Samantha Ronson has/had a bulldog named Cadillac. Yesterday, Cadillac reportedly attacked a woman and her Maltese, either a short distance from Samantha’s LA apartment, or in the apartment building. According to TMZ, the whole thing went down around 11 am on Monday – Cadillac first attacked the (3 to 5 pound) Maltese – named Tiger – and then moved on to attack Tiger’s mom. It is believed that someone else was with Cadillac, and that Samantha only heard about this attack after the fact. Animal Control was called, although they did not put Cadillac down or take him away:
Samantha Ronson’s bulldog Cadillac has beat a hasty retreat from L.A. after a fatal run-in with a neighbor dog … sources tell TMZ — and we found out Cadillac has a biting record.
We’ve learned Sam sent her beloved bulldog packing for the East Coast to live with family … after the dog killed a 3-pound Maltese that was roaming the hallway without a leash Monday in Samantha’s West Hollywood apartment building.
Sam — who had worked the night before — was at home sleeping when the attack occurred. Some of her friends were in her unit. We’ve learned the friends told Animal Control they heard a human scream and then opened the door and found Cadillac in the hallway alone — there was no blood on the floor or on the bulldog. None of Sam’s friends are copping to allowing Cadillac to get out of the unit.
We’ve learned Cadillac previously bit another dog in the building and Sam agreed to send the pooch to a 3-week doggie boot camp for socialization. Cadillac returned home just 5 days ago.
Neighbors tell TMZ Cadillac had also bitten a person in the building but we could not confirm it.
Tiger is the first fatality.
[From TMZ]
At first I thought Samantha (and her dog) were totally in the wrong, but there do seem to be some extenuating circumstances for Cadillac. That being said, he sounds like a violent dog and Samantha should have taken better precautions with him if she did not know how he would react to other dogs, and their owners. My dog is a huge 100 pound monster, and little dogs freak him out too, especially because the little dogs always try to front like they can take him. But my puppy has never attacked another dog, he’s just happy enough to kill groundhogs. Seriously, my neighborhood has seen a Groundhog Holocaust. I guess what I’m saying is that I can understand (not excuse, I’m not saying that) how a big dog and a little dog can get into it and the little dog ends up dead. What I can’t understand is why (and if) Cadillac then turned on the Maltese’s owner. That’s a bad dog. And bad dogs are only made by bad parents.
Samantha spoke out on Twitter about the tragedy:
[From Sam’s Twitter]
Poor Sam, and poor Maltese owner.
Cadillac must be her pet name for Lindsey.
Well at least her dog is still alive. The poor maltese’s owner is the person I feel for.
Any dog that would bite a human needs to be put down, stat. And I am a big dog lover. But it is owners like Samantha and her friends that make people rightfully scared of dogs and the bully breeds especially.
Kaiser? You have a big dog? I love it! My bestest ever dog was the Crashing Boy that you can see in my Gravatar. He was 120 lbs and a big ‘monster beast’. We were always afraid of what would happen if he ever managed to corner the cat. Well one day he did, and by the time we got to her she was soaking wet. From his kisses.
Ok, the only thing I’m confused about is why they didn’t take the dog since there had already been a previous attack. Isn’t that how the doggie laws work? I’m really not sure but isn’t sending the dog to New York kid of like sending the priest to another parrish? Its just going to happen again.
Bad ownership.
Uh no. Just no. It is UNbelievable that animal control didn’t take this dog with them. That does NOT happen in CA. Guess it helps to be a “celebrity”. TMZ has more info on this dogs history as a biter and the fact that the dog didn’t finish his mandatory 3 week “doggie socialization” program that was court ordered.
I have big dogs too, and while they don’t like little dogs, it is the OWNERS obligation to control the dogs. I hope the owner of the Maltese sues the shit out of S.R.
Wow.. it pisses me off to see stories like this, because in at least 9 out of 10 cases bad or aggressive dog behavior is the fault of the owner’s lack of proper training. If this happened just 5 days after she sent her dog away to be trained for socialization (another telling fact) then maybe the dog should be put down 🙁
Right on Kaiser. There are no bad dogs, just BAD PARENTS. If you’re not going to train a dog properly, don’t get one. Ronson and her ilk are irresponsible trash.
That dog needs to be put down. It killed another dog and attacked it’s owner. End of story.
Celebitchy i don’t think sam’s dog attacked a person. This is just hearsay and not confirmed.
I agree with little dog vs big dog problem. Little dogs often get in the face of big dogs. I also think the blame is somewhat on both owners. The maltese should not have been roaming the hallways unsupervised either. They both should have had their dogs under control seems to be the bottom line here.
Send in Michael Vick for some tough love.
Ugh, not a fan of “little dogs” but this is so sad. At my local animal rescue league, the volunteers take so much trouble to re-train the pitbulls that are constantly abandoned because of “behavioral problems” (translation: owner neglect and improper/lack of training. Many end up being unadoptable due to years and years of mishandling. It’s very very upsetting.
If the dog bit a person unprovoked it would be placed on a list of dangerous dogs and be taken away/ quarantined, put away. That doesn’t seem to be the case here so I doubt that happened.
Sad about the small dog but lets face it sounds like both owners just let their dogs run amok without a leash. Animals have instincts and this happens a lot due to moments of carelessness on the owners part.
Um my little dog has been attacked unprovoked by a big dog before. I also have a BIG german shepherd that never attempts to attack little dogs, even if they come around barking. Dog temperament and training has a lot to do with it. Big dogs don’t need to attack little dogs because the owner thinks they are annoying.
accidents happen i have both extremes, really little and really big dogs, and with both sizes of dogs im extremely careful, if im with my little dogs i make sure to be aware and ready to scoop them up, and with the big ones i keep them on a short leash and am paying attention to our surroundings, esp. with big dogs, a kid can go running by and if your muscles arent ready really strong dogs can yank you, also making sure to socialize them from the beginning.. but even with all that things happen, very very sad though
Accidents do happen, but I bet in this case it’s bad ownership. Bulldogs are usually so sweet, too. I feel so bad for the Maltese and his owner – how horrible.
