Earlier this week, Charlyne Yi accused David Cross of being a racist horse’s ass. She told her story on Twitter, of the first time she met Cross and he said something rude about her clothes, then made a “joke” about how she doesn’t speak English, a joke which included the words “ching chong.” Cross has been trying to answer Yi’s accusations all week and he has been doing a very sh-tty job – just go look at his second explanation for what happened, and how he’s still blaming Yi for misremembering the moment.
In my initial coverage, I talked about how much I liked Amber Tamblyn and how my least favorite part about Tamblyn is that she’s married to David Cross. I’ve always disliked him, and now I have a good reason for never giving a sh-t about his stupid brand of comedy. I didn’t say that Amber is “responsible” for her husband’s actions or anything like that – clearly, Cross is an a–hole and that’s on him. But is it okay to feel a little bit of “girl, your husband is a gigantic tool” about it? Maybe, maybe not. Apparently, people have been tweeting at Amber all week and she’s not pleased.
He said he was sorry, publicly, several times. Please don’t @ me in conversations dragging my husband. Thanks.
— Amber Tamblyn (@ambertamblyn) October 19, 2017
I spoke to @charlyne_yi and her feelings/safety are all that matter to me. We’re good. I owe you nothing, Twitter. You’re lucky to have me.
— Amber Tamblyn (@ambertamblyn) October 20, 2017
I’ll say it again. I spoke to Charlyne. I believe her. I’m about HER feelings/emotional health right now, not Twitter’s. That okay with you? https://t.co/aQU5dGqKuY
— Amber Tamblyn (@ambertamblyn) October 20, 2017
I will say this for the last time. Do not hold women accountable for the actions, decisions or words of their partners. Don’t. Do it.
— Amber Tamblyn (@ambertamblyn) October 20, 2017
I feel sorry for her a little bit. What would you do if you just found out that your husband, the man you’ve been with for some-odd seven or eight years, was a racist douchebag to a young woman ten years ago? Granted, I don’t believe this was the only time Cross said or did something stupid/racist/dickish. He’s always been a douche, which is why I was always disappointed with her for marrying him. But whatever, his actions aren’t her responsibility. (Still, I eye-rolled at “I owe you nothing, Twitter. You’re lucky to have me.”)
Photos courtesy of Getty.
I think the fact that Amber says she believes Charlyne says it all.
But what’s with the you’re lucky to have me nonesense?
Major side eye to that.
And no, on the whole women don’t need to be held accountable for men’s actions in a specific instance like this. However, there are times when it can’t be excused. Like when your husband is a serial abuser/harasser of women, a rapist, a nazi or white supremacist, and other massive issues of character. You don’t need to be held accountable for their actions, but in those instances, I’m interested in knowing why the woman is sticking around. Again, this is not for Tamblyn, just general commentary.
I think she was being snarky with that comment.
To me she was clearly being snarky, yes.
Literally the only part of her statements I can’t get behind. Ugh.
Kitten, you’re lucky to have me. 😀
social media can suck terribly in times when you (or someone close to you) is receiving backlash. she’s right, she doesn’t owe anyone anything, but because she cares about charlyne, she sent several tweets giving her stance and opinion.
To me, ‘you’re lucky to have me’ reads as sarcasm.
“Remember that every time a man commits a violent act it only takes one or two steps to figure out how it’s a woman’s fault, and that these dance steps are widely known and practiced and quite a bit of fun. There are things men do that are the fault of women who are too sexy, and other things men do that are the fault of women who are not sexy enough, but women only come in those two flavors: not enough, too much, and it is the fate of heterosexual men to endure this affliction. Wives are responsible for their husbands, especially if their husbands are supremely powerful and terrifying figures leading double lives and accountable to no one. But women are now also in the workforce, where they have so many opportunities to be responsible for other men as well.”
-Rebecca Solnit
Thank you for posting this.
GMAB
Perfect. That’s exactly where society is right now, and it’s not even just one side that plays into it.
I have to appreciate what she’s saying. She’s not shaming or refuting the woman’s claims. And she’s not participating in any dragging on twitter.
