I’ve never owned anything by Lilly Pulitzer. That stuff – floral, preppy – is not really my jam. I go for darker, androgynous clothes. But I admire that the House of Pulitzer has stuck to their look and their target audience (preppy, thin, white women). Except there’s trouble at the country club! Lily Pulitzer opened their offices to The Cut (NY Magazine) and a photographer ended up taking some photos of various employee work spaces. And this photo was published on Monday:
Employee at Lily Pulitzer had these awful cartoons hanging in a cubicle. http://t.co/ThdMWooFgd pic.twitter.com/472SHFoCBB
— Jay Yarow (@jyarow) May 26, 2015
The photo showed some drawings over an employee’s work space/cubicle. Both drawings show cartoonish “fat” women, with one saying “Just another day of…Fat White and Hideous. You should probably just kill yourself…” The other drawing is “Put It Down Carb Face.”
The Cut has not taken down the photo, but it’s not like people are mad at The Cut – they’re mad at the employees of Lilly Pulitzer. There’s been a lot of online backlash (specifically on Twitter), and on Tuesday, Jane Schoenborn, Vice President of Creative Communications told E! News:
“These illustrations were the work of one individual and were posted in her personal work area. While we are an employer that does encourage people to decorate their own space, we are a female-dominated company and these images do not reflect our values. We apologize [sic] for any harm this may have caused.”
I’m sort of all over the place on this. I mean, I’m sure people would bitch at me if they saw my workspace (it’s not like I have “fat jokes” in my workspace, it’s just sort of messy in here), but then again… I’m not inviting anyone to photograph my workspace. To defend this one employee, I think it’s also possible that these cartoons were reminders to stay on a diet, or something like that? You know how some people will put an inspirational weight-loss message on their refrigerator? These cartoons might be like that, only really terrible and offensive. I also think this comes at a bad time for the house of Pulitzer because earlier this year, the Lilly Pulitzer collection for Target was a massive success… except they only did the Target collection in-stores up to a size 14. No affordable Lilly Pulitzer clothing for you in-store, fatty.
Also: I’m not sure why I chose to use Kate Bosworth photos for this post, except that when I searched for “Lilly Pulitzer” images, this is what came up. The Bos and Bella Thorne at the Pulitzer-for-Target launch in April. Well, everyone says Lilly Pulitzer is only for super-skinny WASPs. Kate Bosworth is basically their mascot. The only way this could get any more obvious is if Blake Lively was suddenly seen wearing Lilly Pulitzer.
Photos courtesy of WENN, Lilly Pulitzer.
This is gross but on the positive side Kate Bosworth looks seriously stunning in these pictures.
Ha, I came to say the same thing! This story is gross; Kate Bosworth is a gorgeous woman.
Camilla Alves stands out more to me. She looks stunning in that white jacket.
She has the receding hairline of someone who starves/purges (from the resulting malnutrition). Anytime you see hair like that you have to wonder what the malnutrition is doing internally to her bones and organs. It makes me cringe. That’s why I don’t find her “stunning,” I find her rather sad.
I think she’s lovely, and we have the same hairline. I don’t have an eating disorder, nor am I malnourished (though my diet is admittedly not top-notch, I do eat fruits and veggies and take a multivitamin…). This is a weird assumption to make. Maybe, like me, her hairline is just a result of her DNA?
My coworker who is 28 and eats < 1000 calories a day (declares it is how she maintains her xs/size 0 figure) and can squeeze into as tight as possible clothes. She has the exact same hairline. It is a huge sign of eating disorders. Same with Bosworth.
uh, source please.
I have the same hairline, and am a size 0. Have never had anything resembling an eating disorder in my whole life nor have I even been on a diet. It’s called a high forehead.
actually, she looks healthier and seems to have gained a necessary pound or two. she looks glowing
Mrs Krabapple, not true, and Andrea, your poor co-worker that you keep staring at! A high forehead doesn’t signify anything – except perhaps lots of brains!
My hairline is the same as Kate’s.
I have been fat, I have been thin, and at the moment I am medium-to-chubby – and guess what – my hairline has stayed exactly the same!
Hair doesn’t magically grow where it never grew before, or old fat guys would grow back a full head of hair along with their guts!
@pinns
Old fat guys problably eat lots of calories but they no not come form nutrient-rich foods. You can be obese and eat LOTS of food and still have many deficiencies….
That said, it could be traction alopecia. If you wear your hair in a tight bun/ponytail a lot, your hairline will recede. If you do that for years, your hair might now grow back. I had a friend who wore a bun all day everyday and hair hairline was incredibly high and she was only in her teen back then, it really looked wrong….
I do think KB restricts her food though, she wasn’t always this skinny.
Oops. Might *never grow back
I recently looked up photos from when Kate Bosworth dated Orlando Bloom, and granted she was younger, but now she looks so botoxed and frozen in comparison. She was STUNNING.
I think this photo says a lot about the self esteem (or lack of) of the girl whose desk it is. I used to live next door to a model. She was gorgeous but was so hard on herself. Her fridge was plastered with notes telling herself she was fat and shouldn’t eat so much. Sad.
I can maybe understand someone using those pictures as a motivation to lose weight but the reference to going and killing yourself doesn’t say that to me. Hugely insensitive.
Lovely. I’m sure whoever that is is a real peach to work with.
I don’t care for the LP style, but that is the best and healthiest Kate Bosworth has looked in years.
The pictures are terrible, but I do wonder what the context is here. Because if someone put them up to remind them to stay on a diet, then that’s pretty sad and pathetic.
But with a line that says “you should probably just kill yourself”? That’s beyond motivational aphorisms.