I am a big dog lover, but I’m starting to think bulldogs are more trouble than they’re worth. I have a coworker who has owned them for years and she seems to have nothing but trouble and great expense with them. First of all, they cost thousands from a proper breeder, then on top of that they often require expensive hip surgery or facial surgery. And they only live 8 years tops! At least none of hers have made it must past that age – and they get top veterinary care. I don’t really see the appeal with this breed. Oh, and she had a vicious one, too. It attacked another dog and they had to put it down. Then she plunked down several thousand on a new one… *eye roll*.
If this story is true and Sam’s dog really killed another dog – sad to say, but she probably needs to put it down.
@Rachel
I agree.
Well, clearly, Sam’s bulldog was noton a leash, and possibly the maltese as well. As somebody who is afraid of dogs, it drives me crazy when people do not have their dogs on a leash. I actually had a dog approach me one time and I was clearly scared – the owner yelled at me for showing fear! This was on a public street in SF, where there are leash laws – unbelievable. And no, the “oh, he’s friendly, he wouldn’t do anything!” line does NOTHING FOR ME.
I supervise my kid. People need to supervise their pets. Period.
If everybody already knew the dog was dangerous, what the hell was Cadillac doing all alone and unsupervised, running down the hallway?
Sorry. Bad dogs are not “only created by bad parents”. Dogs CAN have a genetic predisposition to agression ( I am NOT talking about specific breeds, but rather individual dogs). Ask any vet. It IS, however, up to the parent of the dog to do the responsible thing if you have a dog that will attack a human…
“And bad dogs are only made by bad parents.” True but in some cases dogs have traumatic pasts and even a new, wonderful, owner can’t change his or her tendencies completely.
I would never leave my dogs un-crated if they were unsupervised. They get along but all it takes is one of them trying to steal another’s toy or bone or spot on the sofa and disaster could strike. It sucks that the people at the apartment were so irresponsible.
The dog should not have been “sent away” for training. I’ve trained dogs for years and it is mostly the owner that needs to be trained. Also, SR knew the dog was dangerous, so she should have been more responsible. Even though she was sleeping, she should have made sure anyone else who had or should have had control of the dog would be responsible for him. The whole thing is sad.
@artista, that is just tacky. I agree the dog should be put down, but use a humane treatment. NO animal deserves what Vick and his crew did.
@e – sadly it is true that some dogs are treated and abused so badly they cannot overcome their pasts, but those dogs need special, caring owners who know how to handle them.
Plain and simple, I firmly believe that if you have a viscious animal, you must control it or give it someone that can. This bitch can afford the Dog Whisperer. Accidents happen, and I understand that. But learn from them…
If someone’s brute ate one of my pets, consequences would be paid.
I wonder how much attention or love this dog actually gets, with mom gone all night and asleep all day. Buncha groupies feeding it Doritos and Corona.
If this dog has a history of attacking other dogs and people it should’ve been put down. What would’ve happened if it had been a child walking the maltese?
And owners who do not supervise dogs should be charged when these things happen, especially when there is a known history.
“I am a big dog lover, but I’m starting to think bulldogs are more trouble than they’re worth.”
I have a friend who owns a bulldog as well and the dog is constantly on medication because the folds in the facial skin collect slobber, causing fungal infections. I’m not trying to hate on purebred dogs but this is one of the downsides of overbreeding. It seems some breeds suffer greater than others.
I have a 55lbs Chow Chow who’s not that large but people say they’re a vicious breed as well so people do get scared of him. He’s always on a leash in public and when passing another person on the street we either go to the other side of if unable to he will stay on the other side of me so I’m in between him the passing person while on a leash that’s only long enough for him to walk comfortably. He’s never had trouble with anyone before but I don’t see the point of bothering to see if it would happen. I feel bad that she was sleeping but if he has a continual problem with biting I agree he needs to be put down.
Why does she have so many friends over at her house while she is sleeping no less? Isn’t she in her 30’s already? Grow up and take responsibility for your dog and stop having farm animals over at all hours of the day. What losers. These hollywood types need to seriously learn how to spend quality time alone or with their pet but not people.
I don’t think it is instinct that makes a dog kill another dog. This animal is someone’s pet. This dog doesn’t live on the streets so someone was supposed to be there to make sure it didn’t kill someone else’s pet. It is just plain irresponsible to have an animal that you know attacks other dogs and not have them locked up when you are not able to attend to them. Does this woman even have time to have a pet. Maybe I’m biased because she is a celebrity but there seem to be quite a few of them who have children and buy animals with no intention of ever having to take care of them on their own.
TMZ says the Maltese was on a leash, and I would imagine that IF the owner was hurt, it was in trying to rescue her dog! The Dog Whisperer says that Bulldogs are harder to control than pits, and more aggressive as well.
Ironically, this Bulldog would look like a “small dog” compared to my 115 lb. Lab, but I have no doubt the Bully could take him down in a heartbeat.
If you are the owner of an agressive dog, YOU are responsible, and the fact that Samantha Ronsen shipped this dog off that very afternoon is reprehensable. On her part and animal control’s! Someone before me put it well in comparing it to moving a pedophile priest to a new parrish.
I’m sorry, but what are the extenuating circumstances for Cadillac? A large dog that has bitten both people and other dogs; what exactly excuses that? I’ve got three large dogs myself and love animals, but animals who attack need to be separated from the situations that make them violent by whatever means is necessary.
Yeah Kaiser I am the proud mom of a 100lb german shephard/ akita mix and I am a BIG believer in nurture vs. nature.
Well, I guess that in this case “Tiger” isn’t exactly nomen canem…
If you are uncapable of taking care of and educate a big dog (or a dog in general) don’t adopt one. It always ends with the poor dog getting put to sleep.
Where did these “details” come from? The Maltese’s owner? I’m sure they did. And I’m also sure that they’re skewed to present her and her dog in the most favorable light. I agree with the commentors who have stated that every dog owner is responsible for their pet. Regardless of the size. If you have an aggressive dog, whether it’s a 10lb. dog or a 100lb. dog, you need to take the necessary precautions. I have a 98lb. American Bulldog. He’s the sweetest dog in the world. We walk our neighborhood twice a day. And he has been attacked by aggressive little dogs more times than I can count. And he has never defended himself. He has scars from being attacked by these little dogs. I have scars from these little dogs. Because while people expect my large dog to be on a leash, they have no problems letting their aggressive little dogs run wild. Leashes are for everyone’s safety. Use them.
