Mary Kate and Ashley Olsen ended their teen years with more money than most of us could possibly spend in several lifetimes. They only grew wealthier after launching their fashion empire with three centerpiece lines, with the most luxurious of all being The Row. The Olsen twins’ clothing comes at a hefty price, but they’ve always justified the expense by keeping their production stateside. They don’t use overseas factories or sweatshops, which is admirable and a rarity in any business today.
Unfortunately, a new class-action lawsuit says the Olsen twins’ company, Dualstar, treats its interns terribly. They are expected to work harder than regular employees, and they don’t get paid. The point of an internship is to learn for future employment, but it sounds like these interns were only doing extreme manual labor and gruntwork. Lead plaintiff Shahista Lalani says she met the Olsen twins a few times, and “they were never mean to anyone. They’re business people.” But behind the scenes, Lalani says the internship was a terrible experience, and she received no pay or academic credit:
The class-action suit, which alleges wage theft, says the 29-year-old celebs failed to pay about 40 past and present interns who have worked for them.
The lead plaintiff in the Manhattan Supreme Court case is former design intern Shahista Lalani, who says she was treated poorly, toiling for free doing menial tasks at the twins’ Dualstar Entertainment Group in 2012.
The Parsons School of Design grad worked in Manhattan under the head technical designer for the Olsens’ fashion label, The Row, for five months.
“She was very demanding,” Lalani recalled. “I was doing the work of three interns. I was talking to her all day, all night. E-mails at nighttime for the next day, like 10 p.m. at night.”
Lalani claims she was hospitalized for dehydration because of the job’s demands. “It was like 100 degrees outside. I’d just be sweating to death. I probably carried like 50 pounds worth of trench coats,” to Row factories, she said.
The Canadian native put in 50-hour weeks “inputting data into spreadsheets, making tech sheets, running personal errands for paid employees, organizing materials, photocopying, sewing, pattern cutting, among other related duties,” according to court papers.
“When we weren’t doing something, they’d be like, ‘Organize the buttons in the back by color code.’ You’re cleaning. You don’t get a set 15-minute break. You just go with their crazy flow. You just [got] caught up in the pressure,” Lalani claims.
“You’re like an employee, except you’re not getting paid. They’re kind of mean to you. Other interns have cried. I’d see a lot of kids crying doing coffee runs, photocopying stuff.”
[From Page Six]
This story makes me feel differently about the Olsens as businesswomen. Unpaid internships are part of a large systemic problem too. The only people who can afford to work for free are already well off, so they can gain the (perceived) experience or resumé notches. Whereas the kids who are saddled with student loans and no trust fund have to immediately enter entry-level positions with little-to-no upward mobility. Mary-Kate and Ashley’s interns don’t even seem to be gaining experience. If these allegations are true, the twins are taking advantage of their interns.
Dualstar issued a statement to USA Today, saying, “The allegations in the complaint filed against Dualstar are groundless, and Dualstar will vigorously defend itself against plaintiff’s claims in court, not before the media.” The company feels the lawsuit will be dismissed when the facts are revealed.
P.S. I somehow missed these photos of Mary-Kate picking nits out of Olivier Sarkozy’s hair.
Photos courtesy of WENN
They look like death in the first photo, like someone sucked all the life outta them.
Ashley has suffered really badly with Lyme disease.
Don’t know about Mary Kate but I would imagine both she and her sister have really worked hard since their childhood days. It’s hard to see them properly anyway beyond the clothes and makeup, but they’ve always had this gothicy kinda aesthetic.
If i remember right that was a rumor started by Radar online the twins never confirmed it to be true. Not to mention the twins have look like death for the last couple of years.
Really, Neah? I never knew that wasn’t confirmed. My bad.
Off topic: I know Mary-Kate has had some struggles, but can she run a damn comb through her hair?! Every time I see a picture of her it looks greased to her head.
This is common with child stars. Many NEVER washed their own hair. They never really learned. They would have it professionally done and styled almost every day for their job. When she turned 17 she got out of the business and had realized she didn’t know how to wash her own hair.
A friend disclosed they were a child star and this is the norm. Still is too. Loads of stories of celebs (KStew, JSimpson, handfull of others) have stories from stylists their teeth, hair, and nails are all dirty and always need cleaning.
1 of those crazy, but true stories.
Blech! How crazy and kind of sad too! No wonder so many have problems when they become adults, they weren’t taught basic survival skills as kids.
Huh… Interesting theory
Wow.
littlestar
Most did have the skills unlike the twins that worked from babies onward.
They just never had to use them for years and stopped. Or were told to not do this of that because it would mess up what the stylist wanted.
The 1 highlight of all the terribleness…. Shelley Long is freaking amazing.
Interns are supposed to do the menial tasks- that’s the job! This woman seemed to have high expectations of what she’d be doing. I would think anyone who has work their way up in the fashion industry has spent time “sorting buttons” at some point.
However, interns should ABSOLUTELY get paid. There is no excuse for not paying them, they are there working and contributing to the business, and deserve compensation.
Dualstar must be worth a ton of money too, they could easily pay them minimum wage at the very least.
Ugh – this lady needs to take a seat. She was lucky to land that internship, as the competition is fierce at the major companies. It’s possible she was paid in “perks” like clothes or access to events, and she knew what she was signing up for. Now, instead of soaking up all the experience she could, she’s suing and basically sinking her career before it has started.
We all paid our dues – and yes, even as an assistant I was expected to run around Manhattan carrying samples, ordering lunch for the execs, straightening the showroom and yes, organizing buttons by size and color. Did I think a lot of it was beneath my intelligence? Sure…but that stuff has to get done, and I was low woman on the totem pole. I made the most of it and parlayed that into a full time job at a top fashion house.
Fashion is a constantly moving industry and the hours are long. Especially if you’re up against constant deadlines, demanding retailers and time zone differences. Gah, this stuff really bothers me. My husband is still in the industry, and on top of the long hours, he travels almost constantly. We are used to it – it’s part of the job. Sounds like this woman found out early that it’s not for her.
@ Shannon1972
Last time I checked one gets paid for working. Yes, interns still learn. But when interns do create spreadsheets and copy stuff and carry stuff from a to b then this is work that should be paid. Because if the company had no interns then they would have to employ somebody to do these things. But instead they choose to exploit an intern for essential jobs.
Even a cleaner gets paid. And nobody can tell me that an intern doing cleaning shouldn’t get paid because he or she is an intern. Bull***t.
Actually, legally interns are supposed to do work that is meaningful and contributes to their education, and are not supposed to do grunt work that should be done by a paid employee or which would displace a paid worker. Otherwise it is pretty much slave labor. The law takes this pretty seriously.
