I’m still mystified by the Italian court system and its seeming lack of “double jeopardy.” They kept trying and retrying Amanda Knox for murder and I guess we’re finally at the end? At the end of one cycle, perhaps. Maybe a month from now, they’ll decide to try Knox for murder one last time. First, Amanda Knox was found guilty of murdering her roommate Meredith Kercher. Then the conviction was appealed and thrown out, and Knox was released, and she came home to America. Then the acquittal was thrown out and she was retried – in absentia – for murder all over again. She was found guilty. Again. And so the lawyers took the case to the Italian Supreme Court and the second conviction was overturned on Friday. For the entirety of the second court case, conviction, appeal and acquittal, Knox remained at home in Washington state. After the ruling on Friday, Knox released a statement:
Hours after her murder conviction was overturned by Italy’s Supreme Court, Amanda Knox appeared outside her family’s Seattle home and spoke to the media.
“I just wanted to say that I’m incredibly grateful for what has happened, for the justice I’ve received, for the support that I’ve had from everyone – from my family, from my friends to strangers, people like you,” she said on Friday night, according to KING5. “You’ve saved my life and I’m so grateful. And I’m so grateful to have my life back.”
Knox, 27, and boyfriend Raffaelle Sollecito had been convicted of the 2007 murder of her roommate, British exchange student Meredith Kercher, and served four years in prison in Italy before their convictions were overturned in 2011. But last year a Florence court reinstated their guilty verdicts and sentenced them to 28 years and 25 years, respectively.
When asked what the future holds for her, Knox responded, “I don’t know. I’m still absorbing the present moment, which is full of joy.”
Knox’s mother, Edda Mellas, also spoke to the assembled reporters, saying, “We’re so grateful. I know you’re all here but we really need time as a family to digest. And again – so thankful that everything is finally right.”
Asked if she had some words for Kercher’s family, Knox said, “Meredith was my friend … She deserved so much in this life. I’m the lucky one.”
Is it really over though? God knows. When Amanda was promoting her memoir back in 2013, I watched several of her interviews and I came away… unsettled. It’s not that I know the case from front to back or anything, but before those interviews, I had always assumed that Knox had gotten a raw deal and that the Italian cops did a crappy job investigating the crime and putting together a solid case. But after the interviews… I can see why the cops honed in on Knox so quickly. She seems very cold and unemotional, and it would be very easy to see how her self-contained manner would read as “killer.”
Photos courtesy of WENN, Getty.
I find it so ridiculous how people seem to innately know how a person “should” act when faced with horrific events… people were convinced she was guilty because she wasn’t bawling her eyes out for the cameras. It is terrifying to see how many people claimed to just “know” she was guilty for this reason or that; makes me feel pretty shitty about the justice system and how fair trials can ever happen when so many people are so painfully unreasonable.
True. And it happens in America as far as wrongful convictions and state prosecutors and cops ignoring evidence and targeting in one person.
People confess to heinous crimes that never did it and say things under intense interrogation for many, many hours you never think they would. A man, a great young father, broke under long and isolated intense interrogaton and confessed to killing his daughter. He took it back quickly after they released him. They ignored all the evidence and put him in jail
Through an amazing attorney she found they had never sent the DNA found for a more sophisticated test, because they had the confession and didn’t want to lose the case. The DNA exonderated him, but people still thought he was the killer and rapist. They found the park bathroom near where the body was found and in there was DNA of his daughter and the sex offender who had broken in and taken her and raped and killed her. He confessed to it breaking into the house, and said he killed her because his bandana came off his face as he was raping the 3-year-old.
The State did not do its job and tried him on all kinds of other facts to make him the killer, like because he had had beers the night before when he took the kids in town to a festival or something, had come home and put the kids asleep on the couch, and they said because he watched a little porn before he went to bed he molested his daughter. His wife was on an overnight trip I think for a charity run. They said there was no break-in, which was there, and he wasn’t the only house. She said they held her for questioning at the same time as her husband and it was frightening what they were doing to her in there for hours and the cruelty
They were convicting this man and the whole town turned against him and his wife, who knew he would never do such a thing. They loved their town, but moved because of the hate. His world was destroyed losing his daughter, but then to have
your whole town hate you almost did him in. The ordeal between their daughter dying and the real killer being caught and tried was many, many years.
I see stories like this all the time on 48 Hours, coherced false confessions, behavior not right — or reported as not right, not even reported correctly, many spending years and years in jail until overturned.
why did she falsely implicate an innocent black man.
#Wolf, I an’t remember the exact specifics, but they had been interrogating her and she had a message or text message from him on her phone or something, and they zeroed in on him, and what he said, twisted it to mean he saw her later or something, was he involved, etc., and she finally broke and said he was. It was much more detailed than that, but that’s how it came about. I can’t remember. I’m thinking there was evidence there by then that they knew a black man was involved, like hair samples or something, and they latched on to this text or message to her. She didn’t just bring him up and accuse him out of the blue. It was through intense interrogation and the cops bringing him up.
I am paraphasing this from memory, because it was long ago when I read the timeline of how that occurred and I can’t remember exactly the specifics.
@wolf: she had been interrogated for many hours at that point and has said she told them that to get them to back off. Here in the US we’re used to certain standards when it comes to the police and questioning a suspect and its easy to forget that the Italian police in question were using tactics (without a lawyer present) that you wouldn’t see here.
Because at that point, the police had questioned her for 14 hours non-stop and were threatening her with life in jail? They also told her that her boyfriend had withdrawn their shared alibi (and was saying he’d gone out that night). One of them also slapped her. (Those facts aren’t up for argument, they match the police version.)
Also, it wasn’t like she implicated a completely random person … the police were already fixated on the idea that Patrick (her boss, the innocent guy you’re talking about) was involved because he was the last person she’d texted. She wrote “see ya later” which is just a casual “goodbye” in English, but was misinterpreted by the Italians as something far more literal: “see you later tonight”.
That misinterpreted text was why they didn’t believe her original story in the first place … they were looking for a scenario that involved her and Patrick meeting up that night. She gave them one. She later recanted and went back to her original story.
Confessions simply can’t be trusted. According to the Innocence Project, 25% of convictions later overturned on DNA evidence involved a confession. Push someone hard enough and they’ll tell you what you want to hear.
Bridget, thats certainly not down to nationality. in every country there is a large number of forced confessions.
i also dont know which standards you mean? shooting people, having the same equipment like a military force in a conflict?
for example the perp walk is not legal in lots of countries because its mainly used to make the person arrested appear guilty.
not to talk about the prison industrial complex which only serves to make people rich and keep people in jail forever.
by the way the United States have the highst prison population in the world.
@Kara: are you familiar with how Knox was interrogated?
In the US, a suspect would not have been interrogated like that – slapping her, threatening her, coercing a confession – and certainly not without a lawyer present. You can get offended, but this case highlighted some of the differences between the US and Italian legal systems.
I’m inclined to agree with Kara. She’s not arguing that Knox was treated well; she’s just saying that if you’re in a glass house, don’t throw stones. Much of the world looks at the US justice system in horror – militarised police, biased trials, unfair appeal system, access to legal advice, insane sentencing, yadda and yadda. I’m British and I could give you a list of unjust convictions and law enforcement misconduct from my own country.
The Italian system is well established. It’s no more – or less – structurally at fault than any other system in the developed world.
That said, it’s clearly gone appallingly wrong in the conduct of this case.
@Bridget, sadly, suspects are treated like that in the US frequently. Our “laws” against such treatment are case law, not statutory, because such events did happen and get brought to court.
I’m not saying that the US system is perfect, but I am saying that a lot of Americans tend to look at the case through the lens of the US system, and forget that the Italian legal system has different rules and standards. The context is simply different. And again, her treatment is on record. Concepts like double jeapordy, the right to an attorney, of coerced confessions – they aren’t ONLY the provenance of the US, but they also aren’t the standard for other countries.
Bridget – you’re misunderstanding – hardly surprising, given much of the ridiculous reporting of this case – the Italian double jeopardy rules. Knox has been going through the Italian appeal system. The names are all different but the principle is the same as that in most developed countries. The difference is that in Italy, a verdict isn’t “fixed” until it has made its way right up to the highest court, or the defence concedes defeat. In the US (and the UK), the original verdict is “fixed” and must be formally overturned by successively more important courts over the appeal process.