MY little dog is very aggressive. when she was a puppy we taught her not to show it towards humans-and she’s generally really good around other dogs, but i’m ready to snatch her up at a moment’s warning.
They said Sam was asleep and it seems one of her “friends” let the dog out-probably on accident. both dogs should have been on a leash. leashes make great weapons if needed in an emergency situation (i would never condone hitting a creature unless it was a life or death situation).
I place the blame on sam’s friends, and the owner of the puppy.
most small dogs suffer from Napoleon complex, and their owners should understand that and take proper precautions as well. it’s not just the big dog who are the problem. I’ve own, pits, shepards and tiny dogs, they all have downfalls, but if you are prepared there is nothing to worry about.
I’m glad she’s remorseful–hopefully this will make at least one person either stop and consider what breed they are capable of caring for. If you don’t have the time to dedicate to properly training a bulldog or pitbull–get a bichon frise. Its as simple as that.
I’ve always had big dogs and small dogs, not alway at the same time, but they never attacked other dogs. Its’ called socializing and teaching your dog what it can and can’t do. Thos eof you defending the dog that killed another dog shoudl be ashamed of yourselves. Sam Ronson has the money to have had her dog trained and yes, this is her fault. Supposedly, the other dog was on a leash so I doubt it attacked the bulldog due to ‘Napoleon Complex’
As a dog owner, I’m very disapointed in other commentor’s suggesting this is due to breed instincts and I question how well they are raising their own dogs. Instincts are only ever active when a dog snaps, a dog loose down the hallways ins’t going to snap unless its’ under duress, durign which it would be the owner’s fault for putting the dog into that situation.
Oh, and I currently have a Jack Russell and a Jack mix, which can be very stubborn and go for prey. Guess what? They love the dog park and love other dogs. So those of you saying smaller dogs are more aggressive are idiots. It depends on how well you have socialized your dogs. I’ve only ever had issues with work dogs (border collies/heelers/GSD and even then, I was able to curb their behavior with socializing and discipline. Anyone can do it.
This dog needs to be put down and Sam Ronson needs to be fined.
Did I miss something? Why was the dog wandering while Samantha was sleeping? Who was supposed to be watching the dog?
I am out of coffee this a.m. and can barely comprehend what I read.
There is certainly a component to how you treat /train your dogs (i.e. nurture). But, there are dogs that have the crap kicked out of them daily, then when put into loving hands, behave like the angels they are. On the other hand, there are dogs that can be treated like gold from birth who can grow up to have profound aggression issues. Dogs, like people,are individuals, who can have complex mental and biological issues. I promise you. Regardless, a dog that will attack a human unprovoked needs to be euthanized.
My 200 (yes, 200) pound Great Dane is terrified of little dogs now! When he was still a ‘small’ puppy (I mean like 100 pounds small) he was attacked by a Miniature Schnauzer, while he was playing with another dog at an offleash dog park. I was just very lucky that he didn’t decide to retaliate against the other dog – because he could have easily killed it.
I’m not saying that it happened in this case, but sometimes little dogs DO provoke attacks by larger dogs – and not all dogs will just ‘walk away’.
Co-sign on there’s no bad dogs. Just irresponsible, lazy owners who don’t feel like putting any effort into training, exercising and socializing their dog(s).
theres no excuse for anyones dog to attack a person or another’s dog, having 2 small dogs I’m mortified when I see a large unleashed dog coming towards me. I can pick up my 2 dogs but whats to stop a large dog from knocking me down? Just yesterday I heard a woman screaming outside, when I looked to see what was going on I saw a neighbours dog jumping on a older lady walking her little dog. The owner of the loose dog said ‘he was just saying hi’ to her, poor woman was terrified 🙁 I don’t think a dogs just saying hi when its running towards me unleashed. Leash laws are there for a reason.
If your dog can be ‘provoked’ into attacking anything, keep it away from other people and animals. It’s your responsibility.
@Rachel
“I place the blame on sam’s friends, and the owner of the puppy.”
Why is the owner of the maltese to blame? That dog was on a leash. Sam’s dog has a history of aggressive behavior.
“Cosign” on anything you want. Arbitrarily believe whatever you want. Research, ask veterinarians and behaviorists (you know, people with degrees), there are dogs who are just aggressive. It can’t always be ignorantly chalked up to lazy irresponsible owners. In THIS case, it is – a dog that has bitten people before and is allowed to roam around unsupervised – is CLEARLY irresponsible dog ownership.
Pretty sad story all around, My sister has a huge dog, but she is just the most loving dog you could every meet.. There are times when the lil dog that lives next door, will bark its little head off at my sisters dog, and my sisters dog, just looks at it.. like, what are you on lil fella
I had a St Bernard attack my Lab. Both dogs were on a leash and the St Bernard literally pulled his owner across a large area to get to my dog. My dog had two bites but the attacker never tried to bite me. It almost makes me wonder if the owner of the other dog got bit trying to break up the attack.
@Moreaces that’s what a well socialized dog does, the lil dog sounds crazy lol
200 pound Great Dane?!?!?! Whoa! Mine is only 140 and that is big enough for me. I have a Great Dane and a mini dachshund, and for the most part, they get along great. We just have to watch them when they are playing, so the Great Dane doesn’t accidentally smash the dachshund.
Yeah, and I don’t think they should have let Cadillac walk around the halls unattended. I’m all about leashes and supervision!
being an owner of both a little and a big dog, I find overwhelmingly that exclusive big dog owners have a mentality that little dogs are like ninjas and are responsible for attacks against it because of their constant abuse. This may be sometimes the case but i doubt its the majority of cases. And my big dog has not been randomly attacked by little dogs daily, nor has my little dog been attacked that many times by big dogs – only once by a muzzled pit bull, @Rachel where the heck do you live to have had that many encounters / battle scars?
Where is everyone getting that the maltese was on a leash? Tmz who broke story said it was roaming the hallways. None of these dogs should have been let out unsupervised.I don’t think Ronson is the only one at fault here.
