Poor Monica Lewinsky. I know that’s the incorrect reaction to have, especially in the face of Monica’s new Vanity Fair interview, but still. Poor Monica. I always thought she got a raw deal, and I always felt sorry for her. She was only 22 years old when she first began fooling around with President Clinton. While 22 is an adult, can we just say that most 22 year olds are still figuring things out and you’re still not “formed” as an adult completely? And how would you like it if something you did at 22 becomes a huge, international punchline and that’s what defines your entire life? Such is the fate of Monica Lewinsky.
Monica gave Vanity Fair an exclusive essay (?), and I’m startled to realize that it’s been 16 years since we first learned of Monica. Incidentally, many media outlets are calling this Monica’s “first interview” or whatever, but it’s not. Monica gave a handful of interviews back when everything went down (late 1990s) and she collaborated with Andrew Morton on a book too. Check out her Wiki if you want to see just how often she really has spoken out. Here are the VF excerpts:
Monica Lewinsky writes in Vanity Fair for the first time about her affair with President Clinton: “It’s time to burn the beret and bury the blue dress.” She also says: “I, myself, deeply regret what happened between me and President Clinton. Let me say it again: I. Myself. Deeply. Regret. What. Happened.”
After 10 years of virtual silence (“So silent, in fact,” she writes, “that the buzz in some circles has been that the Clintons must have paid me off; why else would I have refrained from speaking out? I can assure you that nothing could be further from the truth”), Lewinsky, 40, says it is time to stop “tiptoeing around my past—and other people’s futures. I am determined to have a different ending to my story. I’ve decided, finally, to stick my head above the parapet so that I can take back my narrative and give a purpose to my past. (What this will cost me, I will soon find out.)”
Clearing the Air
Maintaining that her affair with Clinton was one between two consenting adults, Lewinsky writes that it was the public humiliation she suffered in the wake of the scandal that permanently altered the direction of her life: “Sure, my boss took advantage of me, but I will always remain firm on this point: it was a consensual relationship. Any ‘abuse’ came in the aftermath, when I was made a scapegoat in order to protect his powerful position. . . . The Clinton administration, the special prosecutor’s minions, the political operatives on both sides of the aisle, and the media were able to brand me. And that brand stuck, in part because it was imbued with power.”Job Hunting
After the scandal, writes Lewinsky, “I turned down offers that would have earned me more than $10 million, because they didn’t feel like the right thing to do.” After moving between London (where she got her master’s degree in social psychology at the London School of Economics), Los Angeles, New York, and Portland, Oregon, she interviewed for numerous jobs in communications and branding with an emphasis on charity campaigns, but, “because of what potential employers so tactfully referred to as my ‘history,’” she writes, “I was never ‘quite right’ for the position. In some cases, I was right for all the wrong reasons, as in ‘Of course, your job would require you to attend our events.’ And, of course, these would be events at which press would be in attendance.”Beyonce’s “Partition” lyric, “He Monica Lewinsky’d all over my gown.”
Writes Lewinsky to the R&B pop superstar “Thanks, Beyoncé, but if we’re verbing, I think you meant ‘Bill Clinton’d all on my gown,’ not ‘Monica Lewinsky’d.'”Hillary Clinton
“Recently I’ve found myself gun-shy yet again, fearful of ‘becoming an issue’ should [Hillary] decide to ramp up her campaign. But should I put my life on hold for another 8 to 10 years?” She also acknowledges a surfaced correspondence in which Hillary, writing to a friend, called Lewinsky a “narcissistic loony toon.” “My first thought [was] if that’s the worst thing she said, I should be so lucky,” she writes. (Clinton was also said to have blamed herself in part for her husband’s affair.) Upon further thought, however, “I find her impulse to blame the Woman—not only me, but herself—troubling . . . Courageous or foolish, maybe, but narcissistic and loony?”
[From Vanity Fair and Us Weekly]
She also writes about bullying and the idea of “literally being humiliated to death.” After glancing through Monica’s Wiki page in preparation to write this up, I’m caught up on just how many crappy gigs Monica did, especially in the early 2000s, mostly to pay her legal bills. So I do have to wonder… why not just take the money? If someone is offering you $10 million for whatever (as long as it’s not p0rn, then all bets are off), why not take it?
As for how she maintains that it was a “consensual” relationship… I believe that. I would even go so far as to say that Monica was not taken advantage of sexually – I remember the Starr Report. I remember her descriptions of what went down with Bubba, and I’ve always believed she was a young woman with a crush who wanted the President of the United States to be her boyfriend, and she actively pursued him (or her fantasy of him). Now, all that being said, she was badly mistreated by EVERYONE after that. She was mistreated by Ken Starr, by the Clintons, by the legal system, by the media and on and on. She made a series of stupid mistakes when she was 22-24, and those mistakes have defined her (in the public eye) ever since. So, again, poor Monica.
Photos courtesy of WENN.
Agreed.
Great post, Kaiser. I wholeheartedly agree.
Me too. It goes without saying that Clinton should for numerous reasons have turned her down, but it’s difficult to see how the sexual relationship between them can be regarded as a power play on his part given how she initiated it. And as you say, after that EVERYONE abused her.
I’ve always felt a great deal of sympathy for her.
+1. And I am glad she called out Beyoncé!
+1
+ however many.
How many 22 y/o girls could stand up to being pursued by our Commander and Chief? Not many that I can think of, and Clinton was a known (skirt chaser) quantity. I’ve always felt terrible for her.
+++++ I thought at the time that she was a 22 year old girl, surrounded by power and by a man everyone in the world knows/knew was a womanizer. She flirted. He flirted. It went further. I think it was Henry Kissinger, when asked about his love life, who commented that power is the greatest aphrodisiac. I worked in politics at Monica’s age and I can assure you that many of these men are very, very hard to resist. They ooze charm. Monica was cast as the villain, even by feminist groups, because she couldn’t disrupt their narrative of Clinton. All that being said, doesn’t this seem a quaint time? Wouldn’t we all kill for Bill Clinton and his harmless little scandals (well – harmless unless you are Hillary)?
She should be most angry at Linda Tripp. And of course it was consensual. No one has ever argued to the contrary.
I agree. Linda really betrayed her trust!
-I also feel so sorry for her. She’ll never live down the scandal. She probably has never had a real relationship with a man following the scandal. And she’s in her 40s now, right? The prospect of marriage and kids probably won’t happen either. So yeah, the Clintons, the press, the American Culture and people all let her down. She was so young and brutally (emotionally) punished for her indiscretions.
She was, but a lot of time passed where she could have reinvented herself. I think, in a way, she clings to that period, even though it is unhealthy.
@kiddo True. I too have thought about why she hasn’t gone on a speaking tour or started her own company. She probably could’ve taken back her own narrative and come out on top. Or at least… I hope that was a possibility.
Exactly, kiddo. I was surprised to see she has the same hair and everything. I don’t mean to say she should have changed her name, but she could have become someone different.
I do feel for her – it must have been a horrendous situation to go through and, of course, there are still repercussions in her life. However, she did the deed so – hindsight is a great thing.
What interests me more though is how society has made a shift toward now “rewarding” others in the same type of situation. Example, the 17 yo who posted James Franco’s creepy advances. She was so put down by girls/women stating that they would have killed to have been in her situation and would have shut up and bedded him.
I guess she was one of the original star f*ckers who spawned a generation. Thanks for that as well, Monica.
I find it odd that Monica herself says she was “taken advantage of,” but then goes on to say it was completely consensual. I will never understand this woman. It’s as if she expects everyone to fawn all over her for having an affair with the president. Why should I have sympathy for her? She was an adult when the affair occurred, and as an adult she should’ve realized the consequences of her actions.
Not to mention, this is ancient news. Why is she being given an interview after all this time?
Agree with you Yvonne.
Agreed!
She was old enough to know better. Yes, 22 is young, but not young enough to know that you don’t do sexual things with married men – especially when they are the President of the United States and the entire world is watching!
Consensual meant she said yes, we she acknowledges she did. She was 22, maybe naive, definitely insecure. He was 50, experienced, and HER BOSS/POTUS. He knew she would be an easy target and took advantage of that. And I say that as someone who likes Bill Clinton.
Poor Monica, my arse. Poor Hillary. Hillary is maintaining a fine public profile, and this utterly redundant interview surfaces and brings the whole mess back to the foreground. If you want to move past it, don’t give a worldwide interview two years before the woman who is the actual victim in all of this, is trying to position herself to change history.
While I agree that Hilary was a victim as her husband cheated on her and that will continuously be brought up the rest of her life, Hilary has been able to create a full-filling political life. She was a senator, secretary of state and ran for president. Monica can’t even get a job and she has a master’s degree. Monica will never live down what she did when she was just 22 years old.
T. fanty I agree. She knew the man was married and the president…how else did she think it was going to end…a Congressional Medal of Honor?
@Greata…She was 22…she probably thought that Bill would fall in love with her, leave Hillary and marry her. She didn’t realize she was nothing but a quick fling for her “boss”. I’m no Monica lover, and I do believe that Clinton was a great president, but this whole mess was Bill’s fault. HE was married…HE was the President…HE was in a position of power over Monica. I remember after the scandal broke and Hillary was on one of the morning shows the next day, looking so haggard, and strained, and I remember feeling so sorry for her….
