As I discussed and reviewed over the weekend, I went to see The Fifth Estate. I was one of the few people who did see it this weekend. The Fifth Estate did worse than “bomb” – it only made $1.7 million at the box office. Some of the anti-Cumber people (the same ones who troll me in the comments, I see you h8rs) wondered why I wasn’t discussing the fact that it “bombed” or whatever word you want to describe its terrible performance. I don’t know what to tell you, quite honestly. I didn’t expect it to be a big box office success, but I did think it would do better box office than that. Maybe Julian Assange’s anti-Fifth Estate campaign worked (ha). Or maybe audiences didn’t want to see the Assange story dramatized. Or maybe it wasn’t a very good movie, save for Benedict Cumberbatch’s performance. Entertainment Weekly had a breakdown of what went wrong:
The Toronto Film Festival is the springboard for movies with Oscar aspirations. The last six Best Picture winners played in Toronto, so when the festival named The Fifth Estate its opening-night premiere, people assumed that Bill Condon’s WikiLeaks movie starring Benedict Cumberbatch as the frosty Julian Assange was a bona fide Oscar contender. Condon has an Oscar pedigree (Gods and Monsters), Assange is a mysterious, polarizing figure who remains in the headlines, and Cumberbatch is an on-the-verge actor with a passionate fanbase. The Fifth Estate had all the makings of another Toronto success story, like Argo or Silver Linings Playbook.
But The Fifth Estate stumbled out of the gate with a lukewarm reception in Toronto, and that verdict was nothing compared to the giant collective yawn that awaited the film upon its opening weekend. Critics were unkind, but nowhere near as callous as the paying public. Playing in more than 1,700 theaters, the cyber-thriller earned just $1.7 million, making it one of the limpest opening weekends of any wide release this year. Paranoia, the Harrison Ford/Gary Oldman corporate espionage stinker, performed better. As did Movie 43, the star-studded comedy anthology designed to make The Kentucky Fried Movie look like Casablanca. Not the neighborhood any movie wants to find itself, much less one with such high hopes.
“We’re certainly disappointed by the results,” Dave Hollis, Disney’s distribution chief, told Variety, “and we’re still trying to figure out the ‘whys.’”
When it comes to the “whys,” there are many, starting with the critical verdict that the film just wasn’t up to snuff. A film like The Fifth Estate can’t afford to be mediocre, and it needs that fall film-festival bounce. The American public is somewhat familiar with Julian Assange and WikiLeaks, but not everyone is up to speed on the website’s M.O. and the squirrelly guy who runs it. (Even professional news organizations struggled to wrap the ongoing story up neatly for the public.) To get them to the theater, people need to be told they can’t afford to miss it. Instead, beginning a month ago in Toronto and culminating with this week’s unenthusiastic reviews, audiences were essentially told that the movie was a dud.
But it was more than just the critics. Disney opened the movie in 1,769 theaters, which sounds like a decent number, but in industry speak, it’s no-man’s land. Fall-festival favorites with Oscar ambitions typically open small and gain steam — like 12 Years a Slave hopes to do after opening in 18 theaters last weekend — or they open wide with a huge splash around the holidays. It’s extremely rare for a film to split the difference (though, to be fair, Flight pulled it off last November with flying colors). After the Fifth Estate‘s underwhelming showing in Toronto, Disney may not have known what it had on its hands and tried to hedge its bets.
Since I mentioned Flight above, it’s also worth noting that that movie starred Denzel Washington, an actor with a stellar box-office track record. As popular as Cumberbatch is because of his roles in TV’s Sherlock and in the recent Star Trek movie, we now know he’s not yet someone who can carry a movie. In fact, it will be interesting to see if the stench of Fifth Estate sticks to him in any way moving forward. And might it hinder his Oscar chances for his two other promising movies: 12 Years and August: Osage County?
I suspect that he will be spared this season, just as most critics found something interesting and redeeming in his portrayal of Assange even as they disparaged the movie. But Cumberbatch’s future as a “movie star” is murky, even though it’s unclear if that’s his endgame.
“Based on his choices, his focus seems to be on building an interesting career rather than trying to become a star quickly,” says Tom Heller of Everest Entertainment, the company behind Mud and 127 Hours. “He is picking unique and challenging projects with talented directors, even if his roles are part of an ensemble. The real test may be how The Imitation Game and The Lost City of Z perform, since he will be the lead in both of them. But he is hugely talented, and there are not a lot of actors quite like him at the moment.”
The latter film, The Lost City of Z, based on David Grann’s book about the ill-fated 1925 Amazon adventure of British explorer Percival Fawcett, was once set to star Brad Pitt, so it sizes up to be that tricked-out star vehicle that should settle the matter of whether Cumberbatch has what it takes once and for all. (Pitt’s Plan B is still producing, and Paramount will distribute the movie, which is still in pre-production and tentatively slated for a 2015 release.) Paramount did not immediately respond to EW’s request about the current status of that project.
Meanwhile, Julian Assange must be experiencing mixed emotions. On one hand, he was a vocal critic of the film, warning potential audiences that it was not only biased and unfair against him, but just flat-out bad. Over the weekend, WikiLeaks offered free downloads of their own documentary, titled Mediastan, to level the playing field. Assange seemed vindicated by the poor reviews of The Fifth Estate, but I can’t help wonder if the public’s apathy toward the movie packs a sting for a man who’s been accused of gross narcissism once or twice. After all, at least Mark Zuckerberg was subjected to a top-notch movie that people still talk about, enhancing his fame in the process. Assange may not have liked Cumberbatch’s portrayal, but I suspect he likes being ignored even less.
Granted, I’m a ride-or-die Cumberbitch, but I think this assessment is particularly harsh: “we now know he’s not yet someone who can carry a movie.” Um, I actually saw the movie. He did his best to carry it, and if he had been working with a better script (and director), this would be a different story. Maybe the movie still would have bombed (I do think people are tired of Julian Assange in general, although Assange still fascinates me), but at least Benedict would have gone down with a fight.