My interpretation of this whole thing is David was blackout drunk, can’t remember probably half of the asinine things he said and did 10 years ago, and is just SHOCKED that anyone would have the gall to call him out. Men who think they’re funny, particularly a cetain brand of comedian, cannot be told that they’re out of line. They think they’re geniuses, not assholes.
My husband played poker with him at a charity event and yes, Cross is a blowhard, snobby, sarcastic and according to my husband, “creepy”.
He’s an aging hipster. Being snobby and condescending is part and parcel of that. He thinks/thought that since he’s so above being racist that he can make “ironic” racial jokes that are magically funny because he’s so not racist, you guys!
He shouldn’t have done that. 40 something years old is way too old to be doing that stuff. It is boorish and not cool. But he’s not a racist, you guys. He’s a snotty, too cool hipster who thinks he’s better than you, for sure. He said racist things to Yi, which, regardless of whether or not he was joking, is inexcusable.
Making bad, “ironic” jokes makes you an insensitive ass, not a virulent racist. I don’t think he’s a great guy, but it’s a bit much to see everyone act like he’s a white supremacist or something.
Bless you gnerd. It seems that unless you don’t take anything to 11 like everybody else then you’re problematic too. It’s all so disproportional. It reminds of a few episodes of “Black Mirror” where social media/internet was really represented in a way I see more and more every day. It creeps me out.
Agreed. It’s a stretch to call him a racist over something like this when we’ve heard no other stories similar to this. If he was drunk and said something awful, apologize. It’s not ok to go on a smear campaign every time someone drinks too much and says something they regret. You’ve all done the same, I’m sure. The author of this blog stated she herself said inexcusable things when drunk, consistently, before she quit drinking. Stating saying things and forgetting she said them later as one reason why she quit drinking. Do we cancel her as well for mistakes in the past while intoxicated? Check that your own homes are in order before you disrupt someone else’s.
Well she’s right. She’s not responsible for past arseholery on his part and I don’t blame her in the least for responding in the way she did. Twitter can be such a self-righteous pill at times.
Seriously. We don’t need to blame women for everything men do.
Thing is, if you believe her, and you know your husband, you’ve most likely heard him say things like that. Racism, like misogyny, is almost never a one-off. You are or you aren’t.
Which brings me to my question. I’ve kind of skipped over a lot of the Weinstein discussions because it was just too much, too awful, and not a surprise at all. And I’ve had to confront a bit of my own sh*t from when I was tending bar years ago. But I noticed that some here are fiercely in the “the wife is never to blame” camp (especially on the Affleck threads) and I don’t get that at all when at the same time everyone else in Hollywood is complicit? How are other actors/actresses on our sh*t list for claiming to not have known but the wives are all off limits?
I don’t know if this has been discussed. If so, ignore me. But I honestly don’t get it. I’m no fan of focusing on wives unless they either had an active hand in selling us a false image of a good guy or they tolerate their own man’s bullsh*t and then turn around and write feminist op-eds etc.
I can’t speak for anybody else but I don’t think the women in Hollywood who may have known are complicit in any way, shape or form. Frisbee had a great comment on one of yesterday’s threads explaining why women shouldn’t be blamed for feeling powerless in a patriarchal system. FWIW, I also don’t blame Garner for Affleck’s indiscretions. He is a grown-ass man and he makes his own damn decisions.
I agree kitten. The same should go for georgina chapman as well but she seems to be some sort of exception to the rule. You’ve been one of the few to defend her and not make severe assumptions.
I meant the ones who claimed not to have known. Everyone was screaming YOU KNEW in the beginning. Like that’s a crime in and of itself.
I don’t blame Garner for her husband’s actions. I’ve simply never liked her approach to her public image and the way she tried to clean up her husband’s.