It seems to me that both police and prosecutor have made the verdict unsafe. And it also seems to me that the Italian system has worked in that an appeal made it right to the top court, which acknowledged the conviction is unsafe.
Tell me: how is this different to the US, where, for example, death row appeals are still going on twenty years after the original verdict? I can think of loads of US examples where clear exculpatory evidence has been uncovered and each and every court fails to overturn the conviction.
This case seems to be a bungled mess. But that’s the case for most legal systems – they all deliver the occasional almighty cock-up, particularly in high profile cases.
When you say “other countries” you really aren’t coming across well, you know?
@Sixer: for one thing, after her first appeal overturned the original verdict, in the US it would have been finished – once someone has been acquitted, trying them for the same crime a second time is considered Double Jeapordy, and that includes appealing an acquittal. The example of death row inmates filing multiple appeals – they’re doing so because they’re still on death row. But appeals aren’t a given, because there has to be a legal basis, either new evidence or misconduct in the first trial.
“Why did she implicate an innocent man…” @Wolf, the guy in gaol also implicated someone else. He claimed a mystery man ran out of the room after having stabbed Meredith. He claimed this man said to him “found black found guilty” and then fled. Rudy played the police from start to finish; what an imflammatory thing to say to make the police conscious of the racial tensions that would arise in this case. He didn’t name anyone specifically as Amanda did, but his comments meant that the entire story was thrown into doubt from the beginning.
Note: he later changed his story and said the mystery man was Sollecito.
Pish. I think people (mostly Americans) are determined to stay with their innocent little snowflake impression of Amanda. I dont know enough about the case to comment on the convictions but I will say that thousands of people go through the Italian system without managing to finger a black immigrant male for a crime for which they are suspected. She was clearly attempting to exploit racist and xenophobic fears in Italy and she succeeded.
This girl was American and everybody knows how far the US goes to protect their nationals in foreign criminal systems. Isnt that why the first words out of an arrested suspect is “I am American”? You never hear “I am a Tanzanian or Romanian”. The sheer gall of anybody to propose that she did this disgusting thing because she was “afraid” where many others under the same system, who are not daughters of a super power that would bend over backward to save their own, have never done the same.
I think there has been a lot of misconceptions about how Amanda Knox was treated by the Italian police. She wasn’t interrogated for hours, she wasn’t abused by the police and her behavior was bizarre during the questioning. My gut tells me that she knows what happened to Meredith Kirchner and she was either an active participant in her murder or complicit. But gut feelings cannot convict anyone. Her attorneys were able to discredit the police & the evidence on appeal, it’s was good lawyers do. They planted enough doubt & she’s a free woman. Did she murder Meredith? I don’t know but she sets off all kind of alarms for me.
Look, we evolved our senses over countless generations. Girl reads sociopath. Is that enough to convict her? No, nor should it be. But she’s creepy and you know it.
EXACTLY – she looks cold, emotionless and manipulative because she is – that doesn’t mean she killed Meredith, but doing cartwheels and practically humping on your boyfriend just after the body is discovered – that isn’t appropriate no matter how you frame it..
The fact so many people think she comes off as “creepy” or “cold” means she almost certainly isn’t a sociopath. Sociopaths are glib – superficially charming. Creepy/cold and inappropriate behaviour means Aspergers, anxiety or some other problem with social interaction. (Wouldn’t even necessarily be anything that’d have a clinical diagnosis – “that person’s a bit of a weirdo” is not a diagnosis.)
misstee
She wasn’t doing “cartwheels”. This was proven to be an exaggeration by the italian police. She was sitting in a chair for roughly 12 hours and not allowed to move. When they left and she had a moment to stand up she did back stretches.
“A lie can get half way around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.” -WChurchill
There’s another version on that quote with Mark Twain swapping pants for shoes.
She’s not likable, but I agree. Being a sociopath doesn’t mean you’re guilty. not all sociopaths murder.
Agree completely. Also, before she was even interrogated she changed her story several times regarding where she was at the time Meredith was killed. Her boyfriend later confessed that he did not know where she was either. You said it well- we instinctually recognize creepy, or “off” when we see it. We will never know what Amanda did that night.
Our “senses” don’t tell us much about such people. It’s comforting to believe that but it’s not true.
Have you never noticed how often neighbours/acquaintances/co-workers say about assassins that they seemed to be likeable, charming, even-tempered etc. and not weird at all.
Put yourself in her shoes for one second; I’d be frozen inside from shock if that were me! I’m not an emotional person in general; being hysterical would be totally out of character for me personally and should raise more flags than me being stoic. Someone who knew me would know that but nobody reporting on Amandas “psycho” demeanour actually knew her; they just assumed they did
Lol Nicole in our senses are so finely tuned why do we need evidence at all? Why do people get into relationships with murderers or rapists or child abusers? Wouldn’t they sense?!?
Cindy
Her story was not changing because she was covering something up. It was changing from a language barrier. This has be looked at by independent teams and found to be the case. Words and orders might change, but ultimate context does not. And those taking down her words assumed her guilty from the start.
And her boyfriend was also interrogated and threatened extensively.
We might never know though. You’re correct.
I worked in a men’s prison as a social work intern, and there are lots of ways that sociopath-ism expresses itself. Sociopaths don’t always kill or break the law, either. I saw the ones that did, however… The ones were who were remorseless monsters, hiding beneath a razor-thin facade of superficial charm and normalcy. Those types worked hard to disguise themselves, but it always came out under stress and duress. I’ve also seen the flip side of that — cold, seemingly unfeeling people who make no effort to conceal their complete lack of humanity and caring for others. There are many variations, too, in between the extremes.
I have no idea about Amanda Knox, though. I’ve never seen an interview of her, and don’t know enough about the case. If my time in the prison taught me anything, though, it’s that you NEVER NEVER know the darkness that is in other people’s hearts. Seemingly normal people can be capable of the most monstrous of things, for almost no apparent reason.
I have read comments on this case were people were angry Amanda had the nerve to “smile” when she got home to the States. They felt she was gloating over the fact she got away with murder.
Just scary to think how these people would be if they sat on a jury
Wow. If I was in prison in a strange country for four long years, I would smile and kiss the ground once I got off the plane in America.
Cold and unemotional after spending 4 years in an Italian prison? Well, how odd? Not.
This. Her interviews after her release show that she’s painfully aware that every word she says, every pause, every muscle twitch and facial movement will be dissected endlessly. I just saw someone desperately trying to figure out how on earth she could get people to see she was sincere and telling the truth.
Opportunity but no motive. I know motive is a minor point in murder investigations but I personally can’t wrap my mind around someone with everything to live for commiting such a horrific gruesome crime.
+no evidence….. no blood or hair or fingerprints or DNA. It was a brutal crime and the guy in gaol’s DNA was everywhere. He only said others were involved to get his sentence reduced… which worked!!
Sarah, did you read where he automatically got a third of his sentence reduced because he opted for fast track, then they cut his sentence again during the appeal? And now he has day passes!??!! What. The. Freak!??!
Exactly. This guy is only spending 16 years in jail for killing this woman. His sentenced was reduced because he gave the story the police wanted.
No he received a reduced sentence because he opted for fast track. Anyone that opts for a fast track trial automatically has their sentenced reduced. And there was evidence but Amanda’s legal team was able to attack it & quite successfully.
@Tammy – his sentence was further reduced and he may be now eligible for work release. That’s the man who was found guilty via many forms of evidence.
IMO It came off like a witchunt against her, with no motive or evidence.
Glad this farce of a trial is over.
There is a US reporter who had a similar experience years before with the same Judge or Prosecutor in Italy. A person was found murdered, while he was there doing some foreign correspondence work (someone he interviewed was later murdered a few days after he had interviewed them) He said the prosecutor and police tried to pin the murder on him, made up flimsy evidence. He said they came to arrest him,at his hotel, but he was one step ahead and got on a plane and left the Country, because he could see they were trying to stitch him up for the murder. He never went back, but he said same judge or , prosecutors as involved w Knox trial.
That prosecutor should have been fired years ago.
He comes off as very unbalanced and interested in his agenda over justice and truth.