But yes, maybe it will be a while before Benedict gets another starring role in a big Hollywood movie. But is that really the worst thing? English actors are just different from American actors. Benedict has always been happy moving back and forth from Sherlock to theater to miniseries to film, whatever strikes his fancy, and he has mostly good taste in projects. And what’s the worst you can say about him at this point? That he’s an amazing television actor who should stick to character work in films? That despite starring in one of the biggest bombs of the year, he’s also in two of the presumptive Best Picture Oscar nominees, August: Osage County and 12 Years a Slave? So… there you go. YEAR OF CUMBERBATCH CANCELED. Sigh… I need to see Benedict’s sex gloves.
Photos courtesy of WENN.
So I guess this keeps him at B+ list for now.
Hey now, that’s INTERNATIONAL B+. 😉
I dunno, I guess different camps can and DO put a different spin on it. Largely, it seems like, while most of the response to TFE was, er, lukewarm, let’s say, the response to Cumberbatch seemed to be largely positive. I don’t think anyone would argue that BC isn’t talented. It’s an interesting juxtaposition- the movie wasn’t great, but BC, the main character, was. Highlights the fact that great performances from actors can’t always save a crappy/boring/slow/whatever story or script.
So, I sort of think he comes away with a win and a loss, maybe? So, we’ll call it a draw. Not an overwhelming success, but not a complete and total loss. He’s got other great projects lined up, and he’s got some cool stuff coming up, so, really, I think the Cumber-ascent is still in progress. Perhaps slowed, but still going.
That wasn’t a cut to Cumby, I really have nothing against him (or for him for that matter). He is almost A list because he has a huge fanbase and everyone wants to work with him but until he can prove to the studios that he can “carry a film” he can’t classify as A list yet…
@magpie
Oh, no no, I didn’t think you were mkaing a cut at him! I actually think I agree! He’s not A list yet.
International B+ was a bit of a (bad) joke… I think it was the Katie show where one of the tweets called him an international star, and Katie had to make a point about the wording of it…
I saw it. Impressively, after the first minute I forgot that Benedict is Benedict and just saw Assange – great work on his part. The movie itself is not great. Not enough character development, rawness, standard Hollywood crap version of reality. I am glad it didn’t do well. I am actually going to watch Mediastan.
As far as Benedict carrying a movie, we’ll see, but let’s just agree that he stole Star Trek hook line and sinker. As long as he keeps choosing good roles for himself, he can’t go wrong. Since he is doing such diverse roles, he won’t get shelved, as many do, and with his talent, he’ll always get great jobs.
Fangirls will make any excuses, nothing new. I’m just really happy that this film bombs big time. His obnoxius PR obviously didn’t work.
I actially blame the studio on putting it in wide release. This movie had “limited screening” all over it. studios do it all the time, thinking they can bank on an actor’s fame for an obvious arthouse fare.anyway, this won’t mark him. He still has 12 years, august osage, the hobbit and Sherlock’s 3rd season going for him. Year of the Cumberbatch not canceled!
“He is picking unique and challenging projects with talented directors, even if his roles are part of an ensemble.”
This sums him up to me. Especially if the rumours of him doing Oldman’s Hamlet late next year are true.
I don’t think being a box office star is as important to him as making connections and doing a variety of projects that interest him and earn respect in the industry.
That’s obviously just my opinion.
Long live Sherlock!
+1 love love love Sherlock…
I love Sherlock too! I guess I was one of the h8er commenters lol. I really don’t blame Cumby though, I’ve heard his acting was great in it. I blame just a bad movie with bad word of mouth.
Yes his acting was good but by the end I didn’t care about any if the characters.
How silly. If it bombed, it’s nothing to do with Cumberbatch. Julian Assange is a bore, & people are not interested enough in this story to go out of their way to see it.
I don’t think it would have made any difference who the actors were. Cumby is a great actor, so I wouldn’t pin this on him.
What does bother me about this, is that Julian Assange is taking credit for it bombing! “Yeah, I called it—Boom!” he seemed to say.
Don’t mind me replying here, I just wanted to post the link to a slightly modified version of that second picture but couldn’t find a proper spot:
http://cumberbum.tumblr.com/post/63589195623/x
Good god, it’s too early for that kind of carry on!
@Eve,
It’s never too early in the day to be reminded of what’s *really* important!
@ Lindy:
Fair enough. Let me throw some cold water on you…
http://25.media.tumblr.com/0e0d93ebba5a9554065e776f6deb4d17/tumblr_mv12j4Ugbt1rxuk52o4_r1_1280.jpg
The first two are kinda sexy though:
http://25.media.tumblr.com/b14b7ea08d271ac72ba8338ec61e43aa/tumblr_mv12j4Ugbt1rxuk52o1_1280.jpg
Clenched butt cheeks in the second one…Yummy!!!:
http://24.media.tumblr.com/0944e8fa6ca42bff873162da16084f53/tumblr_mv12j4Ugbt1rxuk52o2_1280.jpg
I need to second EsCon here – it is never too early for that kind of thing. God bless Eve.
@Eve
I still would, in his lovely grey tracksuit bottoms which wouldn’t last long around me. I bet there are people photoshopping themselves under him.
and can we talk about his arms?…sweet Jesus.
*fans self*
@ Miss J- I sent you morning kisses in the Julia Roberts thread. Only a couple though, got to save my best work for tonight!
Oh Marty – bless you! My CHem meter is breaking at this point – I am head over heels. I am racing over there right now to check them out. Meet me there, ‘kay?
@Eve,
Yep, that will do it, thanks! That water’s nice & cold. & is that the neutron cream? *wink*
@Lindy,
Photoshopping ourselves under him, you say?! Lindy, you clever clever girl.
EC I didn’t say I was going to…
😉
*Looks for photo of myself in suitable position..* if I put a Santy hat on him do you think I could use it as my Christmas card this year?
@ EsCon:
That is mocap for Smaug.
