Ooooh, I didn’t think we would be getting these photos so soon this morning. It was announced last week that Meghan Markle, Prince Harry and the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge would be doing an appearance together on behalf of their Royal Foundation. This event was the “inaugural” Royal Foundation Forum, and it was basically just Will, Kate, Meghan and Harry answering questions from a moderator, in front of an audience. Meghan’s already making headlines because she talked about women’s rights and Time’s Up and Me Too. I think Kate just choked on a suffragette emerald!
Meghan Markle voiced her support for the #MeToo and #TimesUp campaigns as she made her official debut alongside fiance Prince Harry and future in-laws the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge today in their first public engagement as a foursome. The former actress, 36, appeared at the inaugural Royal Foundation Forum, an event highlighting the progress of the young royals’ charitable projects. Speaking at the event, she said she wanted to ‘hit the ground running’ after her wedding and support women’s rights.
She said: ‘I hear a lot of people speaking about girls’ empowerment and women’s’ empowerment you will hear people saying they are helping women find their voices. I fundamentally disagree with that because women don’t need to find their voices, they need to be empowered to use it and people need to be urged to listen. Right now with so many campaigns like MeToo and TimesUp there’s no better time to continue to shine a light on women feeling empowered and people supporting them’
It is the first time the foursome have been pictured together since they attended a Christmas Day church service in Norfolk with the majority of the Royal Family.
William officially welcomed Meghan to the family, adding how ‘delighted’ he was for her to join them at the event, which was greeted with a warm round of applause from Kate.
Meghan also said nice things about Heads Together and the Royal Foundation, of which she is now a patron. But seriously, thank you Meghan. Thank you for not treating women’s rights and women’s stories as a political hot potato. Thanks for not treating sexual abuse like an issue with two sides, an issue where it might be “controversial” to come out against it.
A note about the fashion – Kate wore a relatively inexpensive Seraphine dress which costs £99. Meghan wore a Jason Wu dress which is apparently upwards of £1,370. Oh well.
Meanwhile, Kate joked (??) yesterday about William’s preparation for Baby #3. She apparently told someone at her new nurse patronage that “William’s in denial” that they’re having a third. Sounds about right.
Photos courtesy of Getty.
I watched the live stream of the Q+A part and I was very impressed with all of them, in particular, William and Kate. If you take the comments and opinion’s posted on this site as gospel you would think that William and Kate can’t string a sentence together and aren’t passionate about anything but that couldn’t be further from what I saw. William took the lead of the discussion and spoke more, was passionate, enthusiastic, knowledgeable and articulate. Kate was impressive too – more confident in her speaking although she had a quieter, softer voice. She interjected politely too and didn’t just sit there waiting to be spoken too.
Harry and Meghan are known to be confident and passionate so there are no surprises there. I hope the 4 of them get off their assess in the future to bring more awareness to the causes that are championed by the Royal Foundation.
If you’re just now tuning into and keeping up with Kate, then you’re watching her on a very good upswing. Prior to a few months ago (literally), she was working FAR less and had lots of trouble public speaking. Previous videos of her speeches are tough to watch, particularly because of her age. Public speaking can be anxiety-filled, but there are plenty of things one can do to overcome it, particularly if you have all resources at your disposal. It’s a very recent development that Kate has not only done more engagements but made an attempt to be more engaging.
I think it is her new secretary. Both William and Kate are much more eloquent and improved (and the bar was set very low). I know this is not a popular opinion here, but I actually think Kate likes the shift of attention towards Meghan. Meghan thrives, she looks so confident, so at ease… And Kate somehow looks contempt. I do not know if it is the pregnancy, if she is happier, or if with less pressure Kate just relaxes and sort of shares the vibes.
I also saw the videos in the press and they were great together. And they seem to get along very well.
I haven’t been able to find video of the full Q+A, however, after watching few videos on the DM, I have a couple of observations:
1 – Will, Kate, and Harry were rather fidgety. They were swiveling their chairs quite a bit, almost seeming antsy. This is particularly of Will and Harry. Kate did this more than Meghan, but if you watch Kate’s hands she had them clenched together and was rubbing her fingers or playing with her ring.
2 – Meghan looked and sounded the most prepared and professional out of all of them. It was actual quite inspiring. Regal is a state of mind and behavior, truly. I think it’s easy to forget that when there are actually royals, aristocrats, and nobility in the world. Meghan did much less swiveling in her chair, and really only did so if she needed to face someone better or if there was a lighthearted moment. Also her posture, relaxed but professional demeanor, and passion really shined.
I’m going to echo Meghan’s Suits co-star and wholeheartedly agree that the royals are lucky to have HER.
ETA: @Ellaus – I agree that Kate seems more content these days. Maybe she feels like she as completed her family and also feels more content with Meghan around. A confident woman who builds up other women is always a boost, no matter where your confidence meter is sitting. It’s a tough world out there for women.
+1000
It’s the effect of professional hardworking Prince/ss Henry Couple – made the turnaround. In addition, HM POW The Firm hiring a professional Consultant (aka PA), to teach – kick start the seven years Workshy Duch middleton – per reports that middleton, of the decade wait, wanted to retire and stay in to help Staff/Nanny Maria care for the three kiddies – never mind the millions in luxury Entitlements/perks palaces/mansions from tax payers/ Duchy handed over for Royal Duties and use to fund middleton family.
Thanks for your input!
EDIT: Agree with @Hh. This has been a long time coming and it seems that Kate has just now understood her role and is doing a concerted effort in it. I just hope it lasts well beyond Harry’s wedding and the birth of her third child.
I think it is William who has finally come to understand his role. By doing so, he gives Kate space to find hers.
I think you may be right Megan. She usually takes his lead. I can see this.
Oooh, do you have a link for this? Thanks!
Topic of story, Markle, a actress speaking of support of Times Up and Me Too.
What did the other three say on the subject Jason?
This post also mentions and shows Harry, Kate and William as well so I think its fine to speak about them relating to their appearance at this event. Meghan wasn’t the only one there after all. 😉
LOL. PoorJason found his way to celebitchy
Seems like Meghan’s mother, her PR team and her entire social circle have also found their way to celebitchy as well in recent months. 😉
There is no evidence that Doria has ever contacted the press herself, unlike Carole, who has the DM on speed dial. Meghan is a professional woman who has worked for many years and should be good at this part of the job.
