called out by those who are jealous or are puritanical of mind) and going so far off the ends of what the general public can stomach that a majority of society is rather nauseated. Sexy is just that…sexy. And sexy is cool and a wonderful thing. Shakira is sexy as flock (I cleaned that up). Just acting a fool, naked or acting like a two dollar hooker on national television isn’t sexy. It’s, for lack of a better term, icky. Sure, Miley has a 100% right to be as icky as she wants to be wherever she wants to be. But don’t expect society to smile and nod when it is so far off the edge of reason for just about everybody in America. Right or wrong it is the world we live in and Miley IS an influence on young girls. If it is “slut shaming” to say she went too far, then so be it. In my humble opinion, that is.
+1000
+100
It is about word-policing, speech-censoring, and like @claire said — shutting down discussion. It needs to be rejected. I’d rather sit and be tolerant of someone’s ideas no matter how ANGRY they make make me but to truly be listening to them and then disagree or correct on principle rather than shutting someone down because their views make me uncomfortable. What’s the measure of true liberalism, tolerance, and peaceful co-existence? Listening and exchanging ideas even when you passionately disagree … or being a controlling speech-policer?
It’s just rationalization. If someone cares about Miley or the effects she has one the world, wouldn’t it be better for them to tell Miley a better way instead of putting her down, or to not contribute to her success and publicity, instead of making her a thing by talking and thinking about her? Society makes Miley an issue by throwing money in her pockets, to learn, read and hear more about her, and then worries about the example it sets for youth? Well, unless taught otherwise, many youth will think what Miley is doing works, because its not those that love Miley that are making her a legend.
Agreed. I’m sick of the “shaming” culture that’s erupted lately. If you criticize ANYTHING these days, you’re “x-shaming”. Good lord.
+1.
I’m glad she is sending out this message. The tide really needs to turn in a different direction already. Nothing is about talent, creativity or true entertainment anymore. It’s about shock value, pushing the boundaries, seeing how much can be gotten away with, and how complacent society is to just keep accepting it. When it started years ago, those of us who may find something offensive were snapped back at with the response “If you don’t like it, change the channel”. Well, it’s gotten to the point where you can’t change the channel as a remedy because this crap is everywhere. So we’re just force fed this nonsense as entertainment.
I have nothing against being sexy, but you don’t need to give the world a gynecological view of your lady parts to be sexy. Less is more, and can be so much more enticing.
It has always been that way, if you lack the talent you can always take your clothes off.
Good thing Miley wont last long, because she can’t take the shock factor much further (Rhianna’s career is pretty dead now after all her shock PR tactics)
Miley should take some advice from her godmother, multi instrumentalist, prolific songwriter Dolly Parton. Dolly backs her her huge rack with actual talent, Miley is just a submissive cheap idiot with no prospect on longevity!
Just as applying a homophobic slur to a heterosexual person does not change its homophobic origins, and applying a racial slur used against a person of color to a white person does not change its racist origins, calling a man a slut or a whore does not erase the bloody and misogynistic history of the word. Bigotry is bigotry is bigotry.
Slut-shaming is a tool used to police, control, and punish females’ sexuality, physical appearance choices, and even dance moves. Nudity is not dangerous or hurting the world, as one poster claimed. Slut-shaming, however, is inherently prudish (it’s about forcing more conservative ideas about women, sex, and the body) and is far more dangerous, damaging, and deadly than pop stars posing nude and twerking ever could be.
Beautiful stated!
Thank you! Very well put. I wanted to say something regarding the slut shaming comments just being used to shut down discussion but couldn’t find the words.
Well said Leila. In my ideal world people would finally understand that there isn’t even any such thing as a slut. Sleep with whoever you want as long as nobody is hurt by it, who am I to give a sh*t?! Everyone should just tend to their own damn house first and look away if they don’t like what they see out the window.
But people can be hurt by it (diseases, affairs, etc). What I dislike is that opposition to “slut shaming” term is used to completely absolve people of any consequences related to their sexuality. Plus, I think it contributes to the notion that women’s primary value is in their sexuality and particularly in acting sexual in ways that are pleasing to men. It is ostensibly pro-woman but in an extremely backwards way that is for the benefit of men only.
@ Lauren that’s what I said,as long as nobody is hurt. And if nobody is hurt then what consequences are you expecting there to be? Everyone has fun?
While that is technically true, women are the ones who shamed by be called “whores”. Typically when I hear of a man being called a whore, it is not said in the same disapproving tone. I’ve heard it directed at a man as a compliment.
I refer to my ex boyfriend as a whore, and I do NOT mean it as a compliment.
Eh, they are making money while taking their clothes off. They are getting paid to take their clothes off.
Sounds like whoring to me.
Jones is dead on with what she’s saying.
Oh hello, author of this article, what would YOU say? what, is the word “wh0re politically incorrect? In what other career are people required to take off their clothes and/or sell their bodies in a sexual manner? I could see calling a model a wh0re wouldn’t be correct bc they’re not necessarily selling sex, they’re usually selling clothes in a sensual manner sometimes. What exactly is wrong with someone who talks, dresses, and acts like a persons who is overtly SELLING SEX, a wh0re? A wh0re is someone who “engages in sexual acts for money”… ummmmm, pretty sure taking off all your clothes and being provocative and OBVIOUSLY being sexual is a “sex act”. What’s the differnce between that and porn? Penetration? Please. Call it what it is. All this BS about “slut shaming” is ridiculous. If you are going to act in a certain way, people are going to judge you for it. PERIOD. It’s not “slut shaming” or using the wrong words, THOSE ARE THE WORDS THAT DESCRIBE THE BEHAVIOUR. If you don’t like it, stop acting like that.
What is it with this website where everyone wants to tiptoe around the issues at hand? Sure, women can dress and act in a provocative, overtly sexual and suggestive way, and everyone else is well within their rights to describe them as they are projecting themselves. Get over it, that is reality. Same as someone on the People of Wal Mart website get called slobs, for example. At least, “they are dressing like a slob”, or someone who is acting in a way that could be called “mean” or “loud” or “shy” gets called those adjectives. For god’s sake, let’s get a little perspective here.
+1 This whole “slut-shaming” thing is ridiculous. I agree that women should not be shamed for dressing a certain way or for being sexually active. But, when you decide to test the bounds of decency (or at least the society in which you live) by parading around naked and gyrating on someone in a public forum, then maybe you have that “right”, but we also have the right to be disgusted by it and call you out for it. The word slut is NOT the same as the n word or the f word. To equate them is ridiculous. One cannot help being black (the root of being called an n word); and one cannot stop being gay (the f word). One CAN stop acting whorish and indecent.
Co-sign with you and MSM with every word you two wrote.
Centuries of sexual repression and violence are behind homophobia. Centuries of sexual repression and violence are also behind slut-shaming.
To say yes to homophobia is to say yes to sexism, discrimination, sexual harassment, hate crimes, and suicides that are/were a result of homophobia.
To say yes to slut-shaming is to say yes to misogyny, sexual repression, rape culture, domestic violence, bullying, female genital mutilation, and suicides that are a result of slut-shaming.
It’s true that nobody can choose their sexual orientation or gender. But a person can choose how they dress, how they identify, and who they have sex with. And we all have the right to make those choices. A person who calls women sluts and whores for their sexuality, appearance, and dance is really no better than a person who uses homophobic slurs against someone for being open about their orientation, for choosing to dress as the opposite sex, and for openly kissing and hooking up with someone of the same sex.
+1
Couldn’t agree more.
And you can be a man or a woman and still have nasty, backwards attitudes to sex workers that show up in the language that you use to describe sexually active people, apparently.
Score one for feminism?
Since the tweets are recent, it seems more likely that the response was to Lady Gaga’s ass-single w R Kelly. That was pretty lude, IMO.
*lewd*
Nicki Minag breast pics
Lady Gaga, Miley, Rihanna, Miley Cyrus..
I almost think they don’t have confidence in their talent. Beyoncé in her new S&M bondage attire calendar.
Adele sells 10 million albums in the US. Granted, she’s not thin and considered a sex siren. But, it’s shows talent sells over Sex. I always thought Sade was beautiful/sexy and I don’t recall ever seeing her half naked.
I see Taylor or Alicia Keys as a better example than Katy Perry (ugh).
Frankly, I don’t think any of those ladies (except maybe Beyonce) will stand the test of time. Once gravity gets a hold of their bits, no one will be interested anymore.
@MSM
I meant to add Nicki Minaj in the group.
I agree with you about Beyoncé but, I do think Gaga is the most talented.
The girl can sing Pop, R&B, Jazz and play the piano.
sounds like good advice to me.
+1
I’m glad the messenger is a beautiful, classy, talented young celebrity sending the message so people can’t say “it’s just fat, jealous people” who wants these young girls to stop acting like “wh0res” because yes, actually, that’s what they look like. Sorry. If that’s slut shaming, then guilty as charged. I don’t want my daughter acting like that when she is 20. I hope she is a junior in college hitting the books.
A woman can be a junior in college hitting the books (and stomping all over your daughter’s GPA) while still getting naked if she wants to.
Sure. But is she getting naked in the privacy of her room with whomever she wants or for the whole world to ogle so she feels some worth?