Also: internships typically open the door to those low paying entry level jobs. So actually the kids saddled with educational debt and no trust funds to fall back on are often barred from breaking in on any level. It’s a huge systemic problem.
Shannon, actually what Dualstar did is against the law. The Supreme Court ruled on internships in 2012 I believe, and there are many requirements that MUST be met in order to not pay someone for their work. From the Dept. of Labor:
http://www.dol.gov/whd/regs/compliance/whdfs71.htm
*The internship, even though it includes actual operation of the facilities of the employer, is similar to training which would be given in an educational environment;
*The internship experience is for the benefit of the intern;
*The intern does not displace regular employees, but works under close supervision of existing staff;
*The employer that provides the training derives no immediate advantage from the activities of the intern; and on occasion its operations may actually be impeded;
*The intern is not necessarily entitled to a job at the conclusion of the internship; and
*The employer and the intern understand that the intern is not entitled to wages for the time spent in the internship.
Oh goodness. You’re both completely missing the point…interns gain access and real world experience. Fashion jobs are not glitz and glamour – most of it is decidedly not. They involve creating tons of spreadsheets, copying, sorting, lugging, tracking. They see the process firsthand and can tailor their education accordingly, or perhaps realize it isn’t what they thought it was. You get out what you put in. It is not slave labor…that’s absurd.
They meet people they would likely not meet without the internship. Have the opportunity to create relationships with the very people who can help them. No seasoned designer is just going to hand a collection over to an intern. That’s just not going to happen. Everyone has to start somewhere, and access is key.
Miss Jupitero is 100% right: — legally, interns are supposed to work that is meaningful and educational, and not merely tasks that could be performed by paid staff. A legal internship has to supply educational benefits versus just get bodies in for free to do the stuff no one else wishes to do.. Now, they can still say “being in here and listening to people talk is educational” but, they MUST consider the U.S. Dept. Of Labor’s WHD Fact Sheet #17 language:
There are some circumstances under which individuals who participate in “for-profit” private sector internships or training programs may do so without compensation. The Supreme Court has held that the term “suffer or permit to work” cannot be interpreted so as to make a person whose work serves only his or her own interest an employee of another who provides aid or instruction. This may apply to interns who receive training for their own educational benefit if the training meets certain criteria. The determination of whether an internship or training program meets this exclusion depends upon all of the facts and circumstances of each such program.
The following six criteria must be applied when making this determination:
The internship, even though it includes actual operation of the facilities of the employer, is similar to training which would be given in an educational environment;
The internship experience is for the benefit of the intern;
The intern does not displace regular employees, but works under close supervision of existing staff;
The employer that provides the training derives no immediate advantage from the activities of the intern; and on occasion its operations may actually be impeded;
The intern is not necessarily entitled to a job at the conclusion of the internship; and
The employer and the intern understand that the intern is not entitled to wages for the time spent in the internship.
If all of the factors listed above are met, an employment relationship does not exist under the FLSA, and the Act’s minimum wage and overtime provisions do not apply to the intern. This exclusion from the definition of employment is necessarily quite narrow because the FLSA’s definition of “employ” is very broad. Some of the most commonly discussed factors for “for-profit” private sector internship programs are considered below.
Whole thing is here: http://www.dol.gov/whd/regs/compliance/whdfs71.htm
I was an intern, albeit a paid one, and got fantastic experience that helped throughout my life. So, I’ve always made sure interns in my places of work had meaningful experiences and learned, and were not just used as mules. And yes, I worked in the fashion industry too, which treats interns roughly. Normally though it is fun and you are respected and learning. This sounds like it may have been that sort of mid-level bytchery in which some people think they got a servant, not an intern. It happens, and usually someone above corrects the situation.
This lawsuit would not be happening if they had paid her at least minimum wage for the 50 hours a week she had to work. The argument about the type of work performed becomes secondary , but it sounds like she is setting up the argument that the work could not be justified as training for her career.
This is pure greed on the Olsons’ part. It is their business and they are too busy flitting around the world instead of making sure people at their companies get paid. I don’t care if they aren’t running the day to day aspect, they still profit from this abuse.
No one should work for free at a for profit business. Companies are too greedy to not abuse unpaid internships. Time and time again this happens.
I understand what you are all saying, and having been an intern myself once upon a time, I’m familiar with the law. Maybe I am not making my point clearly…what this woman was doing is what a fashion job *is*. What else is she supposed to be learning? Does she want practical experience that can translate into real world skills? Otherwise why bother?
@Pondering Thoughts, @Miss Jupitero, @Tiffany and @Liberty, yes, exactly. The entire point of an internship, as opposed to a job, is that the two are fundamentally different. An internship is *primarily*, *thoroughly*, *necessarily* educational, while a job *can* be educational. The fact that the two have been conflated for a long time doesn’t mean that they are the same or that treating them as such is ethical. The fact that internships have been unpaid for a long time, even when they are actual internships and not merely jobs disguised as internships, doesn’t mean that is ethical either.
Oh goodness, I owe you all an apology. You’re making very good, well researched points and I’m just raging here. Sorry…I’m upset about something else completely and just taking out my frustrations on complete strangers. I’ve got my back up about something that is close to my heart…I always wanted to work in fashion and I love the industry. Warts and all. But I’m not making myself clear, and that isn’t going to happen. I just don’t feel I’m capable of fully rational thought. It’s much more satisfying to just yell.
But I’m not going to have a rational discussion today. I’m bowing out here. I made some crazy points below…ignore them please. Thank you. No more commenting for me today.
Fille/PT.Lib/MissJup/ et al
I did my internship/clinicals. For a time it was grunt work. 65 hours (if not more) a week of grunt work plus classes. Not 65 hours I had to put in, but 65 hours was needed to do the job correctly and well. It sucked and my health suffered as did the others in my position.
But! We did receive credits and made connections on top of understanding the work environment and skills applied. If these interns didn’t and only got grunt work tasks it’s bs. They’re due something.
And when my fellow interns and I got dehydrated and lightheaded we were given water and saltines, but it was frowned upon as weakness of not being conditioned to keep up. A terrible system of slave labor in many cases.
@ Florc
Nope, grunt work is not part of internships. If you did do that during your internship then you have been exploited. And making people working 65 hours / week is ILLEGAL in most civilised countries. Especially if you are expected to do classes additionally. I can’t imagine that any professional can work 13 hours a day (5-day week or 9 hours a day in a 6-day-week) and do additional educational classes AND do his job properly.
If an internship includes grunt work then the intern should get paid. I understand that sometimes grunt work might be part of an internship and then it must get paid.
There is one more point that should be made.
Many here have apparently done unpaid internships which included or merely disguised grunt work. I understand that it is sometimes hard to admit that one might have gotten exploited. But that doesn’t mean the next generation should have to suffer the same kind of exploitation.
