So it looks like there is much, much more to the story with this whole Jack White and Karen Elson thing. I’m still so disappointed in them! I thought their divorce was going to be restrained and hipster-cool, but it’s turning into one of the nastiest, most bitter custodial battles we’ve seen in a while. As we discussed on Friday, Karen’s side of the story is that Jack was threatening and harassing her via email, and she worried that he would turn violent, so she got a restraining order against him. But Jack White is fighting back legally and PR-wise.
First, TMZ got their hands on some of the emails Jack sent Karen – you can read them here, if you want. Apparently, Jack really, really hates Dan Auerbach of The Black Keys and Jack doesn’t want to “lumped in together” with Dan and TBK. Their kids go to the same school, I guess, which was Karen’s decision. Jack also let TMZ know what this was really all about:
Jack White is adamant he is NOT a violent person nor is he a threat to his family — and his estranged wife was just trying to smear him when she got a restraining order … this according to legal docs.
Jack filed the docs in TN in response to the restraining order Karen Elson temporarily obtained against him — it’s all part of the couple’s nasty divorce that’s been going on since she filed last year.
In his docs, Jack says Karen often leaves the kids with him (as recently as last month) … arguing that’s not the behavior of a woman who believes he’s dangerous.
Jack also says Karen recently told a friend, “I’m completely in love with Jack and I’d move back tomorrow if he asked me.”
Jack’s convinced — Karen’s so-called fear was made up as a ploy to “malign him in the public record” … and wants to make it clear he’s not a “scary or violent person”.
Jack’s also asking a judge to establish a temporary parenting plan … since he and Karen clearly can’t come to an agreement themselves.
Apparently, Jack also gave the court some emails that Karen had written to him where she was complimenting his parenting style, saying, “You’re an amazing father, I’m so glad we had these kids together.” While the restraining order still stands – it was a temporary measure granted by a judge – it means that Jack can only contact Karen about their children and that’s it. Karen has filed legal papers claiming that Jack’s harassing emails were part of a “pattern of husband’s bullying wife into submission was a contributing factor in the demise of their marriage.”
As for these new wrinkles… I don’t know. I don’t really think anyone should lose custody of their kids just because they were venting some stuff out via email. I read some of the emails, and while Jack seems like a nitpicky bastard, he doesn’t seem harassing or violent at all. Temperamental? Sure. Pissed off about the custody arrangement? Sure. But it seems more like a guy who is venting than a guy who is threatening his ex. I don’t know. It seems like a messy custody fight rather than violence or the threat of violence.
Photos courtesy of PR Photos and WENN.
Maybe he started dating and she is pissed and now is punishing him.
With so many deadbeat dads out there I don’t understand a mother actively trying to keep a dad away from their kids.
I think we should see ALL the emails before we dismiss this under the “bitter wife” trope. Its not like he is going to leak the incriminating emails to TMZ.
Also, this guy has a dodgy history. Didnt he beat up some concert goer or something like to the point of near death? Not that it makes him guilty of this too……… but violent people often have a pattern.
Two things:
1) Since he (allegedly) leaked the emails that are clearly not threatening she could have also leaked any emails that did show threats and/or violence
2) She left their kids with him as recently as last month. Most people wouldn’t leave their kids with someone who they thought was violent or mentally unstable.
Also, Jason Stolsteimer (if that’s what you’re referring to) got a black eye. I would hardly call that “beaten the point of near death.”
No he definitely did not ‘beat up some concert goer until near death.’ Someone tried to say something like this in the comments to the other post, too. Don’t know where it’s coming from. He punched a guy in another band he had a long history with (he produced their first record when he was dating a girl who used to be in the band) and gave him a nasty black eye back in 2003.
They’re not emails he’s leaking; they’re the actual emails she submitted to the court as proof of him threatening her. They’re part of the record, so that’s why everyone has access and is saying they’re not really violent.