The prosecutor in this case is the same man who was leading the police investigation, so there was noone to put the brakes on his crazy before trial. He is wildly racist and superstitious, and much of the reason he zoomed in on Amanda was because she was a foreigner, with a black boss. Voodoo murder! No, I’m not kidding, that was one of his main theories… The so-called evidence list is unbeliavable, just a bunch of random facts which proves zilch. For example, they found a book Amanda said she had been reading at her boyfriend’s earlier, in her apartment. Proof she was lying? As if she couldn’t have brought it back, she went home and found the body for chrissakes! Urgh, this case makes me angry.
That was the author Douglas Preston, and it was the Monster of Florence case, where a serial killer had been murdering couples for decades. This prosecutor threatened to arrest Preston as the Monster, even though the first murder had been committed when he was sixteen—–and living in America. Without a passport. He’s the brother of the guy who wrote “The Hot Zone.”
The prosecutor attacked Knox with all kinds of salacious and frankly sexist stuff in the papers before the trial. Making out with her boyfriend? Turning cartwheels? All blatant lies by the prosecutor.
Sadly, humans do violent things all the time. We are a violent species. Even if we are young and pretty. If Amanda knox was black, or even unattractive, she would be in prison. I really believe that.
Cindy, she was in prison for 4 years. Regardless of race or attractiveness , it helped that her parents had the resources to keep fighting. Nothing about any of this is fair. That doesn’t make her guilty.
Cindy, she was in prison for 4 years. Regardless of race or attractiveness , it helped that her parents had the resources to keep fighting. Nothing about any of this is fair. That doesn’t make her guilty.
bettyrose
Her parents barely had the funds. They’re in major debt now. It’s believed strongly Knox only agreed to a book to help dig her parents out of that hole. Even the publishers were said know that was her only motivation. She was content to live quietly and not speak of it again.
Florc, thanks for the clarification. I knew they weren’t rich, but I had the sense they had access to resources in the form of equity and community support, which is arguably more than others might have had in this scenario, but they couldn’t protect her from the Italian justice system, so claims of privilege seem off target.
I think that’s rather presumptuous and harsh, not to mention completely unfounded. She was convicted. She spent years in prison. Her parents put themselves in extreme debt to provide her with lawyers over the grueling and long court proceedings. Tell me again how she got a break for being white or pretty?
There was absolutely zero physical evidence of this girl at the crime scene, while the bodily fluids of the killer were everywhere. There was never any shred of evidence to convict Amanda Knox. She was suspected because she doesn’t emote (neither do I…I don’t cry or go hysterical; I shut down and get very quiet and cold), and she was convicted because she was American and loud and sexually active. They painted her up as a drug-addled sl*t, and they created some sick fantasy story that never had any merit and then doubled down on it over and over rather than admit they’d given the guy who murdered that poor woman a reduced sentence so they could be the famous team who brought down an American tart.
@ Cindy I agree.
And no indication that she’d ever previously shown hints of a violent nature.
Yeah, it was a pretty classic burglary that turned into a rape and murder. Nobody who’s arguing that Knox must have done it is citing the early “Satanic slutty sex games” angle that the prosecutor took, I see.
@fairyvexed: Exactly. They’re citing the, “she looks like a bad guy” argument. I honestly don’t know which is worse.
“I don’t like the looks of her. She must’ve killed someone.”
My understanding is that she and Raffaelle cannot be tried again for the murder. The high court could have sent the case back to be retried but instead dismissed the guilty verdict and closed the case. The guilty verdict against her for implicating Lumbe stood but she is considered to have served that time since she was in jail for four years.
This is a pretty sad case. The Italian police had solved the case and it should have been cut and dry, but then a really shady, attention seeking prosecutor with a history of ‘uncovering’ satanism in a lot of his cases dragged Knox into it to make it more sensational. The really tragic thing, is that Kercher’s family were convinced by him and fully believe Knox was involved in the murder. So as far as they believe, justice hasn’t been served because Knox and Sollecito have been released and are allowed to get on with their lives. Amanda has a chance to move on with her life now, and deserves to, but I think the Kercher family will never be able to because they’ll always believe that their daughter’s killer is free.
They were utterly shocked when the original conviction was overturned – they had absolutely no idea that was a possibility. Amanda Knox had been ravaged by the British press and the Kercher family chose to listen to that insane prosecutor. I cannot imagine the grief they experienced, but I also don’t understand how they had so little knowledge of the actual evidence involved in the case. “Satanic sex ritual murder” is kind of far fetched to begin with.
The fact that the victim’s father was a British journalist may have fueled and fed the British press to go after Knox.
It is odd how hard they campaigned against Amanda specifically. They took a few offhand comments their daughter made about her to mean drfinitely guilty of murder.
I imagine there’d be bitterness that this pretty girl lives while yours does not but it really doesn’t make sense to be so out for her blood, rather than out for the truth. They must have had some bad and persistent “inside” advice that Amanda was truly guilty
i’ve read quite a bit of speculation that amanda has aspergers, which would account for her sometimes strange behavior and demeanor. i hate just diagnosing someone like that, but honestly it does make a lot of sense, and it also accounts for how the italian media basically turned her into an amoral freak. i do think she’s a bit odd, and i see how someone could be put off by her behavior, but i don’t think she murdered meredith. rudy guede was all over that crime scene and amanda was nowhere.
i’m not sure why italian law enforcement decided more than one person did this, unless they just really wanted a sensational story about a crazy american girl. from what i’ve read the lead prosecutor was insane anyway, he tried to blame the ‘monster of florence’ murders on satanic cults and arrested like 4 guys who didn’t commit the crimes.
asperger’s makes sense. my brother acts odd, and very unemotional. we suspect he has autism or aspergers
I’ve read quite a few articles and interviews with her family and friends, and I am inclined to agree that she has some form of social disorder, whether is be Asberger’s or something similar. She has said herself she doesn’t get embarrassed by things other people would be embarrassed by, her friends say she is unable to even tell a polite lie to save someone’s feelings, she was too trusting of complete strangers – not realizing the mentally ill homeless person on the bus most likely talking to the voices in his head and wasn’t really trying to be her friend, etc. etc.
I honestly find it hard to connect Amanda Knox with Aspergers Syndrome, because Aspergers patients are known to avoid touch and physical contact, and in bed most are said to be able to bear only the most minimal, genital-only touching, if even that. (Many avoid sex altogether.) Amanda was seen in many photos being extremely affectionate and touchy-feely with Raffaele, as when she was photographed with later boyfriends. I have a brother with Aspergers, and he is not at ease with physical touching.
If I had to guess what Amanda’s affect and behavior indicate, I would guess that first of all it’s her nature to be somewhat lacking in empathy (her statement about Meredith the other day seemed to me so devoid of any real thought or genuine feeling for Meredith or her family!) and and also that Amanda has been so traumatized by the whole experience and her four years in prison that she is emotionally guarded and withholding to an unnatural degree. How much of this is her nature and how much is PTSD is anyone’s guess. But Aspergers? I really don’t think that fits her behavior, her history, or her affect at all.
If you’ve met one person with Aspergers, you’ve met one person with Aspergers. Broad generalizations can be tricky. My teenage son has Aspergers and he is appropriately affectionate and tolerates touching just fine, as do plenty of other Aspergians I have met. Of course some do have problems with touching.
I can kind of see why people might think Amanda is on the spectrum…but if she is she is, I’d say she extremely high functioning. My son flies under the radar pretty well by now and not everyone notices his quirks…but still, I’m trying to imagine him in this scenario, where he’s being scrutinized by the media. He would be an awkward mess, I am sure, and utterly ripped to shreds.
Excuse me but what? I have aspergers and so have my exboyfriend, and I am 100 % touchy feely and so was he! We had sex every day at least once or twice and inbetween cuddling and fondling! That’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever Heard please don’t spread that type of misinformation!!!!
Nope, not true. Aspergers people like touch as much as the next human.
That entire Knox case… is your worst nightmare coming true.
If there is one bit of advice I have taken to heart. Never ever talk to the police unless your attorney is present.
No matter how innocent you are.
No matter you have not done anything remotely illegal.
No matter how you have 12 people, that can vouch for your were about’s of the time in question.
If the police have decided your their “guy”. Then they will look no further.
And that advice came from a former policeman… now criminal attorney.
You never ever speak without your attorney. Even if it is something stupidly simple. You just never know if they have decided your their “guy”. And you weren’t even in the state at the time.
And imagine in Italy. She didn’t speak the language fluently at all and she’s stuck in an interrogation room for hours upon hours, no break, in a different country being interrogated by people who speak a different language.