Am I the only one who thought of neutron cream when I saw the first motion capture picture?
I agree. Movies about hacker types always bomb. Watching people do stuff with computers is boring. I know. I do computer tech support all day, snore. I really don’t think the average moviegoer cares about the Wikileaks website.
Besides, trying to look like Assange did nothing for Cumby’s sex appeal. It worked against it.
That’s it in a nutshell. When hearing about Julian, the majority of people here yawn; which has to sting him a bit. Benedict will be fine, as he’s been praised for his acting in this movie since TIFF. Almost all have said he was the best thing about it. Or that he was great in a mediocre movie.
You are sayings s if the year of Cumberbatch depended on the fifth estate only…it’s called his year because of 5 releases that he is part of. One bombing doesn’t mean year of cumberbatch is cancelled….quite harsh of you to say that.
I am just sad that his hardwork in preparing for such a complex role didn’t pay off. That’s all…couldn’t give a damn about Assange or what he thinks.
I agree Cumby’s “Year” is not cancelled—no way, no how.
The jury is not still out on whether or not he’s an extraordinary actor.
Everyone has movies that bomb, & in many cases, the “stars” of bombs keep getting jobs & keep getting multi-millions thrown at them.
Cumby will be just fine.
I love him however, I think big internet fan base doesn’t necessarily mean big box office numbers. I do think the story wasn’t of interest for many and the simple fact many especially in the US don’t know who he is. Also not sure if he was over exposed and those who didn’t know him were already sick of him? He is a fantastic actor and it will happen but possibly not as fast as his PR and others wanted. He is popular on the internet here in the UK but still no one saw the film, well I did 🙂
+ 1
I liked Sarah’s (from Laineygossip and Cinesnark) take on this:
http://www.laineygossip.com/Benedict-Cumberbatchs-The-Fifth-Estate-bombs-at-the-box-office/28392?celebrityId=21092
I really liked this take too. This has been a hard year for even some of the biggest stars to make bank at the movies. Cumby will be fine, he keeps getting interesting roles and that’s what will keep him relevent.
@Eve,
Good article—thank you for the link!
I’m not worried about him at all.
Yes, I often don’t agree with their take on things but I did think this was a fairly balanced opinion…which was odd considering Lainey seems to hate him.
That was written by Sarah. She posts movie reviews, career prospectus and about cinema/tv series in general both on Laineygossip and on her own blog (Cinesnark).
That explains it so.
Normally Lainey manages to put a “but his face is so weird…” type comments on his posts which bugs me no end.
I hate that she makes fun of his face, too. I also hate her “Minivan Majority” comments, but that’s a topic for another day.
Ok, here’s the thing: I don’t mind that she doesn’t find him attractive, or even that she finds his face weird looking. To each their own.
My only problem whenever Lainey talks about Cumberbatch is that she seems to grasp at straws in order to dislike him. She admits he’s a good actor, but it feels like she doesn’t want to like him in any way.
For instance, it boggled my mind when she posted about him for the first time (she mentioned his work in Atonement and the fact he played the creep who let James McAvoy’s character take the fall).
http://www.laineygossip.com/Carey-Mulligan-wins-British-Independent-Film-Award-Best-Actress-for-Never-Let-Me-Go-06dec10/18611?celebrityId=21092
I mean, seriously?
Later on, she admitted she shouldn’t (hold that against him) but couldn’t help feeling that way.
http://www.laineygossip.com/James-McAvoy-and-Benedict-Cumberbatch-to-star-in-Julian-Assange-film/25170?celebrityId=21092
I had a whole long post typed out, but I’ll just say this: Good points.
Eve, completely agree. You have nailed the point.
I didn’t mean that she should find him attractive it’s just she seems to throw it in when it has no relevance to the story/report.
The comments about his name make me roll my eyes to the point of nausea. If he chose that as his stage name I’d get it but it’s his given name.
@ Lindy:
Don’t worry. I know you didn’t mean that (she should find him attractive).
I only pointed that out because I see some of his fans getting a bit defensive whenever his looks and his sex appeal are questioned.
I agree that certain remarks are totally uncalled for (I saw someone once saying he looked like afterbirth), but I kinda get that his looks are unconventional and/or that some people are simply not attracted to him.
I don’t mind that some think he looks like a lizard. Heck, *I* think he looks like a lizard (mixed with a cat) but, in my case, that’s one of the many reasons for being attracted to him. I can see, however, why others might find that off putting.
I agree he’s definitely unconventional in appearance, and it’s hit or miss with a lot of people! He’s an acquired taste, IMO.
I like Sarah’s articles in general. She always has good points.
Just another guy with an accent who is more popular on the internet than in real life.
You summed that up perfectly.
Lol! I have to say I don’t get the hype about him. Different strokes for different folks though. The movie looks to me like something I would enjoy more from the comfort of my couch.
+1 Jen, absolutely agree.
He does not belong to the leading man category, and he should just be satisfied that he is a working actor.
Grace- you nailed it and so did Jen.
Absolutely, Grace. I was going to post about this glaringly obvious (to the world outside of Celebitchy, anyway) truth, but you and Jen have summarised it perfectly in two sentences!
Christian Bale was once in the position (more popular in the internet than in real life — during the time when internet was NOT as big as it is now). Didn’t mean he was a less and worse actor than his more popular peers at that time.
I think you might be taking this a little too personally, Kaiser. The article wasn’t some hit piece on Cumberbatch — it said that so far he can’t carry a movie (meaning he can’t open it on name alone, like the big A-listers), but that he doesn’t necessarily seem interested in being a big Hollywood star and he has some other, more in-his-wheelhouse projects lined up and will likely be just fine. That all seems totally reasonable to me.
Oh he definitely wanted to be in that A list, that’s why he went along with his PR campaign. The THR cover, the TIME cover, they wanted to push him to become a A-lister. But the reality is, general audience is not interested in him.