Really depends on the person I think? My morning running alarm says “get out of bed you fat and lazy piece of sh**” in all caps + a blaring alarm. Gets me out of bed. I mean I would never print that out and tape it by my desk but I need the same kind of motivation.
I agree…to me there’s an implication there that if you are not skinny, you don’t deserve to live. I mean, she probably didn’t mean it literally, but that’s a really disturbing way to motivate yourself. I imagine this woman bases her self worth on her appearance (been there, and it’s miserable)
There’s a really terrible sub on Reddit that has become popular. It’s called Fat People Hate. It has TONS of subscribers and the gist of it is to make fun of photos of overweight people. That they should not exist and should kill themselves is a very popular mantra there. It’s a horrible horrible place. My point in mentioning this is, believe it or not, there’s a huge crossover with the anorexia subs on there. I can only imagine the level of self-hate that some people must have, and fear, that they spend their time this way or perceive overweight people this way. But it’s not uncommon. That’s for sure.
@claire
“believe it or not, there’s a huge crossover with the anorexia subs on there. ”
How do you know?
They could very well be an inside joke or facetious. Once I worked with a woman who had what we jokingly called “tanorexia”. Even when she was really tan she would complain that she needed to get to the tanning bed because she didn’t “have any color”. One of our friends/co-workers made a cartoon of her saying something about wishing she wasn’t so white (it was more clever and funny than that but it would take to long to explain!) and she framed it and hung it in her office. I’m sure plenty of people nowadays if they saw the cartoon on social media would be all hyper judge-judgey and pseudo-outraged about it, even though it was a perfectly innocent joke amongst friends.
This is interesting who should be getting slammed for this. The employee for having that up in their cubicle? Or the employer for allowing it? I just have photos of my children/ grandchild and pets up in my cubicle.
No one should be, honestly. It’s her personal work space and she’s not inciting violence or terrible activity. Maybe her attitude on weight is problematic but so what? Everyone has problematic thoughts on various topics.
This is sort of a non-controversy that is blowing up for no reason and speaks to people getting offended over pretty much anything lately. Thought policing.
This +1000. People just search for things to be offended about.
I agree, if it was the head of the company or it was official office decorations given out by the company then we’d have something to be upset about as it would be harassment but an individual decorating her personal space with non racist, non violent stuff it’s ok.
The only one she should be forced to take down is the kill your self because that is violent and hateful but the put it down carb face Is honestly just stupid.
Also why is she getting crap for only going to a size 14? That is perfectly acceptable. It is a full size range and sorry we should focus on how truly ugly her clothes are.
I tend to agree with you guys. If anything people should feel sorry for her.
Also, this is no different than many thinspo adages or stuff you find in eating disorder-focused forums. Hell, you could easily find similar sayings and cartoons on pinterest and Tumblr.
I think this person could possibly have a problem and I don’t think she should be crucified for it.
It’s like the journalist was just fishing for controversy and attention.
It’s like the world is looking for things to get offended about. This woman doesn’t want to be fat, more power to her.
But she is inciting violence against oneself.
She’s telling fat people to kill themselves.
THANK YOU! Being offended does not equal virtuousness. Make it stop!
I think: “you should probably go kill yourself” goes beyond thought policing. The rest is whatever — bullshit, but nothing to really worry about. The kill yourself thing is WAY out of line, though, and anyone with a modicum of common sense/brains should know that.
Yep. It’s not a nice cartoon but it’s not necessary to bring out the flaming torch for this.
It’s the fashion industry, we all know it’s bitchy and biased towards skinny people.
Even the kill yourself one doesn’t really bother me. It’s a personal workspace, she isn’t tweeting it to make a statement, there was no intent for anybody else to have even seen it. Frankly, I’m more offended by a photographer taking shots of an individual’s desk than anything about the cartoons.
I think this isn’t truly a big deal, I am more concerned about the employee themselves and whether they are being too hard on themselves.
At the same time…I wouldn’t call this “personal workspace” unless she is working from home. If you are at your place of employment, it can’t be personal. It may be where your station is situated, but it isn’t yours and it isn’t personal.
Same thoughts. It’s so tiring to read about everyone’s constantly hurt feelings. I consider my working space my corner and I do decorate it as it pleases me within the limits of the company’s policy, i.e. no nudity or such. If I wish to call myself “a disgusting donut” I insist on being allowed to do so and if I wish to turn it into a cartoon, I insist to have this too. I’m not peaking at what others are putting in their offices and never comment on it. It’s not my business.
So I wonder if the cartoon said “Fat, Hideous and Black” you would be so blase about it. Also, a lot of you are whining about how your cubicle is your personal space – IT IS NOT. Your cubicle is owned by your employer, and has every right to dictate what goes in (and what doesn’t go in) there. You have no right to ‘insist’ anything. Finally, the fact that you want the right to put up pictures in your office that call fellow human beings hideous and urging them to kill themselves tells me a lot about your character, or lack thereof.
I think the employee and maybe her direct supervisor should be blamed for not doing anything/not noticing but I doubt Lilly Pulitzer has a habit of inspecting every employee’s workspace on a daily basis. I haven’t heard about her brand before this, but if I understand correctly – it’s quite popular and probably has many offices, stores. The owners of such companies often don’t even know most people who work for them. I wonder if that person got/will get fired for this. Although I don’t think she should – a warning maybe?
I just googled their clothes, because I usually like delicate floral prints but these are a special kind of hideous. Trippy florals are definitely not my jam. Kate Bosworth looks good in that dress but others hurt my eyes.