I remember the part where they came back and told her she was HIV and to name the men she had slept with since she had arrived in Italy. She gave them the names. She was not HIV. It was a trick to get the number of men she had slept with since being in Italy, which she hadn’t been there that long, and they used that to malign her as some sort of slut, without morals, and turn the public against her.
That’s what she was dealing with.
Exactly jayna and hautie,I agree 100%
Let’s not forget how the police ruined the crime scene. There was so much evidence that was destroyed, contaminated, forgotten about. While the evidence against Knox was just to put here in the household. And she lived there so that made no sense.
Something awful happened to Meredith. And police ruined any chance of ever knowing what happened.
They brought in an interpreter who was helping the police to get her to confess rather than just translate for her.
Sollecito was her first boyfriend. There were no “men.”
Jenna
I forgot about that. I’ve traveled abroad for school and learned the language while there. It can be scary when you can’t communicate or fully know what is happening around you.
@ fairyvexed: where’d you get the idea that Sollecito was her first boyfriend? That’s not true. The HIV tests and the number of guys she’d slept with came up in the trial.
(Note: I don’t agree with slut-shaming whatever the number, but it was actually fairly low – not enough to raise eyebrows, let alone paint her as a femme fatale.)
So true.
Her mom told her to leave the Country , get on a plane NOW and not go in and be questioned by the police.
every goodguy lawyer i know will tell you to never talk to the police, thats true. everything you say can possibly lock you away forever.
there are lots of statistics showing big numbers of innocent people in jail.
unfortunately a confession does not mean much nowadays in terms of guilt. people just dont want to take the risk to be in jail forever for a crime they didnt commit when they know a confession will be “only” 10 years.
what do you have from maintaining your innocence when rotting in a little cell?
Seriously that’s so f-ing and sadly true and it’s not unique to any country.
An absolute nightmare. I can’t even fathom. I never followed her case until I watched a program on Netflix- I think it was CNN’s great crimes & trials of the century or something. So fascinating- I had assumed from the tiny bit of tv coverage I’d seen that she was guilty, but when I heard the whole story I was shocked at how she was railroaded- it blows my mind. The true murderer is imprisoned (albeit for much less than he should be! Because of implicating her! He is the true monster- I see her as someone who is a bit socially slow and possibly had something to hide in the beginning, in terms of a drug dealer.) It’s frightening how one’s actions in an extreme situation can be used against them.
Totally agree about never talking to the police without legal representation. I heard something years ago (totally unrelated to Knox or this case) during an interview on NPR. Anyway a policewoman was being interviewed and stated “when someone agrees to talk without a layer present, i don’t think they’re innocent; I think they’re stupid.” I’ve always remembered that.
My husband is a criminal defense attorney. I have learned through the years that you never, ever say a word without an attorney present. Doesn’t matter if you’re not guilty. Simply repeat over and over I want an attorney. The things I have heard second-hand from him and his lawyer friends have blown my mind.
I haven’t been following this case much, but it looks like a man Rudy Guede is already in prison for her murder following arranging a date with her–so why did they arrest Knox and her then boyfriend?
The suspicion that they killed Knox cause she wouldn’t participate in group sex is so stupid and has no precedence
They foolishly announced to the world that AK and RS were the guilty parties, along with AK’s boss from the bar she worked at briefly, before any of the forensic testing was done. Then when the boss proved to have a solid alibi and all of the forensic evidence came back pointing squarely and unequivocally at Rudy Guede, rather than admit they’d been wrong and release all 3 original suspects, they just released the bar owner and substituted in Guede as a co-defendant. It happens far too often that police find a suspect then try to make the evidence fit rather than follow the evidence to a suspect.
All I can say is that I never, ever want to be tried in a case in the public eye. “I just know she did it, look how weird she acts, I just know she’s guilty” is NOT enough to convict someone of murder.
That makes me think of that movie with Mery Streep based on a true story of a woman in Australia convicted of killing her child, because she had a cold personality and people didn’t think she behaved right, and didn’t believe them that her nine-week-old baby was taken by a dingo in the outback as she reported, seeing the dingo running off..
Three years into her life sentence she was let go because they found her baby’s jacket she was in that night in an isolated spot by a dingo lair. Her husband had been jailed also as an accessory and was let go at the same time.
The movie is called A Cry in the Dark, and the woman’s name is Lindy Chamberlain. This has happened in this country as well. In 1998, a little girl named Jaclyn Dowaliby was kidnapped and murdered in Midlothian, Illinois. Her step-father wasn’t emotional enough, and he was convicted. A writer at the Chicago Tribune wrote a series of exposes on the case, which helped draw attention to the poorly handled case. David Dowaliby’s conviction was overturned.
Yep. Sadly, despite all the tools in the world to arm ourselves with knowledge, we appear to be living in an age where belief outweighs evidence. Whether it’s criminal law, the “debate” about climate change (how can you “debate” a scientifically-proven FACT!?), or the vaccination thing, people would much rather engage in a bit of magical thinking than actually do the homework.
Do you think that has something to do with the anti-science movement driven by extremist religion?
I don’t think so ….
I’m an Aussie and we don’t really have a bible-belt here, so no there’s also nothing you can really point to as a religious-based anti-science movement. But I’ve still met a few climate change deniers, anti-vaxxers, and people who think the can tell that someone is guilty just by looking at them.
I think it’s simply human nature. People like to think they have agency/control over what happens to them. They like to think bad things only happen to bad people or to good people who made a mistake. That way, they can make sure nothing bad happens to them.
From that viewpoint, the good girl getting murdered during random burglary-gone-wrong is scarier than believing that the good girl was killed because she was too trusting of her “odd” housemate. (If there was even a shred of evidence that Kercher was a “bad girl” she’d have been getting victim-blamed this entire time.) At the same time, it’s scarier to think of the never-ending trial as happening to someone innocent than it is to assume Knox was guilty (or at least some kind of “bad girl”). So there’s kind of a double psychological-push towards assuming Knox had to be guilty.
the court of public opinion is certainly worse. especially if you are arrested which is by no means any proof of your guilt. people will see pictures of you in handcuffs and that does not really look like a innocent person.
I really hope this is finally over. For both Amanda and Meredith’s family. I don’t think Amanda killed anyone. The evidence was lacking along with contaminated and she had no reason to kill Meredith. She was convicted because she didn’t act the way she was expected to and because the court and the media slut shamed her.
^^This.
Meh. My mom and I always joke that my best friend has ‘valium running through her veins.” I’ve never seen her cry in the 20+ years I’ve known her, even when her husband was murdered last year. I was sobbing my face off. She went to nursing school the next day, then got out and planned the funeral he would have wanted, all while laughing at stories and memories and caring for three kids. I felt like if it were my husband, I’d be bundled in bed for three days. Everyone handles things in different ways.
Hmmmm….Has Dateline visited for an interview yet?
It happens. When my dad died I was so composed people kept asking me if I was okay, my husband was convinced I was going to hurt myself because of how normal I seemed. Some people grieve/respond differently.
I will never believe Foxy told the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Her behavior was outlandish – there is something wrong with her somewhere. Even her behavior in jail was bizarre. I agree she’s some kind of sociopath, and I’m sorry Meredith can’t speak from the grave. What a disaster that they got mixed up with the guy in jail.
Then leave the behavior out of it.
The evidence, collection of it, discarded samples all speak to the sloppy handling of this case by the police. And the prosecutor was a known loony with his satanic conspiracy theory he’s tried others for.
Knox came off odd to say the least. This is the same logic used to falsely imprison the mentally disabled or this with mental illnesses like bipolar or depression. Because they didn’t act like you think an innocent person should.
Bottom line. This was so mishandled by the police and prosecutor MK’s family will never know what happened.
This is also why people with natural charisma get away with crimes.
Merritt
True. This is why evidence and the collection, logging of it is so important.
Merritt, great point and so true!
I’ve followed this case since it started and I do not believe her or her boyfriend are guilty. Is her behavior odd, yes. Is it easy to see why people think she is guilty by how she behaves and her odd personality, yes. But if you read the facts of this case and how horribly the way the Italian justice system handled it, then it is easy to see they didn’t do it.
How many times do we hear people say that the mass murderer seemed like such a nice guy, so normal.
Behaviour is not an absolute predictor.