@whatever, please. There’s nothing cute or funny
about dragging Meghan’s parent into these threads in order to support a negative opinion of her or the attention she is getting.
Please stop with the Carol on speed dial narrative. The DM loathes middle class people with pretensions, has said so publicly and has run subtle hit pieces on Kate, Carol and James over the years. He seems to give Pippa a pass. It was Niresh Tana that Carol seemed to have a media relationship with.
Meghan has worked for years in a highly competitive industry with a certain level of success that few achieve. With charity and commercial endeavours on the side. Her work and achievement are there for all to see. Factual and verifiable.
Keen Kate was seen in tabloids together with her mother and sister during the long Waiting Years. That resulted in a marriage and countless gaffes during domestic and international official events while representing HM The Queen. Also factual and verifiable.
Meghan is a lot more worthy than Kate. Kate has not succeeded in anything by herself with the full support of her family other than marrying William, and not during the seven years she’s had The Firm to back her up.
-1000
Princess Henry I/w mum Doria, seem very busy working/ giving back to the community to have any time for PR (not even to respond to all the nonsense from the step adult kids) – to speak for her accomplished, hardworking, dedicated professional daughter who is very capable to speak for herself or Prince Henry and the Royals.
Doria is not even hanging to any tails – she is on with her own work and life, knowing The Henrys can speak for themselves.
Niraj Tanna.
The DM’s Sunday editor has been the Middleton’s PR consultant for years.
What Nota said.
Goodness, guys.
Whatever was literally just responding in kind. It’s incredibly hypocritical that it’s okay to call someone a paid for plant for having a positive opinion on something/someone – but then be outraged when the same is said in return. People have varying opinions of the celebrities on here – overall I’d say it’s VERY rare for someone on here to be on a PR mission. If you don’t agree with an opinion – that’s cool. But it’s incredibly dismissive to automatically jump to “okay ____” when you don’t. It just breeds hostility. At least come back with reasons to support why you disagree, or perhaps move on.
@EnoughAlready – The Editor In Chief of the Daily Mail, Paul Dacre, is a close Middleton family friend who gave them PR advise during the waity years. Its the only rag that will give print space to Pippa and James to promote whatever business they are flogging. The print edition is far more fawning about the Cambridges & Middleton than the digital edition is. In fact they had all the scope on Pippa’s fake royal wedding last year.
Erinn has a point.
Facts help support a case, and now I see why some say that about Carole. I remember someone else saying these things before.
I still maintain Kate’s family do her no favors within the BRF as a whole.
Just look at the DM, and it is painfully obvious it is print payola with some of the people they do 8 to 9 stories a day on or celebrities that no one knows who is trying to launch themselves. It isn’t unbiased.
How many beach frolicking nobodies do they have on their site nearly daily?
Kate and William did very well here, BUT my goodness what alot of waffle and filler in their statements. William has always been good at filler and waffle and projecting confidence in an interview situation until you examine what he actually said which is mostly waffle, filler and lots of nothing.
Btw, did any one notice that Kate’s accent wasn’t her usual fake put on?
By contrast Harry and Meghan were knowledgeable,
articulate, articulate and direct. Able to answer the questions asked with very little waffle and filler. To articulate what’s gone before and what they hope for the future.
It’s quite clear that without Harry’s input into the foundation, it would never have got off the ground if left to just William and Kate. Because if after seven years this is the best they could do………!!
The contrast between Meghan and Kate was really embarrassingly clear. If Catherine Quinn is the reason for this upswing in Kate’s professional life, she’s got a long way to go.
@LAK
We must not have been watching the same thing!. The only part I would slightly agree with you is Kate waffling when asked why she decided to champion mental health awareness (not a direct quote). I think that has more to do with Kate’s own alleged mental health struggles (PND?) and not being comfortable to reveal them. Other than that I think W +K did great.
I actually think this discussion highlighted the input Kate has had with the foundation as well. It was mentioned that she was an integral part of getting Head Together off the ground and that it was her idea to do the campaign and mental health marathon. If these were not factually true I don’t think Harry and his team would have allowed these to mentioned.
Whatever: Kate’s input into HT was mentioned during their PR blitz last year, so no new information was given here regarding that.
The exact same words used in the garden chat they had last year discussing how they came up with HT were used at this conference. Harry prompted, William nudged and Kate spoke. If i am not mistaken, the exact same wording.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=45RqUmxDXiY
Kate’s waffle here is MILES better than anything she has ever said unscripted. On that alone i was impressed, but the bar is set very low that i was immediately struck by Meghan’s ability to speak without waffle and filler.
As others have pointed out, if you have only just tuned into Kate this year, then we read like judgemental witches, but this is the best Kate has been in 7yrs of public life and only in the past 3months since Meghan and Catherine Quinn took charge of her.
LAK
” since Meghan and Catherine Quinn took charge of her. ”
Haha Spot on!!
I am commenting here because you all brought up Catherine Quinn. I haven’t watched the videos but have only seen photographs of today’s event. Nevertheless, I was pleasantly shocked and impressed by Kate’s appearance. I thought “wow, she looks really relaxed and appropriate; like a senior royal; like she’s experienced; well, I’ll be damned. She looks, in demeanor, better than Meghan and together she and William like look the senior couple (although that could be deliberate staging). Professional. Wow.” The addition of Catherine Quinn has been phenomenal. Now, they simply need to kick Jason to the curb. Sorry Jason.
Totally agree!
And the fact that the middletons hate competition of other women, is all there with Waitie showing some improvement beside Princess Henry I/w. It’s also telling from whiny Wilnot, that they are having ‘disagreements’ (and from the looks in the Rover with WIllnot and Cannot something is not all positive for the two workshy called out – and towards hardworking Prince/ess Henrys).
Is this the pregnancy – why do Duch middleton has that facial ‘glazed’ look …?
I was pleasantly surprised.
Meghan seems like a person who would make sure she and Kate were friendly and do a charm offensive to make it happen. I don’t see her undermining or trying to hurt Kate or make her feel insecure. She would be shrewd enough to know that would make everyone’s life a misery and isn’t suitable for the BRF. Kate seems receptive. I didn’t see any hint of animus, and I don’t believe she is an undiscovered thespian, so I am going with they get along.