Agree that the employer shouldn’t be blamed, and not even her direct supervisor. It’s just her personal crap up on her wall. I can think of far more offensive things posted in cubicles in corporate America.
Yes, esmom. ITA.
You just reminded me of a law firm I worked at in Houston. Poster of Hawaiian Tropic girls up behind the copier. Different types of industries promote different types of ugly messages. I guess people have to decide what they’re willing to support. Good ole boy Texas law firm = bikini babes fine to ogle at work. Fashion house dedicated to skinny white country club ladies = self shaming as motivation. None of it is exactly break the internet level news, but sad nonetheless.
Maybe the employee/direct supervisor didn’t “do anything” about this woman’s personal decorations in her personal work space because we don’t live in a dictatorship monitored by thought police?
A lil’ late to the Lilly P. party today, and though I’m not a fan of the clothes, I just wanted to chime in here…
I agree w/Esmom that one employee’s workspace is hardly reflective of the whole company’s culture, and perhaps it’s a personal joke, even if a somewhat sad or harsh and unfunny one.
Speaking for myself, I have on my fridge a magnet with one of those 50s photos of a young girl praying at bedtime that says, “Thank you, God, for a nice face, but the fat *ss has got to go.”
I sometimes wonder what visitors must think, but anyone can see it goes along with other ones there about drinking, drugs and swearing…
Did I put these there to shame myself? Hell, no. They make me laugh – as I go ahead and eat or drink whatever I want.
Both really. It’s unprofessional and hostile. Change the home screen of your phone or something but keep it private. If this person has overweight coworkers or the coworkers have overweight family members and friends -this employee’s self-loathing will create a problem. Why is this person bringing their diet and body issues into the workplace? Seems very melodramatic and immature.
How about NO ONE should be getting slammed.
I just find it disturbing and sad that there are so many adults walking around self loathing. It makes you wonder what we are all doing wrong as a society…
Oh, it’s easy to see what we are doing wrong. Nothing to do with society especially, just us as humans.
Read these threads and observe the vicious comments, insults, faux-concern and gleeful nastiness, as a whole from women directed at other women. And the sanctimonious smugness.
And this is one of the more sensible comments sections anywhere I’ve seen!
Right here on this thread people have said Kate Bosworth has a high forehead because she has an eating disorder. Nothing to back that up.
And then a lot of people saying what a shame it is women have so much self-loathing.
hello.
But neither apologies, nor self flagellation, will actually change anything.
People will just be incredibly careful with their ‘memos’, and far more circumspect in not putting what they think, out there like this.
I don’t think it’s appropriate to hang something like that in your cube–personal message to self or not. What message about herself is it conveying? What message about others is it conveying? Her attitudes & disposition? It’s off-putting IMO. Does she meet with clients in her cube? Or perhaps those pictures are reflective of the work culture.
Although one can think of it as personal space, it’s actually the employer’s space that you are temporarily occupying. Don’t get too comfortable. Stay with the neutral stuff with a bit of personalization. You are not at home.
DENA totally agree. It’s called “being professional.”
@Dena –
Your response had nothing to do with the point I was making.
Exactly, I’m a manager and just completed my yearly -and legally required workplace violence and sexual harassment training. In the workplace there is truly no private or personal space, and this cartoon was in plain view and could be perceived as harassing or offensive to anyone who views it. If it was my office, I would’ve had them remove it and a conversation around why it’s not appropriate, and why they posted it to begin with (ie does the employee need help?) Furthermore, if I had complaints about it and did nothing about it, I would be contributing to a hostile work environment and could lose my job/company be sued etc. So, although it seems harmless it just really has no place in a work/professional environment.
@ Jegede. My comment actually landed in the wrong place. Thank your for your . . . correction.
Laughing at myself because when I opened the article I thought, “Wow. Lilly Pulitzer looks a lot like Kate Bosworth. Wait . . . I thought she was way older.” Then I read further.
Same here!!
I thought the same thing! Lol
Yeah, I don’t think her or anyone else’s picture should have been used for this.
Ha ha, me too! Side note: I have never seen KB look better.
Kate Bosworth, graduate of Cohasset High School. Cohasset, MA is basically the Lilly Pulitzer target market.
Just because I’m nosy (and I’m in love with American Wooden built houses) I Google mapped Cohasset MA street view and the image that came up was the cemetery! Must be a bit quiet then….
It’s also where Witches of Eastwick was filmed 😉
I grew up down there and I have to admit that I adore Cohassett. It’s so, so gorgeous.
It looks gorgeous – must be fabulous in the Autumn with all the trees.
Aww this is where my mom grew up, but since I’m in Canada /on the west coast have barely seen it.
@Dolce Crema-you must come visit!
Cohasset is comprised of all these little rocky inlets and wild rugged waterfront, cliffs and hills. It’s really idyllic.
I live maybe a half hour away..how did I not know this? Learn something new everyday I guess.
As a native Bostonian, I agree 😉
What if she had a picture of an elephant or a pig on her desk as a reminder to stay on her diet? Would you find that offensive? A lot of people use these images to try to stay on track with their own eating. I really don’t think this poor employee meant any harm…
Is “you should probably just kill yourself” motivational?
Maybe it is motivational for the woman who put it up. It’s not a sentiment or strategy I agree with (certainly not healthy), but I dont think its up to anyone else to decide what motivates a person, especially when it’s only posted in one’s own work space.
I’ve actually seen that meme before, I think some people do find it sarcastic/catty and funny and, I guess, motivational. I think it’s twisted and kinda crazy but I’m not offended by it.
to me, it’s like a dry sense of humor joke. I’m sure it’s not mean literally. besides it’s the employee’s personal workspace.