You can send the dog away for professional training, but if the owner doesn’t apply or be consistent with what they’re supposed to be doing it’s not going to be successful.
People who think they can send the dog off and have it come back ‘magically’ trained are either deluded or bad, lazy dog owners who have no business owning a dog in the first place.
I’d been out walking my 185lb Great Dane and he was attacked by a Jack Russell that was off-leash as too many small dogs are because “oh, they’re just little.” Meanwhile, they’re some of the biggest culprits when it comes to dominance issues with other dogs and biting.
I’m surprised by this Old English Bulldog’s behaviour really because most of them are too sluggish and lazy to lick their own yarbles.
The little dog was running around freely too. I blame both owners.
I have had a maltese and they can be very feisty with big dogs and not know whats best for them. You have to supervise your dog .Makes no difference if its big or small.
i’m surprised at this – bulldogs are usually very mellow. how awful! i’m sorry for sam but i have to agree that this dog should be put down, and i am a huge dog lover. i have 2 dogs -both mastiff mixes- that are big, strong girls but total pussies – the cat bosses them both mercilessly. they have been through training school and are very well behaved but i only let them off leash at the dog park, anyway. even there at the first sign of a dog fight i put my dogs leashes on and take them away. there are many clueless dog owners out there.
Erin is right. There is a reason we have dog breeds. Because we want dogs that look and BEHAVE certain ways. At once point in time, some breeds of dogs were bred to have a strong drive to kill other dogs (and are actually still being bred to do that). Just like labs have been bred to like water, bully breeds having the drive to kill other dogs is genetic, and not something that can be taught to a dog nor trained out of it. While it is true that not every single bull dog born has that drive, if it does, and you’re the owner, you’d better be ready to handle your dog properly or it will kill other dogs. Period.
Can we just agree that all dogs are different and move past the bad dog/bad owner argument?
Regardless, the dog attacked and killed another dog and by all accounts, this wasn’t the first time the dog has attacked another. The dog should be put down and I can’t believe animal control didn’t take it right away. I assume it’s typical celebrity treatment.
If Samantha is an animal lover, she would have done the right thing and put the dog down. It’s going to do it again. She’s acting very selfishly. She’s not an animal lover.
@ Crash-weren’t bulldogs originally bred to bait bulls? That would indicate that at the origination of the breed, they would have to be pretty agressive, behaviorally. Granted I’m sure that has been toned down after time but maybe it’s still part of their genetic makeup?
Just pondering…
I get that conflict occurs between dogs.
However, growing up and as an adult, I have had dogs of various sizes and breeds (Labrador Retriever, German Shepherd, Collie, Pekingese, Miniature Pinscher), and they have NEVER attacked other dogs. Never. Never even tried. As well, my paternal grandparents have only ever had dogs from shelters; dogs that came from abusive and neglectful homes and could have been aggressive… and these dogs never attacked another dog.
It comes down to the owner; blaming it on nature is a cop-out for people who do not know how to properly train animals. People may claim that this is just what big dogs/little dogs do, but I have years of dog ownership that tell me otherwise.
If one has a dog that is of a particular breed, one must understand what it takes to train that dog. For example, training a German Shepherd is an ENTIRELY different experience than training a Collie. And German Shepherd’s are not for weak-willed individuals; the same rule applies for Samantha’s dog.
If this is not the first incident for Cadillac then unfortunately he needs to be put down. If he attacked the owner of the other dog in any way he needs to be put down.
It is a sad reality, and it is unfortunate that Cadillac has an owner who did not have the knowledge to properly train and monitor him.
I’m not really talking about breeds. Some of the very best dogs I have ever met have been bully breeds. I am just talking about individuals. Some dogs, regardless of breed, are just bred so poorly by dumbasses that no amount of training can help them, which is tragic, but it does occur. I knew a dog that as it matured became so dog aggressive that it would attack any person in between it and another dog just to get at the other dog. It was really sad, and a product of irresponsible breeders. It was 99% angel and 1% lethal – but that 1% really mattered. That dog’s owner loved it so much and spent a ton of money on it, training it from a puppy…it still wasn’t enough to curb that aggressiveness. 🙁
@ Erin
There are dogs that are bred to be inherently aggressive towards other dogs/animals, but there are NONE that are inherently aggressive towards people. That’s what you’re saying, right?
I just wanted to make that separation.
As a big dog owner (rottweiler husky cross), I’m really happy this post and this discussion wasn’t just a blanket condemnation of all large breeds.
I’m a member of Team “There are no bad dogs, just bad owners.” Good owners socialize their dogs, train their dogs, restrain their dogs, and alter their lifestyle to accommodate the breeds’ needs. I’m not sure if — based on this article — Sam Ronson is a good dog owner. Should a bulldog be living in an apartment? With someone who leads a nocturnal lifestyle? Should a dog with a history of aggression be left in the care of friends unfamiliar with the dog’s behavioural issues? Personally, I think it sounds like the dog was neglected.
As to euthanizing Cadillac, there’s a lot of factors to consider. Was the Maltese roaming free? Was the Maltese on a leash, but behaving aggressively? Did Cadillac bite the owner because the owner attempted to pick up the Maltese in the middle of the fight? Was the owner bit because Cadillac saw her as prey?
Regardless of the outcome, Ronson’s tweets seem pretty balanced and thoughtful. Colour me surprised.
@Katyusha: Unfortunately, drug dealers like to breed dogs that are human aggressive. I don’t think there are any AKC recognized breeds that have human aggression in their breed description though. Not sure if that what you guys are talking about…
Kitten: The origins of the bulldog are from Roman times where they were used to hunt big game, so yeah, they had to be pretty ‘gamey’ and aggressive toward game, but not other dogs or their human family. Then they started to use them in their sick games, where they bear and bull baited with them. Eventually they decided that pitting them against each other would be fun, so they starting breeding for dogs that would fight other dogs.
I’m a little sad that people here keep saying there are no bad dogs. As a victim of pet store deceit (ie my “rescue dog” came from a puppy mill, which I only found out after the dog had been put down and I put on my investigator cap), I can assure you that there are bad dogs – dogs that were inbred, dogs that were brought up in horrific puppy mills – that no matter what the owner does, no matter what protocol they follow, can simply never be trained to live socially and peacefully.