They did a good job.
Having a good supportive friend and new sister could be just the thing Kate needs.
I have nothing to snark about considering it is an improvement.
LAK: It appears that Meghan is an extrovert and kate an introvert. It is a bit unfair to compare them in a q&a form versus a rehearsed speech. No amount of coaching is going to make kate a spontaneous speaker. I am an introvert, I ought to know.
Betsyh: I’ll settle for articulate and knowledgeable. Regardless of personality traits.
And if you notice, i started by saying that this q&a was a huge improvement on past performance.
Btw, i don’t think that being extroverted or introverted is the key to levels of knowledge or ability to string a sentence together.
LAK: The anxiety of speaking in front of a group of people does affect an introvert’s ability to string a sentence together.
I am an introvert, and I can do public speaking. It takes a lot of energy, but I actually do better when I’m in control of a situation and talking to people than I am when mingling socially which usually has no control!
bluhare: I see what you mean. I would better have said Kate appears to have performance anxiety that hampers her public speaking. Performance anxiety doesn’t stem from introversion..
I have a soft spot for introverts, and usually, in group situations, I can pick them out, and I zero in on them. I am an extrovert/introvert because I do get energy from being on my own sometimes but I have no qualms meeting new people or speaking in front of crowds. I was born like this, so I know introverts are wired the way they are too.
I like to make people comfortable in social situations, so I usually approach them and start a conversation, so they don’t feel even more awkward. I can relate more to Meghan because of this.
That said there are tools and things people can do to overcome that and sort of fake it.
The reason I believe this about Kate is how immediately comfortable she is with people she knows doing an event with her.
My husband is a very friendly introvert/extrovert who has to fake it sometimes.
You’re a good person magnoliarose. 🙂
I thought they all did well but I definitely felt Meghan stole the show. She didn’t mean to and you can tell she at times almost head back. I think it is just in her nature. She is the best speak there. That was obvious. But she has that background. I had trouble understanding a lot of what Kate was saying because I could barely hear her. William and Harry were the usual selves. Self aware and knowledgeable as they should be as they founded it. But after 3 months, I would say Meghan left me the most impressed and I am looking forward to seeing her additions to the foundation. The four of them will be a great team.
Even though Megs is joining the Monarchy, she is the best argument against it. Why is she the best speaker on that panel? (IMVHO). Because she worked her way up, from a humble background, to be an actress and use this to become a Celebrity ambassador for the UN. Emphasis on *worked* and *learned*.
Whilst the others…
And this is exactly how and why the Monarchy and ruling classes of the UK have survived. By absorbing the newest and the best into their ranks, and hiding behind them to such an extent you forget the extreme privilege displayed before your eyes.
Megs speaking well and mentioning #MeToo = more ability for WilliKate to hide behind fewer charity appearances and more money siphoned off for helicopter rides and fixing up Palaces that should have been fixed 20 years ago (see Buck house and delayed repairs).
Every word out of her lovely mouth perpetuates this system.
But I love her dress! So there’s that 🙂
Elaine: YES!!!
@Elaine – YES! A thousand times, YES!
Elaine
What is this humble background business? Meghan attended private school, traveled abroad, graduated from a top notch school and ran in all the right circles. Poc don’t always have humble beginnings. Agree with everything else though.
@EnoughAlready. EYEROLL. Of course POC don’t always come from humble backgrounds. I didn’t mention her race. That’s all on you. Not that it matters, but I am a POC, so don’t even think you’re going to lay that racism on me.
I put emphasis on Meghan’s having worked and earned her way in because she did. Her Father sent her to private school with his lottery win. No one is suggesting she went hungry and wore ragged clothing, but she began in humble circumstances, and did not stay there.
Her social circle, her graduating from a good Uni, her traveling, all are a result of her working and earning a good salary from a successful acting career. That is a testament to her talent and her dogged determination.
Megs herself details how, often, she didn’t have gas to get to an audition. How she worked as a calligrapher for other wealthy and successful people. That is neither my projection, nor my assumption. This is her story, the way she tells it.
Like her or don’t like her, Meghan made herself who she is today.
+1million
@ Elaine
Shows who really understand Charity- Royal Duties /the Needy (heck – middleton should be on the same level of giving back) – except the past 17 years the middletons were pretending to be Royals/aristos – indifferent to who they are/came from – middle class/ ‘commoners’ .
Agree with everyone ^^^.
@Elaine
What you said about the aristocrats was interesting and I had an epiphany of sorts. They absolutely do that and not just royals either.
@Elaine, Kate also went to private schools. Just like Meghan. The difference stands firmly in what both women *chose* to do with their, by all accounts, very expensive education.
Elaine
She traveled before she ever went away to college. Her dad was a successful Hollywood lighting director. A lot of young professionals struggle for money before they are established in their careers but that doesn’t mean they came from humble beginning’s. My stepson has a double degree from Tulane University and a trust fund and he is currently waiting tables in New York City so he can pay his rent lol. Megs had quite a comfortable middle to upper middle-class childhood.
Enoughalready: So what you are saying is that MM had a trust fund?
LAK
I’m not saying that. I don’t know if she did. Just refuting that she came from humble beginnings and her struggling financially as a starving actress doesn’t mean she was hand to mouth as a child.
@Enough Already, unless you were actually *in* the home with Meghan, Doria and Meghan’s Dad, you don’t know how much food they allocated her everyday.
Maybe she really WAS hand to mouth as a child (!) Like literally. Are we even sure they used plates?!
Sigh. There are some things, we just can’t know 😉
Elaine
You forgot about chopsticks! 🙂
Senses of humor are always welcome and refreshing.
I do think Meghan is extraordinary and I absolutely think Harry knows this. I project myself a little on Meghan because in a situation like hers I would make 100 percent sure Kate and I were friends. I would force it if I had to to keep things running smoothly and I have a high tolerance for difficult people I choose to have relationships with for reasons.
Since the BRF is here at the moment, I hope they do some charity work that is useful.
I wonder how many people in this thread are American vs British. Because I think that would help in understanding that, at most, Meghan was middle class in her upbringing. The private school she went to seems to be a pretty standard private Catholic all-girls school which, frankly, are almost a dime a dozen in the US. You have your good ones, and bad ones, and one’s right in the middle. But going to one doesn’t necessarily mean you are incredibly privileged.