I just keep going back to questioning what kind of mindset someone has to be in to stare at every day, and chances are it’s not sarcasm and it’s not motivation. It’s either an utter contempt for others or worse, contempt for themselves.
I don’t think the pictures itself are causing such an uproar. The descriptions do – especially the one about killing oneself for being fat and hideous. It combines fat-shaming with suicide encouragement, which is very insensitive.
I understand what you are saying, but for all we know these could be self portraits. I have known a lot of anorexic women in my life – unfortunately – it’s a crappy disease that messes with your mind. I am just trying to be empathetic here.
I don’t personally find it offensive, just very sad. And, even if you manage to maintain your weight in such a self critical way, I doubt you’d even enjoy it, because clearly this is not an attitude of self acceptance, or self love. I imagine this woman is quite young, and that in the coming years she’ll catch on that speaking to yourself this way always backfires.
Honestly, it would seem like a red flag. A work space, like a work computer or work email is not private. I would think of that person as being a bit of a mess for needing to broadcast that sort of thing publicly. It’s like having a fight on Facebook -please do that sort of thing in private.
I’m really, really sad for any woman who would put those types of images in her work cube to see every day. It is one thing to keep yourself motivated, it is quite another to have fat cartoons with insults and stuff that says you should kill yourself. Having a less than perfect physique, I understand where the notion to punish yourself for not conforming to standards comes from, but I’m glad I am able to love myself enough to not to day that. But maybe working in an office like Lily Pulitzer, that is what is required mentally to keep yourself in a high fashion, high profile job, which is also sad.
This is all part of the #thinspo #preppy #summerinlilly tumblr crowd…. teenage girl stuff. Super unhealthy, shallow, and materialistic!
The pictures belong to one individual…. but they do seem to reflect the company culture. If LP made plus size clothing, it would be easier to say “oh this girl is just a self-hating dieter.” But LP clothes have always been for skinny country club ladies, and these pictures make me wonder what their in-house discussions are like.
A lot of clothing companies don’t carry plus sized clothing… Is that a requirement now? Since when?
Also as far as I can remember, most stores only carry up to size 12, and you have to go to a department store or a specialty store to get anything bigger.
RUNCMC that was not my point. I was referring to context. Do those pictures reflect the corporate culture? Like “the devil wears Prada”? If LP made larger clothes, we would know for certain that this is one employee’s attempt to hate herself thin. Since LP does NOT make plus-size clothing, it’s possible there are lots of fat-shaming pictures in lots of cubicles. We just don’t know.
Since people started looking for excuses to justify obesity. It’s very problematic, from my point of view. It shouldn’t be a requirement and indeed, I expect the majority of brands to not show acceptance by constantly going bigger and bigger. Another part of the same story is that size 4 is getting larger every year I buy it. At the same time, deaths caused by obesity and its consequences are currently leading the sad rally leaving behind even smoking. We should actively and in every way go exactly the opposite direction – it’s not normal, it’s not healthy, and it shouldn’t become acceptable by any means.
Mary-Alice, every person, no matter what size, deserves to be treated with respect. Your concern should start and end with your own body.
I was pleasantly surprised Lilly went up to a 14. I was sure they would stop at 10.
Could you imagine having to stare at those drawings every single day like that? Either the person is utterly self loathing or they are all-consumed by thinness (big shock since it’s a fashion designer).
I think she’s probably both.
Agreed.
When I gave up smoking I put pictures of the ugliest, slobbiest people with bad skin puffing on cigarettes to remind myself of all the vanity and energy reasons why I had to stay off them.
Food can be as much as an addiction for people, worse in fact because everybody has to eat, there’s no cold turkey!!!!! So I can’t judge anybody for putting up little cartoons for themselves. Assuming the cubicle owner put it up herself and that someone didn’t put them there to bully her!!!! I find the ‘kill yourself’ comment to be very disturbing.
People lose their sh*t over this label. It’s just green and pink clothing, nothing special.
My mother, when I was little, on her sewing machine made me dresses like that, with lace or other embellishments around the neckline, always floral material we picked out. She was from the south and called it a shift. They looked exactly like that, same texture material also. Kate could have saved some money and whipped that out in a second and saved the $200 that it probably cost her. LOL.
Your mom was ahead of her time! Seriously though, I’m not sold on these dresses being worn by anyone over the age of 8.
I grew up in an affluent neighborhood in the northeast. Country clubs, yada yada. My mom, a size 10 pale brunette, always wanted to be able to pull off Lilly. Nope. It only looks good on wafer thin, tan, blondes. It’s their uniform.
Goop must have these kind of drawings in her house.
So ugly. Those clothes are so, SO ugly.
I heard about the Target line and how there was going to be a mad rush. I looked them up and was so surprised at how bad it was! I think a floral shift is a good idea, but the big flower patterns are just too much.
Agree x’s 3!
wow Kate looks so beautiful in those pictures.
Oh for Pete ‘ s sake. It’s her own personal cubicle which she probably didn’t even know was being photographed. Maybe she is a sarcastic f@$* like I am am who says/does things like this in a self-depricating way sometimes to put myself in check when I need to cut back. People need to stop getting so up in arms. It kind of seems like people are way too sensitive and projecting their own insecurities and way too often making a mountain out of a molehill. Unless she is attacking other people and this is her frame of mind in real life, and others at her job have been personally offended by her cartoons, this is a non-story. I work in a pretty laid back and diverse office and thank goodness there are no uptight people who work here, We give each other sarcastic cards, draw caricatures of ourselves, and snap at each other in fun via post-its left on each others desks on a regular basis. Its like a comedy central roast here sometimes but never any drama. I’m sure someone on the internets would find something to get offended over that they would inadvertently see in our office if someone was allowed to snoop around our personal work space and post pictures.