So please, everybody who was exploited during his or her internship should NOT recommend the next generation should suffer the same.
@ Shannon 1972
The two paragraphs above apply to you in particular.
If you want to enforce the laws that protect interns, it needs to start with the White House. For many years the White House has a summer internship program, it is unpaid and no college credits. A friend of mine’s son, had the privilege of getting a spot. He said the best thing that comes our of it is that you put it on his resume. Half the time it is called camp and the other time is grunt work.
It is internship for kids who don’t need earn money over the summer. MY friend paid for all his expenses, cost her about $6,000 for the summer. My friend’s son said they should at least give credit and a stipend for living expenses.
Pondering Thoughts
I know you’re correct, but using interns for grunt work and working longer hours is done often. And even to full time employees. If you clock out because your time is reached, but you have not finished your cases for the day it’s only going to hurt you. Just like in most jobs. You end up working on your own time and not billing in those hours. It appears to be inefficient.
I have a really great job now. It’s awful to type out, but I would not have it if I didn’t let myself slip into the intern exploitation. It’s a risk and it’s wrong, but it will take decades of fighting it to get it discontinued.
Even now some get asked to finish or fix reports in emails on friday night and have them ready for monday morning. If they worked anymore it would go into OT, but would 1st be deducted from their sick/personal days/hours. So they just don’t file the hours worked. It’s illegal practice, but who’s going to police them?
@shannon – totally agree with you. People would kill for an opportunity like that. I myself had to do all those things as an intern when I started out. N9body would hire me without that experience. Except once my hours were done for the day, I was done for the day. Nobody from work ever called me at 10:00 at night. That would have been weird
There are two schools of thought on the interns task matter, one is that they should do grunt work that no one wants to do and one is that they should be doing more meaningful stuff. The problem with the grunt work belief is that lots of companies abuse the concept and basically make it what this woman is alleging – they use interns instead of hiring paid employees.
Internships are supposed to be about gaining experience not doing grunt work. That’s the whole point of having laws allowing unpaid internships. The idea is that you don’t get paid but you gain valuable experience. Having an intern do grunt work is an abuse of the system. Many companies no longer use unpaid interns due to class action lawsuits like this. Hopefully lawsuits against the fashion industry puts an end to these kinds of abuses of internships. Every intern forced to work 50 hours for no pay is taking paying work away from someone else.
@ Betsy
Thank you!
Though the problem is that interns do both grunt work and they do meaningful stuff even if it is a company with a decent employment record.
Just I never get why interns shouldn’t get paid. Usually they do necessary stuff and even if they are a bit slower than an accomplished employee then the solution is to simply pay them less.
WR, that’s how it works where I work. As I said below, the interns are treated very well and do gain valuable experience in how a non-profit operates. We have very little money and a tiny staff so our entire teams tends to pitch in wherever necessary. I have even had to clean the toilet on occasion as the second newest member of the team but we would never ask one of our interns to do it.
Despite our mysoginistic, homophobic, embarrassing Prime Minister, I am so glad to live in Australia! The internships as described here are illegal! in my state, at least. “Work Experience” that Year 10 students do, is unpaid, but they only do that for two weeks, and some employers are generous enough to give a little something at the end of that time. Many employers give prospective employees a “trial” period, to ascertain their suitability, which can last from one day to two weeks. It is illegal to not pay them, though, even if they work only one hour. If one is in a workplace and “working” in any capacity, then it is illegal to not pay that person. There are schemes where the employer can get government subsidies, for traineeships, for example, but the worker – trainee or not – MUST be paid. Further, we operate on the 38-hour work week. Anything after that must be paid at overtime rates. The only interns who are not paid (that I know of, through personal experience) are trainee teachers. This is because they are doing their practicum in government or private schools rather than private business enterprise, and actually gaining “real world” skills, experience and mentoring, and often, their final practicum leads to a job offer.
Other people who are not paid are those who are on a court order to perform some sort of community service.
I can’t believe that workers in the U.S. are exploited like this. A huge company like this Dualstar group could afford to pay any person who is working there, no matter the title they choose to give that person.
Interns are there to do the menial tasks and work the undesirable hours. It’s one way the higher-ups know a person is committed to getting the job done.
I personally don’t mind unpaid internships. I think for many people they are an excellent way to get a foot in the door and get noticed for bigger and better things. My husband did an unpaid internship in law school, and the company was so impressed by the end, they gave him a totally unexpected bonus check and (way more importantly) an offer of employment upon graduation. Did it absolutely suck paying for all household expenditures on my salary alone for awhile? You bet, but because of a little sacrifice then, we have a great life now. I just think too many people get caught up in the right now, and don’t bother to think about the big picture.
@ Goats on the Roof
Not every intern has a spouse who can pay.
And just because your husband apparently didn’t negotiate well enough to secure a paid internship that doesn’t mean that your husband wasn’t exploited. Fact is he did meaningful work but didn’t get paid. And you should not glorify your husbands exploitation.
@Pondering
The tone of your comment was rude and unnecessary.
1. My husband was finishing up law school as the economy was in the shitter, so there was no negotiating a paid internship. Law firms were really trimming the fat, and he was lucky to get what he did.
2. My husband will be the first to tell you that working his internship did him nothing but good. When he was hired on, he knew how things worked from the bottom up because he’d done it himself. That kind of experience is invaluable.
3. His single unpaid internship led to a full-time paid gig when law jobs were difficult to come by (not saying it’s a cakewalk now) at a company that pays extremely well in salary, plus they take care of his law school loans. What you so snidely write off as exploitation, we call the best damn investment he could have made in his future.
The issue isn’t that the internship didn’t do your husband any good. It’s that the only reason it did him any good is that he was economically privileged enough to be able to intern without pay. It’s hardly acceptable that people who were and are as talented as him or even people who are immensely more talented than he ever was or could be, but who did not and do not have the same economic privilege he did, were and are not afforded the same opportunity he was. It’s hardly acceptable that, had he not had enough economic privilege, he would not have been afforded the opportunity he was to demonstrate his talent. That is a way of doing things that primarily rewards privilege, not talent.
@ Goats on the roof
Your comments are exceptionally belittle-ing to anybody from a poorer family. Your tone is unbelieveably rude.
Your glorify abuse and exploitation of interns.
You can refer to the exploitation of your husband in whatever terms you like, you call it “investment”. Basically you glorify abuse and exploitation and you should do the decent thing and accept that part of your husbands career. See, slaves were exploited, too, and just because one or two of them might have become foremen that doesn’t mean abuse is justified.
So just because your husband did well after having been exploited as an intern that doesn’t mean hiring interns instead of employees is acceptable.