Oh. Let me get this straight. Black eyes don’t count. It only counts if you beat the other person half to death?
On the TMR Vault he said that he went on a date with a blonde woman recently.
Sounds like a typical divorce that has been seriously blown out of proportion. If she doesn’t want him, I’ll take him.
agreed.
In this situation people can show the worst.
Not violent? Tell that to the lead singer of the Von Bondies.
seriously…aggravated assault because someone “ignored” you?
http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1483850/jack-white-be-charged-with-assault.jhtml
dude’s got issues.
It’s never ok to punch someone as far as I’m concerned, but it wasn’t about ‘being ignored’ (quite the opposite – Jason had been trash talking for years.) It was also ten years ago, and no women were involved.
not saying he’s not a jackass (he is) but a fight between two men from ten years ago has nothing to do with how he acts towards his wife/kids. that should have nothing to do with this situation.
While I agree that this was a ridiculous fight, I know quite a few guys that will fight at the bars or with each other. There’s a world of difference between that and domestic abuse. We don’t know the whole story with this one here so I’m waiting before I judge.
That’s a good point (bar fighting vs. domestic violence), but I’m not reserving judgment because she was granted a restraining order. It’s not looking good on his part.
@Bns there’s a big difference between an emergency rrstraining order and ‘permanent’ one. The emrgency orders are for 2 weeks, and are typicslly granted and then you state a more thorough case in front of the judge at some point within those 2 weeks. Basically, Karen’s lawyer just showed up amd requested the emergency order.
Scarlett used to go to the same school as my daughter and Jack dropped her off every day. Seemed like an incredibly involved Dad.
The day the restraining order was filed I saw him at a baseball game with them, it was really cute.
Yes, he sounds like a Type A, emotionally frustrated man who is actively being separated from his children! And Karen’s restraining order screams custody battle antics—she is really trying to stick it to him.
Agreed. I feel so bad for him, because this reminds me of the crap my boyfriend’s ex-wife tries to pull every time she tries to change the custody arrangement(he got full custody in their divorce. That should say something). I’d be pissed too if I had a verbal agreement with someone only to have them break it and proceed to get a restraining order out against me as a custody battle ploy.
I just don’t get why she’s behaving like this. Money?
But your comment reminds me of my nephew’s sperm donor. My nephew is turning five this year, and his sperm donor has paid child support MAYBE three times. And as soon as he found out my sister was bringing him to court for child support, he quit his job. Real prize there.
And Lord, your boyfriend’s ex wife must be a piece of work, because from what I hear/read the courts favor the women when it comes to custody battles.
@virgillia so do you call your nephews dead beat dad the sperm donor?
@Bijlee
Yes! Because that’s what he is. He put my sister through all this crap, convincing her to move to a different state because he “loved her” and he was going to take care of both of them and they were going to be a family. Not! He has contributed less than a hundred bucks to my nephew’s welfare. I’m convinced that the only reason he even sees him is to inconvenience my sister.
When my nephew was born, my parents pretty much bought him everything he needed. My sister couldn’t buy a case of diapers with the amount she received in child support…literally. Her first child support check was less than twenty dollars….every two weeks.
The majority of my cousins are in this situation i.e. with the baby daddy either being useless and/or absent (one of my cousin’s sperm donor’s actually moved out of the state when he found out she was pregnant), so let’s just say I’m learning what not to do once I hit 21 (or sooner).
Why do you ask?
@virgilla girl lol no. I sincerely hope I haven’t offended you. I just wanted to be clear because I call my “dad” the same thing! Im just glad ofher people are like that. I hate referring to him as father or dad because it implies some sort of emotional connection with the man that I simply do not have. It’s a word that means a lot to me so to bestow it on undeserving scum is just what I hate most. I’m in the same situation as you.