Thanks for being the voice of reason!
I was about to type the same exact thing! So refreshing to hear logic and reason.
Amen.
exactly
Thank you!! I am so sick of people being offended by Everything!! Seems like they are just looking for something to get mad about.
I’m not getting a sense of people being offended or outraged, just maybe sad and concerned for this person. In no way do I think she doesn’t have the right to hang up whatever she pleases in her cubicle, but I find it heartbreaking that she chooses to speak to herself in such a way. Maybe because I’ve struggled as long as I can remember with disorderd eating and self esteem issues, and I understand how desperate you can get to get and stay skinny at any cost, because you belive therin lies your value as a human being and your only shot of happiness…it’s a tough space to occupy, and to get out of.
@Beatrice: I’m with you! It seems like being offended and outraged has become the fashion.
Me too. In fact, this is the main reason for me to hardly post in forums, Facebook etc. I am just sick and tired of checking everything I write ten times for “offensive” content, and I just don’t want to censor myself.
@Ava7: I totally agree. I am on the internet since 1999, and people weren’t always like that. Ui, we had discussions which would cause people nowadays to nervous breakdowns….. 😉
Great post. Totally agree.
At work, you have NO expectation of privacy. When I worked for someone other than myself, I was limited in what I could display in my office. It’s not your personal space, it belongs to the company.
Yes, and if you’re not breaking any rules or the company’s policy, you can absolutely hang on your wall whatever pleases you!
Mary-Alice, I would imagine that many companies don’t feel they have to spell out “Don’t put up hateful imagery or text that promotes suicide.” There is such a thing as professional judgment. Many companies DO have ethics or HR policies that describe commitment to professional, non-discriminatory behavior.
I wish we could get away from “But *I* want it and *I’m* not offended so *you* need to deal with it” to asking ourselves how our behavior may reasonably impact others. The comments here show there’s a healthy portion of the public that do feel offense and get self-triggered by these cartoons. Phones, purses, notebooks – these are are private places you can use to your heart’s content without posting on a wall everyone can see.
I try to be very considerate and respectful about language and fat shaming and everything, but I don’t know why this reporter thought this was a story. It’s one individual who chose to put a couple of stupid cartoons over her desk. It’s sad that women beat themselves up that way, but I don’t think it reflects badly on the company. As for LP being only for skinny women, that’s simply not true. They have some styles that only skinny women could wear, but they have a lot of tunics, etc. that look nice on the average woman and they are sized very generously. I can wear their size 8 and I’m usually a 10.
This! Agree. I wonder how this employee is now feeling – guilty, humiliated, angry? IF this person does have disordered eating/thinking, I hope this will be a way for them to get some help.
Exactly. This could get very ugly for her, and she might not be in a good place to cope with it.
Funny. Where was the sympathy for any other disordered eating/thinking coworkers who may feel angry and humiliated EVERY DAY when they see their colleague’s office?
I assume these notes are personal shaming notes not directed at white women et al. So why is it being blown out of proportion. Yes it’s sad no one should be so mean to oneself but it is her desk and her right.
If someone was coming out and saying fat shaming thing, then yes I would be offended. But what someone hangs in the privacy of their own office cubicle and then some other asshat walks by and makes a picture of it….. well its her own business. Not offended.
Also, Kate’s eyebrow game is on point.
I think it was a pretty d*ck move by the photog.
This. This wasn’t a public statement. This is quite literally people in the internet looking for stuff to be offended by.
I wrote for the Lilly Pulitzer brand around a dozen years ago. We were creating a new presence via one of her licensees, and that voice work, humor, and other sales tool club and card concepts were approved by her and later applied elsewhere. So: disclaimer, but also the reason I am writing.
I did not work in their corp offices; I worked in an agency. But the issue to me, based on what I learned in my couple of years of work, is this: the true essence of Lilly was more about her humor and desire to be happy, have fun. She loved a party, right? There was a tale about her kitchen floor afloat with spilled drinks at parties and people sliding about having fun. There is a good book with great photos about her art of entertaining, Out of print, but worth the find. Food, drinking, fun. Live! Almost Auntie-Mamish, like the stuffed toy animals hanging from trees around her house in FL. Fun.
A quote from her says in part, “{my} clothes make people happy. You feel happy wearing bright colors. It makes you smile. Who doesn’t want to smile a bit more these days?” That’s the core of Lilly. Not (then) exclusive WASP-thin sizing, or steep prices, Yes many Lilly fans were active and outdoor-loving people, and thus fit from fun and water. But….this was not necessarily exclusive attitudes, or starving to fit in, more a healthy lifestyle. You can also; look up photos of her own family members in Lilly, or here, see the real Lilly crowd in 2011–
http://fashionhistorymuseum.blogspot.com/2011/11/preppy-american-brunch-celerated-80th.html
Ms. Pulitzer created her print dresses to hide fruit juice stains when she decided to sell fruit at a stand in FL because she was bored being a happy elite housewife. Though from a posh well-to-do NY/NE background, she just wanted to do something. Women liked her dresses even more than the fruit and so… all this.
The current corporate culture (a company called Sugartown Worldwide in PA) may have chosen to target the young thin rich WASP route for their business reasons today. And this employee may be just one more cookie-cutter fashion world staffer obsessed with magazine style and weight. Conversely, the little cartoons may even have been drawn hung in fun for an internal staff laugh of snarky irony at the company decision to pursue thin WASP college girls as the current Lilly image. We don’t know.