Please don’t just think of yourself but try to see the bigger picture. That is decency.
The IRS, the U.S. Department of Labor, and many state labor offices have decreed that internships are supposed to be an academic or educational experience primarily for the benefit of the student. Private sector employees cannot use unpaid internships as a way of avoiding hiring and paying an employee or solely to complete menial, tiresome tasks like copying, filing, or running errands. Both the Feds and states have been cracking down on companies that take advantage of unpaid interns or creating internship programs that offer essentially no academic or training benefit to the students. But the Olsens’ insurance company will likely settle the claims, and the interns named in the suit will almost certainly never work in fashion again.
It does sound like they are trying to crack down on it and really define the difference between an educational internship and what at its core is really just a temporary job for an unskilled worker looking to get a foot in the door of an industry.
The only situation I’d be OK saying should be unpaid is the truest definition of educational internship. And I imagine those are extremely hard to find.
This is making me ragey. There are something like 40 interns backing this lawsuit, not just one woman who “needs to take a seat.” My background is in publishing. It is still common for literary agents to “hire” young women (usually female – publishing has been called a “women’s ghetto”) to do sh*t work for no pay. Mommy and Daddy from Fairfield support them while they toil at their pretend jobs in New York. Personally I think it is reprehensible to have someone work at least 40 hours a week for you and pay them NOTHING because it’s supposed to be such a great experience. Does it really look good on a resume to be exploited for several months making coffee and reading slush pile submissions? (Or sorting buttons by color?) The Olsens are clearly avoiding paying wages to a lot of people and it’s exploitative. “Paying your dues” should not mean not getting paid.
Why do the twins always look and pose like Death Eaters? And who works as an intern and expects to get paid? That’s the point right? Either you have some kind of written agreement/contract for work with pay or you agree to work for “experience”.
I also thought paid internships were common. I know of plenty of people who couldn’t afford to work for free but did it anyway for the experience. Often they do lead to paid positions. As you said, that’s the point.
The only thing I take issue with is the long hours. I work for a non-profit that employs unpaid interns and I have to say we treat them with kid gloves. I actually think we can and should work them a little harder so they get a better taste of what the actual work is really like. In any case, it’s not like they are working for free indefinitely — we only employ them for a semester or summer at a time.
I am totally against unpaid internships. Doesn’t need to be a big salary, but people should and must get paid for work provided. If you want to be unpaid, then you volunteer. I had a two year internship out of university, very useful for my career, and I was paid a minimum – enough to pay for rent and food, and minimum payments on my student loans. My mom helped me out with the car. I’d say that’s fair.
There was an article in the newspaper here in Geneva the other day about an unpaid intern at the UN who didn’t have enough money for housing so he was living in a tent by the lake. Unacceptable. If internships remain unpaid, it creates a disparity where only the wealthy and connected get chances as they are the only ones who can afford such experiences and opportunities
Edit: it’s different if the internship is part of a school program for credit, like some college and university programs offer. Then it’s part of their school fees or whatever, so that’s a different story.
Hav en’t read it, but secondhand I heard that the point of the ex-intern’s case is that fashion internships, like almost all internships in Europe, have turned into near-slavery. Remember the banking intern in England who died of a heart attack a couple of years ago after working round the clock a day or two? Now it isn’t uncommon for Europeans after university to to 2 or 3 or 4 unpaid internships and to work long hours, do undignified and difficult work, because their employers and the laws allow this to happen not because they deserve it or because they are learning anything. And this happens more in the US than we want to admit, also. She wrote it as a wake up piece to others who think that this kind of groveling is good to teach the young’uns a lesson. THERE ARE NO JOBS. IT”S 2015. That’s why graduates take these internships, not to learn how to be humble or how to empty wastebackets.
I couldn’t do internships in college because I couldn’t afford to work for free. I had zero financial support from my parents because they had no money. I struggled to get work after college and had to move from the East to West coast because my brother and sister in law were close friends with a manager at the company she worked at so he gave me a job. My sister was never able to get into her desired field because she couldn’t do unpaid internships. Paid internships give everyone equal opportunities regardless of financial background.
+1000000 typical multi millionaires and they can’t be bothered paying people the minimum wage. This makes me sick. This is which the rich keep getting richer and the poor get poorer. All this ‘oh work for nothing now and you might get a job in the future’ is just taking advantage of people and only benefits those rich enough to be able to live without pay in the meantime. JERKS
@ Deborah, tallo, WR
I so agree with you. Pay interns!
Both girls have had their struggles but they do seem to have a rep for being difficult. They both give off a hard vibe. I guess that’s what child stardom does to you in the end.
Did both of them suffer from eating disorders? I know one has been public about it.
as a fashion graduate, I studied in Cape Town and when my study visa ended last year I had to come back to Mozambique where there is no fashion industry whatsoever. So I’m working in something completely unrelated. Part of me REALLY wants to travel and work in the industry and gain experience as a paid intern/assistant and grow into the business i studied so hard for, but now it feels a bit pointless.
On the other hand, I have always dreaded those months or years of unpaid work the fashion industry is so well known for (even in South Africa), because I am no longer a baby who can rely on her parents to help out, I’m 29 and I need to sustain myself…
So I feel terrible about all these stories I hear about the horrors of interning in a fashion business, for long, impossible hours AND for free, but at the same time I’m weirdly fascinated by the idea of doing it even for a little while. There is always value. You always learn something. but not for too long though…
I’m constantly torn between my dream of moving overseas and working in the industry, and the safety of being home, and hopefully find time to work on what I have studied for, which was to be a fashion designer.
Anyway… I am so sorry for these interns, and this, once again, makes me feel I’m in a safe place here in my country, working for someone else and being paid for it… Even if it doesn’t bring me much happiness….
Hi Mimz
Very interesting reading your story. I’m also doing a job that’s not in my passion area. I don’t have your excuses or reasons though as I’m in London.
I really hope you find the amazing job in fashion that you love and that I know you deserve. Studying in South Africa must have been awesome.
Wishing you lots of luck!
Thanks Bluebell…. Yes Life sometimes puts us in situations where we must make the safest choices for a while, but the danger lies in getting too comfortable. I had to find work because I needed to sustain myself and make a livelihood. But now I don’t know how much longer I want to keep doing this because, although it feels safe and somewhat challenging to work and learn something entirely different, I am frustrated for not doing what I’m good at.
Studying and living in South Africa was awesome and I miss it every day… Unfortunately getting a work permit is very, VERY difficult these days…
Best of luck to you too. I hope you find a way to do what you wish to do soon!
You’re so talented, Mimz. After seeing the links to your designs that you posted I have no doubt that you’ll succeed in fashion.