OT: But who the hell at 22 YO saves a c*m dress? Seriously, that sounds like a 12 year old fan-girl.
@ kiddo: Yes, you bring out the most important point about this whole story. I personally don’t trust a thing this craven idiot has to say. The fact that she didn’t clean her dress…and saved it, says to me that she was planning to use it. I think there is something way deeper about this whole mess–some kind of conspiracy–to get the Clintons, and I think monica was paid off handsomely a long time ago. Now, when Faux News is going after Hillary on a daily basis, Monica suddenly has to tell her side of the story…again. Please. What utter bullshit.
I’m hoping she just kept it as insurance in case things turned against her. Which they did. Still. Eww.
Bill Clinton is simply a user. I have a friend who worked closely with him in the White House for many years, & he once joked to me, while on the phone in his W.H. office, “20 feet fron the Oval,” that the then Chief of Staff, I think it was John Podesta, called my friend’s secretary “shark bait for the President.” Sadly, the corruption at high levels of government, where you’d hope the people in power would be mostly icons….well, they are mostly amoral.
@azurea: you just described just about every man on the Hill. Interns and other young women are treated as pieces of meat by SO MANY of the men in power. What is it they say, that the day the new interns start every year is referred to as Fresh Meat Day? Bill Clinton and his womanizing is not the exception to the fine moral character of the Senate, Congress, etc. At all.
Wow, change history…Not to talk politics, but poor Hillary my rear. She knew he was a cheater. She knew he would lie it about and she went out there and spun the story like a seasoned politician.
I like Hillary but I am not so delusional to believe that she is a victim. Why is poor Hillary a victim is it because she didn’t leave? Why is it ok that Hillary didn’t leave, but people are all up in arms when Robin Thicke’s wife stands by while her husband acts pervy?
Yeah, thank you. I’m a big big Hillary fan, but the shit she said about Monica wasn’t right, and the shit being said about Monica here isn’t right. And I don’t think Monica is timing this to injure Hillary. Hillary has not been out of the public eye since this happened. It would impact Hillary whenever she decided to talk.
Exactly.
Poor Hillary? She has sl*t shamed every woman who is known by the public to have been with her husband, while her husband has been able to save face. What kind of message does has sent to the daughter she helped raised? “Your husband may get some strange on the side, but as long as he comes home to you, just shut your mouth at home, and let the public know the other woman is the one to blame.” Uh, no thank you.
Neurologically, our brains don’t fully develop until between the ages of twenty three and twenty five. So while people of this age can drive, drink, vote, work and procreate, the decision making area of the brain is literally immature. That said, she became delusional, or was perhaps naive, about the nature of her liaison with the President. As a culture, we slut-shamed her, along with Hilary Clinton. Could that whole piece of history have been swept under the rug with the upcoming elections? Perhaps it’s time for a Hilary to reach out to this woman with an olive branch, because times have changed, and this part of our cultural treatment of young women needs to be re-examined. I don’t feel Monica L is doing this for political guile, but it’s part of the zeitgeist; there is a collective feeling the whole issue is unresolved.
Whatever deal Hillary and Bill have is their business and I’m not mad at either of them for it. Monogamy is not the number one priority in all relationships and that’s fine and it should have stayed between them. Bill should have been more discreet, Monica should have had more sense, and Hillary shouldn’t have been cruel about Monica, but Ken Starr and Linda Tripp are the real villains here.
I think, as I said below, that it’s very suspicious that Monica is bringing this up now. And I think it’s wrong. However, Bill cheated on Hillary constantly throughout their “marriage” and she chose to live with it to further her own goals. She knows who he is, and was hurt by the Monica incident only because she believed he might possibly keep it in his pants for the duration of his presidency, but he is incapable of thinking about anyone but himself. Hillary is nobody’s victim. She made her choice to stay with a brilliant, selfish, lying, cheating husband who will never be faithful to her.
All valid points. How about this for an amelioration of my point: I feel very little sympathy for any of these privileged people, who consistently made self-serving decisions. Bill behaved abominably and everyone still adores him. Hillary sold her soul for a political career, and Lewinsky who emote the privilege of not *having* to find work in a field she wanted to be in, is still trying to wash her hands of any degree of culpability in this mess. They’re all kind of appalling.
@T.fanty..True.
I like it.
+1
OK that she doesn’t/didn’t deserve all the backlash, however, 22 years old is not a child, but an age where you are responsible for your own choices. She chose and pursued something very ferociously. Whether we agree that Bill Clinton was an a**hole or not (that I think he was), the real victim of this story is Hillary. Monica never showed any regret for anything. She might try to re-write the story, but I recall very well that after the scandal she tried to make money from her acquired public image: she started a purse line, she did all that mambo jambo with Tom Green, just to name a few. If she wanted this to go away, she could have probably accomplished it (at least at some level) by staying out of the spot light. That she comes now to give another interview after so many years just shows her eagerness to continue in the limelight and that she dares to make comments about Hillary Clinton says a lot more about her than about anyone else involved in this mess. It makes me wonder what her truly intentions are and how sane is this chick…it is a bit obsessed oriented behaviour towards Hilary IMO.
Yeah it seems weird to me that she even is bringing this up now. I kept getting super confused since the last time I checked no one cared about Monica Lewinksy. And no matter what went down with shady Linda Tripp, Monica pursued a married man. She thought he loved her. She went out after the fact and tried to capitalize on her notoriety and it didn’t work for her. I don’t feel sorry for her one bit.
I don’t mean to be rude but you should read the article. The very first thing she says is that she deeply regrets what she did.
@ Kenny Boy
My problem is not a reading one, is a memory one. I still remember very well when she tried to cash on the scandal. If she would really regret it, she would be a bit more respectful and keep Hillary’s name (and her personality judgement) out of it. I don’t care about any of them, but that sentence in there was not of a regretting person.
I disagree. Right now is the PERFECT time for her to come out of hiding. This will be in the news for a while, but will still have time to die-down before Hillary announces her intentions.
In fact, I bet the Clinton’s had some thing to do with this exact timing.
I am with you there. I think this will die down before even the end of the summer. We have a short attention span as a whole we aren’t going to be talking about Bill’s BJ in 2016.
Please, it will be gone by next week.
@T . Fanty +10000000000. My thoughts exactly
I think there is room for two victims in the story. I am by no means excusing what she did and she should have known better, but the way she was vilified is beyond the pale.of course Hillary is a victim of the same public humiliation, I just don’t think that it’s mutually exclusive. the amount that she suffered for a little bit of sex is just not proportionate.
there’s just no need to pit the women against each other like this. Bill Clinton was the one who was married. History has written off Bill’s involvement as “LOL, crazy Bill and his wandering dong” while continuing to crucify Lewinski for being an evil stupid slut and Hillary for being a sexually frigid bitch who can’t keep her man at home. Totally unfair and ridiculous.
^^^^This completely. Every word of it.
YES! Yes, yes, yes!
Well said!
THANK YOU! People are saying that if she would just stay out of the spotlight, she’d be fine. But that’s exactly what she’s done for the last dozen years. If it doesn’t go away after a decade of utter silence, it’s just not going to to away. I’m glad she’s finally ready to confront it, especially if she’s otherwise unemployable.
Great post.
Umm, Monica was the reason Hillary was elected to the Senate. It allowed Hillary to play the victim card, people softened to her, and she capitalized, as a good Clinton always does. Of course Hillary is a smart, accomplished woman, but politically, she was toxic until Monica happened. None of it, not the Senate, not the Secretary of State and not her eventual coronation as President happens without Monica.
Poor Hillary! bahahahah! You can’t be serious. She signed up for all of this by marrying a man who has whored around his entire legal career. Folk in Arkansas were covering his cheating ass way back when he was governor.
No, Billary sold her soul to ride on his back so she could have power. He kept on doing it and she looked the other way in public and tried cutting his balls off back when he was governor but it never worked. She sold her role as strong woman who does not get screwed over in favor of being in denial and hiding secrets. I would have tremendous respect for her today if she’d stood up for herself and said, nope, no idiot lying man is going to take advantage of me, I am strong enough to stand on my own. That is a role model. This? nothing more than a sham PR marriage. Faker than plastic snow.
“Poor Hilary” and “Poor Monica” completely misses the point of this story! We are being fed some First Class Doublespeak à la ‘1984’ by George Orwell. (See my #44 reply.)
The articles are there for anyone who cares to read what really happened. The photos of Monica’s infamous Vanity Fair July 1998 issue do not lie. One picture shows a euphoric Monica Lewinsky cavorting on Malibu Beach with the American Flag, and another depicts her as a Rosalind Russell farmer’s daughter, complete with the busting out of her checkered blouse.
http://books.google.com/books?id=bAC7P_rhW7kC&pg=PA14&lpg=PA14&dq=Monica+Lewinsky+Vanity+Fair+Herb+Ritts+photos&source=bl&ots=5kLVF9HrBL&sig=ypG655MW2QXWd0wcKtXO4Hm9BBc&hl=en&sa=X&ei=ep9rU43_MoKiyAHT94DoBA&ved=0CGIQ6AEwEg#v=onepage&q=Monica%20Lewinsky%20Vanity%20Fair%20Herb%20Ritts%20photos&f=false
Hillary played it all very, very well. No pity party for her from me.