It wasn’t a prep school she went to is what I’m saying. If Meghan had gone somewhere like, say, Miss Porter’s School For Girls, for example, *then* I’d buy the idea that she was privileged.
Also, he dad was a lighting director, not a director-director, or a producer or a studio head. A lighting director is, frankly, more or less a blue-color type job. It isn’t glamorous. And Meghan grew up living in The Valley, not Brentwood, or Bel Air or Beverly Hills.
As a native of SoCal myself it’s sometimes really amusing to watch people try and determine if Meghan was privileged, or call her such, when he upbringing is almost a perfect mirror for any standard middle-class person (even POC like myself) who were born and raised here.
Kate has improved a lot very recently…and it worth wondering whether Meghan coming on the scene lit a fire under her in a way that wouldn’t have happened had Harry married one of those blonde aristocrats who would’ve been painfully shy.
Regardless, I do think the two women seem to like each other, even if you can’t get a fully good read on their chemistry yet.
You know . . . I think what we are really seeing is impact of Catherine Quinn. However, given Kate’s relationship with her mom and sister as well as her demeanor, she may be the type who feels more comfortable stepping out with another woman / female companion on weightier issues. It’s hard for me to explain but she may be more confident in situations where she is competing with her looks and her body (sports)—things that she was raised to do and perhaps even praised for—than she is doing other things, particularly taking the lead.
So sad I missed this. Will look for clips etc,
I’m glad to hear about how well it went and share sentiments of @magnoliarose
I had a feeling Meghan’s professional skills would be welcomed by the BRF. I’m a bit worried they’ll tire her out but this seems a good sign they’re learning & retaining it somehow and from somewhere.
You should check DM for clips and their FB page.
I hope they don’t tire her out too, but I believe she thrives in these situations, and she can take a lot of pressure off Kate to be someone she isn’t. She doesn’t have to check all boxes anymore. She needs to work, but she can stay in her lane and shine there.
Lets hope Princess Henry I/w realize she is no longer a celeb (she actually didn’t behave like in her former profession, so to speak).
On a limb – sorry – all these celebs coming out on high powered producer/s is a bit much and taking up space in other News. These people/women all hid/tolerate for years if not decades, because they wanted stardom and millions of lifestyle at all cost – compared to coming out against the like of such behavior and values. Now we all are overloaded to listen .
Gabriella Union attack and others – fear-pain is one of the few that is valuable – just saying.
Meghan is really a gift for the Royal Family. Finally we have a modern, opinionated woman and not a 1950s housewife.
Thank you, Meghan.
I agree. Even seeing them sitting side by side is like seeing two women from two different generations even though they are very close in age.
During the livefeed, I was struck by the difference between the two couples. One couple was very articulate and knowledgeable and the other was not. Kate and William use so much filler and waffle in their sentences with very little substance.
THIS!
You know I couldn’t put my finger on it but that’s it.
Absolutely agree with you, Judy and Mostly and LAK. I’m with BEEB here.
The Daily Mail comments about her are utterly vicious. Let’s hope the angry xenophobes and racists dislike Meghan so much that it is enough to topple the entire monarchy. That would be a real gift to the British. Plus, Meghan is too good to waste her time with the royals.
Hooray for British republicans, the only kind of republican that doesn’t make me want to burn stuff down.
They’re just disgusting. I don’t know how any sane and decent person–keywords being ‘sane’ and ‘decent’– can watch that video and come away with a bad impression of Meghan out of everyone on that stage.
Umm, yeah three cheers for racism…
I don’t think it’s a coincidence that on the DM and Twitter almost all of the Meghan haters are also effusive Trump supporters. I mean what could they possibly not like about Meghan… There was one especially angry Meghan hater on Twitter and when I looked at her profile she was a huge Trump and LePen supporter spewing hatred of races and immigrants, so that was all I needed to know there!
When Harry said we are family and we are forever i got goosebumps. And i usually have unexplained hate towards royals.
It’s like Markle was the missing piece and they are all aware that they can do something good
I stand by my belief that Meghan will be shut up by the BRF on topics that are the least bit political, including this one, which I don’t see as political, but others do. Why else did she give up her UN charity, which wasn’t controversial at all!?!
Time will tell.
The BRF doesn’t work with the UN.
LAK, I know that! My point was when she got engaged she gave that up. Why? Cause the BRF won’t let her work with them, even though what she was doing wasn’t controversial.
This made my point for me. Meghan will be obedient and do exactly what she is told, just like all the other members of the BRF do. She is showing just how obedient she is already. And yes, I said “obedient.” Because when you follow arbitrary rules made by someone, and you are an adult, you are being obedient. We all have a certain number of rules we have to follow. The ones of the BRF just seem to be arbitrary and numerous.
She gave up all her previous charities because she has to fit in with the rest of the BRF’s work, that’s true, but she will be far less constrained than you’re making out. Look at Camilla’s and Charles’s work, which would likely be seen as political in the US, but isn’t in the UK.
She’s got an incredible platform from which she can make a difference and I’m so happy she’s not shying away from using it. If seeing her get out there prompts Kate to do the same, even better.
William looks like a potato 🙁 . Thank you Meghan for speaking out.
Meghan seems great. I think a lot of people are putting her on a pedestal. She will disappoint as when you are on a pedestal there’s only one way to go.
I don’t think people are being fair to William and Kate.
Why do you think she is being built up right now? Because if she makes a perceived mistake, then people will tear her down. Especially the media since that is what they do.
I think the criticism of William and Kate stems from their having every opportunity and all the time in the world to step up like this-and it’s taken years to finally see it. I do notice (from following them on their official IG platforms) that in the last few months William, and now Kate, have increased their workload. I think that’s great (and about f-ing time.) But to say people aren’t being ‘fair” is silly. They haven’t all suddenly emerged as senior members of the BRF-they’ve been receiving the perks of those positions without doing the work up until very recently.
Kate, William, and Harry all said they would become full time last September. William and Harry did but Kate was delayed due to illness.
Agreed Cynical Ann.
William did less work in 2017 than in 2016, despite being “full time” since September 2017.