Thank you @Kitten 🙂
Yes, everything will work out. I just need to keep telling myself that it will . And your words help too 😀
Life is to short to work in a job you don’t like. Try to follow your dreams.
Thanks @Zip, Trying to keep the faith and keep motivated.
Hopefully I will be able to follow my dreams….
Maybe you’ll be the one to start a fashion industry in Mozambique! I’ll happily be your unpaid model for a while :).
It’s such a pity that you say there isn’t an industry. I always see my friends with the most beautiful fabrics from there. Best of luck!
Well @Shelley, there are fashion designers, seamstresses, tailors, but nothing that is established and nothing cooperative. we don’t have factories, good a wide range of fabrics, we don’t have skilled and properly trained people to employ to make garments for wholesale, this is more a one-of-a-kind, once-off items that go for sale for a client. We only have one internationally known, awarded designer, and he sells in several countries, but besides him, nobody else.
I am more inclined to make ready-to-wear stuff, rather than the stand out one-of-a-kind garment for one client. And there’s little room for me to do it here, if I cannot hire people to make the clothes exactly how they should be manufactured (besides, I don’t have the capital to do so).
So yes, we have beautiful fabrics, but we have a LOT to work on still… and I surely do hope to contribute to the industry’s growth.
Listen, I have crazy student loan debt and because of that I’ll be semi poor the rest of my life. But because I already did one internship my sophomore year of college, the second internship I did senior year was unpaid and I didn’t receive any academic credit. I did it so I could have something on my resume. And sometimes, you need to suck it up and do it. It sounds like the crap she’s explaining (besides the hours, because working at 10pm sounds horrible) is a typical internship. It also sounds like my first job.
Ummm not for nothing but welcome to fashion. This is obviously extreme and I’m not sure I believe it but fashion isn’t this easy little cake walk job of going to shows and parties.
Sorry not sure I’m buying this their hr would be all over it. Also they might get emails at midnight that doesn’t mean they were expected to answer.
It’s not extreme – her experience is normal. She was just lucky that she was in a top house and not some struggling garment company on 7th ave. (which there are hundreds).
Umm I work in fashion I know what we make interns do and 50 hours is extreme hence why I don’t believe the story. No one wants an intern around that much. No matter how amazing they are.
However, the rest of it is a reality. Obviously this girl is an idiot who thought fashion was all fashion shows, celebrity parties and pretty clothes. That isn’t even a small part of it and in reality if you ever have to go to it it’s the worst part of the job. I’ve been doing this for 11 years & am a head of a department and will work 15 hour days sometimes and be known to end up in a store or warehouse pulling goods and moving boxes for 8 hours it’s the JOB. I also havent had a true day off where I don’t check email or deal with an issue in I don’t remember how long. I also have a rich personal life but it took time, I also love what I do and it is worth it. But it’s not glamorous. It’s work it’s hard work, and if you love it it’s the most fun job you could ever have but you have to breath it or it will destroy you.
So for an intern to think she isn’t suppose to do manual labor well she can go work in finance. I can say this sweet thing is done in fashion.
K – you said it much better than I could today. I’m in a very foul mood, so I’m not expressing myself well. But I agree with everything you say – exactly.
Live it and breathe it, or it will break you. Perfectly said.
I think another point should be made and that is that many fashion designers have to rely on a faulty business model. I.e. the customers are not willing to pay the cost of the clothes if everyone working was fairly paid. That is why so many fashion companies, small and bigger, relies on interns and cheap labour in countries like Bangladesh. Most smaller designers hardly pay anyone on their team, and people will still shun at the cost of these designer clothes. Even though they were partly developed for free.
Nobody forced these interns to work there if they felt they were being abused…I am really getting tired of people suing for every damn thing! If you don’t like they way you are being treated….LEAVE…don’t stay on and then expect a big payday…..
Mary Kate and Ashley look like members of the Adams Family in that top picture!!!
They’re creepy and they’re kooky,
mysterious and spooky,
They’re all together ooky,
The Olsen Family
This is exactly the kind of thing people should sue for. Or the cycle continues – unpaid and overworked interns move on and new ones come through. Businesses continue to take advantage unless someone makes them not. They don’t do anything out of the goodness of their hearts and there are lots of problems with the way interns are treated, compensated, etc.
It’s a foot in the door of an extremely competitive industry, where there are plenty of willing candidates for each job. She would have access to contacts and networking, along with clothing and food perks. Can’t put a price on any of that. She could have made the most of the experience. Nothing in this suit sounds any different than I was treated when I was first starting out.
No one is forced to become an intern! Don’t want to work for no pay…DON’T….don’t want to work long hours…DON’T…..But don’t say “ok” and then sue….common sense!
@Betsy I agree with you. Major companies outside the fashion industry often have paid internships. The whole culture of “you should be grateful for this foot in the door” is ridiculous. Even if the candidates don’t have so-called hard skills, they should go through a rigorous selection process on soft and basic analytical skills and have at least a living wage for the paid internship program waiting for them if they are selected. Merit, not how willing you are to work to death for zero pay.
Furthermore, once you get the internship, it’s a slippery slope. Sure, you’re told in your contract that you’ll have to work hard, but delivering heavy packages of clothing in extreme heat? Being on call all hours of the day? It sounds like they weren’t given clear boundaries as to hours and duties. And that’s worrying for any job, but especially when you’re unpaid. I hope this case results in a fair outcome and serves as a warning.
What Dualstar did is against the law! “Internship” is no longer a generic thing, there are certain criteria that have to be met. Department of Labor is a good resource.
The internship MUST be for the intern’s benefit and they can not have them doing tasks that a paid employee would otherwise be doing.
Then I would absolutely recommend that she pursue another career, because fashion is definitely not for her. I lugged rolling racks of gowns through midtown during the summer. I cleaned showrooms and sorted fabric swatches until patterns and colors started to blend together. I created spreadsheets, tracked packages, went out for coffee, made copies…whatever I was asked to do. Because basically, that’s how fashion is done. I made valuable connections because I had a good can-do attitude and soaked up as much as I could. I asked questions. I paid my dues. I went to fashion shows, wore designer clothes and rubbed elbows with celebrities at boutique openings. But that didn’t happen overnight…and the next day I went back to sorting, copying, lugging, tracking…welcome to the fashion industry.
My husband is the CFO of his company. He started as an assistant accountant 25 yrs ago. Yet he still works a full day, commutes 2 hrs home and then takes a conference call at 11 pm because his counterpart is in China. We worked Saturdays and evenings. He came from a very poor family, would scrounge quarters in the street for snacks and worked as a janitor at his high school. He pulled himself up, rung by rung. It’s called work ethic…something that seems to be sorely lacking these days. He complains that many college grads these days think they are owed a career and huge salary just for showing up. They don’t know much of anything (practically speaking), but think they already know everything. And when the world doesn’t treat them like they think they should be, they throw a fit. Slave labor? Hardly. I was lucky to get my foot in the door.