We don’t know the whole story here. I’m not ready to condemn Ronson yet. There ARE bad dogs: Thank your local puppy mill for that fact.
That dog is ugly, put it down. Sam’s getting her ass sued.
I truly beg to differ – there are aggressive breeds. How or why they came to be that way (i.e.: inbreeding, drug dealer favourites) is irrelevant because at this point, it stands that they are predisposed toward violent and aggressive behaviour. I’m thinking primarily of pit bulls. Don’t even bother with the cascade of “oh but I had many pit bulls and with proper training they were the sweetest dogs evveerrrr!!!!” The point is, they are a breed that typically causes more injury to other beings due to their strong bite and AGGRESSIVE nature. In Ontario pit bulls are banned to the point that they confiscate all dogs that so much as look like one, then figure it out later. Just last week I saw the “sweetest pit bull ever” take off viciously after a young, young child. Normally I would never interject an example like this, as one incident with a dog does not prove anything about the breed in general, however this seems to be much too common for pits.
@Katija (#66) — when I wrote “there are no bad dogs, just bad owners,” I was not attempting to be offensive. I was trying to drive home my belief that the problems of violent dogs in our society should be placed at the feet of humans, not the dogs.
Sometimes though, the most humane option is to euthanize a dog. It’s safer for the dog. Safer for the community. I think you made the right decision.
@ Crash2GO2
Yes, that’s what I was referring to. There may be people that are currently breeding dogs to be aggressive towards people, but there are no breeds that are inherently bred to be aggressive towards people.
The animal control has just officially confirmed that cadillac the bulldog did not ever bite a human being. So that was BS some gossip site made up. It killed the maltese, but they are not sure what was its behavior before and are to investigate it. The dog is not actually confirmed to be this dog with an aggressive behavior you are all talking about. So people need to hold their horses when condeming ronson.
@ Bea
Oh, no offense taken, believe me, and thank you for the kind words. After I wrote my post, I actually thought about what I said, and realized that there was a fallacy in my argument: There were humans behind my dog’s lousy demeanor and breeding. The man who owned the puppy mill was the one who inbred my poor little yorkie. HE was the reason that the dog never had a chance to live. So, to a certain point, you’re right. Even when a dog is unable to be rehabilitated, there’s usually a human behind it. However, that person isn’t always the adoptive parents. Sometimes it’s a scummy breeder who raises puppies outside in the freezing cold in tiny cages in their own excrement and DUDE IF YOU THINK I’M DONE WRITING LETTERS TO THE MEDIA AND COMING AFTER YOU YOU ARE SO EFFING WRONG SON.
**deep breaths** So, yeah, no offense taken. 🙂
@ Wonderful
I do think that there CAN be peaceful Pits, and I respect people who are fans of the breed, but at the end of the day, I don’t think that the pros outweigh the cons enough to continue breeding these dogs.
Boxers are a great alternative to Pits. Same rambunctious behavior, same loyalty, a lesser chance of violence.
@ Kitten (#28): Oh yeah, I forgot about the skin problems, too. My coworker has had that experience with her bulldogs as well. You are right that some breeds have suffered unfortunate fallout from overbreeding or just plain bad breeding.
Sounds like in this case that Cadillac needed supervision and wasn’t getting any. I have a small dog, a shih tzu, with a big attitude. She was getting aggressive with my BF’s pit bull the other day, so she will get in trouble if I don’t watch her little smartass!! 🙂
If Samantha Ronson’s Dog attacked me and killed my little dog, I would sue her for everything she owned. It is time that Dog owners take complete responsibility for their pet’s actions. For SR to go on Twitter and post that she feels sad and then send “Cadillac” to live somewhere else just seems like an irresponsible way to downplay any bad publicity. A human was bitten and a dog is dead because “Cadillac” was out of control and left to roam the building. Shame on Animal Control for being so “Star Struck” as to not take away “Cadillac” after the incident because now that dog is in a new place and ready to attack another innocent small dog or person.
Even the dogs get off in Hollywood. I thought this was a democracy!
1. STOP jumping to conclusions .
TMZ SAYS caddy has bitten others. TMZ SAYS caddy attacked first. Since when is TMZ the oracle of truth?
Sam once had a maltese too. Marlboro.
Tiny dogs have napoleon complex. Tiger may well have attacked first. Just caddy was the bigger dog.
Remember caddy in the pap vids… she was beyond mellow.
Don’t jump to conclusions.
Sad. Sad. Sad. More “hangers-on” that disapear when the sh-t hits the fan. No-one admits to letting the dog out!
Now there is going to be a Criminal Investigation per TMZ:
Officials from the County Department of Animal Care & Control tell TMZ there is a criminal investigation underway to determine cause of death for Tiger, the 3-pound Maltese that was killed after Sam’s bulldog, Cadillac, got out of her apartment unit yesterday.
We’re told Ronson — who was sleeping at the time of the attack — is the subject of the criminal investigation.
An Animal Control official tells us they will be looking at the circumstances of the attack and Cadillac’s propensity for violence. As we first reported, Cadillac had attacked another dog a while back and had actually just come home from a 3-week socialization program.
Animal Control tells us this could be a 2 to 3 month investigation.
@ lindsay, yes, I agree with you 100% and with Crash2GO2. I hate irresponsible dog owners, and think they should be arrested & booked when crap like this happens. If there were actual consequences for keeping vicious dogs around other people and dogs (apt bldgs), the idiots would think twice before doing it. And yes, being a celebrity in this city is certainly a get out of jail free card, makes me sick. The dog should have been impounded and put down. I hope sam whatshername is sued from here to kingdom come. I really hate injustices like this. Remember the poor woman who was savaged by the huge dog outside her apt in San Francisco? The owners kept trying to blame it on her for wearing perfume or having too much estrogen? A Los Angeles jury found the owner guilty and gave her a long sentence, but then an appeals judge knocked it down. Sick.
What happens when it attacks a kid?