I hope my daughter has a healthy sex life as AN ADULT but Miley’s audience is adolescent girls and she knows it and they want to emulate this behavior. Kids are growing up too fast. As a parent of a 7 year old girl I keep her away from this trash and tell her I want her to be a nice young lady. But a lot of parents aren’t as “hands on” and their kids get the wrong message about what it is to be a grown woman. Is this what we want for the next generation of young woman? I think not!
I have two toddler daughters and I’m always torn on the issue. I want them to love their bodies, to own their sexuality and to love having healthy, happy sex (when they are adults, of course!). But at the same time, I loathe the message that Miley, et al. are sending. The one that says “Men can be singers/actors/etc. So can women but we have to do it naked and make sure as many people as possible think of us a f*ck-toys while we’re at it.” I don’t know where the line between “slut-shaming” and “You’re more than just T&A” is.
How would you know if she’s doing it for “self-worth” or just because she thinks she’s hot?
You can’t judge someone on their motivations if you have no idea what their motivations are.
Because if she thought she was worth more, she wouldn’t resort to these antics for attention. Miley herself said that if you’re good, you don’t have to resort to stripping. Well, she got naked.
@Marina: I totally agree. “It’s my body; I can do what I want to…” says it all. She’s just attempting in a really immature and pathetic way to prove that silly point. Of course it’s your body and you can treat it how you like, but we don’t need to be assaulted with it.
http://www.celebitchy.com/294632/miley_cyrus_on_liam_hemsworth_it_just_seems_right_to_be_wearing_this_ring/
Less than a year ago, Miley said:
“A star is someone who doesn’t have to take her clothes off to be sexy because you naturally have star power. Sex does sell, but you have to find a way that’s not just showing your tits. I don’t want to be a glorified model. They just walk on stage and it’s all about their clothes — or lack of clothes.”
I wonder what made her change her mind, hmm…
@Gabriella, & This is sort of covering what Jen said about ‘her motivation’ too.
Because Miley was *so* clear w/the statement you provided, I really think the reason she’s ‘gone off the rails’ w/all the ‘overt in-your-face-sexuality’ could be for 1 &/or 2 reasons.
1, I think she has likely been influenced by someone in the industry (be it Larry Rudolph or even maybe Terry Richardson, or if Larry SENT her to Terry), who may have told her that the reason her previous attempt to get into music ‘failed’ was because she didn’t ‘project’ the “right image”, that everyone still looked at her ‘as Hannah Montana, the 12 year old child‘, & need to be shown that ‘she’s an adult now’, then suggesting the heavy duty tactics involving nudity, sexualized dancing & poses, drug references, ect.
& probably a combination with 2, Having been in such a long serious relationship w/Liam when she made her last album, maybe the deterioration of their relationship (combined w/how relatively young she was when it became serious, then lasted so long) has given her a newfound sense of ‘freedom’ to ‘explore’ her sexuality like she couldn’t while in that very seemingly ‘teenage’ relationship. Also, I think she was affected by the likely waning sexual attraction Liam may have felt toward her (or even the other way around, or even that BOTH may have lost towards eachother),& is desperate to be seen as ‘sexy’ because the loss of that feeling in her relationship was painful, & hurt her self esteem regarding her appearance & sexual attractiveness.
I truly think the current Miley is a product of both that freedom after getting out of the relationship, & the influence of someone in the business telling her what she ‘has’ to do to become a successful adult artist who’s ‘taken seriously’ by the industry. I think she has every right to do what she wants regarding her sexuality. Do I think she’ll regret a lot of it? Yes. But we all do regret a lot from when we’re younger. I don’t think she *IS* a ‘slut’ for that, but everyone has their own definition, based on their sense of values & moral judgement, & I think everyone is entitled to express their opinion, but shouldn’t do so in a ‘hateful’ tone, as thats what causes so much pain to others, influencing them to do terrible things, sometimes.
Do I want to see her anymore? Hell no. She’s ‘worn out her welcome’ as an ‘artist’, even though I like several of her songs. She’s over playing her hand, giving into sensationalism.
There are too many people, like you, walking around saying there is nothing wrong with slut shaming. But what you’re doing is creating a divide. “My daughter won’t be a slut.” But whose definition do you use?
Here is what I recently wrote about why using slut, whore, or hussy is devaluing your point and damaging ALL young women-whether they have had no sex partners, one,or 100. I’m just tired of having to explain it over, and over,and over…
http://prettytarheel.kinja.com/what-you-are-really-saying-when-you-call-someone-a-slut-1443524178
^THIS X10000. Yes. There is no such thing as a “slut”. It’s an archaic device we use to control women. It sucks. Stop it. Also, stop calling women whores. Because, you know, having sex for pleasure is a bad thing. A sex worker is an entirely different matter. And trust me, they aren’t famous and making millions.
I agree with many of the sentiments in your blog post regarding the unintentional sexualization of our children when they are just babies. However, Roxy makes a point. Rashida used the word “whores” denoting an individual who sells one’s body. Miley Cyrus is someone who has resorted to selling her body in order to get an attention fix. We may never know exactly where the root of Miley’s desperate need for that attention lies, but for the purposes of this conversation, she is behaving like a whore, in other words a slut. While there are individuals who may arbitrarily use the word, that has no bearing on Rashida Jones’ use of it.
Great blog post! Thank you for posting this-you absolutely rule!
Irishserra,
I strongly, strongly disagree with you. By your comment, you’ve made it clear you buy into this whole “not a slut/slut” idea by stating that she is behaving like a slut. The whole point, the ENTIRE point, is that by dividing behavior into slutty/ not slutty, you’re buying into the idea that you can avoid being called a slut. The words whore and slut have evolved, and it could be applied to you if someone doesn’t like how much mascara you have on, or that your hair is exposed, or that your knees are showing… By defining behavior as “whorish” or “slutty” you’re supporting the very culture that could see you called a whore next week because you have on a short skirt and smiled at someone’s boyfriend.
@mj: I’m just so. damn. tired of explaining it repeatedly. It’s easier and more comfortable to buy into the status quo.
Honestly, I understand where you’re coming from Prettytarheelfan. I think you lose some of us when you say you’re “tired of explaining this every time”. As if others aren’t entitled to their own opinion and you have found *the* “truth” in this whole debate. That’s your truth, and that’s fine. But repeatedly stating that you’re “tired” (read:annoyed) that you have to enlighten all of us is pretty obnoxious. I am glad you think of your opinion as existing somewhere outside of “the status quo” in some opinion upper-echelon, but it comes across as exceedingly pretentious.
Frankly, in this case, I don’t find the word “whore” inaccurate. Miley is selling her body for money. More power to her if that is what she wants to do…but Rashida isn’t patently wrong. Could she have used a more descriptive and less-offensive term? Yes. But it’s twitter, so I think asking for a well thought out and nuanced criticism of Miley’s behavior is wishful thinking.
I don’t find Miley’s behavior even remotely shocking, but it is far from admirable. I wouldn’t want my adolescent daughter mimicking that behavior. And if it takes calling her a “whore” to dissuade a child from acting the same way, I am okay with that.
According to the Old Testament, a whore was any woman who had premarital sex. If a woman’s hymen did not bleed on her wedding night, she was to be stoned.
You may be thinking, “So what. What does my calling a woman a whore or a slut for posing nude in 2013 have to do with women and girls who were murdered for losing their virginity thousands of years ago?”
But there are many people alive today who still have that mentality. I’ve spoken to people in this country who say that if a woman dresses immodestly and/or has premarital sex, she is a slut or a whore. There are people in other countries who use slut and whore this way too. Don’t forget that we live on a planet where there are honor killings and Female Genital Mutilation, and sometimes these events still occur in Western Society.
When you call people sluts and whores or defend slutshaming, you’re defending all that has come with it.
Also, there seems to be a double standard when it comes to nudity and celebrities. If a male celebrity goes topless, in his underwear, or nude, nobody has a problem with it. If a female celebrity goes topless, in her underwear, or nude, she is a slut/whore/prostitute selling sex and has no self worth. Paternalism at its finest. Posing nude has nothing to do with self-worth.
@Lux,
You’re right, and I apologize. What I should have said was, because I often engage with others on this topic, and because I found myself reiterating the same points repeatedly, I sat down and wrote out my argument against slut in full detail. Its not that I’m tired of talking about it, but I am tired of repeatedly typing the same starting points. There is a ton of room for discourse on what I like to call the”slut spectrum;” however, when we are genuinely starting from a point of “girls who act like x, y, or z are sluts” then there are a lot of points to understand before there is room for discourse.
You know what, now that I’ve written that out, you’re partially right. It was a rude approach, and that was not my intent. However, I absolutely believe that I am starting from a much more advanced and reasonable place than anyone who has an arbitrary set of standards for “slut,” I don’t feel there is value that particular piece of their opinion and I want to respond to it without having to write the same points over and over. I’ll position it differently next time.
ETA:As to your point about the use of Twitter, that’s actually part of my problem with the word choice. Dashing off a quick tweet, what’s an easy insult? Whore is always a classic. What people are blurting on Twitter is a better representation of their thought process than a prepared statement, IMO.
@prettytarheelfan
Hear, hear!
Keep making the argument, please!
@Prettytarheelfan.