Most CEOs get fired when they shlup the interns- this case should have been NO different. Bill’s life went on, while Monica’s is stuck in time. Sexual inequality at its finest.
I haven’t known that to be accurate.
Agree 1000%…..many people,especially the fake feminists, are such hypocrites regarding the whole Lewinski saga.
In what way, and who are the fake feminists?
I agree with the premise that many feminists of that era were all about Bill Clinton regardless of the horrible way he treated women. Cheating, sexually harassing them. Remember Paula Jones? Did any feminists come to her aid? No, they threw her to the wolves and said she was making it up in spite of evidence much more persuasive than Anita Hill’s claim of the same thing. Their official line was that Bill Clinton supports women, and they betrayed women to keep to that story.
Fake feminists are those who would rationalize this incident as being a minor incident because they are aligned with him politically. I have seen grown women justify and excuse Clinton’s behavior and lies regarding Lewinsky just because he supports abortion. In all seriousness could anyone imagine if Clinton was one of the Koch brothers? I highly doubt that people on this thread would be so forgiving.
There needs to be consistency,otherwise this type of predatory behavior will become acceptable.
@Steph, Did she seduce him, though? Or did he start the affair? Serious question.
@GoodNamesAllTaken, Bill Clinton was one of the reasons why the country eventually collapsed financially. He and Hillary are both Republican-light.
Totally agree, Kiddo, yet he is credited with everything good that just happened to be going on at the time with the economy. That’s what drives me nuts. He was such a flawed, selfish, immature hypocrite, but people still revere him because of his superficial charm, and point to his presidency as this sort of Camelot. It bugs me, as you may have noticed. Lol
Yeah, agreed, @GoodNames. Thanks for reminding me about the lying under oath. I think based on that, he should have been impeached. However, I stick with my overall opinion that all these F*ckers lie, all the time, and about things that are more critical to the nation.
Eh, people do the same thing with Reagan who was really just a different kind of bastard than Clinton was.
People in this country have incredibly short memories when it comes to presidents.
@Kiddo,
He was impeached. He was acquitted.
Well then, all’s well that ends well?
TheOriginalKitten, Agree 100%.
GoodNames, I tend to think people admire Bill Clinton less for his superficial charm — which is what tended to get him into trouble, after all — but for his brilliance. I don’t think his presidency is romanticized at all, in fact I think it’s fair to say that it was as nearly as divisive as Obama’s has been. I don’t disagree that he’s deeply flawed, but I don’t think it takes away from his accomplishments, past and present.
@Esmom
I don’t think his flaws necessarily take away from his accomplishments, either, or the fact that he is very intelligent. What drives me crazy is the persistent belief that he “loves women” and was good for women. He loves sex and power. He treats women like disposable Kleenex, with no more respect or concern for their humanity than he would give a bug crawling across the floor. He sexually harassed women and other women flew to his defense and blamed his victims. He gets credit for a good economy when it was really just good luck. I do think he has done some good things. I just don’t understand why he remains so popular. He’s not a good person.
GoodNames, I hear you. I think he’s popular because he does continue to do good work. For better or for worse, that is eclipsing his flaws and failures. And sadly, I don’t think there are many truly good people in politics. Or in the highest levels of business for that matter. I’d like to think there are more good than bad but I think the fact remains that when you get to the highest levels, you’ve likely been unable to avoid some of the shadiest people and situations imaginable. Some are just better than others at hiding it. 🙁
Actually, Quinn, most CEOs do not get fired after having affairs with interns.
Perhaps most don’t get caught in such spectacular style. I’ve personally worked for two corporations where higher-ups were fired for having sexual relationships with subordinates. Most companies do not wish to deal with possible sexual harassment claims.
Yeah, I don’t think CEOs get fired all that often for their dalliances. I don’t like Bill Clinton as a person, but he didn’t run a campaign based on family values. He also didn’t rape Monica, it was a consensual affair. So while this was a betrayal to Hillary, at least on public level, (they probably already made a deal with the devil on affairs), why would he be ‘fired’?
Your premise is correct but I think you’ve overlooked the nuances to Clinton’s reclamation. It’s not like he got off scot free as you allude. Lewinsky cost Clinton a shot at historical canonization on par with FDR and JFK combined. His ascendency was dizzying and despite the senior ststesman respect he enjoys today, the Lewinsky scandal pulled him down hard.
Everything Clinton lost its magic and that became the white elephant in the room. Clinton dug in his nails and wouldn’t let his own party completely relegate him to obscurity, but every Democratic nominee since Clinton has made it painfully and publicly clear that he is only welcome on the campaign bus for late night poker and anecdotes. This despite being a brilliant political strategist, an innately perceptive Washingtonian and a serial charmer.
His health crises, his daughter’s wedding, his work with past presidents on the international front and Hillary’s hard work has literally pulled Clinton out of the fire. He has not exactly sailed on.
As for gender bias in the treatment of Lewinsky, I agree, but she also seems to be unable to find a viable course to fulfillment. After all these years the reasons can’t all point to misogyny imo.
I agree.
Yes. I think he achieved a huge measure of redemption last fall, though, with his convention speech.
You bring up an interesting point, but I’ve thought that the reasoning for Clinton being shunted to the side in campaigning was twofold: 1) Bubba overshadows everything. He is magnetic and a total attention hog. No candidate wants to share space with someone more charismatic than that. And 2) his presence with Hillary will always relegate her to First Lady. It doesn’t matter what she accomplished unless she becomes president, because whenever they’re pictured together all you can think about are those old power dynamics, and it puts Hilary in a secondary role.
The other thing is that Clintonistas are notorious for working for their own endgame with little regard for the direct party line. During the Kerry campaign the Clinton faction was difficult to work with because they were clearly working with Hilary 2008 in mind. The Clinton faction is clannish
I personally couldn’t care less about what the White House hussy has to say! Zip it!
I love Bill Clinton to death. I think the man is brilliant, and I wish he could run for president every four years. But I blame him for what happened with Monica Lewinsky. I was still a teenager when all that happened and I think my teenage self kind of looked at Lewinsky as a sl*t. But as an adult I realize Bill should have shut it down if she was flirty with him. She made a bad choice, but he was older, more experienced, and smarter than her. He should have known putting her under that desk would end up defining her life in very negative ways. I kind of like that she doesn’t just go away either. He needs to be haunted by her.
She was ready, willing, and eager to do it. What man is going to turn this down??? Whether your a man of power or a regular person, what man is going to turn this down? Come on!
Um, I know plenty of men who “would turn it down.”
A mature man with an ounce of integrity? What kind of men do you settle for? Men aren’t animals with uncontrollable lust. They have minds, and some of them actually use them.
are you serious with this? so men are just horn dogs with no ability to turn down sex from a willing partner? do you have any idea how disrespectful that is to men?
you’ve also just excused cheating because the poor men just can’t help themselves. I hope you feel like women should get aa biologically earned free pass to cheat, too.
“Sure, my boss took advantage of me,” says it ALL.
i was never a fan (hate all politicians) of BC, never thought of her as a sl*t (but had no respect for her fooling around with a married man), and thought she really took the brunt of it. hard lesson to learn at that age.
and people saying ‘he has a pen!s so therefore’ -that’s just lame. people that work around money that want to be rich don’t always steal. some people have scruples. BC isn’t one of those people, hence being a successful politician. he is gross, always was and always will be to me.
ITA, he should be haunted, but doubt he is.
A mature man with an ounce of integrity?
@ GoodNamesAllTaken…There’s your problem in a nutshell. Unfortunately, no politicians have an ounce of integrity. Not in the system we have. If they start off that way, they are soon corrupted to varying degrees.
Very true. But she was talking about all men, not just politicians, and I still believe there are men who would behave honorably in the same circumstances. They might not be politicians, but they exist.
Isn’t it sad that our political system turns people with decent intentions into liars and hypocrites? Or does it just appeal to liars and hypocrites? I honestly don’t know.
You’re right on the first and second account. As to your question, I ask another: Chicken or egg?
@GoodNames: a lot people get into politics for the right reasons, but chances are those arent the same people with the money to get elected.
I don’t care how old you are…if you know he’s married and yet you STILL make passes…you need to learn the consequences of your actions. Not too long ago everyone was crucifying 22 year old Kristen Stewart for getting with a much less known married man, so why is there a difference? Neither the men or the women in the situations are right OR wrong but they were all consensual and therefore, your actions are yours to deal with. I don’t understand why after ten years this is still being discussed.
Because she was in VF.
I wouldn’t go as far as to say poor Monica but I do feel a bit bad for her if it is true that she can’t get a job and so on. I’m sure her 22 year old self didn’t see the far-reaching consequences of her actions…what 22 year old does?