I’ve had a discussion with a friend about this general topic a few days ago. She’s friends with a misogynistic douchebag who is currently treating his gf horribly. She judges him for it, she’s cried about it. I told her that I’m not surprised that he thinks this is okay because for 16 years (that’s how long we’ve known him) the people around him have just accepted this type of behavior as “oh haha, that’s just him but he can be a nice guy if he wants to”. I don’t want him around me anymore because I don’t want to give the impression that I condone this behavior in any way. That’s not the same as a working environment, of course. But at what point does your support for a person mean you support their behavior? Never? I think that’s too easy.
This, @Kitten. Thank you.
*deleted*
Just don’t feel like getting into it again.
I have not really been commenting on Weinstein but I had to say that I do not agree with this comment at all. I am a black woman and in my community rape and sexual abuse and a whole lot of shit gets swept under the rug as ‘ something white people do.’ Of course this is a downright and insulting lie.
I understand why a lot of blacks make such statements. They are reactionary. Our blackness in white supremacy cast us a inhumane that to draw attention to any dysfunction means the white man will have more fodder for the legitimacy of white supremacy. Fanon has wrote about such thought processes since the 1950’s.
It is the reason why my mom will never say a word against the physical abuse inflicted on her children against our own father. The reasoning is that the world already hated black men and oppressed them that we don’t need more reasons to keep a brother down. Again I can understand my mother’s reasoning as she is a black woman who suffers the brunt of racism, sexism and patriarchy but understanding her viewpoint does not mean condoning it. To condone it is to absolve her of any responsibility. She was my father’s victim too but she also allowed for her children to be by justifiying her failure to act. I simply cannot take her altogether out of the equation as to do that as it keeps the dysfunction going.
I look at women who play into patriarchy the same way I do women who play into white supremacy. I understand why they do it as sometimes it is easier to go along if you think you are personally benefiting or will be protected. But the illusion of it all to me anyways and it is what Bell Hooks also says is that the people in top of such power structures are not truly benefiting from anything of substance at all. They are just made into soulless things devoid of any humanity who prey on others . How is that winning?
I just can’t jump on board with the leaving women out of it because of patriarchy. Maybe it is because I can’t even do it for my own mother because of white supremacy. Hell I can’t even do it for myself.
I have had to really deconstruct a lot of things over these past few weeks concerning my own sexual assault. The person who did it to me was in a position of power over me and someone who is respected with a wife and kids. I never said a word because of white supremacy. My attacker was white. I knew my father would say I was fast if he found out, probably call me a bed wench and all the other lovely names black men reserve for black women.
I also knew that the insistence of the few friends I confided in to ask right away what his race was would frame me as either a victim or as deserving. I realize after all these years that none of this should have stopped me from going to the police. I am a victim but it has taken me a while to realize that I probably played my part in keeping the dysfunction going as his kids have no idea what sort of person he is.
I guess what I am trying to say is that things are not so black in white and it is a very unpleasant but human thing for us to participate in upholding the things which hurt us. Admitting such does not make us any less of victims but it does not mean those who collaborate and collude and turn a blind eye should just be absolved of our actions. I am sorry to say that I believe that is what many people have done in this Weinstein situation. I
Sorry for the novel. I had to get everything I have been thinking off my chest.
@mia Thank you for this.
littlemissnaughty
The wife is not to blame for her husband’s actions, but some wives can be complicit. Jen Garner did irritate me with her pap walks after the world knew Ben was crap. My criticisms were about her as a separate person and the decisions she made. Each situation is unique to the players in the story.
Georgina Chapman is another kettle of fish. She knew what he was and she participated in his abuse by forcing actresses to wear her designs on the red carpet. They didn’t stand on merit, and she used his influence that was gotten through bullying and predatory behavior towards women to build a brand. Georgina is no different from Melania. GC wanted another baby AFTER hearing he had raped someone and all this spilled out but knew what he was all along.
She is responsible for her part with Marchesa only. I don’t believe a wife in a situation that is so known and married him anyway gets a shred of sympathy. Ivanka gets no pass. Camille Cosby gets no pass. They have to own their roles but not the men who are the perps.
Women aren’t weak creatures who have no brain and guile or will, and we can do things to hurt other women or people. We don’t need to be excused when we are wrong. We too have to be held responsible for our actions. Women are just as capable of lacking character and duplicity. We can’t drag one woman and then try to excuse another. It should be clear what is acceptable and what we expect from each other.