I agree. I think the expectations for him to open a movie were reaching a little high. Who knows what the future has in store for him? Maybe he’ll be able to open a big film in a few years, maybe he won’t. But he has a lot of people who want to work with him, so I don’t think this movie is going to seriously hurt his career.
Yeah considering the director made the last two Twilight movies I’m not surprised it wasn’t great. Cumby’s fine, the trades always do this and when he has a hit they’ll publish saying they always knew it.
Concept is king now, not the “movie star”. If it was about the “movie star” then Channing Tatum easily should have made White House Down a modest hit.
I think the poor performance is more a comment on the shameful apathy of the public on an issue that they don’t really seem to understand concerns them gravely – whatever side of the argument they were to come down on if they were to educate themselves – than it is on Benny the Bitch or even on the film itself.
That said, the film does seem to be poor.
I hate to say it, but I am holding out hope that international audiences prove themselves to be more aware and engaged than stateside audiences.
I agree, Kaiser, we should concentrate on sex gloves.
Oh please, don’t blame the public for not caring about Assange and his self-aggrandizing ass.
+1
Self-aggrandizing rapist ass, at that. And very many of the people who might have cared pretty recently (a couple years ago) had a falling out within their circle over Assange being a rapist. There was Michael Moore, bailing him out and laughing over the definition of rape he claimed Sweden had but did not have. There was Naomi Wolfe, claiming it wasn’t rape if the woman was ASLEEP and therefore could not say no. There were a whole lot of the rest of us who don’t have the big names and big mansions, staring open-mouthed at people we used to admire throwing rape victims under a bus because they got in the way of their idolization of a rapist. Oh and then there’s the Holocaust denial.
The timing was bad — the wounds are too fresh, the economy’s crap, and people are worried about things other than this icky person. No one could have starred in this and made it not bomb. Poor judgment all around.
Ladies – I said issue, not person. Do pay attention. If you’ll forgive me, you’re illustrating my point perfectly.
Well, my dear, the movie wasn’t about an “issue”. It was about a person: Assange. And Assange and his adorers have made very sure that the issue cannot be separated from the person. Please do try to keep up, sweetie lumpkin.
My impression is more that Assange’s detractors are the ones who have made it impossible to separate the man from the issue. Hence, for example, Dreamworks funding a biopic based on a negative source rather than a film entirely about the issue.
And I’m coming from a perspective somewhere in the middle: I support whistleblowing generally, but accept that states need security (particularly if more disastrous liberal interventions are to be averted) and you can’t just have unlimited infodumps of classified information.
Truly. I wouldn’t even want to watch that movie if *I* was in it.
Did you see it, Sixer?
Nup. Because it is reviewed as poor, because I would have preferred the focus to be Wikileaks rather than Assange. But I will watch as soon as it gets to pay per view TV. Also, my nearest cinema is a long way off – I live out in the sticks!
Ask me how much I’ve read on the topic and I’ll appear less lightweight, I promise!
So you didn’t see it, but everyone else who didn’t see it and doesn’t care to is not engaged with the topic. That’s some interesting protagonist-centered morality you’ve got there.
I think I may not have been clear.
I am making a point about how important whistleblowing vs nationalsecurity/privacy vs civil liberties is as a group of issues and the relative unimportance it is ascribed in many people’s priorities. I’m entirely qualified to do that without seeing this film in particular and equally qualified to suggest that this is more likely to be the reason for a poor box office than the poor reviews.
Sorry if I wasn’t clear. I trust this clears it up.
While I definitely consider myself an aware and engaged American, I just have no interest in seeing this movie. I don’t like news in entertainment form. Sure, a movie with a message is fine, but I prefer to get away from the daily news when I see a movie. I like to keep the news the news, and entertainment as entertainment.
If I’m an apathetic, unaware American, then what was the excuse for the lukewarm reception in Toronto, Canada?
ProBeer – I think that’s apples and oranges, really. Toronto reception was critical. Box office performance is popularity. Although critics do affect box office, obviously, plenty of poorly-reviewed films are popular, just as plenty of well-reviewed films are not. If you see what I mean!
Because Toronto was for the critics. Yes, the public (those who bought tickets) saw it and the consensus was – good acting, bad direction.
I saw it at TIFF and I rolled my eyes at the “man alone in a room filled with computers” to illustrate the inner workings of Assange’s mind. The direction was rote and unimaginative. The character is not appealing. The acting by all the parties involved was good.
I’m going to jump in and come to Sixer’s defense here-I have mixed emotion about the movie bombing too. I’m glad to see Julian Assange not get any glory because I think he’s a narcissistic asshat that stopped caring about what the real life consequences were of his actions. Having said that, it concerns me that people have kind of forgotten the initial aim behind it (like the actions of Edward Snowden and Bradley Manning) was to make people aware of the fuckery being committed by their government.
I wonder if part of the issue is just timing. A lot of people in the US right now are just so tapped out on government misbehavior (at best) and atrocities (at worst).
With all the shit going on in congress, the NSA wire tapping, drones-and this is just the past 4 years (well the NSA stuff has been going on forever). Before that we had the Iraq war, the US attorney firings, Scooter Libby, Blackwater, etc etc.
I think maybe people might be seeking a bit of escapism with their movie choices right now. I know I am… and I usually enjoy a good, well-acted biopic.
I don’t understand the blowback from Sixer’s comment, either. People do seem apathetic about the issue, and it is a complicated and important one. A lot of Americans ARE uninformed about crucial issues. Have you seen those “man on the street” interviews where half the people don’t know the name of the Vice President? I don’t understand why she’s getting such negative responses.
I don’t get it either, Goodnames.
Cumby did a great job with the available material. Two hours of watching people looking at computer screens does not make for particularly thrilling entertainment.
It’s like Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy last year – you can assemble one of the most jaw-dropping casts ever, but if they’ve got nothing to work with the film will be a huge let-down.
I don’t think it’s his fault that it bombed, the content just doesn’t have a lot of mass appeal. I’ll see it when it comes to DVD but I had no plans on seeing it in theaters. (However I feel that I must add a but.. I only spend my ticket box money on scary movies so obviously I was never the target audience)
Did you see Gravity yet, marie?