That said, I do sort of like her point about Hillary blaming the two of them as being troubling in a way. Why doesn’t Bill Clinton get any of the blame? It takes two (or three) to tango, after all.
Monica was treated horribly afterwards, as was Bill Clinton’s pattern towards the women with whom he cheated, but he certainly didn’t do anything to force her into the relationship. In fact, my recollection is that she came on to him by showing him the top of her thong, etc.. She was young enough that I think he took advantage, or should have had the integrity to turn her down, but we are talking about Bill Clinton, who sacrificed his legacy and potential for greatness because of his lack of integrity and self control.
I thought her point about Hillary blaming herself and Monica instead of Bill was interesting. I guess that’s how Hillary and many women justify staying with habitual cheaters, and how Hillary keeps the heat off of Bill so he can stay in the public eye and help her politically.
I also think the answer to her question about whether she should put her life on hold just because Hillary might run for president is yes, you should. You have already caused Hillary enough public humiliation and pain. We all know what happened. Why bring it all up again now? I find that highly suspicious.
I think whether or not Monica says anything is irrelevant, because if Hilary does run all this crap will be brought back to the forefront. If anything it might even help her a bit, to secure some of the women voters, she’ll be seen as strong, puts her family first, etc..
I honestly don’t feel sorry for any of them, they were all adults and like you said Clinton was known for philandering. Monica was not his first, nor his last.
Yes, I agree it will be brought up again, but I wonder if any Hillary opponents “encouraged” Monica to come forward now?
You basically summed up my feelings towards Monica. She did an awful thing, but she was also quite sorry and only 22 years old. I’m sure it was consensual, but often when someone in their early 20s gets involved with someone old enough to be their father I do think there tends to be a degree of manipulation involved. She was guilty of behaving very badly, but I also feel that Clinton being so much older and wiser (and in a position of power) should have never taken advantage of her crush. The thing that bothered me was the media spin where she was portrayed as the “woman who almost took down Clinton” when in reality it was Clinton’s wandering dong, his lying about his wandering dong, and this weird obsession that the public and parts of the government had about the President’s sex life (I remember my French relatives discussed this once and were like “why did they make such a big deal about that man, it’s ridiculous?”) that almost bungled the Clinton administration.
While I’m empathetic towards Monica despite her wrongdoing, I do think she shouldn’t have talked to VF. What point does this serve? The world has slowly moved on, and it’s been what…15 years? Sometimes there comes a point when the best thing to do is be quiet.
And the total hypocrisy of those parts of the government who went after him who had wandering dongs of their own.
Exactly, several of the people who went after Clinton had wandering dongs of their own. Besides, they should have been concentrating on way more important matters…like helping the country…than policing Clinton’s wandering dong. The thing that gets me is that we have had politicians who have taken large bribes and yet the media made a bigger deal about Clinton screwing around…which was absurd.
He lied under oath. He put the entire country in turmoil and political standstill because he such an immature twat that he was screwing a 22 year old in the Oval Office instead of running the country. Don’t blame the people who used it to their advantage. Nobody was responsible for this mess but Bill Clinton. He knew people would use it against him if he got caught, but he didn’t care about anybody but himself. That’s who he is.
@GoodNamesAllTaken. Oh that’s right. I forgot about that.
I agree with your whole post.
It sounds like she tried to move on and go nowhere, so the article is probably out of frustration and an attempt to stir up more opportunities for herself, but it’s only going to bring up a lot of pain and scrutiny for herself and others too.
@lark
” The world has slowly moved on, and it’s been what…15 years? Sometimes there comes a point when the best thing to do is be quiet.”
–The thing is, people bring up the blue dress and monica often. Monica even said it in her interview, that Beyonce sung about it recently. And for everyone too young to know about Monica, they hear Beyonce’s lyrics…google the phrase and bam, there it is.
People aren’t forgetting. People always reference it. So may be, it was time for her to finally say, “stop” or “here’s my story, now let’s move on..please”
oh my…I just googled the lyrics to that song. I have no words. And you are right, every kid who will look up those lyrics will help keep the story alive. And isn’t it just so sad that Clinton was able to restore his power although he lied his ass off during the whole thing and only admitted to it when he realized there was no way out and she still gets confronted with it in job interviews as a dealbreaker.
@reddy, While that is true and she might have had less opportunity than Clinton since she had less power, she did nothing in the meantime to change the narrative. And here she is all this time later rehashing it. Which, I guess, yeah, maybe it is a catharsis, but she could have aligned herself with some type of charity or something of goodwill, with her notoriety, and capitalized on it. Instead, I think she and Bill are both cut from a similar cloth, in that they are both very self-centered. At least now she is talking about bullying and finding some meaning in what happened, but she also should own her part in it. She knew he was married and had an important role in the country.
Heck the very first episode of Scandal referenced it (it being the whole point of the show and all)
I agree Kiddo–she’s done nothing to change the narrative. She’s not moved forward. The very first thing she did was try and start a clothing/purse line–not get a job. I think most of it is Bill’s fault, but she does bear some blame, especially in how she is perceived.
somebody paid for all of the fancy places she lived in all of those cities. she lived in a very nice apartment in NYC in the west willage. don’t know that i believe that she didn’t have an income. and not certain somebody didn’t pay her something for keeping her mouth shut.
also, didn’t she do a few photoshoots?
I did wonder about that too poppy. I don’t know how ‘connected’ or wealthy her family is. Though after the Edwards ‘scandal’ is isn’t hard to imagine she may have been paid off by “someone” to assist her in going away.
I am curious about the timing of this. Though I can appreciate that VF (and others maybe) could have been asking for a while and now is better than in 12 months time.
The blame for the situation rests squarely on Bill’s shoulders. He was a married man with the world’s most visible and arguably powerful job. He’s very smart but not smart enough to know this was a bad move. Monica is not blameless. 22 is young, esp when you have a crush on your boss but 22 is well old enough to know it was wrong. And that the repercussions could be huge (did she really think if it became public he would stand by her?). Of course there’s probably a “special place in hell” for Linda Tripp?
The worst thing about this whole affair was the prosecution and the ensuing media circus. It was an AFFAIR, he didn’t have her tortured and killed. He didn’t commit any crime – or did he when he lied about it? Yet the world (and by world I mean the actual world outside the world that is the USA) watched in bizarre fascination at the hysterical prosecution lead by Mr Starr. What’s the POS up to now I wonder? I’m not saying let’s all have France’s level of ‘meh, whatever’ but really it was a beat up of enormous proportions. (And that was back then, can you imagine in today’s climate of partisanship what the reaction would be?) Americans might not agree. I speak from a point of view that if my Prime Minister was caught with a cigar and an intern I might burst out laughing.
Yes, he committed a crime when he lied under oath. And you have to put it in perspective from an American point of view. Were the people who used this to their advantage hypocrites? Hell, yes. Is it probably more practical to laugh at this sort of thing as other countries do? Probably. But that’s not what happens here. Clinton KNEW what would happen to this country if he got caught. He KNEW what they would do with it. And he KNEW the humiliation it would put his daughter and his wife through. And he DIDN’T CARE. He did it anyway, several times. Because that’s who Bill Clinton is. Stop blaming the people who wanted to bring him down. He handed them the means on a silver platter because he wanted a cheap screw. HE is responsible.
People seem to forget about that part GoodNames
I know, and it drives me crazy! Can you tell? Lol
OH MY (said in George Takei voice)
You are all fired up on this thread, Goodnames.
I think we need to bust out the bowl.
No, scratch that.
This calls for the heavy artillery–we’re taking gravity bong hits.
Also, all this talk about Lewinsky’s dress made my yogurt far less appealing.
The lying under oath thing was what brought him down, not the sex.
Eww. Kitten, you have ruined vanilla yogurt for me!
Yeah, I’m not a Clinton fan. I guess I’m not that subtle about it. Ok, pass that bong.
Sorry Sloane.
We need snacks too, GoodNames. Weed and honey wheat pretzels will erase the stink of Clinton.
Deal.
Remember to inhale.
Lol, Amy, good advice.
I mean worse things have happened with politicians. The mayor of Toronto was caught smoking crack, and that’s much worse than caught having an affair, yet I didn’t see the media going insane over it.
Honestly what Clinton did is NOTHING unusual in politics or DC.
Yeah, but the mayor had the great excuse that he was in a drunken stupor when he did it. Still shaking my head over that one.
“in” politics, not is.
Wait, what? You don’t see the media going insane over it?
There has been a complete freak out over it time and time again. Where do you live? Because honestly, Canadian AND American news outlets had a field day with this, and it’s been on ton’s of tv shows as well. It was a hugeeee deal.
@GoodNames, Yeah I still can’t believe it even though his substance abuse is well documented… To me, that’s a lot more problematic than a politician having an affair.
@Kiddo, haha sorry English isn’t really my first language!
@Erinn, I live in DC. I didn’t see a hullabaloo over it as I did with other scandals.
@ Feebee, yes, the timing of Lewinsky’s article is suspicious. I believe it’s in the best interest of the Clintons to get this story out ahead of Hilary’s presidential bid. The news cycle wants fresh meat, and Lewinsky has effectively spoiled their appetite to regurgitate this affair ad nauseum.