Don’t want to be an unpaid intern? Then don’t. It’s very simple.
@gas many fashion companies have paid internships including luxury. This girl wanted to work for the row knowing it was unpaid and didn’t offer credit but would be a resume builder. I have a hard time believing this story because no one relies on an intern that much and as for manual labor well that doesn’t stop until your ceo and frankly I’ve seen really good fashion CEOs doing manual labor.
My husband is CFO for a very successful designer, and he still winds up in warehouses, covered in dust, counting garments by hand when necessary. I worked as a department mgr for a huge american designer, and I still found myself in warehouses, factories, cutting swatches and lugging huge rolls of fabric and garment racks across busy city streets in 90+ degree weather when necessary. Creating endless spreadsheets. As an unpaid intern, I did similar things because *that IS the job*. I knew how to do it when I moved into a paid position because I learned by doing. I don’t know what she was expecting…
Now that I’m raising my kids full time, I miss it terribly.
I loved it…it’s a passion. If you aren’t willing to do the work, find another industry, because it’s not a hobby.
Completely co-sign the paid internship pros here – I worked very hard with our internship manager to hire 5 very bright, engaging, and ambitious interns at my company two years ago. They were well paid for the work they did, not just because it’s the law, but because they were working their ASSES off – and deserved the pay they earned.
I think it’s ridiculous to look at interns as volunteers. That’s not what they are hired to do. An internship, at most large companies, functions as a sort of multi-month job interview; both for the intern’s benefit as well as the company’s. Expecting free servitude in exchange for the Great Dubious Honor of toiling away at a Great Dubious Company is the height of hubris, and I’m proud to say I work for a company who certainly does NOT think that way.
@ NN I agree they should get paid but if the program tells you up front they aren’t and you sign on for it then it’s on you. I don’t know what I would have done without my intern this summer (paid) but the job at the row says not paid and no credit. She knew going in. I don’t agree with their approach but since they are honest about it I can’t fault them.
I also don’t buy 50 hours. Sorry just don’t.
If a series of interns is constantly doing a task that is a key component of running the business – that’s a necessary task that requires an ongoing paid worker. Period.
Most companies that abuse internships as slave labor are in fact very profitable….and could easily afford to have proper paid employees doing the tasks instead of having someone do it for free. They could also easily afford the extra burden/hassle that comes with providing a legitimate internship, the legally-defined “educational experience”.
This problem runs throughout many different industries and should be completely unacceptable yet it continues.
@Shannon1972 There’s never been an universal level playing field as far as the labour market is concerned. That’s why we’ve always had employment laws, to avoid devolving back to the “work” (slavery) standards of the industrial revolution. The “hard work” and “work ethic” line is a convenient tag line that benefits shoddy employment practices, and it’s a viewpoint that doesn’t reflect reality. Besides, paying people a fair wage is good for the economy. You can’t get those on zero incomes to buy more things, can you? Your perspective is outdated.
Suing is working though. Many companies no longer use interns as slave labor because they fear getting sued. They’re instead doing the right thing and paying people. The intern system is being abused by wealthy executives who want to depress labor costs so they can further enrich themselves. People will enter these abusive arrangements fearing the effect on their future if they don’t and greedy companies take advantage of that. Abusing people who are desperate for work experience isn’t ok.
What they described is against the law. A lawsuit makes perfect sense.
I think it’s great that she is suing.
It’s easy to say that things has always been like that and that she should have known, but it’s also lazy.
Fact is that the way this intern was treated is against the law and if we ever want the situation to improve we need people like her who don’t act as a doormat ready to be abused.
Just because it’s normal to be treated like sh!t doen’t mean it’s right.
Different states have different laws concerning internships, whether they can be paid, unpaid, earn college credits, and the working conditions, specifically hours, so what may have been acceptable in one state may not be in another. I do suspect that whoever is handling the class action suit did review New York’s laws on the matter.
Unpaid internships – in many fields, even education – are common here where I live and I think they are unfair. But the internes know this when signing up. I wonder how the contract with Dualstar was written for this woman. Small print is not your friend.
Once you sign up, you’re less likely to drop out if conditions are not what you expect. I think that’s where the exploitation gets harder to avoid.
Okay, so this intern has never seen The Devil Wears Prada?! Not that I want anyone treated badly, but come on. This is the way most internships work. They run you til you throw up, they they make you run some more.
Yeah, I have mixed feelings about it. Kids today are so entitled. I do think they should get a small salary, but let’s face it – they know very little, you have to spend time training them, and they aren’t worth much to the company. The things she’s complaining about – getting emails at 10 p.m., being thirsty, carrying heavy stuff – welcome to the world, kid. I was doing that in my 50s as a paralegal – no time for lunch, assignments that would take 4 hours needed by the next day given to me 10 minutes after I was supposed to leave but hadn’t because I had two more hours worth of work, blah blah blah. Yes, I was getting paid, but not that much.
Damit, I had written a long comment and it got erased … ok let’s try this again…
My issue is not with hard work, I think especially in our first jobs, we have to do annoying crap and work hard. that’s life. Get some experience, earn your stripes, stand up for yourself and deal with it. Sadly, that is the world of work.
That being said, my major issue is the unpaid part of these internships. The idea of having to work long hours for free for potential opportunities is, in my mind, elitist and wrong. We have the case here in Switzerland at the UN. All the internships are unpaid, which means that only children of diplomats or rich business men (arms dealers anyone? “Import and export experts”?) have access to the posts now as they are the ones who can afford to live in Geneva and work for free, paid for by their parents or their trust funds or whatever. This means that they are the ones making the future contacts for the best positions later on. And that means that an organisation that exists to strive to make the world a better place will, in the future, be staffed by only the most wealthy and entitled (and not in the Mindy sense of the world), and that would be a way to push the world backwards, not forwards. I’m not saying that people need to be paid much, but I think a minimum wage is absolutely appropriate, even for internships. Everyone has the right to a decent quality of life and to be paid for work provided.
I totally agree they should be paid something, for all the reasons you cite. I did a free internship between college and paralegal school, and they were nice enough to take up a collection and give a “bonus” when I left. No one should work for nothing.
Snazzy…I find it interesting that this whole concept of unpaid internships being designed for wealthy people to remain wealthy is also prevalent in Switzerland. I thought it was a problem only in Africa.
My husband did two internships while he was in school for 6 months a piece, and he definitely was not paid for them. It was a requirement to complete the interships to graduate, BUT it was a very strict contract with stated rules, such as he could only work from 8:00-5:00, 3 days a week etc…if he had ever been treated unfairly, he could have gone to his instructors and they would have gone to bat for him. And, he did get a job offer at the end of his second internship. So, when unpaid internships are something like he went through, I have no problem with it.