It was a bit scary at times…
I think it’s Assange that no one really cares seeing an entire movie about. TSN was different. That film’s success wasn’t because it was starring Jesse Eisenberg. It was a good movie about a story (FB and Zuck) that people wanted to see.
I am not a Cumberbitch, in fact I regularly comment on her about how unattractive I think he is. But I don’t see how anyone can pin this flop on him. I don’t know anyone who has ANY interest in seeing this movie. Assange is an unlikeable person and the whole movie just sounds like a bore. Can’t blame Benny for that.
+1. Don’t care for him, but he truly doesn’t seem to be at blame for this.
It bombed because it looks boring as hell. The story isn’t old enough to need a movie about it. We all just saw it play out in the news not too long ago and it wasn’t very interesting then either!
I’m kind of glad this happened. And by that, no, I don’t mean I hate Cumberbatch or that I wanted the movie to fail. At all. But maybe now things can settle back down to a more reasonable level?
What I mean is that people either seem to subscribe to the theory that Cumberbatch is The Greatest Of Our Time (and if you don’t understand that you’re not one of the enlightened) or that he’s an overrated fandom darling. I don’t believe the second is true – he’s genuinely talented and it will be great to watch his career – but I do think the first is debatable. I’d like to think that the result of this mini-backlash is that people will realize, yes, he’s great, but other actors also are great, and maybe we can be reasonable in how we think about him and his career.
I’m dreaming, aren’t I?
Not at all Grayze, I’m with you.
I didn’t think this movie was going to be all that popular with the general public. Despite the fact that Assange is intriguing, he’s not the sexy, fun, or accessible kind of intriguing. The Social Network made money because it was about Facebook and its college-age genius founders. It was fun, with a sordid underside. The story of Assange and Wikileaks doesn’t work that way–it’s just straight out sordid, and yet, it falls short of being a bona fide “thriller.”
Anyhow, my main takeaway from the EW piece is what Tom Heller said, “Based on his choices, his focus seems to be on building an interesting career rather than trying to become a star quickly.” The Batch is going to be just fine.
To add to your great points, “The Social Network” was also based on accessible material. Just about everyone who saw that film is on Facebook or at least has a pretty solid understanding of what it is. But with Wikileaks, I think most of the movie-going public will say “What’s that?”
The Social Network had huge marketing campaigns behind it that pushed it in our faces. Why? Zuckerberg, his fortune…everything associated.
The Fifth Estate doesn’t have oodles of money propping it up.
Assange’s cause is more noble than Zuckerberg’s information network for governments, but the latter is more successful. Gee I wonder why?
And you can’t really say that the actor who played Zuckerberg is a ‘great’ actor. He’s hideous.
So is Justin Timberlake for that matter.
Jesse Eisenberg is cute!! But TSN also had great writing and direction and a story people wanted to see.
Well, I think that even without all the marketing, I would’ve gone to see a movie about Facebook. It’s an everyday entity in the lives of most people, and like Green Girl said, it makes for accessible material. How many members of the general public are/were heavily involved with Wikileaks?
I don’t think there are many people who would say that Zuckerberg is a more captivating or exciting person than Assange. However, his story is, simply, a lot easier to digest.
The film did much better than Angelina Jolie’s directorial debut and that’s saying something.
So 1.7 million isn’t so terrible. It’s not like the storyline is capable of a huge box office record. Julian Assange is regarded a pariah to US govt officials, so I’m guessing they made sure, in some way, that the film would bomb.
Oh please. That people didn’t want to see a story about icky creepazoid rapist Assange does not a government conspiracy make. It was hardly a pro-Assange movie in any case.
To be fair, Jolie’s directorial debut was in limited release and in a foreign language, something American audience has been notorious of inability to appreciate.
I am disappointed that TFE bombed so spectacularly, but I also agree that it shouldn’t have had a mainstream release. This isn’t the type of film that most people want to spend $10+ per ticket to see. I actually wonder if this could have done much better as a miniseries on HBO (I haven’t seen the film, though).
That being said, I really hope Cumby can move past this. He’s got a bunch of other big movies coming out, and the Star Wars rumors just won’t stop. I think he’s hella talented, and I hope he can shake off TFE bombing at theater like so many other actors have done in the past.
Whether it was his fault or not, that was a bomb of biblical proportions. The people in Hollywood who finance films will take notice; it’s not like the Harrison Ford bomb where he’s got a track record to fall back on. Whether he claims to care or not, his choice of films will dwindle if the next couple don’t do better.
+1
I think people did not want to see a story about a creepy rapist.
The worst I can say about Cumberbatch at this point is that he annoys the crap out of me and every time I see a picture of him he seems to get uglier. But honestly I doubt I’d have much of an opinion on him if certain women on the internet weren’t acting like he was the best and only and most perfect and most beloved and every woman in the world MUST adore him. I have, at this point, seen far more squeeing and assumptions that everyone adores him over Cumberbatch than I have over Robert Pattinson. That is not a good thing for someone who wants to be taken seriously as an actor.
He should never have agreed to do the movie that’s all.
I said the same thing on a post a couple days ago. I still feel that way, but this movie is no setback for Benedict. He’s gotten rave reviews across the board. I’m just personally not too happy he got involved in a film that is so dishonest. And then trying to defend it by saying “this is fiction”. Fiction about a REAL PERSON? Come on, Benedict, you don’t even mean the words you say.
I hate that now that one movie of his did poorly, f***ing trolls are now talking about how he is finally falling and it is pissing me off.
He. Was. Not. The. Problem.
Unfortunately, no one cares about the writers, the director, or the marketing campaign and immediately assume that the actors are the reason why the movie failed. No. I just want to scream because I cannot stand all of the backlash that BC is getting. Call me rabid Cumberwhore or whatever, I really don’t give a s***
I should note that I did see the film and I liked it alright. I’m interested in the topic so that helped.