IMO, the failure to “get” the ethos of the brand is more apparent in the Target line and sizing, while saying “we’re a female-dominated company” — sort of disappointingly typical craptastic corp speak — so basic, and that alone shows a lack of “getting” the brand, the fun, the energy, the woman that was Lilly and the women out here now who are savvy enough to squint at corporate style games, or read snark about it on Jezebel. It’s also clumsy not to scope your offices before opening up to the press. It’s clumsy to run a brand and not notice how your employees, brand ambassadors, think. Creative and fashion people LOVE to joke and snark, and so that may be all this is but also, it’s hung up because someone felt it made a strong point about the brand (two drawings, not one) or the person’s view. Either is a clue about your brand’s direction and the people creating it and so, it should have been seen and chatted about. Not a surprise seen in a reporter’s post.
My guess is Lilly would have had a far better reply to all of this, be it in a new print or a simple witty comment or an educating word to the staffer about the art: (a) are you ok? (b) if you feel that our brand is going that way enough to mock it with TWO cartoons on a body-gaming topic as if against certain sized people we are now excluding, tell someone you think the brand is now a WASP joke so we can all think about why it has become this, and is it right, and is it not just fun anymore. Sales were still climbing in fiscal 2014, so it’s working for them in one way, but maybe are they handling it poorly and clumsily on a broader scale like this. Maybe their offices aren’t sophisticated enough to think the PR impact through, the bigger world implications.
In other words, if this is what the staffer thinks the brand has become or is, vs her own personal weight issues — Lilly has an issue that’s part of its brand journey now.
Thanks for posting. The women in the photos are just real people with real bodies, and they look great in the splashy prints and forgiving cuts.
Exactly.
Their sizes extend to a 16 currently; but now they’re known by headlines (here, CNN Money, etc.) that simply include their name and the words “fat-shaming” and that was avoidable. Culturally that zaps a core customer’s ego, and also impacts women thanks to current body shaming programming. A friendly brand turned not so fun. You can’t pay for the goodwill they built over the years, and now someone is carelessly mucking it up right and left rapidly since Target. A shame.
Again, if their corp goal is a focus on a glamour WASP college student, there are ways to do that without clunkily alienating core shoppers too. I’m a size 6 and have some old Lillys i acquired at vintage, and other non-print and autumn Lilly items from test shopping. But I think these now seemingly regular critical thinking goofs will make me (and others) start to keep a beady eye on whether or not someone is going to thoughtlessly mangle the golden goose. It happens.
Very interesting post. Thanks for sharing all of that!
Weren’t her first dresses made of curtains or tablecloths?
I love the colors of Lilly. I get mine from EBay because of the cost, but it definitely fits the summer Southern atmosphere. Going to the beach or lake (and in the area of Mississippi where I was brought up, everyone heads to the lakes / rivers on weekends), lots of flowers (like Grandma had) – it’s just happy memories.
Thank you for that very informative post! And I know I’m going to get lambasted for this, but having grown up as “middle-middle class” and married into upper middle class WASP-ey society, my observation has been that the women who love these dresses and have the money to buy them….well, honestly they are just more educated, more physically active (tennis, anyone?), very informed about nutrition, and can afford nutritious food. It’s not as if it’s some evil, anorexic, fat-shaming sub-culture.
ava7 –I agree. I’ve hung out with serious multi-generational LP wearers at polo clubs, at venues like Keeneland and Churchill, at some lovely places on the seaboard, in Palm Beach while on another assignment, in Boston, in Charleston, etc. Just nice, educated active women taking normal care of themselves and their families — not some “wicked fat-shaming subculture” as you put it. No Goopy overtones at all. That’s why this is such a shame for the brand to have this as its next PR moment after the Target size thing.
“Ms. Pulitzer created her print dresses to hide fruit juice stains when she decided to sell fruit at a stand ”
Very interesting! thank you for your post!
I’m not thrilled with the stuff that one employee had in her work space, but it’s not like the company was marketing a line of T-shirts with that stuff on it. Of course, I was sent to HR because my co-worker found my “Keep Calm And Spank Me Hard” mug sexually harassing. I explained that I was not talking to her, but that didn’t help. As long as LP keeps making garden party camo and doesn’t start a line of Size Two Or Bust T shirts, I”m okay with it. Not my style anyway.
“Garden party camo” love it!
It’s funny the excuses people are making and I’m actually surprised. Since we are making assumptions and excuses let’s add this- if you notice beside these pictures there is another that says “just saying” I would say this is more how this person feels in everyday life than using this as weight loss motivation. (People use “just saying” all the time to lighten something negative they are aiming at someone else- oh just saying.) I mean seriously? Weight loss motivation? Since when does “kill yourself” have anything to do with motivation? Maybe it’s my Psych background but if you are using motivators like that please talk to someone. That is not ok or healthy. I could careless if this person dislikes fat people, that is their buisness and issue to work out- not mine, but I do believe in having respect for the people around you. We have no idea why these photos are up or the motivation behind them but I guarantee if this was a picture of a skinny woman, with bones sticking out with the same wording people would be up in arms. Think about it. Think about our society. Fat shaming and hate is perfectly accepted.
I know personally I have a sense of humor others might not appreciate , and I am very sarcastic but I keep it to myself in certain enviroments. Just like this – save it for somewhere else. Not cool. And I don’t think that its always about people “getting offended to just get offended” because you don’t have to be offended to think this is in POOR TASTE. I’m not offended but it’s still not cool. I also feel for the women or men that might be over weight or see themselves that way who are subjected to this everyday. It’s not always as easy as just speaking up in a work environment.