I am a feminist who believes who people choose to have sex with is their own business. Equality has nothing to do with sexual acts or cheating on your spouse or significant other. In 1992 and again in 1996, choosing between a politician who cheats and who supports reproductive freedom and equal rights for all and a politician who supports making abortion illegal, blocking Plan B or birth control access to all, entitling welfare to the wealthy & Big Business, curtailing environmental protections, and a frank assault on civil rights was no contest at all.
I hear you, but why can’t we expect a better choice? What is wrong with us that we don’t demand more than the choice between two evils? I don’t have an answer, by the way, just wondering about your take on it.
Yeah, the lesser evil choice is politics is getting very tired, especially since, more and more, the evils are beginning to move to the middle, which was already right of center, as far as being corporatists.
“in” politics, not is. Things are ending up in strange places when I comment now.
You’re a strange place.
But yeah, I agree that we deserve better as a country, but I’ve been so put-off by politics lately that I try to ignore it all. Admittedly, not the best approach.
Well, since you asked, GoodNames, here goes.
Our mass saturation media and the news is very depressing. Personally, I think it’s a tool used by our corporate masters to keep us divided and downtrodden. When independent papers were en vogue, they were vehicles for communities to pull together. They were engines of social change and helped us come together as a country.
Now, you have to look to your community (virtual or otherwise) to get the real news on the ground, and you have to get involved to effect change at the street level, even if that is only voting every office you can including dogcatcher and participating in your neighborhood or home association. (I’m starting “Unstoppable : the Emerging Left-Right Alliance to Dismantle the Corporate State” by Ralph Nader soon, and that should be a good pertinent read.)
We can and must effect change from the ground up, a ‘trickle up’ if you will. We the people will only enjoy as much true and just representation as we fight for. It serves the vested interests for us not to vote and for us to give up and believe that one person can’t fight City Hall. After all, the ‘radical lower classes’ mobbed the elites who wanted our original Constitution and Bill of Rights to only allow the vote to landholders.
Linda trip runs a year round christmas shop called “the Christmas Sleigh”
If her betrayal of Monica does not insure her a place in hell, surely running a year round christmas shop does.
While 22 is an adult, can we just say that most 22 year olds are still figuring things out and you’re still not “formed” as an adult completely? And how would you like it if something you did at 22 becomes a huge, international punchline and that’s what defines your entire life? Such is the fate of Monica Lewinsky.
— Please reread your coverage of Kristen Stewart as I roll my eyes —
Amen.
We all make mistakes but part of owning, learning and growing from those mistakes means not throwing up your age as a defense. True she was 22 but she was not sitting around her dorm room gazing at posters of Rob Lowe and eating pizza with the girls. She was an ambitious scholar from a politically and socially savvy family. She managed to vie for and secure one of the most enviable internships in the country – undergoing many hours of training in procedure and protocol.yet instead of expanding and strengthening the platforms that got her the job she decided ‘oh screw it, I’ll just flash my thong…it’s much quicker.’
You’re right but unfortunately, it’s all in who you like.
@MrsBPitt…I absolutely agree that Bill bears the majority of blame for the affair. Respectfully though…I must disagree…Was she a victim ? Not if she now says that it was consensual. What disturbs me about Monica is that she continues to rehash this issue all the while insisting that she wants to move on with her life. She now no longer has the excuse of age, and obviously knew the impact of this piece in VF would have. Now she proceeds to “instruct” Hilary. Sorry, but I do think “poor Monica,” has narcissistic tendencies.
Bill should have kept it in his pants, and she should have resisted. He shouldn’t have cheated on his wife, and she should have had a “WTF?” moment. However, most women love a powerful man, and when you’re 22 you’re not thinking of the ramifications of your actions. And, most older men love a younger woman showing interest. Maybe I’m a now-jaded 45 year old, but I’m sure this stuff has been going on since Washington in 1789. 40 years ago nobody would have found out about their escapades.
I love the juxtapositioning of this entry with Drew Barrymore’s statement that she wants her daughters to be interns.
Nice!
I have a lot of sympathy/empathy for Monica. She and I are the same age, and I could very easily put myself in her place. I certainly don’t approve of having affairs with married men, but I think she’s not only the victim of her own bad judgment but also of a predatory man with tons of power. I believe it was consensual, and I can also believe she started it, but that doesn’t excuse his actions.
I hope her book makes her a lot of money. I’m glad the bad choices I made in my early twenties didn’t brand me for the rest of my life in the public eye.
Now all that said:
” I’ve decided, finally, to stick my head above the parapet so that I can take back my narrative and give a purpose to my past. ”
Oh that choice of words.
I get why Hillary called her a Looney; Monica thought she was going to get the man, the house, the dream. With rare exception, the man never leaves his wife for his mistress. Especially a politician currently seated as leader of the most powerful nation in the world. That is straight up delusional.
That she had to suffer the kind of wrath she did also pisses me off, since she wasn’t the one who broke her marriage vows. What consenting adults do together doesn’t matter to me at all, but men never get treated the same way as women do after an affair and Monica didn’t deserve to be Santorumed for giving blowjays.
*eyeroll* Why is she yapping about this crap again? She must need money badly.
I went and read her wiki. Looks like she had a relationship with a married man in Los Angeles as well. Perhaps her type is other peoples husbands? Not that the men are not to blame as well (it takes two, after all)… But it’s just seems to have been a pattern for her.
Get a life, Monica.
I actually kind of like her, not because of her mistake but because she seems smart and funny and has handled the situation over the past 16 years with a lot of grace. I feel bad for her as well. I would hate to have every relationship detail and all my mistakes from that age go public. At least I married the guy I tried out most of my stupid mistakes on and he kept my indiscretions pretty quiet (and likewise).
I really hate the tone of woman blaming that goes along with everything Monica Lewinsky related. Why is it always the woman’s fault? He was the one who was married.
Monica got a crappy deal. She made a mistake when she was young and naive and it continues to affect her life. The media and politicians need to stop dragging this story up.
I think it is ridiculous that the media and politicians continue to ask questions about that time. If Hillary were to run again, what happened all those years ago, should not be used to discredit her. She did not have the affair. In general I really hate when someone is hounded about an affair their spouse had.
I agree. She will never lead a normal life. Women get ostracized in these cases. Not saying men escape unscathed, but Bill has enjoyed a nice career and didn’t have to bear the same fall out of having his name and reputation ruined int he same way. What does that say about society and how we view women/how women are treated.
I am sure it was consensual, too.
Excusing Lewinsky is an insult to every 22 year old with a strong work ethic, ambition and a moral compass.
Agree. It was not her first affair with an older, married man.
Nobody is excusing her. Even the comments about her age are not excusing her. You can discuss information to put things in context without giving someone a free pass; these are not mutually exclusive things.
Age as context is only relevant if that knowledge contributes to or aids our understanding of the situation. I simply feel that consideration of her age equates to excusing her for this reason. It would be like mentioning that Lewinsky also likes her steaks medium rare. She was 22. Great, and?
This even more so in light of what GNAT said.
Why do you think placing something in context means it’s a free pass? A lot of people seem to think this way about all kinds of issues, and I just don’t get it. To make it a relatable example to CB, take Justin Bieber. Is it any surprise he is acting like a spoiled little snotrag, being surrounded by mone and daddy being his party buddy and letting all that attention and praise go to his swollen little head? Not a surprise. But it doesn’t mean I don’t think he’s excused from his behavior.
Reason =/= excuse.
I always felt sorry for her. All those disgusting old men asking her such intimate personal details. You know they got off on it. She got destroyed by it.
I would hate to have my life defined by anything I did at 22.
Monica was a grown woman when she got involved with the married Bill Clinton. Although as POTUS, Clinton had the power but they were equally wrong. When she made the consensual statement I took it as Clinton didn’t threaten to fire her if she didn’t go to his bed. Clinton should have received the brickbats just like Monica.
A lot of op ed writers, mostly women, are coming down on Monica out of fear that the rehash of the scandal would hurt Hillary’s maybe bid for the White House in 2016. The only way I could see this hurting Hillary’s political fortunes if it’s confirmed that Hillary knew about Bill and Monica from the very beginning, and not broadsided like the rest of the nation when Slick Willie had to confess on camera. Hillary’s image is the surprised wronged wife who rose from the ashes of scandal and shame to become a US senator and Secretary of State. That image would be tarnished if proven she looked the other way. John Edwards’ dying wife, Elizabeth, lost some sympathy points when it was revealed she knew about John and Reille from the get go. This would go to the character question for Hillary, just like Mitt Romney’s “47%” statement. It’s a long way from now to November 2016 – enough time to chip away at a legacy.
You honestly think Hillary was “surprised” that her husband was a cheater? After the countless times he had cheated before? Just because she didn’t know about Monica specifically doesn’t mean she didn’t know she was married to a liar and a cheater. She did. She just chose to ignore it because she would be nothing without him politically and she has the same lust for power as he does. She sold her soul for it, and she got what she bargained for. I don’t find her admirable or pitiable in the least.