I don’t think people have her on a pedestal. She is trashed as often as praised especially in the media. People’s issues with William and/or Kate was happening long before Meghan entered the picture. They had a reputation for being lazy. It has been recent that they seemed to be doing more.
It has taken seven years to get to this point, and as LAK points out so well, there is still less “there” to what W&K actually said. They’ve gotten better at saying the same talking points they’ve been saying for years? Maybe Catherine Quinn is better at getting them to memorize an elevator speech. She might even be able to teach Kate Middleton how to pronounce palliative after all these years.
Whether or not they have been “full-time”, the effort to try to be professional hasn’t been there. If they had been showing up prepared, engaged, and able to articulate themselves for their engagements in the past? They wouldn’t have earned so much criticism. Instead we’ve had 7 years of them not even reading their prep notes – and William telling people that proudly during engagements.
We’ll see how this goes. I wanted Harry and whomever he married to split off a separate Foundation, so am disappointed to see them lumped in here. As has happened in the past, I expect W&K to take credit for the work being done by Harry and now Meghan under the banner of this foundation.
@NOTA, totally agree. William and Kate are a real disappointment in many ways and I doubt that will change any time soon.
+1
She will realize though that she can tone down her ‘force’ some – her HRH status globally means can use her status/resources and ‘get it done’!
Former actress???
– Does royal protocol permit the royal family members to have careers outside of royal work?
She’s a full time Royal. That’s her “job” now. She quit Suits and has no plans to continue as an actress. She’s also shuttered her blog, which was her side gig.
Once she is a working royal, and she would hace to be one, she would be a former actress. Sophie Rhys Jones tried to mantain her bussiness but after a scandal she had to let go. It can mean a conflict of interest for the Crown.
Meghan will have a new job as a working royal, and it is quite obvious she will not be an actress.
If you are not a working royal, just a member of the family, your spouse can keep working, but this would.not be the case.
Yes. Sophie did for years. But royal work and health issues eventually wore her out.
Sophie and Edward were never intended to be full-time royals. Those engagement numbers she racked up – more than KM has ever worked in a year? That was while she was still running her PR company and the royal work was “on the side”.
The sting operation against her meant they needed to close up shop on outside work and be “royal only”. Duchess of York did write childrens books starting before their divorce, but I don’t remember what percentage she kept vs. what was given to charity.
I like her so much already
Good for her! I’m glad she’s saying that. On another note, I like her dress.
Kate’s, this is not my favorite of her outfits. It’s hard to believe they are close in age, looking at their skin.
I think part of that may be the pregnancy, to be fair to Kate. She tends to get a little puffy and dry-looking when she’s expecting. She normally looks much younger. Also, very pale people do tend to age more quickly. I’m, sadly, speaking from experience as a Scandinavian around the same age as both women. I have biracial cousins who are a decade older than me and still look to be in their 20s. I’m not bitter. 😉
Being underweight and being a smoker hasnt helped Kate either. Both age you prematurely. Kate always looks better when she is in her third trimester because her face fills out to what it would presumably be if she maintained a healthier weight. And she was a smoker for years. I don’t know if she still is but that has definitely played a role in how her skin looks.
I do think Kate looks better pregnant, very healthy. Just the texture of her skin doesn’t match her age. Maybe it is the smoking.
She does look good here though!
Yes, Meghan has good genes on her side. Kate’s dieting, smoking and sun is catching up with her.
I don’t like the hem of the dress (I wasn’t sure if it was a dress or a a jumpsuit when I looked at that first pic) or the giant ankle straps of the shoes. But I like the top half of the dress, and I really do hope her & Kate get along. I’ve maintained all along both of those ladies need each other to survive in that family.
I have old skin, and am this age. Genetics, a life long battle with depression and anxiety, Two kids, one with epilepsy, and a lot of time in the sun have done it. But it’s the skin I’ve got, so I hope not too many people are looking at me and going ‘I can’t believe she’s that age, her skin is terrible’.
Here we go!! Let’s all mock Kate’s skin compared to meghan’s. Kate looks old, haggard, she is wearing a wig while Meghan is a goddess the likes of which has never been seen.
All on a site that smacks you if you say these things about the wrong person.
Sheesh.
Because sometimes it IS racist. I will call it as I see it. If you aren’t racist, it should not bother you.
I concur with Magnoliarose!
@magnoliarose, the point being made is that even a valid criticism of Meghan, such as she hangs onto Harry too much when they are supposedly working, is called racist. There are no valid criticisms of Meghan allowed in the world according to some – they are ALL racist.
And that is just not so.
Heaven forbid two people in love show PDA. Horrors.
I was very happy she said something. We can’t make gender equality and women’s empowerment a “political” issue. It should not be controversial to believe in equality between genders.
I really like Megs dress, and Kate’s is just fine for a maternity dress.
Same. Kate looks cute, it’s difficult to sit still like that in the final months of pregnancy. I give her credit.
Henry I/w shoe is lovely too.
I enjoy seeing all of them together.
I watched some of this and yea I thought it went really well. They have a lot of chemistry between the four of them. They covered a few topics and all in all a good look for the BRF.
Meghan supporting Times Up is great but not surprising? I mean that was (one of) her big philanthropy focuses was women’s rights. I would’ve been more shocked otherwise. And yes Times Up shouldn’t be political but we are fooling ourselves if we think it isn’t to many many people
Your right. Times Up and Me Too originated in the industry Meghan used to work in and she probably knew/met/socialised with the people involved (the victims and the preditors). Add in her previous work with women’s rights and it’s no surprise she is supporting the movements.
Metoo originated in 1997 …
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/20/us/me-too-movement-tarana-burke.html
I like Megan’s dress, but considering the temperature in England right now, I am missing sleeves.
I think it looks pretty ridiculous. It’s snowing right now!
Her coat probably has sleeves. I’m often in short sleeves indoors during the winter because the heat is turned up too high.
Not indoors surely. Why would that matter if you have a coat to run to a warm car?
Does that mean that Kate probably wore a coat to the event and actually took it off instead of sitting in it while on stage?
Photos of their arrival show Kate wearing a coat.
She’s inside. And she’s under lights-it was probably hot on stage. It’s navy blue-hardly a summer dress.
I also could not understand why she chose sleeveless in this cold weather, maybe that was the best dress she could get hold of.