Most of the divorced fathers I have seen do ABSOLUTELY nothing to deserve the title father or dad. They don’t do sh*t for their kids and don’t get nearly the same amount of criticism. And then it’s always the mother that has to put up with her children’s tantrums and bad attitudes because she’s actually the one disciplining and raising them. Then these loser dads get changed and come back asking for forgiveness much later in life when the raising of the child isn’t necessary anymore.
These moronic sperm donors deserve it. I just don’t think they get enough shaming. Yes ladies I’m well aware that there are good fathers who are unfairly treated by their ex partners. But let’s get real. On a worldwide basis there are so many more deadbeat loser dads that disrespect the mother of their children and don’t take responsibility for these kids than there are moms of this same nature. Fathers that love their kids and take an active role, strive to make sure they do as much as the mothers, other parent whatever should be just as annoyed with these loser dads and shame them too.
And note I’m not saying this about jack white. I like him and respect his work. By all accounts he sounds like a good dad. I’m just talking in general.
Also I hate the idea of using celebrities as role models because I just don’t like that idea. And it’s typically the web who are expected to be role models. Women don’t need role models. The guys do. It would be nice of there was an expectation on men to be good role models more.
…end rant.
@Bijlee
I wasn’t offended, just curious as to why you asked.
I agree completely. I’ve never met my sperm donor, and I don’t ever want to. I already have a Dad…who may annoy me sometimes, and had a rough start with learning how to be a good parent, but he’s still my dad, and he has been since he was 21.
The ironic thing is that my sperm donor wants to meet with me and my twin, now that the child support ends this year. All I have to say is hell no. Never. Not in a million years. I might want to meet my brothers, but not him.
The kicker is that he has five kids with his current wife, five or six other boys w/ other women, and I have a sister out there. Yeah, so he’s been spreading it around for quite some time.
I referred to my deadbeat dad as the sperm donor, too. Drove my brother nuts… But remember we’re mammals, not birds. Mother Nature never really intended the females to be dependent on male help and often part of the mother’s job is to protect the young against the male. Even among social primates like us, the males are dispensable after they’ve performed the sperm donor role. I’m sure that is why females are actually sturdier than males and typically have less self-destructive tendencies. Mother Nature doesn’t care if the guys kill themselves off in pointless life-threatening activities, sad but true. Some males are nice to the kids even in other primates, but they are still raised by the females. Human males are certainly capable of bonding with infants and becoming real fathers in the sense of someone really raising the child as a mother would, but many don’t. It’s their loss, judging from the real fathers I’ve known. For human males, it gives a better purpose to their lives as well as providing a kind of insurance if anything happens to the mother and it considerably reduces stress on the mother if she has a true and equal partner. The over-rated protective role of the male is mainly to protect against other males, which is a problem in general in primate societies. But females can and do band together to do the protecting, both against a violent sperm donor and other males, and humans are especially capable of this. Isolated living arrangements make it easy to forget this capability. If we all accepted responsibility for all the kids in our community rather than thinking each family unit should sink or swim on its own, we would be in much better shape and more true to our social primate nature.
And (if she’s lying about him being violent towards her, for me, signs point to yes) she should be thanking her lucky stars that he’s someone who doesn’t dump the kids on her, and go off chasing the latest.
As someone who’s sperm donor forced my mom to go get a paternity test, while swearing up and down that me and my twin brother weren’t his, AND telling my mom that if she brought him to court for child support that we would never have a relationship with him-I’d love it if he had accepted his responsibility as a whore and man’d up.
It’s crap like that^^^ that makes people praise men (when it should be expected, not rare) for taking care of their responsibilities. Same with women.
He doesn’t seem violent? Are you kidding me? He was arrested in the past for aggravated assault.
I really wish people would stop sanitizing the behavior of these guys. And worse still going for the bitter woman stereotype to blame HIS behavior on. If you ever find yourself wondering why men get away with horrendously violent behavior, it is because of victim blaming attitudes like that.
@Merritt
Very well said. Totally agree.