I actually agree that your opinion incorporates a reasoned and, likely, a well thought out logic. I just wanted to point out that phrasing it in the way you have will distract from your point (which may very well be a good one).
Edit: agreed re: Twitter. I don’t use the platform because I am actually afraid of the drivel I might be tempted to spew. I think Twitter is indeed part of the problem. I guess I am jaded and have come to expect some of the worst of humanity being displayed in those 140(?) character outbursts.
@Lux-I appreciate the insight. The last thing I want to do is offend someone BEFORE they get to the meat of my arguments! There’s plenty to get offended about after they read my point. I also feel like I have to justify why I’m linking my post, but it should definitely have been positioned more cleanly.
I avoid Tweeting like the plague. I would just vacillate between feminist posts, sports clips, my cute kid, and shoes. No one needs access to my inner monologue!
@Prettytarheelfan. Haha, if only most people would have the self-awareness to guard the world from their inner monologue (and for the record, I have a feeling I’d rather listen to yours than 98% of the people who actually feel the need to share.)
@ayre:
Thanks for both posts!
@Lux: cute shoes and redheads like ToddlerT-B do make everything better!
@ Prettytarheelfan & Leila in Wunderland
Yes, yes and yes! (I should probably add a TW here)
People often seem to forget when they are commenting on this topic with “if the shoe fits” etc that to someone out there in the world they too would be considered a slut or a whore. It is a totally subjective term and every single woman on this planet fits at least one persons definition.
And for the people who still don’t seem to get it:
When we no longer live in a world where slut or whore is the last thing a girl or woman thinks about herself before she commits suicide, when we no longer live in a world where slut or whore are the words a girl or woman hears as she is being raped or beaten, and when we no longer live in a world where slut or whore is the last thing a woman hears before she is killed is precisely when I’ll stop being so damned sensitive about slut-shaming.
For f*cks sake this isn’t rocket science. A little sensitivity costs nothing.
I never said “my daughter won’t be a slut.” But I will do my best as a parent so she has high self esteem and doesn’t place value on the way she looks. I always tell her that it’s more important to be beautiful on the inside than the outside (although she is both).
@LeilaInWonderland – Pretty much all my varying opinions have been made already, so I’ll just say this.
It’s an offhand point, but an interesting one to me, anyway. If I lived back in Bible days, I’d have been stoned for sure, because my hymen broke doing intense ‘stretches’ in 9th grade gym class. I’d never given it any thought until reading your comment, but to the society that ruled back then, *I*, who had never had sex, would have *still* been deemed a ‘slut’ or ‘whore’, for something completely unrelated to my doing anything they even seemed ‘wrong’.
I’d have been ‘assumed’ to be lying while saying I hadn’t, & been stoned. It’s… hard to describe my reaction to this realization, a little ‘in awe’ of it, maybe. My perspective against those terms was already in agreement w/you & Prettytarheelfan, but this just strengthens it further.
People what does a whore look like? How does a whore behave? My understanding of a whore is a woman who has sex with men for money. What Miley and some others are doing are not a true representation of a whore. Now if you say she is acting like a stripper that would be more of a true statement. A woman can be dressed appropriate, act like a lady and still be a whore. You wouldn”t know that she sold her body because she”s not acting like a whore.
High class escorts are called whores but you don”t see them acting like Miley. A young woman in college who hit the books everyday wearing jeans and a tshirt can be a whore who sells her body but we wouldn”t know because she”s not acting like a whore.
If Miley was hitting the boulevard at night scantily clad while going up to cars and asking men if they want a date then she would be acting like a whore. If she is sleeping with a lot of people then she might qualify as a whore.
So once again how is she acting like a whore? Is it because she”s selling sex; nope she”s selling a sexual image without the physical contact of what sex is. Her main issue is that she doesn’t have the talent to back it up.
Men in the music business sell sex as well. They love flexing and taking their shirts off. Usher used to drop his pants doing some of his performances. Look at The Red Hot Chilly Peppers they would strip down and use socks to cover their penises. It was for shock value of course and Miley is doing the same thing
You know what V4, I don’t like the sense you’re making. And I think I shall have to flame you for putting that damn image of RHCP in all their sad sock glory back in my head. I thought I got rid of that years ago..
Miley is a poseur as are most pop stars, plain and simple.
@BlueMarie I am truly sorry does it bring you comfort in knowing that I can”t unsee it either?
V4 – Yours is the best argument (IMO) in the entire thread. Cogent and well-phrased. Shrill speeches about “slut shaming” don’t generally work for me, but this, I get. Thank you.
@V4.. only slightly better, but I’ll take it!!
I agree 100%, am a woman, and have no problem with her use of words. These girls are selling sex to make money.
IMO,they are being prostituted by the record industry.
When guys like Channing Tatum or that band LMFAO pose topless or in their underwear, dancing sexually and shaking their partially visible genitalia, are they prostitutes as well?
Nudity and dressing provocatively are not the definitions of prostitute. A person who makes their living by singing, acting, or modeling but who has gone nude and danced suggestively in several of their acts is not the same as someone who earns their living by having sex with people. These celebrities are in no way disadvantaged or criminalized in the way that REAL sex workers are. There are sex workers who find that misuse of the word prostitute ridiculous, privileged, ignorant, and problematic.
I hate the term “slut shaming.”
me too and it is completely overused to the point where it is meaningless
Yes! And it disregards the risk in bad behavior/decisions.
@McRaw: That’s not true. You can talk about the risks of things like unprotected sex or feel that cheating is wrong, and still not be engaging in the act of slut-shaming.
To be honest, I don’t like the terms slut-shaming and body-shaming either, but these problematic and bigoted acts have to have a name.
This is in the wrong spot. But since I’m here, I’ll say that I hate the term slut-shaming as well. The following comment has to do with Bedhead’s commentary. Apologies for being a dope and putting this here by mistake.
I’m not sure what kind of descriptor would work. Maybe it can be referred to as self-sexual objectification?
I agree that people have the right to dress and pose as they wish, but when that (sexual bravado and exhibitionism) becomes so common as to be the norm, are we then saying that those outside of the norm are not relevant or valuable without those actions?
I hate it too. I have a friend who likes to use that term and it kind of gets on my nerves.
Slut-shaming is a stupid term (exactly for the reasons Kiddo has stated on these threads) and I love Rashida, but I wish she wouldn’t use the word “whore” to refer to other women. Just my opinion, it just bothers me.
But as I said, I love Rashida and I really appreciated what she said here.
Yes, something else to keep in mind in our over-sensitive, overly political correct world. I’m waiting for the day when people will not be allowed to have opinions anymore for fear of offending ANYone.
I don’t necessarily agree with the general theme; it would be better if women didnt have to sell sex. On the other hand, she sounds like a stuffy scold. Grown women can disrobe all they want for magazines, films, and music videos. It’s none of my concern if its their choice to do so.
THIS. All of this, plus her language made me super uncomfortable; people should pay more attention to HOW they phrase their opinions.
Disagree! It’s an opinion; she can phrase it however she likes. People are way too concerned with being politically correct about everything. Stupid liberals.
I meant I don’t *disagree with Rashida’s underlying message. I disagree with any policing of how people express themselves. If a woman wants to pose naked, I might comment on how artful or tacky it is, or I might avoid it altogether. But they can do it if they want.
Right. And she herself posed for GQ in 2011.
Yes, I think Hillary Clinton should be able to, get naked and take pictures of her a@# then Instagram it.
And still be elected President.
The rest of the world leaders mostly men – will take her seriously.
If they don’t – all the major news outlets – should scream don’t “Slut shame our President!”
@misscherokee
In 2010 Krystal Ball ran for the House of Representatives seat for a district in VA. At the time she was in her late 20’s. During her campaign, some pictures of her with her ex-husband were leaked to the media. They were both fully clothed. But because her ex-had a dildo on his nose and they were being a little playful, people had a field day. She was completely shamed over pictures that are not even that big of a deal. Pictures that are decidedly tame compared to what many politicians(Vitter, Gingrich etc) have engaged in.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/krystal-ball/the-next-glass-ceiling_b_757819.html
Katy Perry might not have disrobed fully, but she shot whipped cream out of her breasts and had an entire tour dedicated to strategically placing candy props on parts of her body so i don’t think comparing her to Adele is sound.
THIS. I don’t find Katy to be a good comparison. **triple post, sorry**
THIS. I don’t find Katy to be a good comparison.
THIS. I don’t find Katy to be a good comparison. **triple post, sorry**
As much as everyone on this site hates her, I think you have to add Taylor Swift to the list of pop stars with staying power who don’t disrobe. And she is a pop star. She blew past her “country” origins long ago.
I agree, but really she is still a country singer, it’s just her Pop singles are the ones that go mainstream. I was worried that her album would be pop, but much of it is very country and quite good (and much better than ‘we will never, ever…and I knew you were trouble)
I question Taylor’s staying power though. A lot of her popularity is based relatively juvenile themes. Unless her writing progresses, I’m not sure if she will continue to have popularity beyond her mid 20’s.
Yes I would of used Taylor as an example instead of Katy Perry. Besides she and Adele are the two most successful female recording artists today. Neither of them have barely shown any cleavage.