@GoodNames – No I don’t think Hillary was 100% clueless about Monica, given Bill’s track record. What I’m saying is that’s been the public narrative of Hillary as aggrieved in-the-dark FLOTUS: she stalwartly defended her louse of a spouse, opining this was a vast right-wing conspiracy, all the way up to a few hours before the national reveal. That was about the time a court order for Bill’s DNA, to match that on the blue dress, was issued. The subsequent impeachment rallied people to the First Couple’s defense. When 42 (Clinton) left office, he left with a 60%+ approval rating. That’s how the Clintons got a second act. People who want to see Hillary become 45 (th President of the United States) don’t want possible new revelations to derail a history-making dream.
Ok, I see what you’re saying. Sorry I misunderstood. You are right.
The public narrative drives me crazy. As you might have noticed. I honestly do not understand how people can whitewash this couple and elevate them to hero status after everything they have done. I think Hillary might be our next President, and as much as I would love to have a woman president, that just makes me ill. All I can think of is her saying she was running from her helicopter, dodging bullets, when she was actually being greeted by school children. Sorry, I need to breathe into a paper bag now.
The lie Mrs. Clinton told about dodging bullets on the runway is totally gross. You’re right about that, GoodNames.
Our political system is broken. Only millionaires need apply. The relentless media focus on a Lewinsky type story is a sadly transparent distraction to the real problems our oligarchy engenders. I have never been prouder of our country than when Democrats, Republicans, the Left, and the Right came together to thwart military adventurism in Syria.
The Emerging Left-Right Alliance to dismantle our Corporate state is the one we all need to come together on. Our environment should be our number one focus, followed closely by social justice and a living wage for all.
Monica, Hilary, Bill – Girl and Ex President BYE!
Yawn. Go buy another bag o’ Chips Ahoy, Monica.
Way to add to the conversation by tossing in sexist/sizist stereotypes.
Monica’s interview with the liberal leaning Vanity Fair is obviously some kind of backroom deal with the Clintons to reinvigorate the perception that Hillary is a victim who is capable of overcoming anything.
The next thing I’d expect is that Hillary will reach out to Monica with some grand benevolent gesture of forgiveness.
Oprah is probably in the process of orchestrating a sit-down which will air in prime time during November sweeps.
Yes…I think this has all been carefully orchestrated.
Oh, I think this “has all been carefully orchestrated” also. But not by Hillary, or any dems.
ITA, Tippy.
I was involved in an affair with a married man in my late 20’s. I was so naive, I truly believed all the lies he told me. I have many regrets about my choices. If my entire life had been defined by that one terrible choice, it would be devastating. I feel kind of sorry for Monica.
+1. The choices I made in my early 20’s would not be the same ones I would make now. Some were stupid and many were made because I was young and naive. To have those choices haunt me for life would be difficult to say the least. She was a young girl, and he was a powerful man who used that to seduce her, and I’m sure it didn’t take much.
Not to mention, things have a way of snowballing out of control. (Dangit, why does everything I write sound like a double entendre?) She might not have “gone after” Clinton initially. Just started flirting, He was receptive. Flirting gets more risque. Things start moving fast. I’ve been on a few slippery slopes myself, especially when I was younger. That’s not to say she wasn’t an adult, and of course she bears some responsibility. But in a way, there but for the grace of God go I.
was ANYONE really asking about this? did we want to hear more about it? is stirring the whole pot again sixteen years later when everyone has forgotten about it really going to help people to NOT associate you with this scandal? no? I didn’t think so. go away.
^^^ This.
The person we should feel sorry for is not Monica Lewinski, it’s Chelsea Clinton. SHE was young when all this went down. Monica was a college graduate. I agree that she was mistreated by the media and the legal system. But I don’t agree that she was “still young” though I’ll concede that she was very immature. She shouldn’t have told someone she hardly knew (Linda Tripp) about the affair. When you decide to get involved with a married man, particularly someone with children (let alone the president!), you should do all you can to protect the people involved instead of bragging to your co-workers. STUPID!
“I’m going to the White House to get my presidential knee-pads on!”
Guess who said that? Monica went after Clinton like a heat-seeking missile and he fell for it. The Clinton’s never had what you would characterize as a great physical relationship in their marriage. That doesn’t condone what he did but it does put it in an interesting light where a young woman is deliberately throwing herself in an aggressively sexual manner at the President and he stupidly succumbed. Then she tells the biggest blabbermouth in Washington, Linda Tripp, about the affair. Linda wanted to take Monica down and did so spectacularly. It’s almost as if Monica wanted the affair leaked as in her addled brain she thought she stood a chance at an ongoing relationship with Clinton.
She was and apparently still is a mixed up person who wreaked havoc in many people’s lives – why rehash a sad and destructive situation but for another grab at fame and public sympathy without understanding the pain and embarrassment it will bring back for so many?
Who do I feel sorry for? Chelsea. She most certainly didn’t ask for any of this mess. Everyone else is, to varying degrees, in the wrong.
Monica was young, yes, but she was an adult. And let’s not forget that President Clinton wasn’t the first married man (in a position of authority over her) that she pursued. How many passes does she get? She could have faded away forever and had better chances for a normal life, but she keeps putting herself back out there.
President Clinton damn well should have known better. This story was Fatal Attraction meets The West Wing – Monica totally pursued him. Sad to think the leader of the free world was brought to his knees by a BJ. That being said, his “relationship” with Monica was more extensive than I think most people realize. It went on for a while.
As for Hillary, I think most people, at some point in their relationships, could look back and say “yes, I could/should have been more attentive.” Does that make this her fault, absolutely not, but I don’t really feel sorry for her either. I think she and President Clinton both knew darn good and well what they were climbing into bed with when the relationship began, politically and romantically. And I don’t think she would be where she is today without him.
+1
I feel for her. Like so many here have said, Bill got off lightly. Monica got all the blame. She was a wide-eyed teen with a crush on a man who had power and influence over her. No, it doesn’t make her blameless, but I think she was a kid who got in too deep. When it comes to things like this, there is always someone who gets hurt. And its usually always the lovesick woman. The man keeps his marriage, he loses nothing. Monica lost a lot all because of one teen crush. I do not abide affairs, but I give her a pass because she was the vulnerable one, he was the one with power, influence and authority. I truly think he took advantage of that. Its the same reason why teacher-student relationships are forbidden. Its a power imbalance and dollars to donuts its the one who is lovesick and in love that loses out all the time. Its unfair but that’s how it goes.
She was 22, a college grad, and knew exactly what she was doing, not some innocent, rosy-cheeked teenager who got preyed upon by a sexual deviate. She flashed her thong at him, came onto him like gangbusters, made it quite clear that she wanted to sleep with him.
Oh, and she was also having an affair with another married man at the time.
She should have changed her name! Maybe done some volunteer work. Cut and colored her hair. And then gotten on with her life.
That said, she got in bed with the President of the United States and one who was married to Hillary Clinton. Did she really think things were going to work out exactly as she wanted?
I have absolutely no sympathy whatsoever for her. First, she was not some naive girl, coming to the big city for the first time. She lived in the Watergate Building with her mother. While in college she had an affair with a married professor. Then she gets an internship in the Whitehouse, which kids without money/connections usually can’t get or can’t take because they pay no money, and pursues a sexual relationship with the President. Then she keeps a stained dress that her Republican allied “friend” Linda Tripp (who is taping their conversations) tells her to hold onto. After leaving the Whitehouse, she gets a job at the Pentagon, has another affair with a married man, and has an abortion.
She then parlays that into a gig designing handbags for Bergdorf Goodman and then a stint at the London School of Economics. Please! Give me a break. She’s just sorry that her little tawdry stint with fame didn’t come during the height of the internet age when she could have made a career of bad decisions and BJ’s into a “career” like Kim K. and the infamous sex tape.
…and isn’t it convenient that this is being published in time for the fall Congressional elections and pre 2016 presidential election. As a woman who was in graduate school during the last term of Bill Clinton’s presidency, the level of hypocrisy was mindblowing. John Edwards and Newt Gingrinch (they with their own affairs) felt the need to take Bill Clinton “out to the woodshed” from the floors of the Senate and House, respectively.
As for Hillary Clinton and Bill. Last I checked, he wasn’t running for anything and Ken Star (A Republican hatchet man) got to spend $79 million in taxpayers money to look into every crevice of the Clintons personal and professional lives. The only thing we were left with was a BJ. Excuse me if I am a bit too old and tired of hearing younger people parrot right-wing talking points and giving passes to Ms. L.
Brava eurogirl70! Best comment of the thread imo.
A-f’ing-men sister!!!!
Lewinsky thought she was clever and turned out not to be. I think she got what she deserved. She failed to control her narrative or chose the wrong one.
Can someone tell her to change her hairstyle and makeup please -_-
Well spoken in her interview, ML gets cred for taking responsibility – not playing the victim – the Kardashians, Bethenney Frankenstein, could take a lesson in class from her.
I’ve always given Monica a pass on the grounds that young women do dumber things for less interesting men all the time. She wasn’t a gold digger or famewhore, just a typical college kid. And yeah the thought of my ill advised college hook ups being a public joke makes my blood run cold.