This isn’t based on anything other than my feeling looking at these photos but I think these four make a good team and maybe Meghan isn’t the second coming but she might be the missing puzzle piece for them to finally find their groove? Took them a while.
They all look great. Although William needs to stop with the history professor style. Dude, you’re 35!
I recently purchased a Calvin Klein dress that looks identical, and at a fraction of the cost. Just in case anyone else loves this style.
Fashion commentary aside, it is so crucial that at least Meghan is being outspoken about this. Women, we know what we want. We know our minds. We know our bodies. We’ve been unheard for so long. Even worse for our mothers, grandmothers and great-grandmothers. Maybe Meghan can get Kate on board and make her care/understand that this is not a political movement but a human Right’s one.
I think Meghan looks great. Kate looks nice too. That color works well for her. Sitting on a stage like that though – a longer dress probably would have worked better and been more comfortable. Oh well.
I’m glad Meghan said something about Times Up. I’m sure it was intentional, although probably not directly aimed at Kate. I feel like she is just making the point that its NOT political and if it is deemed political by some – oh well again, she’s going to say what she wants because womens rights are important to her. She’s not going to send coded messages via black ribbons.
(at the time I didn’t really care that Kate didn’t wear black to the BAFTAs, but as time as gone on I find myself getting angrier about it, which is silly.)
@Becks, I understand the irrational anger! When I first saw a picture from the BAFTAS, I thought “Oh, Kate’s in a dark green dress and wearing emeralds.” But when the additional explanations came (“she can’t wear all black because blah, blah”, “the black sash was a nod to the #Time’sUp”), I got frustrated at the lack of respect their PR team shows to the public by trying to pass off obvious lies and excuses as truths.
Agreed. I wasn’t bothered by Kate’s choice because I didn’t figure she’d wear black, and that’s her right. But what bothered me were the BS excuses that came after the fact. It’s just so insulting to people’s intelligence.
That was the part that bothered me too. They were lies, and that was annoying when we all knew it wasn’t true.
Precisely. I am so not here for shaming women for their clothes. But I am also not here for insulting lies about suffragette emeralds.
Sexual-harassment is not political but neither is racism, gay rights, wage equality or gender equality. Where was the royal family or the queen on these issues when people were in London protesting and rioting in the streets? They wouldn’t have been caught dead supporting these issues publicly. This and Meghan looks lovely.
The younger royals are testing waters. Since Markle isn’t royal yet, this is like a trial version…
But i do ship Markle and Middleton. Girl power in blue.
I feel the same. Meghan has a bit more freedom and people already know she is an active feminist strong in her beliefs of female rights. So her saying this (and getting overwhelming support) opens the doors for the future. She is the perfect royal to tackle those issues without the family and they are smart to use her in that way. It is all a game of chess.
Totally agree. I think it’s good that Meghan has said this and I think it’s an indicator she will keep speaking her mind about women’s/girls’ rights issues. I hope she doesn’t let the grey men silence her. These are not political issues, they are human rights’ issues and should not be ignored by the royals.
Good for her! By not treating these issues like some scary topic that can’t be touched, you take the drama away from it. She just simply said where she stands and that’s that.
Regardless of how I feel about any of them…I’m excited to watch Meghan do her thing. Between the engagement photo dress, the unconventional engagement interview, the suit at the event, the sleeveless dress today and the women’s rights comments, she’s clearly going to plow her own road and doesn’t seem to give a hoot about how things ‘used to be done’ and I’m here for it. She’s going to make mistakes and piss some people off but omg this is going to be fun! Go Meghan!
I watch parts of it and yes they all seemed engaged in what they were saying – Katie Keen still needs to work on her public speaking as she was the weakest one when you watch all 4 of them interact.
Harry and Meghan were the young and chic couple, very engaged and informed. Katie Keen and William looked like a boring middle aged couple who were trying to keep up with the young uns. I was always instantly drawn to H&M whenever they spoke, when W&K spoke I tuned out – she’s still rocking that fake posh accent and he can’t help but make jibes/jokes at Harry (William never misses a chance to put Harry down).
And am glad Meghan mentioned MeToo and TimesUp – just goes to prove the point that Katie Keen COULD have said something to support it and chose not to even though William did. She (KK) has a LONG way to go to prove she cares about anything other than what designer clothes she can buy and alter.
I was struck by the difference between the couples. William and Kate are the weaker half and without Harry’s input, i do not think that foundation would have gone as far as it has. They spoke with so much filler and waffle and barely able to articulate their vision. When Harry and Meghan started speaking, the contrast was really marked.
And the BBC lunchtime news was snarky about Kate because they reported on the other 3 and included a clip of each one speaking whilst Kate was described as Meghan’s ‘future sister in law’ whilst camera swept past her. No clip of Kate speaking or summary of what she said. Maybe in later braodcasts?!
Yes ITA that the foundation would have been dead in the water without Harry. W&K stuck to (or tried to) their talking points and briefing notes as both Harry and Meghan went off script and made things relatable. You could see the desire to help from them, whereas for the other two it was a just a good PR stunt.
LOL that’s prob because she gives them nothing to work with so they don’t even bother any more. She says nothing of note or interest and they have clearly given up trying to make her interesting.
I agree with LAK , W&K need H&M but fear being outshone. Meghan is the most confident and intelligent of the four, and I had a sense of William being worried that she will overtake everything. I can imagine Meghan being rather bossy in a sweet way.
I’m surprised we got access to this. Although this is the first Forum that has been done, right? Usually it is a set of closed-door meetings a few times a year.
This is the first forum.
Perhaps this is why Kate didn’t ditch to go shopping instead?!
😉
This was a great opportunity to create the PR idea that its the fab four, the modern future of the Monarchy. I think we all know which couple will do all the work for the foundation, with the other riding on their coattails.
Thou I can’t believe Meghan used the ‘hit the ground running’ on royal duties – i cringed so bad. Look what happened the last time we heard that one – we’re still waiting on her hitting the ground.
Digital Unicorn (aka Betti) : i cringed too. But for Kate. Without meaning to do so, MM is saying words heavily applied to Kate which turned out to be disappointments in the context of Kate.
Love this new feminist Duchess.
“…you will hear people saying they are helping women find their voices. I fundamentally disagree with that because women don’t need to find their voices, they need to be empowered to use it and people need to be urged to listen.”