However, in this case, it sounds like the company was really taking advantage of free labor.
I think some people in this thread are missing the point that unpaid internships are extremely predatory and largely only benefit the college kids whose parents can afford for them to live in a fancy city while they don’t get paid. When I was in grad school a few years ago, unpaid internships were the norm in my profession. 1-2 years experience is practically mandatory to land an entry level (entry level is no longer entry level) gig. If you want a real job, for many students, it involved going into debt on loans to work for free while you’re in school.
I agree 100%. Said the same above
Yes, I think I was missing the point a bit until Snazzy’s comment, so at least one person has been shown the light thanks to both of your persistence. Thanks for that.
Love you GNAT 😀
I agree. I had to do an internship in order to graduate grad school but I was also working part time too since I could not afford to work for free. And you are doing the tasks of a full time employee and no one has to pay you for it. It blew. I was glad to be done with it.
Yes, they are missing the point. I hAve a b.s. Degree in finance. I did not do an internship Bc I was already working while in school to pay for my apartment, food, etc. the rich kids in sororitys and fraternity’s did the unpaid internships, participated in clubs all things they could afford to do because mommy and daddy were paying for their schooling and living expenses. So when I got out of college I had a hard time finding a job because of no experience in my grades want the best because I worked and went to school. I kept getting the you have no experience or you to over experience or overqualified I mean. Finally I gave up and just got a job down did even need a college degree for. If I could go back and redo it I would’ve taken loans out the wall zoo and I studied and get unpaid internships and all the club stuff.
Ok I think you’re unfairly attacking some people. Internships are valuable and often paid although not that much (barely over minimum) and not only rich kids took advantage. People figured out what they had to do.
I think internships should be paid and for the record most are in the fashion industry so this girl made a choice to work for a company that didn’t offer compensation. She can’t complain about what goes into her job after she gets it knowing the parameters that exsist. Sorry but she wanted a glamourous job hanging out with the Olsen twins so she took an unpaid internship knowingly. What she got was a realistic job in the fashion industry and maybe met the celebrity owners twice. She made a choice with a lot of knowledge and didn’t like the reality. I think all internships should be paid but they aren’t and this company is up front about it.
@Amanda predatory is the right word. You only have to google something like “strategies for saving on operations” and half the results that come up suggest “hire interns” (to get free labour). The mentality is all wrong. I feel bad for these young people who have big dreams of working in glamorous industries and end up getting a horrible experience that doesn’t really further their careers.
I have trouble telling them apart. Is Mary-Kate the one on the right in the first pic?
Not to be mean but I think they look creepy in pictures especially when they pose together. Maybe it’s their clothes or how they carry themselves but I feel like am looking at old women in a young woman’s body.
Remember how damn CUTE they were in their movies??? Don’t think I covet a thing about their “aesthetic”. But then again, I’m a pretty unhip, middle-aged white woman.
I just think they are too thin, and that makes them look old. I’m not trying to concern troll or body shame – clearly they like the way they look and their health is their business, but being that thin draws their faces to the extreme that it ages them, imo. I’m sure they would shudder at my body should they ever see it, so we just have different opinions of what’s attractive, I guess.
Internships are terrible, full stop. I think they did originate in the US. And when you add supposedly big names like the Olsens and fashion to the mix, it’s a recipe for exploitation.
Not always – I interned a few summers at a firm in my field (paid), and did get to experience what a typical firm was like (something college did not teach!), and had stuff to put on a resume when I graduated. Plus I learned I did not want to specialize in that particular area of my industry, and ended up in a much more fun area.
We also have summer interns at my firm now, they work and are paid for it, but we also try to involve them in different areas of the business so they learn as much as possible.
If a business does it right, internships can be valuable. If they take advantage and are just looking for free labor, it’s wrong.
@Lucy2 sorry, I meant *unpaid* internships are horrible. Those summer programs you’re talking about are usually paid and they can give young people a good overview of what their field will be like.
Instead of doing interships one could try to work parttime in a field they are getting an education in. That way you get experience and something on your resume. I never did an internship as they all would have been unpaid and I did not a) want to up my debts , b) had parents that could support me and c) had no money in the bank myself to go even a month without payment (rent and food do not pay for themselves).
That’s the problem with unpaid internships. It can be hard for college students to find paying part time work since employers around universities know they can offer exploitative free internships instead. It’s very unfair to low income students who have no choice but to earn money while they go to school. Unpaid internships should be made illegal for so many different reasons.
Unpaid internships are class warfare.
Lawdy, why would Hiddleston even think for one moment of joining this family?!
Have you seen Elizabeth’s boobs? They definitely tipped the scale. 😉
Haven’t but I’ll take your word for it, but it’s not as if great boobs are in short supply in his industry!
I think natural ones as nice as hers are not that common. At least I can’t think of any actress who is curly in a similar way (she happens to have what I would describe a perfect female body).
But it was just a joke anyways. I have no idea what he really went for. Perhaps she’s the smartest nicest person around and nothing like her sisters.
Bedhead I’m glad you mentioned that people who take unpaid internships are usually well off because for the most part that’s true. I had friends who were able to take internships out of state (they were international students whose scholarships gave them a generous stipend) so they were able to do those sort of things. My friend told me how pretty much all of the other interns came from wealthy families so rent,money etc., was never an issue. Internships are certainly valuable; I’ve taken unpaid ones before, however, they were local and I wasn’t paying rent. I think it’s really unfortunate that people have to pass up awesome opportunities because there is no compensation.
The twins look like Edward Gorey art that has come to life!
It’s so sad to see them like that! They are what? 29? They look very old and very sick.
No not naturally thin. But actually I’ll.
I am loving that beautiful 90’s reminiscent floral gown worn by the lady in the background. WERK IT
Not gonna lie, kinda feeling Sarkozy’s sexy, squinty old balls vibe. Shall I show myself to the door?
They really look terrifying, my god, that first photo!!
They look like the Mrs.Haversham twins.
These two when they were children looked almost exactly alike, even though they weren’t identical twins. Then puberty and maturity hit and they started to look different from one another. (If you look at photos of the Olsen twins from their late teens they look like two different people.)
When they started looking more like individual people and less like clones, however, it seems like they then got a bunch of cosmetic surgeries done so that they could look exactly like each other again. It seems like they both got tweaked into the same person, so this was a mutual plan.
Complaining about 50 hour weeks??! Ridiculous..
Complaining about no breaks…agreed. That is inhumane.