I don’t think Monica should have a scarlet letter following her the rest of her life. She was young and paid the price for a stupid mistake. BUT Monica has given several interviews years ago. So breaking her silence? I remember last year when there was a rumor she was shopping a book I went back and read up on her life after. She came from money and after the scandal she was quite popular in the NY social scene. She was the host on that dating show on national TV, the one where the people wore masks or something. She went on to get her Master’s in England and worked for several years with a company. She has connections through her family.
I feel for her as far as the degredation she had to go through and the stress of the legal process and that it follows her. Clinton didn’t get off. He was hated for quite a while. Gore didn’t he want to be associated with him when he ran. I didn’t even like him anymore until a year or two after his presidency he was on Oprah and I was blown away by his passion for issues and his brilliance and an ability to explain issues over my head in a more understandable way. His passion for the country brought me back on board again. But it followed him for quite a while. He moved on and founded his non-partisan humanitarian organization and redeemed himself.
Monica’s life and love life hasn’t gone the way she wanted. I just think she’s not happy with herself. But to say she put her life on hold for eight years while Hillary ran is laughable. Nobody was stopping her from having a career while Hillary ran.
She has always made me very, very sad. Her life was ruined.
Yes, she made a dumb decision, but she was a stupid kid following her idealistic, romantic heart. Yes, she brought it on herself. Yes, she was dealing with the most powerful man (AND woman) in the free world. And it was wrong. But her mistake was held up publicly for the world to see, and the world judged and punished her for it. It was hypocritical in every way.
Could any of us mere mortals hold up our own youthful romantic mistakes to such scrutiny and survive? It was brutal.
Honestly, who could hire her? She couldn’t make a living, folks. Perhaps there are some who are made of stronger stuff who could have turned that notoriety into a moneymaker, but I think that takes a level of self-confidence and fortitude that this gal just never had. If there was ever any foolish gal who needed protection rather than persecution, this was the girl. And she did not get that.
I’m hoping she finds some peace and happiness.
She had affairs with married men before and after Clinton. She has issues. I think, and I mean this kindly, that maybe you are the one with the idealistic, romantic heart. There’s nothing wrong with that, in fact, it’s a good thing. I agree that Monica was treated badly, but she has a pattern of seducing married men. The men are responsible for keeping their vows, but she’s no innocent lamb. And why did she save that blue dress, if not to use this affair in some way that required proof of her affair?
I think I would I say I have empathy for her most human of failings.
She looks very, very unhappy to me and always has.
Yes, I think her unhappiness is maybe at the root of her behavior. She needs some help. I hope she gets it.
There was nothing idealistic about her intentions. She said “I’m going to the White House to put on my presidential knee-pads!!” What does that say to you? What does the fact that she repeatedly flashed her thong at him, followed him relentlessly to every public appearance? Was intentionally and obviously presenting herself as sexually willing and available? She thought she could break up his marriage. She was and may still be a seriously deluded and mixed up person who damaged many people’s lives, not just Bill Clinton’s.
For all those comments “she knew what she was doing”– I’m sure she did, but who among us has a horrible thing that they regret in their past (and I know I do– improper liaisons that would make some posters here clutch their pearls) they’ve done it, and they regret it, wish it had never happened, and asked for forgiveness and moved on? I wish I had a life as perfect as some as you must have. We expect forgiveness for ourselves when we screw up but prefer to flog others. I’m glad my life isn’t defined by mistakes I made when I was 27, never mind 22.
+1!
Most of us have not done something as horrible as targeting the President of the United States with every sexual come-on possible. This isn’t sleeping with someone else’s boyfriend or having too many drinks at the bar and lugging home a stranger, this is determinedly seducing the President knowing full well that she was doing something for which he could be impeached. Then blabbing about it. Please fathom the seriousness of this before you accuse us of having perfect lives and not making mistakes – don’t equate this as a youthful mistake, it was a deliberate, sick and selfish seduction.
I think Hillary, Bill and the Clintonistas should not believe this is going to blow over anytime soon. I looks at the CNN and Huffington Post sites with their Lewinsky threads. CNN has over 9,000 comments; HuffPo has over 3,000. Seeing the high interest in this story the media is going to mine for every Monica nugget it can find and report it. News commentators are starting to show some sympathy for Monica and going into Bill for his behavior really hard. They didn’t do that 20 years ago. Even some posts on threads are showing no love for Hillary; she’s seen as an ambitious wife willing to endure public shame to amass power. The Clintons need to tread lightly; Barack Obama proved they are not invincible.
Well, lets see. Who talked about bailing out mainstreet and not just Wall Street. That would be Hillary. Who won her Senate seat in NYC right after the scandal broke by 10 points in NYC? Who was know as the “workhorse” rather than the “showhorse” of the Senate? That would be Hillary.
A Star Commission report cost the American Taxpayers $79 million. That report and the corresponding investigation went on for 4 years. During that time, an investigation into Whitewater, Travelgate, and Filegate produced no wrong doing on the part of the Clintons. Once investigation after another was piggybacked on top of anoher investigation into the Clintons. This was not an investigation conducted by those sympathetic to the Clintons, but by Republican stalwart and hatchetman Ken Star.
While it may be assumed that Hillary had her connections to Wall Street, it was actually President Obama who received his primary source of campaign 2008 funding from Wall Street; not Hillary. The same man who said he would have voted against the Iraq War resolution voted in favor of giving retroactive immunity to the telecomm industry that has been spying on everyday Americans since the presidency of George W. Bush. The very spying program that Edward Snowdon exposed.
The Clintons are a threat both to the Republicans (who cannot walk and chew gum at the same time) as well as the Democratic establishment in D.C.,as they have always been seen as outsiders and do not require any handholding. Bill Clinton showed the Democrats how to win elections and yet both Al Gore and John Kerry couldn’t locate their own proverbial “balls” to actually get out their and fight for their election lives in 2000 and 2004. President Obama ran on staying “above the fray” and we have yet to see one Wall Street powerbroker doing the perp walk. He goes along to get along; even pre-2012 when he had a majority of his own party in both the House and Senate.
In the end it is simple. Bill Clinton is not running for office; his wife may. If there was any degree of impropriety on the part of former Secretary of State Clinton it would have damn sure come to light by now; as the Republicans have been trying to do just that for the past 25 years. The reason that the media has decided to pull out this little chestnut is because the Clintons have always been smarter and better prepared than any party or any person has been at trying to drag them down.
Oh my God. You’re bringing up Whitewater as a defense of Hillary. Who happened to “find” a file of documents relevant to her document production requests that happened to be in her office but were ” overlooked” until, surprise! The DAY AFTER the statute of limitations ran on her misdeeds?
Her run for office? How about her claiming she was running from her helicopter, “dodging bullets” when she was actually being greeted by school children, while REAL brave heroes were being killed? Then the claim that she ” misspoke” when she was exposed for the liar she is. No impropriety on the part of Secretary of State Clinton. Does Clinton sitting in front of a congressional committee about Benghazi, having the nerve to answer “what difference does it make now?” when asked about why lies were told to the America public about the nature of the terrorist attack wherein four Americans were killed during her watch ring a bell? That just happened to be right before the election of her boss who had falsely claimed that Al Qaida was dead?
Smarter? No. More willing to lie, cheat, pay off, backtrack, hide documents, break the law, fake a “marriage” and sell their souls to the devil for power, maybe. And for the record, I’m a Democrat. The Clintons are a disgrace to the party and to the country. But she’ll probably win, because people like you will not admit she is what she is, no matter how much evidence stares you in the face.
First of all, Hillary Clinton’s direct statement was not “what difference does it make”. Her full statement reads:
“With all due respect, the fact is we had four dead Americans. Was it because of a protest or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided that they’d they go kill some Americans? What difference at this point does it make? It is our job to figure out what happened and do everything we can to prevent it from ever happening again, Senator.”
That is very different in context than how you are trying to spin it. Second of all, it was the United States Senate (and the Republican’s) that held up the additional funding to shore up security at our embassies; Bengazi being one of them. Marines do not provide security at any embassy installation. They serve in a guard duty capacity only. They do not perform military opperations. They never have.
What about the suicide bombings at our military barracks in Lebanon in 1983 under Ronald Reagan? Or the suicide bombing at our U.S. Consolate in Saudi Arabia in 2004 which killed 9 under George Bush. You put people in areas of the world that are volatile and thing happen. And don’t parrot right-wing talking points at me. You can call yourself whatever political stripe you wish to. It doesn’t make your statement true or based in any kind of fact.
Eurogirl, you rock!
I was watching that hearing. And her direct response to the question was a very hairy “what difference does it make now?” THEN she said what you quoted. So you’re the one rewriting history. And her answer doesn’t even make sense. On one hand she’s saying we need to figure out what happened, and on the other she’s saying it doesn’t Mae any difference. The truth is she knew all along it a an act of terror and she lied about it, and now she trying to cover that up by saying it doesn’t matter. Well it matters to me, and the families of the four dead Americans, and lots of other people. Who vote.
I notice you didn’t respond to the Whitewater question or her complete fabrication of dodging bullets. What’s wrong, don’t you have any talking points to parrot on that one? Which is all you have done, except for try to change the conversation to what other presidents have or haven’t done, which has nothing to do with anything.