I agree. I don’t think she’s told the whole truth either. I do think she is the “lucky one” though. It certainly wasn’t Meredith.
What do you guys think happened then? A lot of the things that were considered strange behavior were press fabrications – the “cartwheels”, the buying hot lingerie (she couldn’t get into her apartment and needed underwear). Things got so blown up in the press, but do you really think that she hooked up with a strange drifter to have a sex party with her brand new boyfriend?
Agree, bluhare. R.I.P. Meredith.
I don’t know what she did or didn’t do. I said I don’t think she’s telling the whole truth and I stand by that. I don’t think she is. Whether to protect herself, her boyfriend, Meredith, or whatever, I don’t know. People do a lot of things that seem out of character if you don’t know them, including random sex with strangers.
There is a huge leap from random sex to murdering your roommate, though.
Bridget, of course it’s a huge leap to kill someone. And she doesn’t look like someone who’d do it. But that doesn’t mean she didn’t. And it doesn’t mean she did. My point was, you don’t know. And neither do I.
Bluhare
There was loads of evidence that was flushed away, misshandled, or discarded. We will never know the whole story. It does seem though Knox was accused because it was easy. Not because the evidence fell that way.
That the semensample alone was corrupted and never tested should have those in charge of that task fired.
I just don’t think Knox did it. How a person comes off isn’t enough for me.
I’m mystified by the double, triple, infinity trials for the same murder with the same accused.
They are not trying her multiple times. They tried her once. In Italy you are allowed to appeal each court decision.
Appealing an acquittal is like re-trying them. In the US if you’re acquitted, that’s the end.
And can’t you do this 3 times Diamond? Appealing the decision?
The accused is allowed to appeal a guilty decision. The prosecution is not allowed to appeal an acquittal.
If new evidence pops up then it is a different story.
@DiamondGirl, Amanda Knox wasn’t initially acquitted though, she was found guilty. She wasn’t being retried at any time, it was the reversal of the conviction that was appealed to the higher courts and their decision reversing the acquittal was appealed to the highest court. Same case, just appealed three times.
No mention of innocent Meredith, murdered in her own home. Knox knows something, but she will never let on. Have some respect for Meredith’s family and go quietly if you are going to continue helping to hide the truth.
Truth is lost. We will never know the real truth because of the sloppy handling of the evidence and interrogation by the police. You and I can claim to know, but nothing can back that up outside of opinion.
And MK’s family believes this was as the prosecutor claims. Which no evidence supports. Same prosecutor believed this was the motivation on other crimes. He’s got an agenda and seems very off balance.
Knox is living fairly quietly. She isn’t demanding this continue to remain in the news.
You know who should have respect for the family of the victim? The prosecutor. Instead of telling them about this work of pure fiction he’s claimed before on others. Their daughter’s murder became a platform for him and not about seeking the truth of who and how her life was taken.
Great post, Florc
How does this man still have a job. He is nuts.
Exactly, Florc. Insisting on justice IS showing respect for the victim. Trying to railroad people is NOT showing respect for the victim. The murderer is in jail enjoying his day passes.
The murderer is in jail: Rudy Guede. The (albeit corrupted) physical evidence pointed at him, but it was the prosecutor who decided that Knox and Sollecito must have been involved despite there being no phyiscal evidence to tie them to the crime – and this isn’t even the first time he’s done that. If you want to blame someone, blame the prosecutor – who also cut a deal with Guede for shorter time to try to get Knox. Meredith Kercher’s killer was caught years ago.
I agree the Italian Justice system leaves a lot to be desired as do all Justice systems and from the start it seemed the details of the case were muddled and muddied and then there was the presence of Knox herself….This article cleared up many fallacies and sheds an interesting light on it all. http://www.salon.com/2015/03/27/amanda_knox_verdict_the_real_evidence_and_why_almost_everything_you_think_you_know_about_the_case_is_wrong/
That was an interesting article. Thank you for posting it.
Thanks for the link.
But once I saw who the author was, it lost a bit of validity for me. Nelson’s coverage of the case has seemed bias to me in the past (much like the journalist that writes for The Daily Beast and wrote the book that was turned into a movie – can’t remember her name). Nelson’s written opeds about Knox & Sollecito’s guilt.
The author only covers clearing things up /or refuting Knox/Sollecito’s claims or PR, but does not talk about issues from the other side of the case and these surely exist. There are enough falsehoods on both sides and it would be fair to point them both out.
So I use caution taking Nelson’s points as completely truthful. She has been vocal in her belief that Knox/Sollecito are guilty.
And herein lies the problem. Much of what we are reading is biased in one direction or the other. That’s why as I posted below, what I am most interested in reading now is the court’s reasoning
Anyway, the whole thing is tragic, especially for the Kercher family. So sad.
The article is citing initial findings by one side, many of which were found to be baseless by the appellate court.
That article, which sadly purports to clear up fallacies in the case, instead relies on a lot of them. The claims Amanda left bloody footprints in the hallway, the claim that Amanda’s phone was outside Raffaele’s apartment at some point that night, etc. Also, relying on Alan Dershowitz’s take on the case is a bad sign because he has proven again and again he does not have any sense of the actual facts of the case. (He keeps insisting AK’s DNA is on the murder weapon without seemingly having any awareness that the actual murder weapon has never been found.)
He was also involved in another case involving police mishandling of evidence. OJ Simpson.
Everyone: Is there a better link with objective evidence? I would actually like to read it if that was not.
@bluehare, I don’t know that I would call this article objective or focused purely on the evidence (the Knox family obviously cooperated with the reporter), but it has some things I had not known or realized until reading it, including a fairly straightforward and simple theory of the crime that doesn’t involved any wacky sex-crazed-satanic-orgy-rituals-gone-wrong nonsense.
http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/news/the-neverending-nightmare-of-amanda-knox-20110627
There’s an ex-FBI agent, Steven Moore, who began researching her case when his wife saw Dateline or something and said she was guilty, and after going over everything he could find concluded she was innocent. This was before her appeal when the convictions were overturned after four years. He breaks everything down on this site.. I don’t know if everything he concluded is right, but he brings out many great points on missing evidence and what he concludes from the evidence, etc. I’ve only read a couple of sections. “The Mountain of Missing Evidence” section I read and found interesting.
http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/FBI.html
Rollingstone did an interesting article in 2011 that still generates comments to this day. It’s more a narrative about certain of the events in the very beginning and commentary on the legal system, etc., not really an in-depth investigative journalism, but I read some things I didn’t know, like they brought some friends in the apartment in the morning when they thought a break-in had occurred. Everyone lawyered up and left town, because their parents were smart I guess, except Amanda and her boyrfriend, who thought they were helping.
http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/news/the-neverending-nightmare-of-amanda-knox-20110627?page=7
Bluhare
The majority of my info has come from a few sources.
I have friends scattered about in Europe and we’re keeping the “penpal” ritual alive! This was heavily iscussed in our letters and news clippings would be sent both ways. There’s a heavy bias it seems from all sides of this. It’s up to the reader to have common sense and a basic understanding of right and wrong.
Imo the prosecutor being unbelievably corrupt and obsessed with satanic crimes/racism/sexism. The language barrier. And the mishandling of evidence that was noted at the scene, but not actually taken in (bloody boot prints/semen on pillowcase next to body). Toss in a murderer that gets a lighter sentence by saying Knox and her bf did it.
And that prosecutor is a disaster, but he has some power so he continues without being questioned. Seriously, look into him. The man is unbalanced and accused a child in another part of the world to committing murder.
Huh. Just on the first page, i found a troubling—-and slanted—–omission. They say Sollecito’s DNA was found on Kercher’s bra clasp.
What they do NOT mention is the fact that the bra clasp was only found forty five DAYS after the murder, after it had been kicked around the bloody crime scene. In fact, in prosecution video, you can see the crime scene “technicians” pick up the bra clasp—–with their bloody gloves!——pass it from person to person, then sort of kind of put it on the floor sort of where they found it—-after which THEN they photograph it.
Plus they have Alan Dershowitz expressing skepticism about Knox, and he’s been a misogynist scumbag forever.