“As we first reported, Cadillac had attacked another dog a while back and had actually just come home from a 3-week socialization program.”
wait – so sam sent her dog away to some bullshit doggy bootcamp to “socialize” it? that is so hollywood.
The dog needs to be put down. Plain and simple.
Dogs can be rehabilitated. For the dog’s sake, I’m kind of glad that it was sent away (out of the reach of animal control.) Maybe, hopefully, her family will socialize it and teach it how to behave.
I read an interesting story about how LA is having problems with increasing numbers of dog owners. I don’t remember where I read it… maybe LA Times?
The gist was that apartment complexes are increasingly permissive of dogs, including large breed dogs, which is dramatically increased the number of canines in the city limits.
However, this poses a problem, because there are lots of people who think it’s a great idea to own a Great Dane while living in an 8th floor studio. There is poop everywhere on the sidewalk, dogs barking, altercations (like this one) between unsupervised dogs…
Simply put, there are too many irresponsible owners who don’t have the time or knowledge to properly care for their dog’s needs.
A large dog like Samantha’s needs both exercise and mental stimulation. Dogs are pack animals– they need the comfort and company of their ‘pack’ (i.e. their human owner, who should be their Alpha.)
Too many dogs, too little space. Bound to be problems.
@ wonderful
I can tell by your sentiments you know nothing about the behavior of dogs; what you just said is your opinion.
“there are aggressive breeds. How or why they came to be that way (i.e.: inbreeding, drug dealer favourites) is irrelevant because at this point, it stands that they are predisposed toward violent and aggressive behaviour. I’m thinking ”
This makes absolutely no sense. There is a difference between aggression towards people and aggression towards animals. Any pitbull you see “viciously” running after someone is that way because of their owner – not because the dog was born that way.
Seriously – read a book on dog behavior. Then maybe you can stop spreading detrimental rumors like that.
I have a small dog and for some reason, he does not like big dogs. Not all (he is forever running away to the neighbors that have a Golden Retriever, he is obsessed with that dog, who know why), but when some get too close to him, he will sometimes snap in their faces. I’m not too sure what the deal is–either he feels threatened by their size or the big dog has inadvertently hurt his paws (he is forever hurting them). So to be conscientious, I usually pick him up when I see a big dog headed his way. I wish owners of big dogs would do the same and keep their big dogs on a leash and not insist “they are friendly.” Some small dogs don’t like big dogs, just like some big dogs don’t small dogs.
The woman who owns that Maltese must be devastated. A dog that has injured people on two occasions shouldn’t have a chance to harm anyone again. The pitbull should be put down.
jane16: I was actually living in SF at the time that poor woman was killed and it was horrifying. The fact that the owners never apologized and tried to blame the victim was unreal, and I distinctly remember the entire city (me included) hating their guts as a result.
I adore dogs and have never been without one or more in my life, but I also agree in full that owners need to take responsibility. If your dog tends to be aggressive yet you insist on living in an effing apartment complex, then make sure his ass doesn’t go outside unsupervised EVER. Or if he runs past you or one of your idiot friends when the door’s open, make sure everyone who visits knows to get him back inside immediately, ffs.
@Katyusha
It may make you feel good to dismiss Wonderful’s opinion as uninformed or ignorant… so “bully for you”; but certain breeds of dog were developed to fight. We’ve had the Roman example but there are also the bulldogs that were breed in the Industrial Revolution times to fight to the death. These are the dogs that will NEVER stop once the fight begins. They were the “working mens'” past time – dog’s that tore each other to pieces. In the modern days you’ll often hear of the descendent breeds now clamping their jaws down on the target and even when the owner punches their dog to make it let go, it wont. My point is, some breeds wont back down once the fight begins.
My maltese/shitzu was attacked two years ago by a dog off it’s leash in a dog walking area where it is compulsory to keep the one’s dog on a leash. It chased my dog around me, trapping my free hand and twisting the hand that held my leash. I was powerless to protect my own pet while the owner took ten seconds to even get there and choke hold his mongrel. To this day I am determined that if an unleashed dog runs up to me, I will first kick it in the face before it gets too close.
German shepards and other breeds of working dogs do attack but can be reigned in or pulled off by their owners. My dad owned a GS when he was a security guard. Bulls, staffs and the like are breeds that will continue fighting despite the owner’s efforts. If I see one of the bred-for-aggression breeds that you defend ever have a go at a child, and elderly person or a small dog – I’ll snap it’s damn leg. Then step on it’s throat. I’m 105kgs so that MIGHT stop the attack.
My dog is still alive but now barks at every dog he sees. Instead of a choke chain, I put him in a two-point harness and he is never out of my control. For nine years he was a well trained dog I’d raised from a puppy, but now I cannot stop him from aggressively barking at other dogs. But he has never bitten a dog or a child – like I said, I have him in control. He weighs 10 kgs so unlike a ridgeback, I can jerk him away if some other dog wanders over. It isn’t his fault, he’s been traumatised.
Samantha’s dog had a history. She also had a history of not keeping the dog under control. Regardless of whether her dog bit a human, it did kill a dog that didn’t stand a chance. Regardless of her dog’s history, as the owner of a dog nearly killed, I am adament that her bulldog must be put down. Too many owners of aggressive dogs think that a dog killing another dog is acceptable and just “dogs acting like dogs”, according to one Facebook staffy owner.
Wonderful is correct. Some dogs are “predisposed toward violent and aggressive behaviour”. What Wonderful said makes complete sense. Logical, and backed up by modern statistics. So, Katyusha, go “read a book” yourself.
its sams fault, not her poor dogs! i would rip her head off of her neck! i am a proud maltese mother and i would defend her if it was the last thing i did!!! stupid bitch sam. i hope her dog isnt killed.
I adopted a boxer/pitt mix and believe it or not he’s a total wuss! He barks to defend his territory but so far he is a total push over attention whore! The neighborhood kids love to tackle him and I was nervous at first since he’s newly adopted that he might attack but he didn’t. I understand that since he’s adopted I will never know his full history, but from what I’ve seen he’s been loved and well trained. We take great care to make sure he doesn’t jump on people or approach people who may not want to be approached by him.