Cumberwhores unite! (I don’t think he’d like that name very much.)
At this point, I really think he doesn’t care as long as it just stops being brought up.
Trolls are trolls for a reason. They’re not even serious about what they write. The whole purpose of a troll is to cause trouble, make chaos. Trolls ARE agents of chaos. So don’t get upset by them. They actually don’t care about what they’re saying, or about Benedict. They care about upsetting people. That’s why “don’t feed the trolls” is so often said. Feeding them helps them achieve their mission. Ignoring them is the only way they will go away.
To be fair, in this day and age, there are *very very* few actors/actresses who can “carry” a movie. (I define that to mean that people will go see it mainly because of that actor/actress.) In fact, I think that the topic has been studied based on box office receipts and other data, and IIRC, the only star who still reliably draws an audience to the point of being able to carry a movie is Denzel Washington.
Certainly, Benedict can act, but the movie industry has changed so much that it’s pretty unfair to say he can’t yet carry a movie. Nobody really can anymore, at least if you’re talking money.
Very true. Even Angelina couldn’t get people to go see “The Tourist”.
I think movie goers are more sophisticated now days but the studios still want it to be like the Golden Era when people went to see a Cary Grant movie, a Garland pic etc…
Yep, and Johnny Depp was in that movie, too! It’s not just about who’s in the movie anymore.
Fully agree.
Actually, they have concluded that the day & age of any one person carrying a film is long over. Which is now why we have reboots & sequels galore. So we traded one shitty idea for another. *sigh*
This.
I have many favourite actors, and I’ll watch some real crap just to see them, but unless the film they’re in is getting good reviews I’ll wait til I can stream it.
I’ll go into a film blind if I’m a big fan of the director, but never for an actor.
I think this movie falls under the “Too Soon” category. We don’t know, nor will we know, the whole story for a few more years at least so the film wound up looking like a “movie of the week” cash grab that backfired.
But, considering no one has criticized Cumberbatch’s actual performance, I think he himself will be fine.
He’ll bounce back. He’s a wonderful actor, and The Fifth Estate just may have not been the right project to springboard him into the major US spotlight/top of the heap leading man roles.
Let’s see what happens with the rest of his films this year, The Imitation Game and The Lost City of Z. I think he may come out on top within the next year or so (here’s hoping!).
And regardless of whether his films do well or not… my adoration for him will never fade (well, as long as he doesn’t end up with another Katia Elizarova, it won’t). My mad crush on him, as of now, still holds strong 🙂
+1
+1 again
The problem is this is a movie that should have been a small release, and the studio was trying to ride the Cumberwave that’s been rolling of late. I don’t think his career will suffer. Anyone who knows anything about the film industry will tell you it was a studio mistake to make this a wide release.
Everyone already knows everything that happened, so why would you go see the movie? Why would you go see a movie about internet nerds publishing information people didn’t want to hear about?
“Why would you go see a movie about internet nerds publishing information people didn’t want to hear about?”
I, for one, wanted to hear about it. I wanted to know.
Lol, government corruption. What’s that?
Eve, that’s true, but for the most part, it seems like Americans don’t want to know about the horrible things our government does, even when they are doing it to us via the NSA…
Eve, I’m gonna have to agree with Holden here. In my neck of the woods, people tend to ignore the ‘ickier’ aspects of the world.
@ Holden and LadyS:
I’m aware of that. And it saddens me that people would rather close their eyes than know about the truth.
Really? You have to defend Cumberbatch’s film by running down Americans? Maybe people just don’t want to watch someone type into a computer for an hour, eh? I can see plenty of that for free at home.
What are you talking about?
Nerds are amazing.
The silverline of this movie bombing for me is that I won’t have to line up to get the ticket! And pick any seat I want without having to be there an hour before!
Anyway, I won’t be too worried about Cumberbatch’s career. He’ll be fine. And we have yet to see how the movie is received world wide. Probably foreign audience like it better?
“The silverline of this movie bombing for me is that I won’t have to line up to get the ticket! And pick any seat I want without having to be there an hour before!”
Same here. Although I fear I won’t have the chance — I don’t think it’ll open here where I live (it opens on October 25 in Brazil but I live in a shitty city where only big budget movies open for sure).
Just curious about a particular point. When a movie bombs, does the supporting cast take any of the heat, too?
I’d like to think that if they aren’t frequently in the marketing, then no.
I think that the person leading the movie is a large reason why people go to see films. I saw World War Z, solely b/c Brad Pitt was starring in it. I like watching zombie films too, but I don’t know if I would have saw it if someone else was starring in it.
I personally think that having certain supporting actors in a film helps. But it seems as if the studios heavily rely on their leading men and women to truly pull people in.
Honestly, I wish they would focus a little more on the subject matter and the whole cast to push a film. Don Cheadle, Tommy Lee Jones, Robert Duvall, and others like that are just as integral to making a film good just as any lead actor/actress is, too.
I’ve seen it depend on the casting. If it’s the “it” actor of the moment (like here) they tend to take all the flak. If it’s an ensemble piece or there’s big names in the supporting cast, they get some heat, too.
I’ve read several reviews that panned the film but gave him and Bruhl big props for their work with what they had.
I wonder if he even wants to be a ‘star’ in the Hollywood sense of the word (Tom Cruise who usually only plays Tom Cruise) Cumby is a British character actor trained to work in the theatre, other British character actors? Daniel Day-Lewis, Gary Oldman, Christian Bale (although Batman made him a huge star he’s still essentially a character actor). Maybe that is the path he will follow, he certainly appears to be someone who actually wants to be good at his job, rather than just be famous and that means he’ll get better as he gets older. The best is yet to come from this one…
I hope he never becomes a star in Hollywood. I hate, hate, hate that Hollywood is the gold standard of whether an actor is “A-list” or not …. the same Hollywood that has ZERO respect for art as demonstrated by the horrible movies that studios spend collective billions to make and promote. Hollywood as judge? What a joke.