I think it is safe to say Taylor has pass that “Staying around past puberty” phase. She’s definitely no Debbie Gibson, Tiffany or boy band whose fan base tend to desert them once they reach young adulthood. She’s been around for 8 years now 16-24. So either her fan base is growing up with her or she’s recruiting a new bunch of teens for every album. But the girl keeps selling over 5 million per album.
Lots of people on this site still call Taylor a slut, though. Because why not? They’re totally pure and perfect.
ITA about KP completely. I’m always astounded at how short people’s memories are…
I agree! Katy was in GQ with nothing covering her nips but her fingers. In her Teenage Dream video laying naked in the clouds, etc. Katy does expose herself to sell her products.
I agree – by comparison now she might seem tame, but she’s not exactly modest and conservative in her image.
Among the dictionary definitions of “whore” is; a woman who engages in sexual acts for money.
Well if the shoe fits…
And the definition of a sex act is as follows:
Noun 1. sex act – the act of sexual procreation between a man and a womansex act – the act of sexual procreation between a man and a woman; the man’s p*nis is inserted into the woman’s v*gina and excited until org*sm and ej*culation occur.
So unless we know for sure that Miey’s exchanging intercourse for money, then I don’t think “whore” is really applicable here.
+1
Good to know oral sex is not sex! Come back Bill Clinton! All is forgiven! 😉 Obviously I know it’s not literal, I’m simply defending her analogy.
LOL. What? So not oral? Not anal? Coitus must occur? And only straight sex?
I should hope that “sex act” is not limited to your definition…
Not MY definition, but thefreedicitonary.com’s definition.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/sex+act
If you have an issue with it, maybe you should write them a letter of protest.
@TheOriginalKitten. Let me start by saying that I thought the definition you used was comical, and my comment wasn’t supposed to mean anything more than that. But, while I am at it and responding, if you look hard (or in this case not very hard at all), sure, you can find sources that may define a word in the way that best suits your argument to the exclusion of undesirable definitions that counter your argument.
Merriam-Webster has a vastly broader definition of sex act. You chose to use that definition from freedictionary.com to support your argument. That’s fine, but it completely circumscribes the inclusion of a large array of other things that many dictionaries (and I) would count as a “sex act.”
edit: I am an idiot and posted this in the wrong place. Oops!
My point was never to get into a semantical argument, my original comment was simply a response to this:
“Among the dictionary definitions of “whore” is; a woman who engages in sexual acts for money.”
Mia4 brought up a dictionary definition of the word, so I responded with a dictionary definition of the word “sex act” in response.
I mean look, I’m not a fan of Miley or her behavior, I’m simply trying to get us to remove the derogatory words from the collective lexicon when we’re trying to discuss issues that revolve around feminism.
It’s an interesting and important discussion being raised about how women are perceived in our current society and the lengths that some of us go to to achieve fame. Lowering ourselves by using slang terms really just detracts from the conversation.
Contrary to what some might think, I’m not trying to police people’s speech or be sanctimonious, simply making the point that we’re contributing to the problem by referring to women as whores, sluts, hos, etc.
Yes of course it’s free speech, but it’s damaging in my opinion.
@TheOriginalKitten. Well said. I addressed this in a previous comment, but I do think part of the problem is the use of platforms like Twitter to express cohesive and constructive opinions/criticisms.
I am not giving people a free pass on what they say just because they use an inherently problematic platform to say it. Just that, it is easy to make flippant statements that are not well conceived when you are basically blurting things out stream-of-consciousness style.
Personally, I do wish Rashida would have used a different word because it makes it so very easy to dismiss her larger point.
This is a problem I see frequently. Person A says something with some value, but uses terms that Persons B,C, and X find offensive. Persons B,C, and X might then dismiss the entire argument as invalid. This if, of course, Person A’s mistake (even if unwitting).
Dismissing Person A’s entire argument for those reasons seems like a more legitimate (yet equally fallacious) version of the age old ad hominem attack. I just wish Rashida and others would be a little more careful that when they are trying to say something meaningful they try to do it in a sensible way that doesn’t so needlessly automatically undermine their argument with some listeners.
A “sex act” can be anything, actually. Masturbation counts – which Miley simulates repeatedly and constantly, in her videos and performances.
Love her. She does no wrong. And she’s talking to plenty of young celebs out there.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++1
I’ve always thought Rashida is such a beautiful woman. That being said, I also am on-board w/Rashida & her comments.
This climate of political correctness is becoming a bit much for me. Look @ Miley & her antics….if the shoe fits, WEAR IT! Honestly, I don’t know what else to call what she’s doing, really. And yes…it will be really hard to “top” what Miley’s done…very hard.
When I think of that term, “slut-shaming,” it makes me think of how rapists will flip the script & try to bring shame on rape victims…which really, really upsets me, & the term is very apropos in such a situation.
But w/regards to what Miley & others are doing…nah. They want that fame & will debase themselves any which way to get it. IMO, they’ve opened themselves up to ridicule. They’ll take attention any way they can get it…ugh.
Totally agree with every word of your post. The next time I see “slut shaming” referenced here I will refer them back to your post.
: ) @Tig, thanks for your kind words!
Wait did you just say it”s really hard to top what Miley”s doing. It wasn”t that long ago that Madonna took out her boob on stage and she”s in her 50″s. She”s still pulling crazy antics. Let”s hope Cher doesn”t turn back time and flash her bare ass to us like she did in her video.
Rashida is so pretty!Now, that’s a real beauty, who doesn’t feel the need to strip any given second. I swear, I don’t even recall a single picture of her where she was showing a little bit of cleveage.
I think she’s also talking about Kim K and Nicki Minaj. The post I read last night included pics. Rashida’s wording may be off or even harsh to some people, but I agree with her 100%
http://m.necolebitchie.com/2013/10/21/rashida-jones-to-female-celebs-stop-acting-like-whores/
right on point!
“The next big pop star will have to go even further than Miley’s antics”
Not if said pop star has actual talent.
please let next pop star have actual talent.
Ummmmm Katy DID fully disrobe. Remember the cover of Teenage Dream?
Yes, has everyone forgotten the California Gurls video? http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/music/i503530-8/singers-strip-off-for-music-videos-katy-perry-california-gurls.html
I know Katy has evangelical Christian roots but she’s no Adele or Taylor Swift lol
Technically, it’s a painting but I’m just being a stinker for kicks.
If it smells like it and acts like it and looks like it why not call it by it’s real name. What else is a WH@r* then? Please give me a proper description. I give Rashida a high five on this.
Using that word is all about creating a dichotomy: whore or not a whore. The connotations of slut/whore/skank are fluid, and calling someone a whore is lazy.
And because I am tired of explaining this every time, I wrote out a whole explanation on why we all need to work a little harder on our criticisms.
http://prettytarheel.kinja.com/what-you-are-really-saying-when-you-call-someone-a-slut-1443524178
+1.
+2
And she also said “acting” like a whore. She didn’t say “being” a whore. She didn’t go into Miley’s bedroom and judge her private behavior. She is referring to the fact that Cyrus acts like she can’t control her vagina in public. That is an issue.
@ prettytarheelfan: a wh*re is a wh*re and a sl*t is a sl*t. No need for any explanations. I agree with Elle Kaye 100%
What a useful contribution! You’re really moving the needle with that argument!
For that genius @SummersReign, so by your logic Rashida herself is a whore right?
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-g5nWv00afzw/Tf3Or4lPCGI/AAAAAAAAARw/tXb4e7Ob_sA/s1600/gq2.jpg
First of all I agree with everything she said. But I don’t think she is just singling out Miley. I think she is singling out celebrity as a whole who either got their by being or acting whorish.
She needs to include Madonna in her message.
Yep. Madonna totally started the whole “naked for attention thing”. The original talentless famewhore
Nope, that was Marilyn Monroe. And I’m sure that if we go back far enough in history, there will be a cave woman somewhere raising her animal skin to flash her butt or boob for attention!
Well she is entitled to her opinion, and I have to say I agree with it. I am a gen X’er. I am terrified at the thought of the generations behind me. We are spawning a new generation of entitled, brats who think this behavior is the norm.
I remember back in school when 2 Live Crew’s “Me so horny” was banned and people were shocked at the lyrics. Today, we wouldn’t bat an eye. Let’s face it, kids are impressionable to this behavior.
Each generation creates the next. The baby boomers created my Mom’s (“working woman”) generation, who then created the “helicopter” parenting generation. What type of generation are we creating next guys? Thoughts?
What the hell is wrong with this thread? Really? It’s ok to just call people whores and sluts? Guess what, people? By someone else’s definition, each of you could be called a slut or a whore-and it could have nothing to do with your actual sexual behavior. The way you wear your hair, or expose it, the way you make eye contact, or wear shorts, or show cleavage, or flash your knees, or wear a bathing suit… It’s ALL up for examination, and its ALL open to interpretation.
When you call someone a whore, or a slut, you are really just making it clear that you are reinforcing your own “value” or your daughter’s “value.” What do you do when the next person comes along and calls YOU or your child a whore because you have on short shorts, or she’s wearing eyeliner? The rules will just get tighter and tighter, until we’re all behind a curtain so our behavior won’t be suspect. We, as women, are feeding this when we tear each other down and use whore and slut as an attack and a way to set ourselves apart. There is SO much to criticize-let’s focus on something beyond “whore.” Stop being so lazy.