But there’s also the “what if’s” we deal with as well. What if he bites. What if he attacks etc. A dog regardless of breed is a wild animal. If he gets it in his head to attack you or an animal he will. Do environmental factors apply, absolutely! So does their genetic predisposition to aggressive behavior.
My “baby” is the sweetest animal I’ve ever had. I also know that he has the capability to seriously hurt and possibly kill someone or another animal. So I use common sense and keep him on a leash that I hold close to me when others are around. Hopefully he never bites or attacks but if he does I will have no choice but to turn him over to animal control. Its a sad fact but I don’t want to be responsible for him hurting anyone.
still assuming TMZ speaks Gospel, huh?
Caddy did not bite the woman. Caddy has not bitten another human. And Caddy won’t be around much longer anyway.
For Samantha to lose the only family she has on the West Coast.. will that be enough for you witch-hunters?
———–
“Roache says the investigation will be “a long, lengthy process,” probably taking between two and three months.
In the meantime, Roache says the dog can stay with Ronson or her family members since it did not attack a person.
“We don’t believe there was a bite to any person,” says Roache. “If the dog has bitten a person it has to be quarantined for 10 days and we don’t allow the dog to leave the state.”
Ronson has reportedly shipped Cadillac off to New York to be with her family, and Roache says this is an acceptable arrangement.”
——
one more time: CADDY DID NOT BITE A HUMAN
In the meantime, Roache says the dog can stay with Ronson or her family members since it did not attack a person.
“We don’t believe there was a bite to any person,” says Roache.
from: http://www.eonline.com/uberblog/b198144_samantha_ronson_facing_criminal_probe.html
what i find interesting is according to x17 lohan’s name was on the report. Say what?
http://x17online.com/celebrities/samantha_ronson/samantha_ronson_facing_criminal_investigation_for_dog_attack-08312010.php
:'( that is so sad. The poor owner of the maltese! :(((
um HELLO! If ur dog kills groundhogs, there won’t be much stopping it from moving onto other animals.
A killer is a killer.
I don’t like the idea of putting dogs down, but they should do something about Sam’s dog…
@Annabelle I’m not sure how old you are, but dogs are supposed to kill small furry animals. They’re predators.
However, just because a dog wants to kill something doesn’t mean the owner should let it. I always have to watch my dogs because they’ll find rats or mice and kill them.
Also, you can’t blame the owner. I’ve had lots of dogs, and right now I have two adorable doxies with opposite personalities. My little Char-Char is a biter and Redgie never in his life tried to bite anyone. When little kids come up to us they can pet Redgie all they want, but I have to hold Char-Char or he’ll bite.
You should watch those groundhogs though, they can carry lyme disease and plague fleas.
so sad! especially for the little maltese 🙁
@KatScorp: If I were you, I would carry a 1.5 foot length of hose, doubled up. If a dog rushes you or your dog, a good crack across the bridge of the nose will stop most dogs and will certainly work much better than your foot.
I think Katyusha’s point was that no matter what a dog or breed’s trouble, man is responsible. And she is right. Bully breeds, especially pit bulls cannot be safely managed by the majority of owners who are clueless about the nature of their drives.
“If I were you, I would carry a 1.5 foot length of hose, doubled up. If a dog rushes you or your dog, a good crack across the bridge of the nose will stop most dogs and will certainly work much better than your foot.”
Crash2Go2, I hear where your coming from but you could kill a Collie or dog with that facial type doing that. That’s not a blanket defense against a dog. It certainly wouldn’t work on a pit if it got ahold of anything.
Also, the hose should be about a foot and half long, 2-3 inches in diameter with a wooden dowel inside it (So says Bill Koehler – his training method is excellent, particularly for problem dogs). If a dog is coming at you, you don’t want to be fumbling around with a hose.
How is it incorrect that I said it doesnt matter now HOW the dog or breed became aggressive (although it is of course a terribly sad scenario), the point is that NOW we are dealing with the consequences of people owning these dogs? I know quite a bit about dog behaviour, and I no where said that because a dog would attack another dog it means they would attack a human, however it is a terribly slippery slope and if you think you can trust a dog (particularly one thats proven itself to be aggressive), well, you are just fooling yourself. I know a few that tear off after anything SMALL, such as small dogs, cats or CHILDREN. I never made the claim that dogs are NATURALLY born aggresive, I said some breeds, ie: pitbulls, have been UNNATURALLY bred to be aggresive in my many areas THEREFORE they are actually born predisposed toward some form of aggression (as KatScope stated much better that I). You are not budging me from this point, particularly with the research that has come out of Ontario. My main point was that this part of the argument is largely irrelevant, as it doesnt really matter how the dog became aggresive the point is that it poses a threat NOW. I would love to stop all horrible breeders from doing what they do and to reverse thousands of years of fight-training, but we cant at this point, so I feel it is the responsible thing NOT to purchase such species of dog.
Thanks KatScorp you know what’s up!!
“Crash2Go2, I hear where your coming from but you could kill a Collie or dog with that facial type doing that. That’s not a blanket defense against a dog. It certainly wouldn’t work on a pit if it got ahold of anything.”
No, there is no blanket defense. But you have to do something. I’m curious though – wouldn’t a wooden dowel inserted make it even more lethal (if that is what we are worried about)?
Anyway, if a collie was rushing me or my dog with a look of murder in its eyes, I wouldn’t be too worried about whapping it one on the muzzle and accidentally killing it. But seeing as how collie attacks are about nil, the chances of that happening are also about nil (IMHO of course).
And you’re right, once a pit gets a hold, a hose is useless. The point of the crack across the bridge of the nose is to stop the attacking pit (personally, that would be the only breed type that I would really give a severe wack to) in its tracks before it gets a hold, because once a pit does get a hold, only a break stick and someone who knows how to use it can do that.
@Wonderful: Actually, it is very possible to breed dog aggression out of pit bulls. All it would take is a focused effort and some responsible breeding (and changing the breed standard).
Never said it wasnt possible, but as you said yourself it takes a responsible person willing to put in the effort. Unfortunatly this is not usually the case, particularly amongst the type of people who are drawn to pit bulls. I never said it wasnt possible to have a nice one, but would I ever trust said “nice one”? Never.