Remember the story is the victims, men like Harvey, a complicit system and moving forward to change this climate across the board. The silver lining is not to have to look at those hideous dresses anymore, no one has to pretend to like them, he can’t buy her way into significance, and the fashion world can breathe a sigh of relief.
The biggest factor for me is evidence or proof. Is there something factual that shows a person was complicit? No matter if they are spouse, co-worker, friend, I don’t think accusations should be thrown around without proof. People always have different sides they show to different people. When we accuse innocent people just because they were in the orbit of someone else, it weakens the attack on the actual perpetrator.
The words of the victims are the strongest thing to me.
Agree 100 percent.
Completely agree. We don’t know what a person goes through on a daily basis, what their thoughts and feelings are, their situation. Although some people on here seem think they know everything. “She knew” “this is what she’s like” as if they are with them 24/7 and can read their thoughts.
Victims have spoken out about being forced to wear the clothes. It has been reported as well as other things over the years. But I have no inclination to hunt links or sources it to make a point nor delve deeper into my personal reasons. There are so many bigger points to made and my thoughts and opinions formed way before this scandal was exposed.
Extreme white male privilege aided by masked loophole feminism is part of this societal problem. I don’t believe in victimization feminism so I see a difference between blame, complicity and duplicity either to diminish victims or distancing from victims as if the woman is inherently above or the same as the victims. It is not the case if a woman participated and benefited from the system dependent on silence and subjugation of women.
This isn’t an either or situation. This system is dominated by men, no doubt but to ignore the roles women, especially white women, can play ignores another element of the system to be dismantled.
I totally agree with her. I also can’t stand anymore the whole sanctimonious rhetoric anytime someone does something stupid, offensive even. Let’s criticize, held them accountable but when the whole purpose of that seems to be about knee-jerk reactions dragging people, I’m out.
I’m sure I have said or did stuff in the past I wouldn’t be proud today and wonder, if confronted with that today with the sort of mob mentality we see everywhere, how would I react. I don’t think this helps at all because it doesn’t encourage any self-reflection, people are more likely to feel defensive. It all goes beyond calling people on their bad behaviour, because nothing is ever enough, cynicism is everywhere. Explaining is not enough, apologizing is not enough. I really wonder what people want exactly because changing the past is not possible and often the one who suffered directly seems less demanding than everybody else.
And this isn’t just about this case, in particular, it’s just something I see mainly online everywhere.
Amen Miss C. If we are going to cancel people based on stupid shit they did 10-20 years ago, then bye bye world. No one is perfect and all things at one time. It is about growth and reflection. If they privately settled the situation with Ms. Yi, then it turns into a positive and a learning experience. I am a brown woman in my late 30’s and guilty of some stupid sh*t in my youth and even in my 20’s… it is never too late to learn and grow.
Amen. It’s all so easy to judge when you’re anonymous, isn’t it?
If I started canceling everybody that for a moment behaved in a way I didn’t like, said something I didn’t agree with or simply reacted to something in a way I found inappropriate… then I would have no friends and would not speak to my parents.
If I read every single interview from the actors/directors/writers/musicians whose work I follow then I don’t think anyone would be safe from my disappointment.
I guess that’s the self-righteousness world we live in now. If you are not perfect then you’re canceled. I just try to save my canceling powers to people who are criminals and/or clearly horrible human beings. But this is something I’m still working at because it’s easy to just go along with the whole group thinking and react impulsively like everybody else.
It also massively oversimplifies the reality of disengaging from something or somebody you love. What is Amber Tamblyn supposed to do, exactly? Divorce her husband over this? Agree that he’s a piece of shit on public media? Social justice is pointless if it doesn’t accept the potential for improvement. If we just “cancel” everybody, then who the hell do we convince to do better?