It also doesn’t mention how many other DNA profiles were found on that bra clasp. I don’t remember if it’s 3 or 4 or more. And certainly no one is claiming that many people touched the poor girl’s bra. It’s just proof that the clasp is so hopelessly contaminated, you can’t ascribe any evidentiary value to it at all. The most absurd part is that the Italian courts declare the party disputing such evidence has to prove when the evidence was contaminated. Which is ridiculous because no one can point to a specific moment in time and say, “There! That’s when it happened.” The Court should instead put the burden on the prosecution to show it wasn’t contaminated, which they could never do here. But because the Italian courts apply this unattainable standard, the pro-guilt camps will always insist this bra clasp is valid evidence.
This article is incredibly slanted.
It will be interesting to read the Italian Supreme Court’s reasoning for not only overturning the last guilty verdict, but also shutting down any other opportunities to try them both again (which apparently they could have sent it back to lower courts but did not).
I wonder how much will be based on lack of true evidence and how much on how police/prosecution handled the case.
Part of the reason there is no “true evidence” as you put it is because of how the police and prosecution handled the case.
It makes me sick to hear people make excuses for her.
+1
+100
Not excuses. Facts.
Too much went wrong in this investigation to know what happened. Simple truth is if you think you know you’re not following the facts.
I don’t know. I do know those in charge of this “investigation” did nearly everything wrong. It was carried out with truth and justice being secondary to the prosecutors agenda of satanic slut shaming voodoo murders.
There’s a lot of opinion in the Amanda Knox case and very few facts. That’s what I’m concluding and I’ve followed this case for exactly less than one day. 🙂
It is a fact her DNA was nowhere in Meredith’s room, while Guede’s was covered in it. That was a hell of a clean up job!
I’m curious: to those that say “how can you speak up for Amanda Knox” what exactly do you think happened?
What happened? A criminal with a past history of burglaries and using knives and of being in that house uninvited at least once went to that flat to continue his recent streak of burglaries and was surprised to find someone home that holiday weekend. That someone was Meredith and he raped her and then killed her with his knife. He left plenty of evidence behind both at the scene and in the victim.
I’m curious how folks actually think Amanda Knox fits in there. There’s some of the “Meredith will never see justice” and “how could Knox have gone free” comments and I’m genuinely curious how they think she’s guilty aside from just not liking her. Aside from one crazy unsupported theory and a lot of press mangling, nothing actually points to her.
It baffles me, too. I’m completely baffled by the legions of people who just “know” she did it. I never saw one single thing that made me think she might be guilty.
Wow. I’m surprised at how many people believe her. It seems to me that her family hired a top-rate PR team (which they did) and it worked to persuade public sentiment. I think the lack of evidence and the corrupted evidence in this case, not to mention the innternational political ramifications are the reason it has now been dropped. The Italian justice system is different than the American – but no better or no worse – just different.
Amanda’s story changed over and over again. She did not falsely confess due to pressure – as what happens in the U.S. all the time – she changed her alibi and her narrative again and again. She lied many times in her interviews in the press. She is charming, bright, and charismatic, if odd. She states her case in numerous ways that belie the truth. I don’t think she has Aspergers, I think she is a sociopath and had something to do with this murder. But that is just my opinion. Clearly, I am in the minority.
I don’t blame them for hiring PR: “Foxy Knoxy” got massacred in the press, with stuff that didn’t hold up under closer scrutiny. And I find it funny that people easily brush off the British press as being ridiculous and yet are treating it as gospel in this case.
Because as others have pointed out: the killer was found and is currently in jail. No evidence actually supported the prosecutor’s story, and the contradictory information came from a 12 hour interrogation in a foreign language. There’s a reason why this case is done and won’t be tried again – it turns out “I just don’t like her” isn’t actually grounds for finding someone guilty of murder. Do you really believe that Amanda Knox took her brand new boyfriend, picked up a drifter, and went back to the apartment for a Satanic orgy and then killed Meredith when she didn’t participate? Really?
I think she knows more and did more that she is letting on. I also think she is very good at lying. She’s not innocent in this.
Since this case played out in the press it had to be argued in the press.
Lady D
Is this just a feeling? It’s thought she might have downs or be a sociopath. They have difficulty showing emotion in a way we deem normal. It’s not a guarantee they’ll kill over you or i.
I think it’s just silly people will base a person’s involvement in a murder on how they came off in an interview or after being released from jail in a foreign land.
It could be argued for those hikers captured by Iraq or North Korea that they really were spies and once they got off the plane they smiled because they got away with something.
When it comes down to life or death or jail in a foreign land you’d better have more than a feel you get by seeing them on tv to think there’s guilt. There needs to be more. Evidence.
Just because someone is of the opinion she may be somehow involved doesn’t mean they believe in a crazy satanic orgy theory. Sometimes people skate because of police eff ups. Sometimes people are wrongly convicted.
I agree. I think Amanda Knox has not told what happened truthfully, and I think that the police may have made mistakes but there’s a lot more to it than meets the eye. And her PR firm has done a masterful job. They’ve earned their money.
I disagree.
And I enjoy our Wiglet Wagon rides greatly so i’m removing myself from this.
This type of judgement and opinion is of witchhunt origins. Just a claim and a funny look and your life is no longer yours. And reason for pr was absolutely needed. She wasn’t getting a fair trial without it. This was being argued in the press more than court.
So, I can’t.
I came too late to remove this. It was rude and unfair written in the heat of the moment. I apologise Bluhare.
@Frivolity, I’ll admit my bias right here – I’m from Seattle, and I have friends who are friends of Amanda’s parents so I am hardly a neutral party. As shocked as you are that many people think her innocent, I am equally as shocked that there are people like you who think she could possibly be guilty.
As for her parents hiring PR, did you expect them just to stand by quietly and watch their daughter spend the rest of her life in a foreign prison for a crime where the case had holes you could drive a truck through? The Italian legal system virtually guarantees this case was tried in the public long before it makes it to the courts. I’m not saying that’s any worse (or better) than the US judicial system, but if the potential judges and jurors are allowed to read the press as the trial progresses, then a good PR campaign is also good legal strategy.
My heart goes out to Meredith’s family, she and they are the ultimate victims in all this, but I am beyond convinced that Amanda played no part in the murder and was victimized and vilified every step of the way – by the rabid tabloid media in both Italy and England, by the mishandling of the crime scene by the first police on the scene, by her lack of familiarity of the Italian language and her own unbelievable naiveté, by a buckets-of-crazy prosecutor who was being investigated for misconduct while still being allowed to prosecute a high-profile case. By the way, if I’m understanding the Italian system correctly, the prosecutor is also the chief police investigator so he was leading the investigation even before the case came to trial.
@Bridget, usually I find the British tabloid press amusing in their lack of grip on reality, but this case demonstrated to me that more than a few people treat their fantasies as fact, which makes them dangerous rather than entertaining.
For those that have no trouble believing everything the tabloids have been spewing, a small point of fact if I might. The ‘Foxy Knoxy’ moniker was given to her when she was EIGHT years old, because she was a smart player on her childhood soccer team, not because she was some sort of sociopathic she-devil that was destined to bring her satanic sexual villainy to a small innocent town in the Italian countryside.
I agree completely. I firmly believe that she and her boyfriend were there that night, and know what happened, though I am unsure as to the extent of their participation in the murder per se.
What’s incredibly frightening is how eager women are, it seems, to put away another woman on nothing more than opinions slanted by vicious sexual slander. If i ever get arrested, i guess i’ll take an all-male jury. All it takes is a prosecutor—–who was convicted of abusing his office! during Knox’s trial!—–and saying the right things about a woman (“She’s a slut so she MUST have killed her roomie”)——–and so much for evidence. The prosecutor also accused Douglas Preston and Mario Spezi of murder! How come nobody’s arguing THEY got away with it?
@fairyvexed
Agreed. Too many people are very willing to believe the procecutor despite his history of manipulation and witch hunts. It is scary. People want to believe that their own sex life cannot be used against them, but if you are a woman it can and will be. They will make you look like a slut or like a jealous prude. It is all about the angles and no one should ever delude themselves about being immune to a witch hunt.
Based on what? You’re convinced they were there based on what?
I’m not sure I would go with different not worse. First the Italian system doesn’t allow changes based on rulings. In the US if something is found to be unfair and a ruling is made in a past case that ruling can be used to justify the decision in another case. This might not seem important, but if you look at the codes as written a lot of things would be prosecuted and interpreted by courts very differently, and then the law applied not justly to all. Italy is a bit like Vegas and any ruling just stays with that case. Not to mention the appellate process which could continue through many court systems, unless as in this case the panel decides enough is enough and the decision is final.