Benedict is awesome and a fantastic actor. I’ve seen lots of his work already and I’m currently 3/4 of the way through Parade’s End. He is nothing short of brilliant. He’s too damn good to be judged by the greedy sycophants of Hollywood. To hell with them all.
Yes!
Maureen, I think I love you! 😉
I agree! How is sh!tty a@@ed Hollywood the ONLY measure of anyone’s success? And I mean: actor/actress, director, producer, or writer? Some people don’t even *know* what a Tony is! And we look down on TV projects as lesser projects or entities (and most shows in the States aren’t as good as TV shows in other countries. So it lives up to our expectations).
Geesh. Hollywood puts out a TON of crap to be everyone’s ‘gold standard’. But it’s where the Holy Grails of Fame & Fortune can be found.
ooooh That hit a nerve didnt it! I said ‘Hollywood style’star in the post, I wasn’t approving of it! I hope he doesn’t go that route given that the Hollywood system seems to suck life and talent out of actors, Johnny Depp did decent work in interesting films until he became a ‘star’ then his acting went down the pan, Robert Downey Jnr has talent but no way of showing it in a bloody great metal suit, Heath Ledger had potential -never fulfilled. Luckily BC is older, has got his head screwed on and isn’t turning his back on decent acting roles, he’s doing another Sherlock and is said to be doing Hamlet in the theatre in 2014 – he’ll be fine – on his own terms I hope…
He doesn’t deserve the shade considering most if not all the reviews I read said that it wasn’t the actors, it was the story itself that was the problem. Both he and Daniel Bruhl have gotten great notices for the film.
I think the problem is that the Wikileaks story is now out of immediate public view, so there’s not much interest in it. Also, Julian Assange is a dick.
Having read all the comments, I find it interesting that in general, if you’re a fangirl of a specific actor, it’s easy to make excuses for film failures but yet when it’s an actor you don’t fangirl over you are very quick to point out how awful/terrible the actor is. Why can’t you give other actors the benefit of the doubt? And I know not everyone commenting was fangirling over BC. Just curious.
You make a good point, except that whether you find him attractive or not, or think TFE sucked or not, you can’t really deny that he’s a tremendously gifted actor and quite captivating on-screen. You can’t say that about everyone with a fangirl following.
@Beth, well that’s subjective….at least to fangirls.
Well, Beth, this may come as a surprise to you.
I don’t find Benedict Cumberbatch attractive, and The Fifth Estate was mediocre at best. And yet, I don’t find him as enormously talented as his rabid fan base here at Celebitchy does. He is incredibly overrated, in my humble opinion – and believe me, I am not alone there. Captivating? Hah. I think Benedict Cumberbatch is…watchable. And that’s about the most enthusiasm I can muster.
Are you saying fans cannot be objective???? I can be objective and I DO think he’s a tremendously gifted actor. Since you seem not to share that opinion, where has is acting been less than on par?
I’m really curious about this too. What other examples do you have for decent actors/actresses getting thrown under the bus? (This is assuming they acted when in said project)
@LadySlippers, Taylor Kitsch? Many people cited him as doing really good work as Riggins on FNL. And his 2012 movies were bombs. Were they completely his fault? No, obviously not, but yes he was declared as not being able to open a movie (given he was the lead in both Battleship and John Carter and part of ensemble for Savages).
I think the quote by Joe Montana applies in a lot areas of life applies to many positions of life- “The QB gets too much credit for the win and too much credit for the loss.” Same could be said for the star of a movie.
@Mom2Two,
I don’t even know who that is. And, only one of those films is something I recognise. Sorry. 🙁
I agree w/ Joe’s comments. It’s true too.
Sandra Bullock had an equalling telling comment: ‘The acting thing is so beyond my control. Acting isn’t mine. You’re like a tiny piece in this big, corporate mechanism that needs chemistry and divine intervention.’
This movie was always going to be a tough sell — it focuses on an unlikeable character, and, by all accounts, seems to be a pretty terrible film. That’s not Cumberbatch’s fault in any way.
BUT, the studio rolled out this movie in a major way, and the campaign very much focused on Cumberbatch. I suspect they worried about the quality and content of the film, but thought perhaps his sizable fan-base might be able to save it. For whatever reason, the fans didn’t come through. I do think this is bad news for Cumberbatch. It’s not a career death blow by any means, but I don’t think it bodes well for his leading-man status. He’s in a couple of great movies this fall. But those movies are also ensemble casts and it remains to be seen whether people will focus on his performances, considering the wealth of powerhouse actors in both 12 Years a Slave and Osage County. Those movies are not being marketed as Cumberbatch-films, so their success (or failure) won’t be attributed to him. If he manages to stand out, I think he will do just fine. But he still may not achieve leading-man status.
I agree that the critics were harsh. I believe that he was brilliant as Assange and that Daniel Bruhl was wonderful as well. I think it was just marketed kind of like it were a thriller or action and that just wasn’t the case.
Haha! 😉
In reality BC doesn’t have mass public Movie Star appeal. He might be considered a good actor by some, but leading man material he is not. He should stick to character roles in ensemble films (where he preferably plays the villain because that is where I think he is suited best both looks & ability wise) and his TV work.
I don’t really think this film will have an adverse effect on BC’s career. He’s on such a roll right now, and has been cast in so many films recently, that to see some of them go by the wayside is to be expected. Every movie star has had their duds.
Besides, I would think the largest base for this type of film would have been supporters of Assange, and once he very publicly withdrew his support for the movie, I think that buried it. I mean, if he doesn’t want to see a film about himself why should I?
he’ll be fine. he has a full plate next year of varied, interesting work. he’s still on the rise. there is no actor who can carry a movie anymore. it’s all about the specific project and how the studios manage it. cumby will always have his strengths: he’s incredibly talented, likes interesting projects, and people in the industry like him enough to want to work with him.