YES exactly!!!
The best argument to pose to women who so casually throw those words around: WHAT are you teaching your daughter? If your daughter went to school wearing a short skirt and was teased by a group of boys and girls and called a “slut” based on her outfit, what exactly would YOU tell her when she comes home crying about it?
“Sorry honey, you asked for it by wearing that slutty skirt”????
Ugh. People depress me. If you want to hate Miley, please go for it (I certainly won’t be stopping you) but hate her for her annoying attention-seeking behavior and sh*tty music. Please just stop with the name-calling.
You make an excellent point. My issue with Miley is twofold:
1)Do it right:
If you’re going to twerk do it right (she did it badly)
If you’re going to sing do it right (her vocals at the VMAs sucked-period)
2)Make sure when you’re displaying yourself that publicly in a sexual manner that it’s what you want to do and you are the one with the power in that image. Which means you turn it on or off when you want to. Not when the record company says, and that’s where little Miley’s at.
In addition to my rant I do find many women who behave like hypocrites and don’t realize how they effect young girls and boys in their care. I’ve got a cousin who routinely makes comments about the girls in her sons’ classes as if they are too forward and “slutty” when she herself had many boyfriends before she was married, had her first son before she was married and lived with his father before she was married. She fails to realize that in many cases, others would have characterized her behaviour negatively.(I personally just thought she was living her own life the way she saw fit.) Yet she pretends now that she has kids that that never happened. It sends the destructive message to kids to hide and be ashamed of all sexual behaviour prior to marriage which I think isn’t healthy.
Virture lives within your character, not between your legs.
@HK9,
This is a great point. I touched this need for autonomy in another post. “Virgin Miley” was created as a commodity. This need we have to slot people into”good” and “bad” has now resulted in “Slutty Miley.” Did she control the development of either image?
@HK9
What you said reminds me of my aunt. She used to do the same thing to her daughters. My aunt had two girls with two different fathers before she met my uncle–and they had a daughter before they got married. But the way she tells it now–she had sex only two times before she met my uncle, AND they were married before she had my cousin.
And it has negatively affected her daughters–one has two kids w/a lazy man, and the other married a man who thinks he’s going to get into the NFL at 35 i.e. lazy as well.
*snort*
While I get your point, I think you could say that about any word. That’s its open for interpretation and varying definitions and many of them, in the wrong hands, can be potentially dangerous in the way you describe. Should we cease to communicate?
In an ideal world, we’d all have the time and ability to articulate perfectly what we are thinking. We would be deliberate and careful and use sufficient elaboration. But it’s not an ideal world and sometimes we will reach for a potentially harmful word for whatever reason (ease, convenience, time). It’s fairly human. I don’t see the need to “word-shame” anyone. Educate? Maybe.
Anyway I have used the word whore before but I’m conscious about my audience and the context – that both will support the use, that my audience is wise enough to know the intention was not to set the women’s movement back. Perhaps Rashida assumed the same of her audience and context.
So I’m guessing that since you didn’t list it in your numerous posts then skank is up for grabs??
I joke but my cousin has this tattooed on his back, pure accident.. it’s his kids initials. I stand by my right to call him that, I mean if the ink sticks right??
ahh damnit, you did use skank upthread.
You know, skank to me has always been more of a reference to a particular clothing style, but it could definitely go in here as well. I do find the idea of a “skank” tattoo priceless.
I get riled up about this. I have a passionate need to try to educate, and it’s really a waste of my time.
ETA: it was more of a throw in, I suppose. Whore and slut are my trigger words.
You are missing the point and have gone way off target!
I know this thread is so depressing the way other women are calling others sluts so flippantly is horrendous! demonstrating slut-shaming themselves. How can you all be so cruel? I hope you don’t have daughters with all that judgment
“The rules will just get tighter and tighter, until we’re all behind a curtain so our behavior won’t be suspect.”
This is one of the things that frightens me about globalization. While there are many wonderful things about sharing cultural traditions across borders, I worry that the power and respect that women have come to expect in more developed countries will be erroded by companies and powers trying to appeal to the billions of people (aka potential consumers) who live in countries with limited rights for women. Will women’s rights be set back by companies and countries trying to appeal to the men in control of patriachal societies and their finances?
Will our movies get even WORSE in their depection of women, trying to appeal more to global audiences? Will we start making acceptions for international/multi-national companies and their treatment of female employees if they expand into our countries?
There is nothing WRONG with this thread, except that not everyone agrees with your opinion.
I agree, I can’t believe all these comments basically calling Miley a whore and slut and saying theres no such thing as slut-shaming. It’s making me feel a bit sick.
If the shoe fits …
Ah yes, I have never been know to jump on any politically correct bandwagon nor am I known for being diplomatic in my opinions…in fact at times I can be for better or worse very blunt. So, when I read Rashida’s comments I actually laughed first (because it’s funny) and nodded my head vigorously (because what she’s saying is true). I agree with some of the other posters on this thread that if you look up the official definition of “whore” it is used appropriately. If you look up the word slut, well then that’s where you have a grey area because it refers to someones morals. That’s not what Rashida is saying here…she is pointing out certain individuals (who may or may not include Miley) for acting like whores.
The problem is that when you jump in and want to say someone is acting like a whore, and you want to use the original definition, then as TOK so graciously pointed out elsewhere, you need to use definition of engaging in sex for money. I don’t know what y’all saw, but Miley wasn’t blowing Robin for a dollar up there. Instead…
You know what? Forget it. I said it elsewhere, I’ve written about it…there’s a point when the damage is so insidious and the approach is so woven into our cultural fabric, that it’s just a waste of bandwidth that could be used to stream 30 Rock and find cute puppy videos.
+1 @Ginger
Her wording may be awkward, but her message is good, in my opinion.
There is no such thing as slut-shaming. Sluts should know acting like that isn’t cute or appealing. It most be really hard acting like a lady or a woman with class these days.
Gross.
I’m with Rashida Jones and Gloria Steinem both on this topic: Wouldn’t it be nice if women could be listened to while we’re wearing clothes?
How did it come to be in our society that *wearing clothing* became an expression of male priviledge?
Everyone is so hung up on the words whore and slut but the real problem is most of these women are only getting ahead because they’re willing to get naked. There’s nothing wrong with sex and nudity but there’s something wrong if that’s the only way people will notice you.
Well said…
@ Renee-Right. ITA with what you said and notice how you made the point without using the words “whore” or “slut” in reference to the behavior your describing?
People get hung up on those words because they’ve been used to repress and demean women for centuries. We can call out Miley on her behavior without resorting to name-calling. It’s not that difficult even for a person of average intelligence and it’s a more effective way of getting one’s point across.
LOL! Exactly. Preach it.
It’s about time someone said something. Even if you don’t agree with the delivery of the message, we (well, most of us) can agree that she’s on point with what she’s saying.
finally..somebody whos saying the true! Miley is been acting like that (not saying she is) but shes been acting and i was waiting for somebody who tell her that…its a shame that her parents are fine with it.. (well its money right???)
And Miley isn’t a whore, or a slut, or even really using sex to sell.
Her being naked isn’t really getting her any positive attention or increased record sales. Her nakedness makes her look like an idiot. Not some supreme sexual being.
The “whore” thing made me flinch, but is it wrong? Isn’t the definition of whore someone who sells sex for money? Maybe the Mileys, Rihannas and Gagas aren’t having intercourse for money, but they’re definitely selling sex.
Or the sex act?
Considering the fact that Rashida has done plenty of provocative photo shoots in lingerie for magazines like GQ I find it hard to take what she’s saying seriously. There’s obviously nothing wrong with that but she needs to get off her high horse if she’s going to publicly scorn others for doing something she’s done herself. I genuinely liked her a lot before this and am pretty disappointed by her eagerness to shame (which yeah, sorry, that’s exactly what you’re doing Rashida and preemptively trying to cover your own ass doesn’t change that) other females for not upholding some standard that even she isn’t meeting.
doesn’t bother me that she used whore because she was on twitter, not giving some sort speech. Twitter is just a place people brain fart, it’s casual and thoughtless and throw-away, and not meant to be more than that. Using whore casually on twitter is different to me than her giving some sort of statement that’s more formal and cemented.
Can’t people just express themselves and enjoy the privilege of free speech and not be labeled and called names like “slut-shamer”, etc? How about we try just listening to people sometimes rather than jumping on the soapbox to judge and correct their speech? It’s not people’s phraseology and choice of words that’s dangerous — it’s the word-policing and speech-bullying and forced self-censorship that’s dangerous to open thought, honest discussion, and free speech.
No one is saying Rashida shouldn’t be allowed to legally use the word whore. However, an open discourse about why “whore” is our go-to, instead of “tone-deaf has-been” is important and empowering.
It’s not speech-bullying. (Side note: really? That’s a thing? WBC is in my neck of the woods this week, perhaps I’ll take my speech bullying down there.) it’s questioning a word choice by a well-respected and intelligent woman, who could have achieved the same purpose without being lazy. I have always liked and respected Rashida Jones, and there is a world of material out there to insult. “Whore” is just…catering to the lowest common denominator.