A couple of things bother me about these negative comment against Amanda Knox. I can’t believe the amount of people who believe she is guilty because of her demeanor. If life was that easy no one would be found guilty when innocent or vice versa. Second, why do people insist she is a rich American who bought this verdict with great PR people. Well I wouldn’t have hired this PR firm, seems a lot of people on here think she is Foxy Knoxy and a killer. Also, assuming because she is American she is rich really? I am sorry I have been to both Italy and the UK and you guys have far more money than over here . In the UK a hamburger costs $8-$10 are you kidding me, I’d rather go to NYC at least you can find reasonable priced goods, and lets not talk about the taxes. Her parents were just middle class people in Seattle, Washington far less expensive than the UK and Italy.
Finally, the court will release its findings on why they overturned the latest conviction in 90 day, and furthermore why they believe the case should end at this court. If you believe in the Italian system so much read it and see their conclusions. They must have had some justification.
I think you’re generalising about people having way more money in the UK, burgers, etc. I’m English and some people have more money then others, exactly the same as every other country in the world. It’s all relative. It’s like me saying everyone in the US live in mansions! In reality some do and some don’t. How can you compare Seattle with the whole of the UK??
Zoe-L you are absolutely right, and that was kind of my point. Some seem to infer Amanda Knox is a wealthy American who bought her freedom with well placed PR. First her parents are middle class who went into heavy debt to defend her. This point really hasn’t been disputed. The PR angle is funny as I would say there are still a lot of naysayers even after the higher court issued a not guilty verdict and not able to be viewed again by a lower court either. I am curious about their verdict and reasoning.
My comparisons on wealth are just as legitimate as those unsubstantiated comments. Which is what it is anecdotal evidence, generally not admissible in any court of law. At least I went to several cities in both the UK and Italy, and price wise I found the UK and Italy to be very expensive, and that was my experience. Whereas Seattle, not so much, and I live on one of the more expensive cities on the East Coast of the US.
You find Amanda Knox charming and charismatic? Really? We must have different definitions for those things.
You think she’s charming? You must be the only person in the world who does. I routinely see her described as “cold” and “awkward.”
Poor Amanda. I guess that people who “just knows” she’s guilty will continue to ruin her life. Never mind that there was no evidence, no motive, no criminal history. And that with Rudy G there was all of those things, and no link to Amanda, just to the victim. She was inconsistent when interrogated and tried to point her finger at others when she felt accused. Also, she looks numb and awkward, don’t forget. Guilty!
While she did have opportunity, the physical evidence pointed at someone else (who has been convicted and is currently serving time) and she had no motive. I don’t think she’s remotely charming or charismatic and that was part of her problem.
The Italian police handled this very badly and then tried to cover up their incompetence – that is a given in this case. Rudy Guede has never really implicated these 2 thou he has maintained Amanda was in the house that night as she let him in.
Their story has changed repeatedly so am sure people can understand why they were suspects and they both have come across as cold during interviews. However odd, cold behaviour does not make someone guilty of murder – maybe guilty of a personality disorder.
I don’t think we will ever know what happened that night but while i don’t think either of them killed Meredith, they both know more than they have told. Hence, why Solletico is now saying that Amanda wasn’t with him that night, that he was home alone. Any evidence that might have placed her there was destroyed by the italian police and the CCTV footage of her allegedly going out v early to buy bleach at a supermarket near the flat is of a very poor quality and no one can be sure it’s her.
There is a theory is that Guede was Amanda’s drug dealer (she had his number in her cell phone apparently) and he came to the flat to sell her drugs – she got high while he attacked Meredith in another room, leaving her to bleed to death. She’s found Meredith, freaked out and called Solletico to give her an alibi to cover up her drug taking with things snowballing from there.
This is so scary: “I don’t know anything about that case, but ….” Justice should not be based on how one feels, or skin colour, or clothing, but on evidence and proven facts only. Also what is the standard for right behaviour, who decided it should be there right kind of behaviour? What is odd/ cold for one, is normal to another and almost gregarious for the third party.
Okay….I am going to be that catty blog-commenter that I am so often annoyed by…but i can’t hold it in…where on earth did the “foxy Knoxy” thing come from? They tried to paint her as this gorgeous sexy femme fatale type..and then i see her and see how she acts, presents herself and I’m like….REALLY? HER? (Arrested Development reference)
It was a nickname from a high school sports team that the British press found on her MySpace page.
It was actually in the 2nd or 3rd grade…not high school.
And apparently it given to her because she was sly/smart about figuring out the strategy of the teams she was playing against, not because she was ‘hot’.
It’s hard for an eight-year-old to be “hot.” The nickname came from her childhood.
The cock-ups and cover-ups by the Italian police are reprehensible and remind me of the mess the police and investigators made of the Paul Bernardo/Karla Homolka string of rapes and murders that took place back in the early nineties. He was known as the ‘Scarborough rapist’ as most of his attacks took place there (eastern end of Toronto). Despite having a composite drawing that looked EXACTLY like him, when he was finally taken in for questioning the detectives asked Bernardo why he thought he was being investigated for the rapes. He said it was only because he resembled the composite and the detectives concluded that such a well-educated, well-adjusted, congenial young man couldn’t be responsible for the vicious crimes. He and his fiance then went on to drug and rape a young girl Karla worked with, drug and rape her younger sister who subsequently died from the drugs they gave her. They then abducted two young women, Leslie Mahaffey and Kristen French, raped, tortured and murdered them. There are other unsolved murders of young women in the area, as well as a rape committed while Paul and Karla were in Hawaii on their honeymoon. The murder of Elizabeth Bain was originally pinned on her boyfriend, Robert Baltovich, who served eight years of a life term before being found not guilty and released.
The DNA evidence from the Scarborough rapes sat untested on a shelf somewhere in Toronto for over two years. The police artist’s sketch triggered many calls naming Paul Bernardo as someone who strongly resembled the image on the Scarborough Rapist flyer, and women who were nearly victims managed to get a license plate number that would prove to match Bernardo’s car. It was never followed up on.
In a photograph taken by one of the senior officers investigating the death of Karla’s sister, the videotape of Tammy Homolka’s rape is sitting on Karla’s nightstand—no one checked to see what was on the tape, and it was not collected for evidentiary purposes. Despite a 3 month search of their home, videotapes of the rapes and murders of French and Mahaffey were never found – they were hidden in plain sight in a ceiling light fixture.
Between the lead investigator’s inexperience and because Bernardo was arrested before a solid case was developed, all they had to go on was Homolka’s description of the videotapes, and a plea-bargain was struck with her for a 12 year sentence. She’s been out of jail for some years and is living in the Caribbean under an assumed name, has remarried and has a child. Paul Bernardo is serving a life sentence with no chance of parole and has to be kept in solitary confinement most of the time because several attempts have been made on his life.
What a frightful legacy of stupidity by the police and detectives for the families of the young women who were raped and murdered by those two.
Yes, I remember that case. It was shocking and horrible. I don’t know how victims’ families, like those and Meridith’s, ever get any peace.
That is absolutely chilling. But as many people have commented, it happens across the world. The only shred of comfort is that people do still care enough to pursue the real culprits and bring them to justice. When we lose those people, or that demand that justice is done, then we are really in trouble.
She is a murderer and I’m outraged Italy’s prosecutors let her (and Raffaele Sollecito) free. Shame on them!
Where is your proof? No evidence or DNA found. How do you know Guede is innocent? All evidence points to him.
Well, there was DNA evidence, but it was said to not belong to Knox or her bf so it was tossed out.
Serena
You need proof outside of gossip to accuse someone of murder. Or someone could do it to you. There’s a justice system for a reason. And Knox is still not convicted and having it stand in a higher court.
Shaming people for looking at the evidence in the case, is illogical. The evidence in the case shows that Guede is the murderer.
Oscar Pistorius got coverage here. But I guess he’s a celebrity of sorts. I guess I can’t answer your question, other than she’s a polarizing figure.
Enough about Knox – who’s that hot guy with ALL THAT HAIR behind her?
🙂
What hot guy?
That’s her fiance. He’s a rocker and a ghostbuster. Collin something.