I totally agree. I mean people are saying the photographer is to blame for taking the picture.
all the defenders of this person’s choice of “art” -you do realize this is a cubicle, other employees see these illustrations. daily.
also, it isn’t approriate because it sends a message that most brands would never want to be associated with publicly.
actually, many many reasons why this would be considered inappropriate at a place of business.
I agree!
If someone at her working place had a problem with those cartoons, she’d be in all her right to go and talk to her about it.
Anonymous twitter users who don’t even know your name and might live in the other side of the planet? That’s a stretch.
It really depends on the corporate environment. If it’s a lax environment no one would bat an eye at that. You can’t say what is or isn’t appropriate without knowing the environment.
People are offended by a couple of cartoons a random woman has on her working cubicle?
I wonder if these people ever have time to be happy being offended by the most insignificant things.
Omg, YES! Agree with you!
Well, speaking just for myself, I am able to remain happy and grin at puppies while also looking at the cartoons as a stupid PR gaffe affecting a company’s business and women who shopped the firm thinking the firm was their “friend” so to speak. Economics. I am able to think it could be a typical co-worker joke, for snarky fun, sure. BUT it wasn’t on someone’s fridge at home. It was in an office welcoming a reporting team. Dumb move, period, when your job is selling a product to women of many sizes. You can be laughing at the art with a coworker, inside joke, funny — but, seriously, use the critical thinking part of your brain and don’t post it. This isn’t your high school locker, your fridge, or your instagram. It’s work.
It was dumb not to scrub for a PR walk-through. People’s livelihoods depend on good business PR, from the person at the desk to a warehouse packer with a mortgage, medical bills and three kids. That is why displaying the cartoons is, to me, IMO, a stupid thing. Nothing to be happy about if you mess up business by doing something dumb that gets public attention in this way and people get laid off if this causes sales to drop.
Great point.
Oh, it was stupid to have that up there while they were visiting. That is without questioning. I’m talking about the people who act offended by this.
Josefa, I do know what you mean; they are just silly pictures really, if you saw them out of context, so why be offended. Cartoons like any other, a joke, move on. I would usually agree.
But I think some people here (like me) may feel worried about the person who hung them in light of the “probably kill yourself” wording. I once inherited a lovely employee who needed serious care, who had very similar things on her home fridge. The images, the words. She was anorexic, nervous, compulsively working out in the company gym instead of working, and she was depressed, etc.. We all had to step in to help her, fearing for her life. So there’s that. Self loathing can be hidden under jokes, but it can still indicate a problem.
If that is not the case, then it’s a possible comment on customers, or women of a certain body type, and that can seriously hurt a LP customer who may identify with the image. She’s going along her day happily. wore her Lilly on the weekend, and then turns to the news, and sees this. She may laugh. Or be crushed and alienated. She was just a private person who liked LP, and felt happy, and now she’s embarrassed about her body, even tho the shift styles are perfect for her, etc.
With everything else going on in the world I am gobsmacked that this is news, or that anyone even cares.
The cartoons weren’t in a “personal” workspace, they were in an employment workspace. The employee should have kept the cartoons at home and used work appropriate motivationals at her place of employment.
I got into trouble at work for having a flip-through type of photo album at my desk. It was for individual pictures, and the photograph that I had showing was of a guy I liked playing with a wolf hybrid.
But because it also had a photo, inside and not shown, of when I went to a male stripper show – just a picture of me fully clothed between two male strippers who had pants on but were topless – and I made the mistake of showing it to a friend when other busybodies could hear us talking, I was told to remove it from my cubicle.
There is no way that type of “cartoon” would ever be allowed anywhere I have worked. I don’t understand how they got away with it.
They went up to an xxl/18 in store. It isn’t the same as an 18w though.
It continues to floor me that a simple shift pattern (sewing 101), made up in a floral fabric easily found at any fabric store turned into a billion dollar company.
“I go for darker, androgynous clothes.” YAAAAS! Helmut Lang, girlfriend.
Unless YOU want someone telling you what photos you can and cannot have in your own personal workspace, I suggest you mind your own business. Thought policing is not cool.
But where do you draw the line? And considering a drawn picture or photograph innapropriate in a professional setting isn’t thought policing. It’s not as if someone’s trying to control your thoughts, but just encourage a productive workspace. A photo or drawing are not thoughts, but objects.
We actually do. HR keeps us on our toes with that stuff.
You mean HR does try to thought police? This is very interesting. I’ve never worked at a large corporation. Any way you slice it, I feel for this girl. I hope she at least is able to remain anonymous.
It’s not thought policing, it’s policing what is up on a board in a public workspace. Like it or not, all workspaces are public and are subject to scrutiny with no expectation of privacy.
Your own personal workspace is one thing — and that space is located in your home or the space you personally pay rent on. Fill it up with anything! Go for it. Who cares? It is yours.
But this is the company’s workspace, not her private world. It’s where this person had something hanging on a press-walk day that proved damaging to her company. Think about it: Of all the things she could draw, or letter, or hang, she elected to post a little showing of work mocking certain kinds of women, in a company that clothes women, all kinds of women. Women who ultimately are the ones who paying her to sit there, investing in her.
Why did she feel so at ease hanging this up inside LP? Why those particular drawings? Why that topic? Why two, not even just one? One is a joke, two starts to become a thought theme. Why? What made that art relevant to her to explore twice, and relevant enough to her to hang in her workspace? So relevant, that she wanted to see it daily on the edge of a work mood-board space? Think about that for a minute. Does it say something about the company too?