“It all goes beyond calling people on their bad behavior, because nothing is ever enough, cynicism is everywhere. Explaining is not enough, apologizing is not enough.” I agree with you somewhat, but celebrities can be very annoying with the way they handle apologies when they fuck up on issues like this too. There are the “My history of liberalism speaks for itself. I’m opting out of ever apologizing for anything I put out there publicly ‘cuz I’m so real and I’m an artiste’- types, who come off as a little arrogant. And then there are the ones who make the apology 100% about their feelings, their good intentions, and how everybody is being so ‘cruel’ to them, but 0% about what’s wrong with whatever they did. It’s going to be harder for people to forgive, move on, and quickly let things go when an adult public figure acts like that.
I’m married to a man who has been a reformed white supremacist for almost fifteen years. When we come across people who he’s harmed in the past, his actions then are not on me. His actions now are not on me, but I ensure he gives better apologies than “you misunderstood!” and he understands the gravity of the situation. Our marriage is by no means perfect at all, but I challenge him to do better, and he does the same with me. Hopefully Amber is challenging Cross behind closed doors.
But her weird self-righteousness on Twitter has cancelled her for me.
I congratulate your husband for changing his mind. Most people never do-it’s not a small thing.
Thank you for your anecdote. I totally agree with you.
I think she is just being defensive because people just kept going at her and it wasn’t just because of her husband. She called out James Woods and the MRA crowd is using this to smear her.
Mmmmmmm nah. You are the company you keep to a certain extent. Now it very well may be the case that she didn’t know this side of her husband, and the fact she believes Yi is a good sign, but still complicity and silence is a huge thing (especially since casual racism usually isn’t a one-time occurrence). It’s why people like Ivanka, Melania, Harvey’s wife, Bill Colby’s wife, etc get dragged to high heaven for their response to the men in their lives’ actions. (It is interesting to note that as I was thinking of examples I couldn’t really think of any male ones, but that could also be because I just woke up.) I think it’s quite understandable for people to be curious about your thoughts/why you’re linked with people who do terrible things. Constant @ing on Twitter is annoying though I’ll admit that. Idk why they’re expecting her to annul the marriage over this smh.
“You are the company you keep to a certain extent. ” Exactly.
You probably couldn’t think of any male examples because males rarely–if ever–get blamed for their female partner’s behavior.
That’s probably true as well. This world we live in is a triP.
The only time I seem to really see male celebrities being blamed and shamed for the behaviors of famous women in their lives is when it’s a case of a woman who’s seen as ‘loose.’ People will talk as if famous men are short-changing themselves by deigning to love and date, get engaged to, or marry a woman who has lowered herself in value by “being a slut” instead of holding out for the classy virginal bride that all good, manly men are entitled to. A lot of times when famous married women choose not to dress conservatively, people will say, “I can’t believe her husband let’s her dress like that”. A similar thing happens with daughters, although both parents seem to get shamed for that. But other than that one issue, there doesn’t seem to be as much of an eagerness to interrogate men over the behaviors of the women in their lives.
“You are the company you keep”. Welp, I really can’t find anything wrong with that statement. I don’t think you automatically get absolved because the words or actions didn’t come from you if you maintain your support of those who do such terrible things. a lot of times silence is permissive.
Right. I don’t think wives and girlfriends should be treated as responsible for the words or actions of their men. Too many personal failings and bad behaviors of white males in particular, but all males in general, get blamed on single mothers, sexy women, unsexy women, wives, etc. But that’s not a pass to be an enabler either, and some women do actively choose to enable racism, abuse toward others, or predatory behaviors and mentalities in their men. (That happens a lot with mothers and sons too, which is an entirely different, sad can of worms).
I can’t think of a woman who has done anything that equals men’s wrongdoing. Not a single wife on this level. I can only say K Fed possibly, but she was more harmful to herself. We just aren’t as evil as men. lol
‘He said he was sorry several times’. Girl, where? White women really need to stop treating racist white men like they’re kids.
Exactly. I loved that she dragged James Woods but she making up that her husband even apologized. She doesn’t care about woc.
He may have done so privately. I believe he referenced privately reaching out to her in one of his tweets. I am not defending him but maybe something else occurred there that we are not aware of.