@ Merritt I see what you mean, and I certainly don’t condone the assault he committed, but I know quite a few blokes who get violent with other guys (pubs + football matches springs to mind, again not condoning it), but would never even think of laying a finger on their partners or kids. Aggressive in some situations does not always equal domestically abusive.
edited to add: psychologically, domestic violence is very different from other types of violence, hence why most domestic violence advocates do not recommend anger management courses for abusers.
I agree to a point. I don’t think you should start calling someone violent until there’s absolute proof. Getting into a terrible fight with a GUY in the past does not prove domestic violence. The full story isn’t out there. My husband got into a terrible fight with his sister’s ex, and he’s never laid a finger on me (or he’d be an ex himself). I think the bitter woman/violent man crap applied more to the Denise Richards situation of years ago, when Charlie Sheen painted her that way, and people believed him, despite the fact that he had a history of attacking his exes (i.e. shooting Kelly Preston). There is not enough information to make an informed decision here.
The thing about waiting for absolute proof, it is often ends with someone getting seriously hurt or killed.
I don’t know enough about him, so I have not heard about him blowing up at fans. But what I am saying is that ONE incident that was not a domestic one does not prove that he’s violent or an abuser. The tone of his emails sounded more frustrated than violent. I don’t like kangaroo courts.
He screamed at concert goers in 2010. In 2012 he ended a show abruptly with no explanation.
He sounded like a controlling jerk in the emails. He is upset because the kids are going to school with the kids of someone he hates. And he doesn’t want to sit near that person. Is he he 5? Seriously, he doesn’t sound concerned about the kids, he is concerned about himself. Yet he accuses her of selfishness.
In another one he is complaining about the fact that the attorney told him not to communicate with the ex. Yet he continued to do so. He was warned and he ignored it. That is harassment.
The emails posted were all from the same day, and yet he is all over the place in them. He sounds scary and unstable.
That happened 10 years ago. If he had repeat offenses I’d be worried about it, but getting in a (rather one-sided) fight one time when you’re young and drunk isn’t an indicator of future domestic abuse.
He also has a history of blowing up at fans.
I’ll never understand why people feel the need to apologize for someone else’s bad behavior.
Meanwhile his ex is automatically assumed to be in the wrong. Yet, his emails reveal that he has a very controlling demeanor. You don’t have to touch a person, to be an abuser. Abuse can be emotional as well. He complains that she reneged on an agreement, but it also sounds like he continued to contact her despite attorneys telling him not to.
@Merritt,
I’ve been a fan for years and been to many shows and I’ve never experienced whatever you’re talking about.
I’ve been to concerts where I wished he would have blown up at some of the ‘fans’ near me. I’ve seen people throw stuff, tackle little girls to get to the front, talk throughout the whole show, get mad at people who were standing because they wanted to sit, etc.
@mercy; well there was that one time with the dead weather when they played an exclusive rich hipster crowd and he got a little buzzed and shouted at them for acting bored to try to look cool. other than that i can’t think of anything.
I don’t think that his ex was automatically assumed to be in the wrong. If you look at the posts from Friday most people took her side at first and cited how disappointed they were in him. It was only after his emails to her were released that peopled started thinking that maybe she’s pulling a “Halle Berry”. This boils down to 1 of 2 things:
He either wants to start dating or is in a relationship OR she wants to move back to England with the kids. Either way, hell hath no fury and all that.
Aside from the 2003 assault (which I felt was own way out of proportion) all you’re rrally describing is a guy who’s a dick, but not even a controlling one (and yes, I am quite familiar with controlling behavior within the context of relationship violence). I wouldn’t necessarily want to hang out with the guy, but none of this is evidence of relationship violence. And when your biggest evidence is a 10 year old arrest, atime when he yelled at someone during a concert 3 years ago, and a time 2 years ago when he walked off stage, your evidence is flimsy.
Ok I’ve read the emails he wrote.