Dowells are pretty light, it’s essentially there to keep the hose rigid and give it more weight.
I think everyone with a Pit should learn how to use a break stick (and walk the dog with one). Here in Canada though its considered illegal dogfighting equipment/paraphernalia. I don’t know what individual US states have legislated in that regard, but that’s the only thing that will open a Pit’s mouth if it’s got something. Ok, that and a bullet but that’s it. They have a very, very high pain threshold – again though selective breeding in fighting dogs.
Personally though, I think the Japanese Tosa is a much more dangerous dog and they do fight them in Japan. It’s a big sport over there.
p.s. I love the dog threads, dogs are my passion 🙂
Maybe these apartment complexes (no matter how ritzy) shouldn’t allow dogs period. My year old Dane/Boxer mix is as friendly as can be to anyone that comes up to him when we are around. But if he’s home by himself he growls at everyone and anyone that sets foot on our property. (It’s very scary even if he’d just run away if they tested him because of his size.) Maybe both the dogs roaming the halls thought it was ‘their’ property?
edited to say: And our dog is afraid of our chinchilla!
Break sticks are legal in the US. And I completely agree with you that pit bull owners should carry them and know how to use them.
I love dogs too. I recently had to rehome my adorable Staffie due to having to move and changing from going to school from home to working full time out of the house. I love the bully breeds, and hate to see breed specific legislature if only because I know it doesn’t work and only puts the dogs in the hands of criminals. But I am realistic enough to know that very few people are willing to do the work that is required to own them responsibly, or to educate themselves about the breed or dogs in general. And I certainly can’t blame people for being afraid of them.
I can’t tell you how many clueless dog owners of other breeds would let their unleashed or even leashed dogs just come right up to Levi. Fortunately for me he never showed even a hint of dog aggression. I guess he looks pretty benign because he is not particularly stocky and is white with one black eye. His cuteness factor is high. 🙂
From what the report says it sounds to me like those most at fault are the people who let two dogs wander unattended and off their leashes in an apartment building. Whether or not this is Ronsen and the other owner I can’t say. Some dogs will dart out a door when they see the opertunity,that’s not really an excuse for letting them run free though. When I first got my dog (three month old puppy Rotty/SharPei mix, could potentialy be very agressive if not handled correctly) I was very careful about socializing her to as many people and dogs as possible. I was also very careful about the people around her, I even moved out of a house I had signed a year lease on because one of my roommates was so irresponsible about letting her roam around and would not follow my instructions on how to treat her (you’re not doing me a favor by walking her if you don’t know how to leash train a dog and thus end up undoing whatever I’ve managed to teach her) but it did take me several weeks to find a new place to live before I could leave. If something had happened during those weeks I would be devastated. Bottom line, if other people are going to be in a position to take care of your dog, you have to be willing to be a bitch and get in their faces and make sure they know what they should do, and put the fear of god in them should they not do it.
It can be hard, but dogs are every bit as much of a responsibility as a child. Boundaries, consistency and constantly knowing whats up with them are a must.
@ Wonderful
Understood, but by that logic, a TON of dogs have high prey drives and can have a tendency to be animal aggressive. It’s the job of the owner to curb those tendencies. When they owner doesn’t do that, the animal(s) suffers.
People need to be responsble for the animals – period, since dogs are not able to do that.
@Katyusha: It is normal for dogs to have prey drive – they are omnivores and need to hunt and eat prey. However, dog aggression is not a ‘normal’ drive. Dogs are very much pack animals and normally very social with their own kind. True, they will posture and threaten and even scuffle with strangers, but those types of tussles are usually all noise and very little injury.
No – dog specific ‘killer’ aggression had to bred for in order to get it to present reliably. The only reason we see so much of it these days is because of the enormous popularity of the pits and other ‘bully’ breeds and their mixes.
The Maltese should have been on a leash. If a smaller dog is provoking a larger dog, the larger dog can easily take down the smaller dog with one bite. Unfortunate but true.
Those of you wondering how the dog got around to biting the other person. I once saw two dogs that belonged to the same family fighting. The idiot father instructed his six year old son to ‘go in there and break it up’. The kid got bitten, obviously, but I don’t blame the dog one bit. If you get between two fighting dogs, you’re getting bit and it’s your own fault (or in the case I mentioned, your idiot parent’s fault). Did this lady try to reach into the bulldog’s mouth and remove her dog? Then she should have expected the bite.
Also, pit bulls originally were not bred to fight, but to tenderize. Yep.
And just because the news said it was a pit, doesn’t mean it was a pit. Your average person can’t tell bully breeds apart.
Labradors bite more than any other dog breed.
**The more you know**
Wow, here in my county in North Carolina, they would have either taken the dog for 10 days or made her separate him for the time. Long ago, my chow chow attacked my fiance. (long story with human being stupid and getting between a dog fight.) When I called animal control, they got all of my information – including that I was going to have the vet put him down the next day at whatever appointment time – and then made me keep him segregated and alive for 10 days. After that time, I ended up keeping him but always looked at him differently. (Had to eventually put him down when he started going deaf and blind and he tried to attack me.) It was incredibly stressful, especially when I had to take him to the vet.
Poor owner and Maltese… And if the dog had a history of biting, he should’ve had a muzzle on to be near anyone. That’s the least a responsible owner should do, which it seems that Sam isn’t.
She says she wishes she could offer more than condolences. She can. $$$$$. Hopefully, the owner of that poor maltese will see a check soon, and a new puppy as well.
“Also, pit bulls originally were not bred to fight, but to tenderize. Yep.
And just because the news said it was a pit, doesn’t mean it was a pit. Your average person can’t tell bully breeds apart.
Labradors bite more than any other dog breed.
**The more you know** ”
To tenderize? That’s just fascinating. Links please?
Labs may bite more, but pits and their mixes have the highest fatality rate to both humans and dogs. And that is a fact.
I love the people that come on here, make wildly uneducated claims, and then condescendingly infer that others shoud educate themselves as they have. Bravo Laura, you have educated yourself with propaganda.
Alyssa, I have been a fan of yours for a long time and a cheer you on for being a mother. Congratulations and I pray all goes well with your new baby.-Marly