Oh wow, this is fabulous. This needs to be plastered everywhere. We have voices — they’re good ones — just stop trying to shut us up. LISTEN.
She’s the most articulate of the bunch. She made original, concise statements.
I have heart-eyes.
😍😍
We both do.
I found Harry to be the least articulate of them all and that was surprising. He came off like a child with three adults, it was really odd.
I do appreciate an honest comment and observation, which yours is.
Harry did not skip the Paraolympic games on home turf using “work” as an excuse. Like his future King brother did, and was caught on holiday with his wife, future Queen Consort, mother of the another future King, with her bits showing. Gleaming with glee. Reporters talking on record about some sort of marital activity.
It was referred to coyly as Kate and William engaged in an “intimate act of marriage.” Those living outside the UK have seen the published pics.
The Cambridge’s are lazy. There’s ample evidence over the arc of the marriage. They’re not much chop at their jobs because they have not put any effort into them. Funny, that. They get away with it because no-one in the UK dares to critique them honestly.
Harry has more charm but is also cut from the same cloth. He’s drifted since leaving the army, done a few interesting things BUT only what interests him personally, so I’d put him in the dilettante camp up to this point. Same with Meghan. More hype than work re. the handful of charity gigs so far. The couple exude charm and enthusiasm so let’s hope it translates into lots of activity that is meaningful to others rather than just good personal PR.
@ Marnie: interesting comment, I haven’t seen the video, wish I could. Isn’t he the only one of the four that does not have a university degree? Not that that dictates intellect in all cases, but it often leads to a more extensive vocabulary/speaking skills (speech 101 class for all freshmen at my uni)
He’s dyslexic and went to Sandhurst for officer training. It is a tradition with aristocrats that the second son becomes an officer in the military.
Meghan is very articulate and loved her chic outfit. The contrast in the 2 couples was interesting. The old stodgy royals and the new modern royals.
We all know Meghan is a great public speaker. I’m really surprised this site hasn’t highlighted her speech at the UN (I think this was in 2016) where she spoke about female empowerment and women’s equality where she talked about writing to the manufacturers of a soap company because she found their ad to be sexist at the age of 11. I highly suggest you watch it, it’s a great listen. You can watch her speech here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMoVen6_XuA
She will make missteps as she learns more about her new role but there has been ample evidence that she has done charity work, she is good at public speaking, and she has the kind of smile that really lights up her entire face. Considering she has done that and her overall work as an actress, this event was probably so easy for her. And the fact she actually name dropped Time’s Up and Me Too is a big deal. William danced around the subject at the BAFTAs and while Kate didn’t wear black, they both had multiple opportunities to comment about it way before Time’s Up was an official movement. I wonder if Meghan will be discouraged from mentioning that again in the future but seriously I’m so glad she said something as a former actress.
As for the fashion, both Kate and Meghan looked comfortable and I like to think they coordinated their shades of blue.
The big difference between the two is that Kate is very much the introvert and Meghan the extrovert. Extroverts like to talk, introverts like to listen. Kate wasn’t tried to compete with Meghan, which was good. The usually banter betweeen the two brothers. I couldn’t help but think that Diana would be happy to see them like this. And Kate again in blue! Methinks it’s a boy. 😊
From the outside, we cannot tell that about either of them. Some insist Kate Middleton is an introvert, but the stories from her schooling years put the lie to that. Many actors are introverted, which is often sited as to why they got into acting.
Myself, I’m a big introvert but am required to act like an extrovert for my job.
Agreed. I’m an introvert who hates public speaking but I am good at it. That’s not a brag or a humblebrag, I’m good at it because I hate it but have been required to do it so I practice, practice, practice. And the things I have been complimented on, appearing engaged and empathetic, I attribute directly to being introverted. Kates not a good public speaker because she didn’t bother to practice, it is a skill.
Maybe when Kate seemed like an extrovert at college and in her 20s, her partying years, she was drinking. I used alcohol for years to hide that I am really an introvert, being out and about like an extrovert.
The stories stem from middle school, where she earned the nickname MiddleBum because she loved flashing her bare bum at the boys. Teachers admitted having to have a talk with her about it to get her to stop.
Kate cannot compete with Meghan. Kate hasn’t shown nothing of substance or meaningful since she became Duchess of Cambridge. FFS she didn’t even have competition to land William. She is where she is because of the millions spent by her parents and Wills decision to marry her as she was the last one standing after a decade of waiting.
Can we at least give Kate some credit for upping her engagements lately? And we have yet to see what Meghan will do.
@Maria, I am not giving Kate any credit for the time being. She’s had more time to prepare for royal work than what it takes for an undergraduate degree and at least an MA. And keeping a part time job and maybe family to take care of. She’s done less than 100 engagements a year mainly photo ops and recording videos. Let’s see what she does in the next 5 years.
@Maria To be perfectly honest, no, not really.
A couple of months working more after almost seven years isn’t really anything to be praised. Yes, it’s good that she’s doing it, but only because she should have been doing it all along. If she were only one or two years into the marriage, that might be different, but I don’t think she deserves credit for finally getting round to doing the bare minimum once all of her other excuses have been extinguished.
Also, taking so long to get going says that there’s something external making her work more now, rather than it coming from herself. Whether it’s Catherine Quinn, a sharp talking to from the palace about her numbers, competition, or whatever else. So why should she get credit for what something/someone else caused her to do?
So, Meghan has been engaged four months?? And done, what, 4 events?? Before we crown her Queen of Everything, can we see how much she is doing a year or two in? Maybe being pregnant? Or having young kids.
I agree that Kate has always needed to do more, but Harry is not ambitious, and I expect Meghan to sink to his level, doing the bare minimum. She is not going to outwork her brother in law, the future King. And laziness is just the young royal way.
Meghan has already done more at this point that KM had done at the same point in their lives (the engagement period). Let’s give her credit for *already* working more than Kate Middleton. MM has a career because she worked hard and is ambitious. I don’t expect those traits to disappear, just like I don’t expect Kate Middleton’s lifelong laziness to disappear.
I do believe she isn’t naturally extroverted in professional situations. I don’t think it is natural. She seems easily intimidated and unsure often.
She does better in a group.
I see some improvements, and I am glad for it.