@Alisha But then he backtracked and blamed Charlyne Yi for not knowing he was in ‘method acting’ in a bar.
Thiiiiiiiiiiiis. We treat white men like they’re kids across the board. It always boggles when I see white men in my office who can’t even be bothered to keep track of their own calendars. They’re not reprimanded, they’re rewarded with having one of the women assigned to “gently nudge them” about deadlines and meetings.
In this case, I get her point. But in many cases, cases I’m personally aware of, the wife/partner is very aware of her partner’s awful, damaging, sometimes criminal actions.
Quick story. When I was fresh out of college I worked with a guy who was kind of a big deal locally. He was sometimes charming and smart and engaging and sometimes unreliable, surly, lecherous and drug addled. The wife knew he had many affairs and did drugs. But she personally told me it was the fault of the women he was cheating with. It was their fault he was cheating and their fault he did drugs. She stood by him until he was arrested. Then she played dumb and filed for divorce. Some women should be held accountable for their part in enabling and excusing awful behavior.
And the guy harassed me too. I never reported it because I was 23 and felt lucky to have the job.
I have seen that too, especially when sexual brutality against women is involved. It gets twisted into victim shaming. Like brawling over a cheater, I have never understood that.
“He said he was sorry, publicly, several times. Please don’t @ me in conversations dragging my husband. Thanks.”
That is a lie Amber. Your husband said he didn’t remember her than he said he was in just playing but he didn’t apologize.
While women arent responsible for their husbands behaviour they are still responsible for their choices. And who you date and marry is very telling. We need to stop defending white women (aka the 53%) for their terrible choices and when they defend or side with racist, sexist men.
People also werent holding her accountable for his behaviour but for her defending his non apology. DONT LET WHITE FEMINSTS USE FEMINIST RHETHORIC TO DEFLECT CRITICISM!
Word. Women are often powerless but not always. At SOME point we are responsible for who we associate with in our personal lives.
It’s true that Amber isn’t responsible for her husband’s behavior, HOWEVER, it does make me think about the fact that she’s so closely linked to a man that behaves the way he does.
I don’t understand people in relationships who act like they have no say in their spouse’s or significant other’s behavior. I dated an asshole once. We were out together one night in a group and he acted like a complete moron around my sister’s friend who is gay. I called him out on that right on the spot and made him check his behavior by doing so. It’s really simple. And if that kind of thing matters to you (you know, people acting like human beings and treating people right), there is no excuse. If you can’t call somebody out for being a complete asshole, maybe you shouldn’t be with them in the first place.
Sorry, but no one is going to tell me that Amber has never witnessed her husband act like an asshole, and frankly from where I’m sitting, you can’t try to be the new Susan B. Anthony (just an example), calling out men on their behavior if you’re not going to apply that same standard to the man you share your bed with.
If it isn’t intersectional, it isn’t feminism. I’m not here for faux feminists. There are no exceptions. There is no “he said he’s sorry,” especially because he DIDN’T really even apologize, and her saying that she believes Charlyne doesn’t mean anything. Who cares what she believes or doesn’t? She came off self-righteous and very much like her opinion means the most in the situation, and it’s pretty clear that she believes her and her husband get a pass. This is a shining example of what people are talking about when they talk about white feminism.
I agree that partners are not responsible for the behavior of their partners.
However, this has got make you wonder what she sees in him, if you didn’t already? She expressed so much concern for human rights, why would she want to be with a racist? Or maybe it’s just women’s rights she cares about and she, like Mr. Cross, finds racism funny?
YEP! The same way people are re-considering their opinion of Amber with this new information, I judge men who take up with women with shitty behavior, and it does cause me to re-think my opinion of them, because to an extent, who you date (and your friends) reflects you. It’s not holding them responsible for their partners’ behavior to wonder what they are thinking in being – or staying – with a shitty person.
Just a note that I don’t think has been brought up. Both Amber and Charlene worked on House MD, and I’m fairly certain their time overlapped. I could be wrong about that, because I had stopped watching by then. But I think they were both in the last season.