Now turn it around: say you work with a guy who has his cube decorated with cartoons suggesting certain shaped women should kill themselves. That’s how he spends his time –drawing curvy women and writing “kill yourself.” Ha ha ha! He’s just fun. Leave him alone. Hey, want to go drinking with him? Maybe date him? He’s just funny John! You two should hook up. Wait you’re not TOO curvy, right? He doesn’t like ’em too curvy.
That art could also be demeaning to outside business vendors or clients walking through to a meeting, the way this guy walked through. You think all vendors have humor? Nope.
This is about business. Not thought police. Because: look what’s happened to LP.
Agreed. I am a size 6 and I would not feel comfortable if my coworker had this up I their cube for me and other coworkers to see daily. Am I easily offended? No, but that’s just not something I’d want to see everyday and I’d think poorly of whoever thought it was important enough and “funny” enough to hang in their cube. Most of the time if you have jokes or comics up in your cube then they are going to relate to your job in some way so if this too relates to her job then there is something very wrong in that workplace culture.
To the ‘stop being so sensitive and offended’ people, take your own advice and chill out. There’s nothing wrong with people expressing their disapproval with fat shaming and suicide ‘jokes’. Nor is there anything wrong with deciding that you will or won’t buy from a company based on their corporate culture.
I don’t make any apologies for trying to be conscientious about how and where I spend my money.
All it takes is one person to be offended and here comes the lawsuit. The office manager needs to get a clue and ban anything that is derogatory. Your personal space is called home, not work.
I agree…people need to chill.
Kate is stunning in that dress. Wow.
I can’t waste any energy being mad about this. Yeah, the cartoons are horrid, but I feel sorry for the person who found them inspirational. That person probably has horrible self esteem and is miserable.
If this was in eyeshot of anywhere near where a non-employee could see it…this was incredibly stupid. Any supervisor in their right mind would have asked to have those drawing taken down immediately.
Being a clothing company and knowing how aware the public is about the fashion industries ideals on the perfect female body-type…anything that would even mildly substantiate that stereotype would be on the sidewalk.
The reporter is shit-stirring, but it’s rather telling that a fashion company allows that kind of material to be visible to the public eye. My workplace has pretty strict rules about what we post that’s viewable to others, and that kind of content would definitely not be allowed.
Yeah…No. that’s not particularly professional. I try to remember that I am just a squatter in my work space. I do not own it, the company does, therefore anything I put up can be reflective of my company. Do i still have snarky ecards up? Absolutely, but they are by no means mentioning killing ones self or shaming any particulary group of people. Theres a way to decorate your space and still be professional about it.
Also I know when visitors are in the building just as this employee would have known. I mean really…a fashion company having up signs about people being overweight is just low hanging fruit. That employee should have known better and that supervisor should have said something before a mag showed up…
When I saw the pictures of the workspace cartoons, I immediately thought that the worker must be a regular at another bitchy gossip site that regularly puts down overweight people. “Carb face” and “just sayin'” are oft used phrases there – really surprised that the word “Frau” wasn’t up there, too. I used to go there a lot, but found all the misogyny really off-putting.
Perhaps the cartoons are intense…for the workplace. But if we’re honest with each other here…to care about your body image and to cast shade on others doesn’t necessarily mean you’re full of self-hate or self-doubt. Maybe she just thinks fat = gross. A lot of people in a lot of different workplaces do. I mean…I suppose if I’m being honest I’d rather kill myself than be fat.
Yeah, actually, it does. Because those of us who are happy and self-confident with who we are don’t define ourselves by the body or feel the need to validate our sense of beauty by degrading others regardless if we find them attractive or not. I’ve been both very fat and very thin in my life. Right now, thanks to college schedules and medication, I’m about twenty pounds heavier than my usual, and I’m fine. I don’t feel ugly. I don’t feel “fat.” I don’t feel inherently less valuable than I did in a smaller jean size. Frankly, I think I’m pretty awesome, and if my size isn’t what you want, there are seven billion plus fish in the sea who might think otherwise. Besides, I’ve got a doctorate to work on, AND I work in a hospital and see shit that convinces me that there are far worse things than weight gain that can happen to a body, so you know, PRIORITIES. If I lose weight later, great. If not, also great, because I love who I am, and I could care less about how others view the instrument that is mine alone to utilize.
So your honesty? Makes me roll my eyes. Because holy sh*t at how pitiful it would be to waste a life over adipose tissue.
I mean…I suppose if I’m being honest I’d rather kill myself than be fat.
let´s hope you´ll never get a desease , because , in your perspective , fat is “evil and the worse scorge in the earth…
Let´s see how you age and accept your body changing and no matter who much your diet or exercise you´ll never be considered attractive, you´ll never be young again and you turn ” the invisible woman to the other people who think in this similar terms.
With your school of “Though” way to see this issues , it would be a hard path
Listen Skinny women everywhere (including the fashion houses who praise skinny women and fat shame plus size girls.) The plus size girls are out there modeling, looking good and loving their curves. Sorry if you skinny girls can’t handle it, but us plus size girls are here to stay.
P.S. To all you skinny models I would rather be beautiful and curvy, then be flat high way. if you think fat shaming is the way to go by telling plus size women to kill themselves then you are the most ignorant people on earth. you make me sick. To you miss pulitzer you are the most ignorant one of all for letting this go on in your fashion house. So if you don’t want the backlash reign in your employees and their ignorance.
Lilly Pulitzer passed away in 2013 at age 81. She was not ignorant. And skinny shaming is just as bad as fat shaming. Women come in all shapes and sizes and no one should be shaming anyone.