The point is:
“if you are trying to say you want me to see my kids two days a week you’re crazy”
I see there’s a man who’s seriously pissed by his ex-wife behavior,and who wants to be involved in his kids life.
I think this woman is trying to use the law against violence to her own advantage.
Bitter divorce, I feel sorry for the kids.
Sounds like a narcissis, turning things around so everyone jumps on the “bitter ex-wife”. I feel bad for Karen.
Except of course when it was Seal, who happens to be a big black guy.
Next she will be accusing him of sexual abuse of their kid(s).
What a beautiful couple. Not.
One incident of violent behavior 10 years ago doesn’t make him automatically an abuser. The Von bondies guy was a total ahole who stole a bunch of money from the band. I remember jw was defending his gf at the time. I think a supermodel is stuck in Nashville and she’s trying to move.
Maybe this whole problem of his is the reason why Meg White had that performance anxiety problem? Just putting it out there…who really knows?
I’m pretty sure that Meg married her 2nd husband in his backyard well after the White Stripes broke up. Also, he is still supposedly friends with Renee Zellweger. It has always seemed to me that he maintained a good relationship with his exes. Also, if he was really violent and threatening toward Ms. Elson, it most likely would have happened at the beginning of their marriage, not 2 years into divorce proceedings. Something in the milk ain’t clean.
Meg did get married at Jack and Karen’s home, and Meg’s husband played in Karen’s band.
Meg has always been shy and quiet. She even said it had nothing to do with Jack, it’s just who she is.
Abuse can start at any time in a relationship, but to include the kids in the TRO and then leave them with him right after it was signed (and these past few days, based on sightings) makes it seem like the TRO was posturing or legal maneuvering to sway the judge and gain an advantage in court. If the comments here on Friday in response to the TRO were any indication, it worked in the court of public opinion.
It feels totally intrusive reading the emails. But I don’t see how they prove anything in terms of hatred, violence or threats. He’s saying he’s fed up with her dragging out the divorce and he wants to be involved in parenting and is upset that he can only the kids twice a week. He comes across as frustrated with her and frustrated that he cant be in the kids lives more. Just to say Alot of times one person drags their feet just to be ugly. Its a way to control the partner especially if the other person wants to move on. Anyone that drags out a divorce, well thats not really good for the kids either. To me this sounds like Halle Berry/Gabe situation.
She wants more money. Simple.
If she reduces his visitation she’ll get a bigger payout or she might even take the children to live in England.
She’s a vindictive cow.
I don’t know who I feel worse for, Jack or the rugrats. A friend of mine who I no longer speak to pulled the same sh*t on her husband when she got a divorce, ended up with full custody. He only got visitation once a month, slipped into a depression, and nearly killed himself. I don’t even know how it happened, the guy wouldn’t even kill an ant, let alone lay a finger on his kids.
One incident 10 years ago does not a domestic abuser make, ESPECIALLY if that incident did not involve a domestic situation.
I obviously don’t know the ins & outs, but, based on all the evidence presented so far, he seems like a really involved father who is pissed that his ex is using custody/visitation as leverage to get what she wants. $20 says she is doing so under the advice if her attorney, but its still shitty.
I hope this all gets worked out quickly & with as minimal damage to the kids as possible
+1
I don’t even know when that ish happened with Jason Stolsteimer but I’m pretty sure that it was before he had kids. Relevant because for most people, having kids calms you down somewhat and you tend to think before you act i.e., no longer getting into bar fights.
I’m starting to hope he gets custody, as bad as it may sound. Despite the tempestuous side of his personality, he wants to be an involved parent while it’s looking like she’s trying to win some more money and move the kids across the ocean.
I’m more and more on jack whites side now. Its disappointig that they can’t seem to settle this amicably. But ever since last weeks article jack seems to be responsible and more willing to settle this appropriately. I wonder how this leaking of information affects their case now. Does it have an effect?