So this is a weird but true story. I once met this guy who was a friend of a guy my bff was dating. After meeting him for the first time, I commented to my friend that he had dead eyes and it wouldn’t surprise me if he ended up murdering someone someday. About a year after that I saw him on the news because he had murdered his grandmother by stabbing her over 100 times.
The point of the story is the first time I saw this girl I thought the same thing–dead eyes. Even when she is smiling, it doesn’t change anything. But that’s just my random opinion, and by no means proves anything. But honestly, she looks like someone I wouldn’t want to make mad.
I have been on the receiving end of some “dead eyes” comments, which is actually pretty hurtful, since I am a very empathetic person. A couple people pinpointed it is the blue which makes them think so (it is the same shade as Amanda’s eyes, actually) and it gives a vacant appearance. I sure hope I never get accused of murder, lest people assume I am cold and unfeeling.
Amanda is going in the “OJ Simpson” file.
They did not try her “over and over again.” They tried her once, and then the conviction was appealed. The case goes through a series of appeals–brought by one side or the other– to make sure the conviction stands–or doesn’t. In some ways, this system has a lot more opportunities to free innocent (or even guilty) people from a conviction unlike our own system, which has relatively narrow and specific guidelines for overturning a guilty verdict.
This whole notion that the Italian system is unfair or somehow inferior to ours is narrow-minded. They are simply different systems, each with its own benefits and drawbacks.
I believe she is guilty as sin. I believe she (mostly) got away with murder. But so it goes. My heart breaks fro Meredith Kercher and her family.
It’s not unfair. The prosecutor though….
Too much evidence was logged and said to be at the scene and not been seen since. Things were botched by accident or on purpose..
If she’s guilty and it’s as clear as day as some of you say why is the higher court not holding it. Why did the prosecutor have to go the satanic ritual route and not stick to facts. Because there were none? Yea.
Oh, I agree. There is no question that there were enough screw-ups in the investigation and problems with the prosecutor to make the case ultimately go the way it did. That doesn’t make her innocent. Case in point: the third roommate’s room with the fake break in. The thrown-away cell phones. The clean up. The framing of Patrick Lamumba. There are far too many wrinkles in her story for us to say, oh, poor girl Framed from start to finish.
All I know is that her boyfriend scares the $#!+ out of me in those pictures.
I can’t expend the same energy as I did in the previous AK threads, so I will leave it at: evidence points to Rudy Guede acting alone, and all evidence to the contrary was due to faulty police work. She couldn’t have been there in the room or she would have left some trace. Period. You can’t clean up your own DNA and leave someone else’s. The room was covered in Guede’s DNA. The prosecution and police department’s egos and credibility were on the line, and they went after Knox and Solliceto so vigorously to protect themselves. Guede had been on a crime spree, so there is that, and once they thought they had Amanda’s guilt on lock, they wouldn’t back off.
Fun fact! The police detective recently got in hot water for witness intimidation in another case.
Just also wanted to add that it’s easy to forget about Meredith in this which is a huge shame. When the person accused (incorrectly) of your murder ends up a bigger victim than you, there are major flaws in the justice system.
I can’t imagine the feeling of fury Amanda must have felt while in prison. She was told she was HIV positive and asked to make a list of all sexual partners. This list was leaked to the press. A second test confirmed she was clean. That something like this could happen makes me furious beyond belief.
Yes Meredith was killed that night, noone can deny it. But the numerous small deaths the two falsely accused must have endured over the past 8 years are not able to be measured. They will never be the same and can never live a normal life. That too, is a tragedy.
Italian law system is simple: since the jury and judge are human and can be wrong, both parts can be judged 3 times in total. This obviously applies only if one of the two parts asks for another proof revision in Court. I so t say this is better than other law systems but this has pretty much been a plus for that criminal lier Amanda, becaude she was found guilty the first time. In US system she would have been locked in jail since then, no chance of judgment revision. I don’t know whether she’s guilty or not (nobody does, beside her), but for sure she has lied to save her ass, accusing an innocent man and when he was cleared from accusations (after 2 weeks in jail) she has accused another one, the one who is now in prison for participating in Meredith’ murder. Participating with whom it had not been made clear. So she’s a criminal, that’s for sure.
Not much to say here, but I’m very sad for the victim’s family. The lack of credibility and professionalism of the prosecution/investigation is ASTOUNDING. I’m blown away.
The first trial court documents were available online and converted from Italian to English. I read them in the entirety. No one will ever know what actually happened, let alone why, but she was part of it. She is guilty. I couldn’t care less about her lack of emotion or not acting like the average person would under those circumstances. I do care alot about evidence and there was plenty of evidence – hard evidence and a lot of circumstancial evidence. A lot of people don’t think much of circumstantial evidence but if there is so much of it, it can’t be explained away, I take it as seriously as I would hard evidence. Evidence includes all three of the suspects’ bloody footprints revealed by luminol, their DNA at the crime scene including Knox’s mixed with the victim’s, the fact that there was no real break-in which leads to an inside job, Knox implicating an innocent black man, Sollecito not confirming Knox’s alibi, cell phone evidence, the 2 perps own words which are contradictory and not believable, victim’s DNA on a knife found at Sollecito’s apartment where victim had never been, witness testimony that they were not where they said they were.
Sometimes sociopaths are pretty young women you’d never think would be capable of a heinous crime. But it happens – look at Casey Anthony – who also got off scott free because male jurors couldn’t beleive she did what she did.
I’m wondering if you have read anything other than the first trial court documents? It is just a lot of the “evidence” you cite has actually been questioned and the reason why Knox and Sollecito were released in 2011. This “evidence” was seen as possibly contaminated, was purely theory, was proven to be completely wrong, witnesses were deemed unreliable….
I appreciate every one has an opinion on this so, just as I have every right to believe they are not guilty, so, too, do you have a right to feel the opposite. I would, however, be interested in your response when the Italian Supreme Court release their reasoning and findings behind the complete and total acquittal of the pair when it is released in 90 days.
Hmm…
well the DNA on the knife was at too low a level to be appropriate evidence. The knife was also proven to be the wrong size to make the stab wounds… so… yeah
The footprints of Amanda’s found weren’t made in blood as was claimed originally. Luminol gives positive results to other substances than blood, such as cleaning products. If you believe Amanda cleaned the crime scene, how did she manage to remove all traces of her own DNA but none of Rudy’s?
The “DNA mixed with blood”.. well that’s simply explained by Amanda’s DNA being present in her own bathroom (shock horror) and the victim’s blood then being deposited on top, likely when the actual perpetrator tried washing his hands clean. Is your DNA in your home? Most definitely. As are fingerprints and hair. Neither of Amanda’s were found in the crime scene room at all yet Rudy’s were everywhere. How do you wipe clean fingerprints while leaving someone elses? They’re invisible…
Other circumstantial evidence like the shop owner claiming they bought bleach on the morning of the murder have never been proven to be true…
It seems as though you’re in the “la la they’re guilty fingers in ears” camp of thinking. I hope you’re never in a situation like this being judged by someone like yourself…. it might not end as well for you
knox got away with murder and that kind of karma will come back to her…
Accusing someone with no evidence is probably also frowned upon by the magic gods of karma. Watch yourself!
I’ve read everything there is to read about this case – the media articles, interviews, books (by Follain and Nadeau and Knox’s own book), even the translated judgment reasons (skimmed those last ones) (which you can find online at a great site, the murder of meredith kercher dot com).
I’m sorry, but Knox was involved in some way and this last decision was Italy stepping aside to avoid an extradition/diplomacy issue. Maybe the circumstantial evd wasn’t quite enough to overcome the mucked-up forensics in a court, but it’s enough to convince me she cleaned up and staged the break-in.
The amount of PR that’s gone into getting coverage for her case is insane, and the PR people have told outright lies. I’ve seen reputable papers print bs that wasn’t researched (the Washington Post seems to be an exception). You really have to read up on this and avoid most US reports to get a sense of the truth.
She was there. And if she cleaned up, then the likelihood is that she was involved in the murder of Kercher itself, and I think it was drugs and alcohol, because I don’t think she would have been that stupid to actually carry out a premeditated murder.
Blog owner: your comment on being unsettled is right on the mark. I always felt she was too grateful to be back. I’d be really angry if I were innocent and put in prison for 4 years for something I didn’t do. There’s another good blog on this issue by a professional lie detector (yeah, that’s an occupation) who trains cops. Look up Eyes for Lies and her comments on Knox’s demeanour.