She chose the word. Period. Nothing anyone can do about that. It was her FREE choice. See, this is where I have a problem: focusing on her choice of words (is that word-shaming??) rather than on her overall point/expression/message. Even if I don’t like a word a person uses I can overlook it for the sake of getting at the bigger message. FWIW, I don’t personally call people sluts and whores. I try not to name-call at all. I’m not saying I DON’T name-call, but I sincerely try not to let it be my automatic “go-to” speech. But I just am not bothered if she compared certain types of women to whores/hookers/whatever. I’m focused on her bigger point.
Fine, geez, we get it, Tarheel – you’re tired of explaining it all, of enlightening us peons to the truth that only you hold, of trying to educate the less-educated. Get over yourself. It all boils down to opinion anyway; we can just as easily say that you’re “slut-shamer”-shaming those who don’t agree with you. Get off your pedestal and trying to talk down to those who deign to disagree with you, or express different thoughts than you.
@sooloo
Prettytarheelfan is trying to make a valid point, and has been doing a good job of it in this thread. She’s arguing for a conversation about why someone would choose to use the word whore to describe behavior that is not found in the definition of the word. It’s a really worthwhile discussion to have. Please don’t be so dismissive.
And it’s not subjective opinion whether or not Miley Cyrus is a whore. She hasn’t been convicted of exchanging a sex act for money. Fact. So why would someone choose that word to describe her?
SooLoo,
I already addressed up thread that I should have positioned my initial points better. This is an on-going and controversial topic. There are tons of ways to bash performers that doesn’t require a Word that has so many ties to misogyny.
+1 @sooloo
What if Miley likes dressing and acting this way?
Why will we scratch each other’s eyes out if a woman is told to ‘get in the kitchen’, but when a female entertainer wants to flaunt her sexuality we slut shame her. I’m not saying I enjoy seeing her dance around in nude plastic, but I would rather her dance in that, than be fully covered up, if that is what she wants to dance in. The problem is we ASSUME it isn’t what she wants to wear and she is being forced to flaunt her sexuality in an over-the-top manner to sell records.
But what if that is what she actually likes wearing? Or how she likes behaving and performing?
What if her Hannah Montana days of being the ‘good little role model’ in the public eye is actually more damaging than sticking her tongue out and twerking on stage.
Slut shaming is lame. Let them be young and ridiculous so they have something to look back and smile about later.
I’m sure this will be a very unpopular post, but I have to say it….
We talk about the double standard, why don’t men have to engage in this kind of behavior to sell records (see various threads above on this site, and countless others). I don’t understand this – men aren’t showing the goods so to speak because other men aren’t. Women are, more often than not, competing with each other. If a man came out with a very sexual video/look that inspired the same response from women I guarantee there would be a flood of other men trying to top it. While I agree there is a double standard in terms of actual sexual activity (women are sluts, men are players bulls*it) from a marketing perspective Miley is competing with Taylor, Britney, Katy, Rihanna, etc. who are all competing with each other for that male consumer. It has little to do with what male entertainers are doing to drive sales.
However, the sexual marketing of women is geared toward men who click those videos, buy those magazines or visit those sites. If we take the male consumer out of the equation it changes the game completely. It’s extremely tiresome to hear female entertainers waving their feminist flag over their naked bodies grinding on wrecking balls. Say whatever you want to feel better at night, but that kind of behavior is nothing deeper than making male consumers think you’re hotter than so and so. Of course nudity/sex can be beautiful and empowering, but that’s not what we’re talking about. We’re talking about current music/celeb culture where too many women are giving up personal responsibility to break the cycle, excusing it as art, at worst “feminism”. True talent can and has stood on its own, its those with little talent and a willingness to compromise themselves in the interest of fame and money that keeps this machine so well oiled. There is little difference between these types of women and the men running their careers other than at least the men arent trying to hide it and call it something its not (with the exception of a few that exploded on to the scene way too young and overly sexualized, I.e. Britney who had a nice career before the school girl fiasco, but no where near the fame that brought her at 16).
Essentially ladies, this is an internal problem. Men like sex, and there is nothing wrong with playing to that fantasy. What do women like? Well, as a woman that’s a little harder for me to define, but I personally don’t want to see a man naked on a wrecking ball. I want him to be marketed as a protector, sensitive, romantic, whatever. And I must be in the majority on that one because we see so little hypersexual marketing of men.
I agree with Rashida, though I would probably do a little rewording, something to the effect of we need fewer celebs competing with each other to be the sexiest or most controversial. ANYONE can take their clothes off for money or to get some guy to spend an afternoon clicking on a video. There is nothing special or admirable about that. Get people talking about your talent, your natural beauty. Care less about making millions on top of your millions. Own your part in this cycle and stop being so damn greedy. No one needs a birkin, and millions in poverty work just as hard, if not more than you. Show some humility.
well said and bravo for saying it. there are way too many other factors at hand to make this a cut and dry issue. the word whore IS a very lazy description… kind of like using the word hipster to describe any young person who dresses with a bit of style. but miley is playing up the whore character isn’t she? you can’t tell me that she woke up one day and was like, “all this time i’ve known that the real me is one that rides a giant fake wrecking ball prop buck naked.” no, no, no. she knows she has a sick body and she’s showing it off for men to ogle, for women to envy, and for as much attention as she can generate. the word whore isn’t ideal here but she knows perfectly well she’s playing into the stereotype that she hypersexualized and sexually aware because “HEY EVERYONE! I’M IN MY 20s and I LIKE SEX AND I LIKE DRUGS SO LOOK AT ME. WHEEEEEE!” We were all there once and all felt incredibly empowered by our own sudden ability to make choices that weren’t necessarily endorsed by society at large. She’s just going through that phase and she’s using her sexuality, or rather, relying on her sexuality and her new found proclivity for subversive culture, (in this case, ratchet). as consumers of popular culture, it is natural to want to criticize when it doesn’t fit our moral agenda, so why do we have to reduce these criticisms to accusations of slut-shaming? Miley should be subject to the criticisms because she depends wholly on her gimmicks to sell her music.
Agree 100%. The entire mainstream music industry exploits feminism so that men can feast their eyes on naked women. At least that’s the way I see it.
“See you can dance around wearing just your undies! We aren’t misogynists, we’re letting you embrace your sexuality, show your body to the world you shouldn’t be ashamed by it.”
Only truth is, again in my opinion, that’s sugarcoating the fact that men are still calling the shots.
Can we please stop calling each other sluts and whores….PLEASE
This.
We women can be so busy name-calling each other and then getting in a huff about things that we don’t even have time to notice when the guy who is younger/less qualified than us gets the promotion. Again.
Of course. Tina Fey addressed this succinctly in Bossypants:
“This is what I tell young women who ask me for career advice. People are going to try to trick you. To make you feel that you are in competition with one another. “You’re up for a promotion. If they go for a woman, it’ll be between you and Barbara.” Don’t be fooled. You’re not in competition with other women. You’re in competition with everyone.”
I for one am good with slut slamming…I call a duck a duck when I see one too!!
What an ugly thing to say. What’s the point, the payoff, about having pride in calling anyone a ‘slut’ or a ‘whore’?
All other debates aside, can we all agree that’s it’s a good sign that a post debating the meaning behind an (arguably) poor word choice and the social implications around a sentiment by Rashida is garnering a few more comments than They Who Shall Not Be Named?
I disagree with her word choice, but completely agree with the message.
I will show her dat if she stops wearing PJs in public.
You can disagree with what Miley Cyrus and others are doing without tying their worth as a person to how sexual they are. Slut shaming is all about implying that women who have sex or who enjoy it are not worth knowing or caring about. Anyone who thinks that isn’t a valid issue is fooling themselves.
Others have stated it before but if you actually look up what the definition of a slut or a whore is, Ms. Cyrus doesn’t actually fit. As far as I’m concerned, people who are calling her a whore are just being lazy.
Completely. She is being provocative on purpose for attention, and she IS SUCCEEDING.
She isn’t actually a whore… and even if she were, how exactly to you prove that? Do you have video of her doing people and receiving money for her services?
If not, everything is pathetic assumption and pearl clutching sadness. Let’s witch hunt the evil whooooooores
.Implying that someone is bad or inferior because of the number of people she has had sex with, for having premarital sex, for enjoying sex without a long-term romantic commitment, or having sex before she was a certain age.
. Implying that someone is bad or inferior because of the ‘sexual immodesty’ of her clothes, pictures, dance moves, or makeup.
. Waving the prostitution flag in order to police and deride a woman’s sexual activity, nudity, dance moves, or clothing choices. (also known as whorephobia)
. portraying a woman as problematic and a danger to herself and others because of nudity or her clothing choices or dance moves (also an example of rape apologism).
These are all examples of slut-shaming, and can be done with or without the use of slurs like slut and whore (although those words will automatically qualify it as slut-shaming.
Basically, slut-shaming is the act of implying that female worth, respectability, self-respect, or status as either being good and having morals or being bad and having no morals is dependent upon her ‘sexual purity’, how much of her body she has kept covered, or the way she moves her body. It’s an old, inherently prudish, and inherently misogynistic way of policing and punishing female sexual activity, clothing choices, and dance moves.