He sounds like a controlling nut in the emails. But to get a restraining order and claim you’re afraid for not only yourself but for your kids cmon! It sounds like she’s punishing him for something. I’d venture to guess it’s either money or jealously.
I’m absolutely positive that he is a moody C U Next Tuesday but show me ONE artist who is not. Every artistic person I’ve ever known has been moody and controlling. That does not translate to abuse. If she is making this up it will backfire on her because when their kids are older they will resent her for it.
Controlling behavior is emotional abuse. It is amazing how easily and quickly people dismiss that.
Emotional abuse is demeaning a person into submission and doing things such as threatening self-harm to get what they want. I don’t see anything emotionally abusive, just a rightfully stressed out man who doesn’t know how to properly react.
I agree, but who’s guilty of that here? Him, her, both, or neither? I’m thinking both, and she’s using the kids and lawyers as part of her quest for control, or the upper hand.
There’s still a difference between being a type-a control freak and being controlling within a relationship. HUGE difference. And to be honest, its this kind of stuff that actually minimizes the experience of those who are within controlling, emotionally violent relationships.
Team Jack.
love the pink eyeshadow.
He seems very passionate about his career and kinda obsessive. But violent? I don’t see that anywhere in those emails.. Pretty sure he is a guy who is hard to handle, my way or the highway type, but I don’t see violence.
As a divorced woman myself I think it’s normal to hate/love your ex and that can change daily. My ex and I fought bitterly for a while. Luckily we seem to be agreeable concerning our son. I think you can choose just how bitter you want to be. You can choose to hate or let it go. BUT if indeed one party gets violent…by all means a TPO is called for. Who knows what really went on behind closed doors?
Jack White may be a bit of a hot head, but I’ve never heard anything about him being abusive to anyone, including his women or children. The emails are quite tame and appear to merely reflect understandable frustration.
It looks to me as if his soon-to-be-ex is being a melodramatic bi!ch in an effort to get what she wants.
Like someone pointed out above, divorce brings out the worst in all involved and if in Jack’s case that means some emotional emails, that doesn’t seem so incriminating to me.
i’m surprised she got a restraining order based on those emails alone, very mild if you ask me
Don’t assume that a restraining order means he’s violent. A good friend of mine had a restraining order taken out against him by an angry ex, he literally hadn’t contacted her at all, she was just vindictive and wanted to humiliate him! I love Jack White’s music, but I think it’s petty if this is boiling down to him not wanting his kids to go to school with Dan Auerbach’s kids, there’s another site with a whole bunch about that and how JW thinks the Black Keys have ripped him off, which I think is bs, I love the Black Keys too. However, I’ll wait and see how thing whole thing plays out…
I agree that is petty. He should be able to put whatever differences he has with Black Keys guy aside for the sake of his kids. It’s very immature and he should be embarrassed.
This is getting tedious already. Just hug it out, man.
I was jumping on the a-hole bandwagon the other day so as not to be naive, but now I’m thinking unless we see proof of real threats and violence toward Karen, this is another nasty split complicated by children being caught in the middle. I really don’t want to think he’s awful unless he actually is.
Did anyone here actually read the emails?….just curious because on Friday just about everyone on the board talked so much trash! It seems that almost everyone who has read them can agree that in no way does he seem violent or aggressive. Temp restraining orders are so easy to obtain. I had a friend get one after she got one (I repeat ONE) text message from a disgruntled former employee. I had another get one when her ex showed up at her dorm room one to many times. The ex never threatened her he just made her uncomfortable….and sometimes that is all it takes. Plus, the fact that Karen has raved about what a good father Jack is should make you all question this. Apparently she also left her kids with him willingly for 10 days recently. All this from someone who is supposedly scared for her and her kids safety.
I have nothing but respect for Jack, much more inlcined to believe him than Karen. meg is well known to suffer from an anxiety disorder which prevented her from playing in public, hence why she decided to leave the band.
Im not going to judge either way until I know more of the story.