Not getting paid..agreed that is wrong. I think that a living stipend should at least be provided for interns. I generally think that a lot these unpaid internships are designed to exclude less privileged groups of people. Especially in South Africa. I see so many internships that require the students to have their own car. Even in cases where a car isn’t actually needed for the job. Which of course means a privileged few at that level would even apply for the job. It’s sad and at least people are now talking about it and shedding light on the issue.
It would make sense to complain about 50 hour weeks if she signed up for 30 hour weeks or less and that was stipulated in the paperwork when she signed up. That would mean in addition do doing the agreed 30 hours per week unpaid, they basically manipulated her into working an additional 20 hours per week unpaid without her agreement. That is exploitation. Internships like this are a way executives “cut costs” by essentially manipulating young people who don’t know better into a form of indentured servitude and this means that there are fewer REAL jobs for people who are qualified to be compensated appropriately. Either way, the whole labor market loses out and it’s just not right. What happened to being paid for an honest day’s work? It got so out of hand that the courts and the federal government both had to step in. And both of those institutions realized they were also benefiting handsomely from unpaid labor in the process. There needs to be even more reform. We are talking about people who had to take out loans and probably still worked at least part time to get themselves through school, and now that they graduated with a degree and qualifications, they have to work without pay for well-heeled bosses who are making bank while ordering around these people who somehow have to afford rent, car payments, loan payments, health insurance payments, etc. while being overworked (which keeps them from being able to get another REAL job to afford the bills), all for some intangible potential but unproven later benefit to their resumes. There’s nothing about this that is not fucked up. I’m so thankful that my university valued its interns because I was making $15 an hour at my undergraduate research internship. Then I hear about things like this, and it really makes me angry that so many people who are making more money than they know what to do with somehow think it’s alright to treat interns like their labor and contributions are literally worthless, that they don’t deserve to be paid enough to keep a roof over their heads. It’s the height of elitist arrogance and the “let them eat cake” attitude that rising income inequality is creating.
If this was a lawsuit filed by just a handful of former interns, I might chalk it up to sour grapes or whatever – but it was filed as a class action, which means a lot of other people are also suing (I think I read more than 50 in another article). That’s a lot of disgruntled people.
My former company employed (as in got paid) interns from the local fashion and arts college on a regular basis. They were paid minimum wage (but let’s be honest, no one is going to make ends meet on that kind of money) and also received course credit. Yes, they sorted buttons and labeled files – I don’t think we ever sent any of them for coffee – but they also got a front row seat to what it takes to put a clothing line together from start to finish. They would sit quietly in the corner as the executives reviewed drawings, samples and prototypes and decided what to produce, change, or discard – sometimes the lowly design assistants didn’t even get to attend those meetings, but the interns did.
Some of those interns were amazing – hit the ground running, knew their stuff, did anything they asked without complaint and did it well. Those interns got a glowing recommendation from the Design Director and an offer to come back when they graduated. Others were dead weight and never got to do more than sort buttons and open mail and even thought that was too much. But they were all paid and not one of them would ever have grounds for a lawsuit – let alone more than 50 of them.
“I had to carry 50lbs of trench coats in 90 degree weather!”
This sounds like a line from The Devil Wears Prada.
If your entire industry relies on unpaid internships, then the industry is broken. Unpaid internships contribute to wage inequality (only the rich or at least those who are supported by the bank of parents can afford them.)
Also, personal anecdotes aren’t data.
Elizabeth Olsen FTW!!
I might be a little late, but thought I would chime in. I am the director of a fashion merchandising program at a large University (not in New York). A large part of my job is to work with fashion companies to place my students as interns. I’ve worked with over 50 fashion companies in New York and I can tell you, they’re all different.
1. Most companies do not pay, but they do require that the interns receive school credit for the internship. Many companies will pay for the interns’ lunches and/subway passes.
2. Most companies do not make the interns work long hours (more than 35-40) because they want to avoid lawsuits like these. Sometimes during busier weeks, interns are required to work more, but my students typically don’t mind because they enjoy the experience.
3. I will not work with companies that treat my interns poorly or that make them do only grunt work. Some things that seem menial (filing, sorting, etc.) are still important. If the intern wasn’t there, someone would have to do it. I also won’t work with companies who make interns do an excessive amount of manual type labor.
4. I work with my students for a full semester before they intern so if they have problems like these, they know to let me know right away so we can fix the situation (sometimes that means them leaving to work with another company instead).
5. I visit my interns on site during their internship and develop relationships with the companies so I can see for myself what the work environment is like.
6. Magazines are the worst. Even before Conde Nast stopped internships, I wouldn’t allow my students to intern with magazines.
7. The biggest thing I tell my students is that they have to work hard, do everything that is asked of them, and do it with a smile. From there, if you’re working excessive hours with no breaks or feel as if you’re being mistreated, let me know ASAP.
I have been doing this for over five years and have only ever worked with four or five companies that I’ve had to blacklist. Most of them treat their interns well and provide a valuable learning experience.
Thank you for the insight! I think you’re running a fantastic program and thank goodness for your students that you’re there to make sure they don’t end up getting taken advantage of.
These two remind me of Howard Hughes in terms of being reclusive.
When I was in my early 20s, I participated in a year long, national volunteer program and was placed in a local nonprofit, for what was supposed to be a specific project. To this day I am flabbergasted that the Executive Director thought I was there to complete every menial task she could think of – reorganizing file cabinets, cleaning closets, delivering brochures. There’s a fine line between busywork that everyone has to do, and thinking that someone is there to take care of every small chore you’ve been meaning to get to.
I might also be a little late to this but I want to share my story on it. I interned at a local concert venue with the tech crew. There were 4 people altogether on this crew, including me as the only intern. The venue was an opera house built in 1880s, so there was a lot of maintenance to be done, plus doing shows, upgrading equipment, and doing various things that had nothing to do with putting on a show, like plumbing.
On a busy week I did 80 hours, on a slow week 50. The week of the annual music festival I got 20 hours of sleep the entire week. While I was not paid, I enjoyed it tremendously. I learned things like basic plumbing and basic electrical, I also faced my fear of heights and strangers/crowds and gained a lot of confidence in myself that I didn’t have going in. I started out doing a lot of grunt work and worked my way up to running light and sound boards. I knew walking in that there was no way I would be going near a 20,000 sound board and a 30,000 lighting board any time soon. I was also given more responsibility as I learned more. My last festival I was stage manager for the loud and local stage meaning I had to do all the prep work make sure all of the riders were covered and everything else that was involved with it, it came out to be 300 hours in prep work. I wasn’t paid, but I met musicians ( Wilco, Arlo Guthrie, Taj Mahal) I got valuable training that I couldn’t get in my large classes, they also fed me dinner, I got class credit, but I feel like I was paid in many times over in other ways.