Nudity and overt sexuality are not inherently bad, oppressive, and sexist, whether it’s a famous person naked in Marie Claire or someone else. Many a woman and many a feminist enjoys nudity and the overtly sexual and feels that these things should be open. The problem is the unequalness of the nudity, combined with a cultural message that a woman’s beauty and sex appeal are the most important things about her.
And yes, constitutionally you have the right to call women sluts and whores as you please, just like you legally have the right to be a homophobe or a racist. All I, as a feminist, am asking those of you who are pro-slut-shaming is to at least be aware of and honest about what you are contributing to.
In addition to it’s inherently sexist, arbitrary, and prudish nature, slut-shaming promotes and leads to all sorts of violence against women and girls. Some females are beaten because of it. Recently at a school in my state we had a girl get beaten up by other girls ‘for being a slut’ (she took naked photos of herself). We’ve had parents beat their teenage daughters for having sex/getting pregnant. We have teenage girls killing themselves because they were being slut-shamed. We have teens who think it’s ok to call rape victims whores. We have honor killings and female genital mutilation. And because of slut-shaming, we have rape culture.
If you can in good conscience continue to slut-shame or defend the act of slut-shaming, that’s fine. Just remember what you’re promoting, and know that there will be people to call you out on your bigotry, just like people will call you out for using racist or homophobic slurs.
I don’t know, Leila, I only skimmed your post, and to me it read a lot like Jack Nicholson in the Shining with, All work and no play, except in your case, this is all I saw…slut-shaming slut-shaming slut-shaming slut-shaming slut-shaming slut-shaming slut-shaming slut-shaming slut-shaming slut-shamingslut-shamingslut-shaming slut-shaming slut-shaming
Would you please come up with a better word? It’s getting as bad, if not worse, than people being called sluts. It’s like a cut and paste troll rant at this point. I think you are a smart person, so I believe you have the ability to express yourself as an intelligent individual, not a Jezebel-bot, and get your point across without wagging your own finger of shame at everyone.
Maybe everyone else feels enlightened by these repetitive posts and I’m just a loon. It could be, I won’t deny it, but I had to get that off my chest.
+100000000000000000
This. Jezebel bot is an excellent description.
And no kiddo I don’t feel enlightened. It’s cut and paste at this point and it’s repetitive and redundant (see what I did there?). Sorry I couldn’t be as nice as you Kiddo.
Give a historical perspective to the damage perceived impurity has done for thousands of years and get called a Jezbot? Sounds about right…
Keep it up, Leila!
The only problem I have with this post and I’m not calling any names is that it comes across as preachy. You have a message and that’s fine, spread it. But stop doing it as if you’re 2 feet above everyone else, people stop listening when they’re being talked down too, at least I do.
Trading one type of ad hominen for another is not a way of opening minds.
I do not use any of the pejoratives (like whore or slut) mentioned, on this board or others or in real life.
My point is that using “slut-shaming” is off-putting, to the point that I won’t read the comment. I think Leila has had some excellent opinions to share. I wish she would make them without using that term.
One side is wagging a finger, with words like slut and whore, instead of discussing the larger societal ramifications of exhibitionism (which may be their issue, maybe not), but knee-jerks instead, based in puritanical philosophy, where the other is wagging fingers based on an assumed role of intellectual superiority in membership of a website and knee-jerking in repetitive response, but being shut off from any deviation of talking points, even if derogatory names weren’t used.
I don’t think that is a way to further discourse and open minds.
@blue Marie
The problem I think we face is that this is an unpopular opinion and before we can educate, people have to understand that there is a problem in the first place. It is absolutely frustrating to say, over and over, that women in the US are still facing discrimination and abuse because of our gender, and have tons of people yell back “nun-uh.” It does leave us feeling like we’re back in the school yard, and it leaves me yanking my hair out in frustration. Lux and I had a interesting exchange up thread about my approach, and I agree with some of her points. I have seen people calling each other names on both sides,and that doesn’t help. That being said, when people don’t like that the same points are being repeated, they need to understand its because the same comments are being made over and over. There have been tons of variations of “well, she’s right, a whore is a whore,” and “well, whores shouldn’t act that way,” and “back in the good ol’ days, women knew how to be ladies,” on this post. It’s a repetitive argument but coming from different sources. The problem is, there are only a few people willing to get into the trenches and engage with those commenters, so Leila may seem repetitive because she is using the same argument. Shr may feel she is starting over every time. It’s part of why I absolutely came off as an ass in the start of this discussion: it can be frustrating to have the same conversation over and over with new people repeating the same basic points. We will continue to engage because we hope that at least one or two people will think before they call someone a whore/slut. The rest will dismiss us as brain washed feminists, despite the fact that it is about as far from the truth as you can find IRL.
Hope that helps with perspective.
There are more male whores than female ones in the industry. Of course we’ll never address them though.
Bedhead, the thing people always forget about Katy Perry is that dating Russell Brand gave her a MASSIVE push of publicity just before she started marketing Teenage Dream. So, whilst I agree that her branding is definitely a bit more coy than some of her contemporaries, it’s sadly true that it was dating a known lothario that raised her profile so much. So less depressing than twerking on a m—–, but still utterly dependent on the male gaze.
Slut shaming woman and telling men to show her “dat ass” ha ha talk about woman enforced double standards in the industry. Is it me or is this a case of “woman hating woman” in this industry? Why is she specific to young women but not addressing guys who go crazy?
This is how I am reading this.
She’s really cute.
Food for thought…Source: etymonline
slut (n.)
c.1400, “a dirty, slovenly, or untidy woman,” according to OED “Of doubtful origin,” but probably cognate with dialectal German Schlutt “slovenly woman,” dialectal Swedish slata “idle woman, slut,” and Dutch slodde “slut,” slodder “a careless man,” but the exact relationship of all these is obscure. Chaucer uses sluttish (late 14c.) in reference to the appearance of an untidy man. Also “a kitchen maid, a drudge” (mid-15c.; hard pieces in a bread loaf from imperfect kneading were called slut’s pennies, 18c.). Meaning “woman of loose character, bold hussy” is attested from mid-15c. specific modern sense of “woman who enjoys sex in a degree considered shamefully excessive” is by 1966. Playful use of the word, without implication of loose morals, is attested from 1660s.
Our little girl Susan is a most admirable slut, and pleases us mightily. [Pepys, diary, Feb. 21, 1664]
Cf. playful use of scamp, etc., for boys. Sometimes used 19c. as a euphemism for bitch to describe a female dog.
There is a group of North Sea Germanic words in sl- that mean “sloppy,” and also “slovenly woman” and, less often, “slovenly man,” and that tend to evolve toward “woman of loose morals.” Cf. slattern, also English dialectal slummock “a dirty, untidy, or slovenly person” (1861), variant of slammacks “slatternly woman,” said to be from slam “ill-shaped, shambling fellow.” Also slammakin (from 1756 as a type of loose gown; 1785 as “slovenly female,” 1727 as a character name in Gay’s “Beggar’s Opera”), with variants slamkin, slammerkin. Also possibly related are Middle Dutch slore “a sluttish woman,” Dutch slomp, German schlampe “a slattern.
What is it Henry Miller used to say…. are you trying to cut the b— off the English language? A whore is a whore, male or female. Women should act better because we’ve been treated like second class citizens for centuries. If all anyone knows about you is that you take your clothes off and can’t really say anything else, or if that’s what you’re famous for, then what does that say about you? Let’s start raising the standards already.
Can someone please explain to me (because I am old) what the hell is wrong with slut shaming? If I see a woman acting in a degrading manner, parading around half-naked, shaking her ass in public, licking the entire Craftsman tool line and other things that leads the average idiotic, perpetually pubescent male to view women as nothing more than disposable sex objects, then hell yeah – I’ll call her out on it. The consequences for that behavior isn’t confined to the woman engaged it in. The rest of us pay the price too. So if I call out a slut and she doesn’t like it – too bad, so sad.
Those of you who are pro-slut-shaming are all within your legal rights to call females sluts when they dress, dance, or behave in ways that offend your conservative Rush Limbaugh/Westboro Baptist Church/G.O.P./sex-negative roots. However, know that by doing so, you are all contributing to a culture of bullying, suicide, domestic violence, female genital mutilation, rape apologism, female genital mutilation, and honor killings. So don’t complain when you hear about those things in the news. Also, ladies, remember that some day another bigoted prude can look at your own low necklines, shorts, make-up, dance moves, or number of sex partners and deem you to be sluts or whores well.
You see, this scarlet-lettering does far more harm to women, girls, and society than revealing clothing, nudity, and sexual dance moves ever could.
Some people are so intolerant and old-fashioned that they can’t allow people to dress and dance how they please without it bringing out their inner Newt Gingritch/Massie Block. The women in the revealing clothes grinding and twerking at the clubs aren’t the ones promoting oppression of women. It can’t even be honestly said that nudity itself harms people. It’s the scarlet-lettering girls who are really promoting repression and bigotry.
Let me ask you this: Which idea do you think hurts women more, 1.) The idea that people have the right to dress and dance however they please, and nudity is not a bad thing, or 2.) The idea that a female’s sexual purity and modesty determine her value, and that women who dress a certain way, dance a certain way, or ever pose nude are inferior/bad people, because open sexuality is a sin and men need women to be modest?
Honestly, which idea do you think has lead to more hatred, suffering, and bloodshed?