I wonder if this issue had happened then or came up, or that’s how Charlene happened to even meet David.
Sigh, so many white people dont see the it as “racist” if it’s toward Asian people. We are just so nice and timid, you know?
Glad he’s getting dragged to a certain extent. And Amber, wtf? I don’t get them as a couple at all. I think she lowered the bar with this one, a lot.
Agreed with the first part about racism. I saw a lot of people act like this was no big deal on twitter.
Yes I notice that too. And they also have a very reductive definition of Asian: only Chinese, Japanese, Koreans, Vietnamese, and Thai. Asian is way bigger!
I know. It is dismissive.
Women of color and feminists are not lucky to have these kind of “allies” who are tied to sh*tty men. White feminism is so blind sometimes. These women pretend to be allies while they’re married to racist, sexist men and they don’t do anything to change them. That’s why Amber does have to answer for what her husband says because it contradicts her so called values. If you sell yourself as a big feminist and an activist online and in public, explain why you are in love with someone who says racist and sexist crap. David Cross had “grab them by the p*ssy!” as his IG bio for the longest time. He thought it was funny. You need to see the hypocrisy here. The kind of men you date says a lot about you, whether you like it or not. I don’t care if he does something bad and you didn’t. If you let it slide and you stay, it’s problematic. You endorse him the minute you enter a relationship with him because if you’re not like him why are you with him? White women allow so much crap from their family and partners and then they call themselves allies. You do owe Twitter and explanation because you’re opinionated about everything, and then whoops, you have the exact problem at home. Why not start there? I’m so tired of these white actresses pretending to be so woke for the social media praise, but then they date racist jerks and tell us they don’t owe us an explanation. Yes, you do. I personally don’t feel lucky to have fake allies and hypocrites who pretend to be woke but love racist and sexist men. You will never catch me date someone like that. It goes against my values. I say what I mean and I mean what I say.
@Annie – cf. Hillary Clinton. I never took her seriously as a feminist role model after I realized how much bad behavior she had enabled in her husband for the sake of their mutual political ambitions.
To be fair, once in a marriage, as time goes on, it is inevitable that people’s investment in those relationships builds and then tends to overcome abstract things like “principles”. I get that – it’s a very human response. I just think it should be acknowledged, not denied.
There’s something about him I just don’t like. And no, don’t hold a woman accountable for the actions of her partner. But I’d question my partner if I heard things once they were out in the mainstream. Or if he said something in earshot. Or if a friend said he said something. The worst thing I know about my husband is that he’s a lawyer.
I disagree. I’m not disappointed in her for marrying him. I think they are great together. I also know for a fact that before my husband and I got together, he did/said dumb shit. Then we met and we started learning from each other and growing together, and now we are two completely different people. We change, we grow and we need to support and forgive people for mistakes they’ve made in the past.
And don’t hate on Amber for marrying a guy you don’t like. If someone said that to me, my feeling’s would be really hurt 🙁
I have mixed feelings about situations like this. On the one hand, no one should be held accountable for another’s actions unless s/he was fully aware of and encouraged them. On the other hand, the attribution of total innocence to partners when they are women occasionally smacks of infantilizing them. Surely, women are as entitled as men to the dignity of their own choices: even bad ones. Relationships are complicated. I had this discussion with myself over the Clintons. However much I admire Hillary Clinton for some things, one thing that enraged me was the decades during which she enabled what she knew very well was rampant infidelity, and its implicit sexual rejection of her as a woman, for political ambition. Had the Lewinsky scandal not gone public, she would have turned a blind eye to her husband’s disrespecting his office, the home they shared even if it was the White House, and risking public humiliation of his wife and young daughter. And she stood by him all the way, enraging every middle-aged woman who saw a husband’s eyes stray toward young firm flesh after a couple of decades of marriage.
Where do we draw these lines? If she didn’t know, she didn’t know. But I have this theory about relationships: the red flags, the clues, are always there. Lots of people, men and women both, choose to ignore them in the flush of romance.
I’ll take her word that she never saw this side of him. But my experience of life is that that kind of asininity is hard to hide.