You can’t see the truth because you don’t want to. I’m expressing my opinion, not parroting anybody. Fool yourself as long as you like. You’re not fooling anybody else.
Sorry but I am not rewriting history. There was no pregnant pause between what does it matter and the rest of her statement.
As for the other part of your statement, as I mentioned before during their time in office there was a $79 million Star Investigation. Run by Republicans by a Republican (Ken Star) out for blood. If there was anything to find it would have been found as they were out for blood. This was not Watergate.
As for your continued harping on Bengazi, I counterd every issue you brought up. It is all there in my earlier statment and there is nothing more to say.
As I said, I was watching the hearing. You are either wrong or you’re lying.
You ignore the fact that she withheld evidence in Whitewater until the statute of limitations ran, then suddenly “found” a file that had been mislaid. It’s hard to prove a case against someone who doesn’t hesitate to illegally withhold evidence until they can no longer be prosecuted.
And still nothing from you about her fabricating a story about dodging bullets? How she understood what the men and women in the military were going through because she had done the same? What’s your excuse for that one? Obviously you don’t have one, or you’d spew it forth, even if it was a lie, just like in the Benghazi hearing.
And no, I won’t stop “harping” on Benghazi. I hope nobody does and she finally has to take some responsibility for her massive failure and subsequent lies. Sorry that bothers you.
And let’s not forget her lovely campaigning based on the fact that she could “get the white vote” while Obama couldn’t. Her racist attempts to frighten white Democrats into choosing her over Obama because he couldn’t “deliver the white vote” like she could. There a a hundred more examples of her lack of character, but I’m wasting my breath. She’ll probably get elected because of the willfully blind who don’t care about little things like lying, cheating, intimidating, ruining lives, abuse of power, fraud… She’s so smart and such a legend!
GoodNames, Eurogirl is correct in the Hillary Clinton transcription. Here is the link to their exact exchange to prove it. – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wVnOu-aFlQ
Thank you sloane.
I’m just a few years older than Monica L., and I was a big fan of the Clinton administration until the news broke about this affair with his intern. It wasn’t so much about the fact that Bill Clinton cheated on his wife, pretty much everyone knew he wasn’t a faithful sort of guy, but the way these people treated this young woman deeply disturbed and disgusted me. They started off by treating Monica Lewinsky like she was some nut case who made it up. Over and over again, Monica was portrayed as some stalker who was obsessed with Bill Clinton, showing up in the crowd at many of his public appearances. And then when the “presidue” on the dress turned out to be real, and Bill could no longer deny his actions, Monica got slammed some more for being a slut. She was young and stupid and made some mistakes like many people in their 20’s, but she didn’t call the media to report that Clinton had cheated with her. . . she just trusted the wrong person (Tripp). She wasn’t a victim by having “relations” with the President, but she paid a pretty steep price for her choices.
I was so disappointed in the Clintons. Especially Hillary. She is not a feminist, by any stretch of the imagination, the way she so willingly threw this young girl under the bus instead of asking her dear husband why he was dropping his pants for a woman who was half his age (not to mention his subordinate). I will NEVER vote for Hillary, ever (and I’m a fairly liberal person). Hopefully I won’t be in the position where I have to make that choice.
Be prepared to be in the position to make that choice!
I suppose we will have to wait and see– a lot can change in a year.
Yeah, don’t vote for her. Instead vote for some creep like Rand Paul or some idiot like Rick Perry, who want to take away food stamps, school lunches, cut the budget of the VA and let our PTSD vets roam the streets; and then continue the corporate welfare of giving away trillions of $ to oil and big agra corporations, and give tax cuts/keep tax loopholes for millionaires and billionaires.
eurogirl70 – no matter how many things you put out, the 2008 Democratic presidential primary proved the Clintons are not invulnerable. They can be hit, and they can LOSE. Bill’s statements during the SC primary did not sit well with African Americans – a voting block that is relied on by any Democrat for victory. Hillary recovered with victories in later primaries, but at the end of the day, all traditional Democrat coalitions were needed to take the White House. Although John McCain made things easier by picking Sarah Palin as his running mate, that Democratic coalition was needed to hold things together. There was bad blood between Obama and Clinton camps but they had to pull it together to ensure a Democrat moved into 1600 on Jan. 20, 2009. If the Clintons want to move back on 1/20/17, they need to get everything locked down – Benghazi, Monica, etc. and not relying on surrogates to pooh-pooh the whole mess and the media playing along. Everyone thought Chris Christie was a virtual lock for the GOP nomination until Bridge-gate. Anything can happen.
Count me in the camp of Monica sympathetic. She was 22. He was the president of the USA. He was her employer. Consensual maybe, but there was a disproportionate imbalance of power (ya think?) and many CEOs and executives have been burned. For sexual harrassment in similar situations.
She was used by everyone in this process. Everyone.
And humiliated. (“I did not have sex with THAT WOMAN.”). She gives him a BJ and she doesn’t rise to the level of having a name.
Hillary called her crazy.
Hillary — you were crazy for marrying and staying with a horn dog. Your choice, but really…
And ML is no dummie. She’s tried to live a quiet life. She has a great brain on her. And now she’s come into her own and owning her history
Yep. Monica sympathetic.
Are you kidding?!?!? “Tried to live a quiet life”?!?! She has tried everything but. This isnt even her first Vanity Fair piece. There was the one where she is posing on the beach wrapped in an American flag. (No, I’m not kidding–this really happened.) Your statement “she was used by everyone in this process.” is incredible. This, about a woman who bragged to friends that she was going to nail POTUS, and then saved the (gross) evidence to be trotted out later. I don’t believe for a NY minute she was anything other than a part of a conspiracy. I don’t believe a lying word out of her stupid mouth.
John Stewart has a great piece on Faux news and the Benghazi bullshit from Monday night. The right wingers that have destroyed this country, broken the backs of the unions and the middle class, and made the rich richer than even they could have ever imagined are great at their hateful propaganda. And poor little Monica plays right into their hands.
Link please… I searched for this and found nothing. No Monica on beach with American flag. What’s with the hate?
Monica wrapped in an American Flag on the Beach was one of several controversial photos in a six page spread in the July 1998 issue of Vanity Fair. Her photos, depicting her as a farmer’s daughter and more, appear to have been scrubbed from the web. Christopher Hitchens’ text that accompanied the salacious spread reads in part:
So—was this the face? The face that launched a thousand subpoenas and ruined the coverage of His Holiness in Havana? Since January, America has been subsisting on a meager diet of Pentagon and high-school yearbook mug shots, revealing more about American dentistry than about the obscure object of desire. Now Monica Lewinsky has graduated. She has graduated, furthermore, into that pantheon of women who, it seems, shook men enough to shake history. Helen of Troy, Theodora of Byzantium, Cleopatra, Lady Macbeth, Sally Hemings, Wallis Simpson, Christine Keeler, Donna Rice, Camilla Parker-Bowles . . . they have nothing in common with each other, but everything in common with an ancient narrative that everybody, however coy or hypocritical, is encoded to understand. Best of all, Monica has joined this class without saying a public word.
Here are the lips that Revlon nearly hired. Here is the unarguable femininity that got the alpha and beta males, from Vernon Jordan to Kenneth Starr, biting through their pencils and stuffing their briefcases. Here is the major hair that set off the most important beret of the 90s. Here is the girl next door, if your Zip Code is 90210, or—provided you believe some unconfirmed gossip)—if your zipper is next door in the Oval Office. It’s the world’s oldest and newest tale.
Monica Lewinsky’s critics like to say that she’s a seeker of attention. Well, by George, she’s got it. But she didn’t get it, like her chief-executive friend, by being all things to all men. She’s one thing to all men, and to all women too, and that is: a reminder. Kings and presidents and potentates may rise and fall, but Mother Nature is boss, and her daughter is no slouch, either. That’s what Bill Clinton meant to say when he spoke generically about “that woman.” – http://www.vanityfair.com/society/features/1998/07/monica-lewinsky
@jane16 and LeahReed, here is a link referring to the exact nature of these censored photos. http://www.nytimes.com/1998/06/10/opinion/liberties-feathered-and-tarred.html
I’m not American, and am I few years younger than Monica… so when this all when down I had only a passing interest in this story. But since devouring two seasons of House of Cards I am sooo interested in what must have been going on behind the scenes!
Poor Monica my ass. At 22 I knew not to have an affair with a married man. And especially the President of the United States. A man who had a young daughter. I don’t think her mistreatment by the press was justified but come on. Girl you were beyond stupid.
I want to thank Kaiser for some juicy gossip that impacts our real world!
Monica Lewinsky, from her infamous Vanity Fair July 1998 six page photo spread by Herb Ritts, to today’s shameless spin of this “new” she-finally-breaks-her-silence story, badly displays for all of us the galling attempt to rewrite history. (See my #44 Reply.)
For a quick primer on how packaged lies are sold as truth each and every day, watch “Network”. The moral here is, Kids, don’t believe everything you see because the whole story is being carefully manipulated and massaged.