LaurieH:
I feel it actually contributes to the behavior that we see from Miley and other celebrities because we draw a hard line, using subjective criteria, and I addressed it in full here:
http://prettytarheel.kinja.com/what-you-are-really-saying-when-you-call-someone-a-slut-1443524178
Here is an excerpt:
This carries over into the Miley Cyrus situation because Miley was required to be “good” (virginal-Hannah) to be a role model, and now, because we have created the two sides of the coin, she feels she has to be “bad” to escape Hannah.
If she hadn’t been placed in the mold, she would have no reason to break it. That’s what we do when we foist adult behaviors on children. That’s what we do when we talk about sluts. We put everyone in a category-slut or not a slut, and we make up arbitrary rules that could tie into the way you dress, flirt, look, dance, or even wear your damn eyeliner, and use those rules to define what a slut is. We then take that word, SLUT, and use it to harm, hurt, and shame young women when they try to figure out who they are. The “Good” look at the “Bad” and feel better about themselves. “Well, at least I’m not a slut.” The “Bad” look at the “Good” and think, “Well, I’m already ruined, why bother having self-esteem or trying to better myself?”
It’s just setting young women up to look at outside behaviors and classify their own and other women’s sexual behavior, instead of using their personal beliefs to determine how they feel about an action.
I don’t like Miley Cyrus’s behavior. I think she’s using shock value for attention, and I think she has been taught that media attention gives her worth. However, I don’t think defining any behavior as “slutty” is a solution, any more than banning abortion is a solution to unwanted pregnancies.
She’s right but it doesn’t mean we have to dress like schoolteachers (as she does).
Geez, the amount of judgemental and nasty women on this thread agreeing with Rashidas comment is incredibly depressing and speaks to their complete ignorance. Just backward-thinking, anti-feminist cowards acting as the certified whore-detectors or the whore-police of society. Because if they don’t bully and shame the 20 year old women of this world into acting “classy”, the MORAL FABRIC OF SOCIETY will fall apart!!!!! *eye roll*. Except we’ve only been policing womens sexual behaviour with violence and anger and shaming SINCE THE BEGINNING OF TIME and it’s like nothing has changed.
I was a fan of Rashida so this is very disappointing. Prettytarheelfan and Leila in Wunderland, you are the best! Why can’t people just understand these basic concepts?? EDUCATE YOURSELF PEOPLE!!! You are only hurting yourselves and your sons and daughters in the long run.
No offence but calling other women NASTY in here for sharing the same opinion as Rashida is also blatlantly JUDGEMENTAL and straight up insulting.
One can disagreeing without resorting to personal insults and that adjective is insulting.
One should refrain from criticizing others for doing something one is exactly doing too, otherwise it discredit any other argument.
Just a thought…
No. Saying that someone is judging a class of people – not a particular person – with a very charged term, is descriptive reality, not ‘judgmental.’ It’s not hypocritical. You simply and evidently don’t understand in a literal sense what either ‘judgmental’ or ‘hypocrisy’ mean. The commenter was doubtless reacting to things like someone posting about ‘slut-slamming’ upthread, about being glad to ‘call a duck a duck.’ You cannot seriously insist that people defer to opinions that offend them for fear of being ‘judgmental.’ Absurd and irrational.
It’s better to not pervert language when possible, don’t you agree?
@ Huh
I perfectly understand and i think it’s hypocrital either way.
You judge women for slut shaming or just for sharing the same mindset as Rachida and call them NASTY…not dumb or being wrong or narrow minded or prude but straight up : NASTY.
Two wrongs doesn’t make it right. Both are judgemental, narrow minded and pretty insulting. Period !
Ugh. You can criticize a woman WITHOUT calling her a slut or a whore. The main issue with slut shaming is that you may call both genders out the same way, but society as a whole does not treat women or men that way, and reducing someone down to only their sexual actions is ridiculous. Mia Farrow has done tons of charity work, raised 14 kids, and had a long and successful career. And yet the comment section of an article on her was littered with people calling her a wh*re. Would we ever reduce Jack Nicholson to such a base term, when he’s guilty of the same things and way worse than Mia? We define women by their clothes, their behavior, they way the act but we rarely if never do the same for men. And I’m not saying don’t call people out—but defining someone solely by their sexuality, the way the dress, or their sexual misdoings is fucked up imo.
I’ve always loved her! Does it really matter much if this is passive aggressive slut-shaming or whatever? The fact still remains that Miley’s performance left the whole world stunned and disgusted and how many young girls are now copying her, thinking it’s right and cool to do so? Seriously Miley. I can’t wait for the day to come when you look back and regret every single thing you did.
During my many years in retail, I was always happy to see a gentleman who was past age ninety come in regularly with his “lady friend”, in her eighties. He would open the door for her and treat her in all matters like a queen. One day a co-worker commented on how cute they were. I replied that theirs was a generation before women became “bitches and hos”. So for those who decry slut shaming (or whatever you want to call it), yes women should have the right to do as they please, but with scores of young girls wanting to emulate, what message are we sending? Miley may be laughing all the way to the bank, horay for her, but how many young women dream to have this kind of success or simply be like Miley for all the attention the media is lavishing on her? How many will be exploited in their pursuit to be like Miley or Kim or any other celebrity who uses sex to sell? WHY OH WHY are we not teaching our girls about true role models and women of power; Benazir Bhutto, Sally Ride, Malik Yousufzai, Maya Angelou and the list goes on. We must teach or girls to honor themselves first and foremost. Encourage our girls to get an education, travel the world, experience different cultures, pursue what inspires their soul. We owe this to them.
She is definitely right.
Look at he 90’s R&B world with En Vogue, The Good Girls (One of the most beautiful hirl group), Karyn White, Cece Penniston, Janet jackson, Chante Moore, Chantay Savage, Whitney Houston, Mariah Carey, Aaliyah, SWV, Allure,Amel Larrieux, Anita Backer, TLC, 702…And so many singers and girl groups back then.
Now tell me seriously if those women were not more sexy than the likes of Beyonce today, Rihanna even with baggy pants on ?…They never show their ass, shaking it like mad. You couldn’t see those women half naked or twerking in a thong in their videos like Rihanna is doing today. Hell Rihanna wouldnt stand a chance against anyone of them in that era with her week voice and nasty antics.
The ‘Giving Something He Can Feel’ video of En Vogue, is one of the sexiest ever and they are not half nacked. The ‘We Need A Revolution’ video of the late Aaliyah depicts her as one of the most beautiful and sensual Young singer out there and yet, she didn’t need to show her ass.
Today, all of them are promoting soft porn related image and attitude with weak tunes and stupid lyrics.
They are trash and think they have class, giving a run for their money to all the R&B vixen models out there whose only work is to ‘shake dat ass’ while accepting being called a ‘b!tch’ in nasty songs that degrading all of us, women.
All those R&B singers of today have some responsability in the depiction of how women are referred to in R&B and rap songs. They have cheapen out.
Beyonce takes the cake cause she is the lead and has started in the 90’s. Yet even with good looks decent voice, she couldn’t refrain joining and even leading that bunch of mediocre singers and caved in into that soft porn circus most female entertainers get into today.
Sigh…I miss Aaliyah.
Miley uses sex as a crutch because she can barely sing. as for Mariah she did appear in a few of her videos naked or nearly even if it was for a few seconds. granted many people don’t take Mariah seriously as a song writer though she’s the most successful solo female songwriter ever even more so than one of her Idols Carole King
Ughhh every time women are referred to as slu+s and wh0res for their behaviour it sets women everywhere back. We can have no sexual equality while our actions are still denigrated and singled out as being dirty, slu+ty, impure or bad.
No man is ever referred to in this same way. Oh man, no shirt? What a desperate slu+… he is asking for all the trouble be gets. He should be ashamed of himself. What is he teaching our young men? He has no self respect. He is worthless and pathetic and has to use his body for attention.
Everyone who starts to try and define.. THIS makes you a wh0re, this doesn’t, this does etc. you get into very tricky territory… you say Miley has become a wh0re who is selling her body? Would you say the same of a model? What about an art model? What about the Renaissance models? Were they wh0res with no self respect because they posed nude?
Your witch hunts are so outdated. So a slu+ is someone who has sex with lots of people? What is lots? 2 is a lot to some where others may see 20 or 50 or 100 as lots. But apparently people who also dress a certain way are slu+s? What ‘certain’ way is this? A skirt above the knee to one person, a g string in public to another. These words are loaded and should be avoided for the sake of women everywhere and for the progression of our society!
That’s a joke about Katy Perry right? Have you ever seen her film clips?
While perhaps not as blatant as ‘Wrecking Ball’, she’s barely any different
Check out her California Gurls film clip…
People rant about Miley sexualising child like themes… California Gurls is one big ‘candy’ shop ad!
I agree with her. Class is dying. And no amount of skin is as sexy as class.
It all comes down to self-respect. There are people who can get naked and do it tastefully, hell, tackily, and it still doesn’t leave a sour taste in your mouth. That’s because they are self-aware and they know their limits. In my opinion, what’s disturbing about Miley’s antics is that while she seems to be aware of the choices she’s making, she still seems at her core, confused and desperate for attention…and that just reeks of desperation…not so much with the intent of “artistic expression”. My two cents.