Can someone please explain his appeal? I just don’t get it. I’ve seen Sherlock and he kind of creeped me out,
If you genuinely want to understand the appeal, watch “Third Star” and “The Last Enemy” on Amazon Video. There are others, but he’s um…nicely displayed in those two.
I’m baffled as to why JJ Feild hasn’t made a bigger splash. He looks like a younger, handsomer Jude Law, and is a wonderful actor (he’s in Third Star, too).
There’s a wonderful version of Jane Austen’s Northanger Abbey with him, Felicity Jones and Carey Mulligan.
I totally agree about JJ Field! To be honest I’m surprised more people aren’t fawning over him considering IMO he kind of resembles Tom Hiddleston in fact I had to watch Third Star twice (it nearly killed me) because I swore it was Hiddles.
Variety, which is as close to the industry pulse as you can get normally, also said it’s very unlikely it’ll hurt him:
http://variety.com/2013/film/news/does-fifth-estate-bombing-hurt-benedict-cumberbatch-as-a-leading-man-1200744982/
They noted there was no way Cumberbatch thought this movie would make him a leading man because of the subject matter. It was about the showcase as a character actor, and it paid off in that respect.
The studio overreach was obvious, tbh. That Wikileaks documentary, We Steal Secrets, got rave reviews and buzz but no distribution deals because of lack of interest.
I think he’ll have a career similar to Colin Firth’s… lengthy, with ups and downs, and a female fan base that’s devoted but wants to see him in specific types of projects, e.g. costume dramas where he gets to flex his own voice and accent.
He’s been working steadily for over a decade, made the cover of Time International, worked with Spielberg, Streep, Tom Stoppard and Danny Boyle… I think we can skip worrying about his future.
I have to say I prefer his voice work (thanks for converting me, CeleCumberBitchies!). In lead roles, it’s like he can’t quite sync his face to his voice. I feel like he does better in ensemble pieces where he can fine-tune a smaller performance, or in very stylized Anglo productions that play to his classical manner.
Brad Pitt’s new Z production with BC sounds very promising for instance. With The Fifth Estate, (a) I want BC’s own voice/accent, not Assange’s pidgin; (b) we all lived through it a few years ago, I don’t need a reductionist, noncommittal fictional account. With this kind of story, you have to pick a side (e.g. Erin Brokovich, All the President’s Men, Reversal of Fortune, etc.) and argue in favor of it with your narrative. People having qualms for an hour and a half… not so interesting.
The reviews for Benny’s performance have not all been good but he has managed to come out of the film’s failure without loosing his reputation as a good actor. And Sixer I do agree with your comments re the Film and the uneven focus on Assange which overshadowed the political issues. The publicity surrounding the film also had a similar effect.
Whether he is leading man material is still a big question mark. Not everyone who saw Star Trek felt the same about his performance as the fans and a lot of Sherlock is also down too the writing and the charisma between him and Watson. One of the things I feel that really holds him back is his lack of potential as a romantic lead. So in many ways he is better off sticking with the bios and good quality supporting roles.
A blind man could see the failure of this movie coming. It was too soon to make a film about a person as derisive as Assange, especially when there is no resolution for the main character. Film’s need to have a beginning, a middle and an end.
It was a limited release film and pushing it into wide release hastened it’s box office failure. A so-so script and the absolutely wrong director, studio overreach (greed) just added to the misery. The acting was good all around but the film as a whole is just mediocre.
The film’s failure as nothing to do with whether one country is more apathetic than another but I do think it had everything to do with the perception of Assange as savior/a$@hole. A third didn’t see it because they thought it disparaged Assange, a third didn’t see it because they think Assange is a pompous, egotistical asshat and a third didn’t see it because they don’t give a f$&k about Assange or WikiLeaks.
I never place the failure on a film completely on an actor’s shoulders because it is a collaborative effort, so everyone should share the pain. For now this film’s failure will not hurt Cumberbatch because his reviews were very positive; he’ll continue to get work because he is talented. However, if future films he headlines do not make money…well it’s called show “business” for a reason. Hopefully he’ll get the time needed to find his niche and find better projects.
Last thought, even if he doesn’t become what is considered an A-list leading man, Cumberbatch will have a long and varied career as a high profile character actor which I think is actually Cumberbatch’s endgame.
I hate to see this reflecting on Mr. Cumberbatch when it appears SO OBVIOUS that this film was going to have problems– Him acting his ass off couldn’t save it. (It was quite confusing at times to me and he was the only thing that kept me continually interested and connected to the film.)
Way back in August I read this article and, at the time, really hoped the author was wrong:
http://www.flickeringmyth.com/2013/08/special-features-does-anyone-care-about.html#comment-1018870461
His basic premise *then* was that basically Americans are in an isolationist mindset and do not want to go to films about political or upsetting subject matter–no matter how well done or “important” & he cited the relatively poor performance of “Zero Dark Thirty” & “The Hurt Locker” (among other) films that were well received by critics but that the US public simply didn’t put money out to go see.
Also, I noticed that they were claiming the film failed on SATURDAY morning! I mean, come on! I hadn’t even had a chance to go see it yet (along with how many others of the Cumbercollective?) I work Fridays, all day! And then what about the International market? Anyone remember what happens when BC flies into Tokyo?
This film shouldn’t have gone to wide release, the director would have been wise to attempt to get Julian Assange to cooperate or buy in at least a little– the *main audience* who would have seen it (Reddit users and fans of Wikileaks) had been pre-warned to hate it, and no one other than rabid fans of the actors in the film bought tickets.
The studio should be damn glad that BC has a strong following, or there would have been NO box office take at all.
Found a cool site where you can see what the current box office stats are, if anyone is interested.
http://boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=fifthestate.htm
I don’t think this truly detracts from Cumberbatch. Anyone with a lick o’ sense knows that a film about Assange was a hard sell. Even if it got rave reviews, it would have done better in view on demand or dvd. It’ll probably make some money when it does go to cable, etc, but it just wasn’t the right project. His career is chugging right along. He’ll be fine.