Is it just me, it seems as though William tries to put Harry down, belittle Harry. It use to seem like brotherly banter but it’s more than that.
Harry and Meghan should crave out separate agendas from W&K and separate their offices from the Cambridge’s. H&M will be more successful if they do so.
Definitely separate agendas. Otherwise Kate and Wills will just ride on Meghan and Harry’s work, experience and charisma. Yeah, let’em do all the work while getting the photo op and pretending to be knowledgeable/involved.
@SoulSPA
Why do you continue to imply that work the foundation does it all Harry’s work and W +K just take credit? It was pointed out just today in the discussion that Kate had an integral hand in getting Head Together/Mental Health Awareness off the ground as well as coming up with ideas to promote the initiative. This shows that this foundation is a collaborative effort and not a one-man thing. Kate now has her own sub-section within MH awareness to focus on children, women and parents and nearly all of her public engagements center around this sub-section. Harry didn’t come up with that. It shows that she is putting the work in for the foundation and the cause.
It’s odd how you to choose to ignore the facts (that Harry himself hasn’t disputed) to push this agenda of yours.
Whatever: it’s been obvious for years that WK take the credit for Harry’s work. Different areas might be listed for the different Patrons, but it is Harry doing the actual work. The proof is in the pudding in their ability to articulate the areas they supposedly Patron / work on.
All the areas Willuam so proudly mentioned are actually Harry’s areas with years of work to back that up. Yet his work is credited to the foundation which in turn is credited to WK.
Harry ALWAYS differs to William because of status. That is just the way they roll in the family. As brothers they love each other dearly, but as a family they always differ to status.
@LAK
I think its easier to articulate and show how something like the Invictus Games helps injured soldiers with their mental health as opposed to how an initiative helps children, women and new parents. Kate has arguably picked the harder areas to focus on which makes it harder for her to see the results of what she is doing. MHA around children, women and new parents is a very, very complicated minefield.
Showing up and telling people that essentially you don’t develop mental health issues if you have loving parents? Mental Health is too big and complex of an area for Kate Middleton to take on, in any format.
Seriously @ whatever, i take it you’ve only just started paying attention to these 3?
Harry has been working on these issues since he was 19yrs old. He shown progress for over a decade. His particular special interests were incorporated into the Foundation and were / are the areas of growth within the foundation.
Further, he was discussing mental health a long time ago. In the context of IG before it was taken under the umbrella of the foundation. He gave interviews about it. At best William showed up for afew IG games and that was that. Now that it is a success, the foundation, but really WK, are claiming credit.
William’s specialty is conservation, and Harry has applied himself more in that area than William ever has. Harry has articulated ideas and or thoughts that show his increasing knowledge of the subject despite not being his area of interest until a couple of years ago. William? Not so much. Not even when the media pointed out that he was about to publicly endorse a conservation project that abused animals on the side.
As a collective they can discuss Harry’s projects because those are the ones being worked on by Harry and showing growth. They can’t say the same for WK’s areas unless Harry has kickstarted their projects and moved them along.
The HT campaign is a classic Harry campaign. It followed the usual PR path he follows leading upto the launch of any of his projects. Until the big push PR campaign ahead of the marathon, there was little awareness of it and WK barely featured in any of it’s advance publicity.
Kate might have thought up the idea to bring the different mental health strands together, but she isn’t following through on it as shown by her inability to discuss the process with knowledge except to repeat the talking points of their PR campaign per the video i posted upthread. She repeatedly needs prompting to remind her that she started it per the PR campaign. Doesn’t deviate from those PR points to offer any insight beyond them.
@LAK
Do you think Harry innately allows it because he was brought up to support William? I do think they love each other, but I sense some jealousy or something from William or snark with meaning.
Or do you think Harry does it because he likes it and it keeps the institution going, so it is for the good of all?
@LAK
Harry may have talked about Mental Health for ages but so what? it’s not a race. Someone like Kate may have only decided to focus on this area after experiencing her own mental health issues later on in life. And if her realisation came much later than Harry it doesn’t make her less worthy to champion the cause. Also excluding the Invictus Games and Head’s Together, what did Harry achieve by talking about mental health ages ago? Did he manage to change laws? get extra funding for the NHS so plebs could get the help and support they required?
The area’s the Kate is focusing are incredibly complex, it’s going to take more than hosting Invictus style games to solve the issues children, women and new parents are dealing with.
@magnoliarose
If I were William, I’d be jealous of Harry too. William has lived with the shadow of the crown looming over him since birth. Every life decision he’s ever made has been calculated and evaluated by third parties due to that. Conversely, Harry has been allowed a great degree of personal freedom in exchange for his immense privilege and, for all the talks of him being thrown under the bus by or for William, I feel people tend to forget what sort of scandal he walked away from relatively unscathed. Had future king William been spotted roaming naked at parties or caught dressing up as a Nazi for fun (a display made all the more lamentable given former King Edward VIII’s support of Hitler), the public and journalistc uproar would have been unparalleled. Comparatively speaking, Harry got away lightly with his repeated offenses.
Does the palace “prefer” for Harry to be caught in a scandal rather than William? Obviously. Does the press feel more comfortable addressing Harry’s transgressions than their future king’s? Sure. But if William had done a quarter of what his younger brother has, he wouldn’t have been as softly handled as Harry was either.
@whatever KW have a whole establishment to make them look better. I am not convinced. It’s hard for me at least to believe that they are honest in their endeavours. From a History of Arts and Geography major. Harry has years of experience on mental health if only for his military career and work with war veterans (military in active combat are affected by stress and trauma long term if not cared for).
I am not convinced either by William’s “cleaner image”. He’s pulled the D card way too often. He’s shown to despise his privilege instead of honouring it. So no, I am not convinced.
Whatever: Clearly you don’t know that mental health is how Harry came to the idea of IG. IG is the direct result of his mental health awareness and advocacy.
He discussed the mental difficulty of veterans and how physical activity helped their mental health and brought them back from the brink. He discussed the help he got in the wake of his tours of Afghanistan, particularly the flight with a wounded soldier.
He started with Help for Heroes and moved along to WWTW. As a result of that he visited the American warrior games which he morphed into IG.
Discussing mental health as he went along.
It’s not a marathon, and i’m not saying Kate should back off. What i would like to see is input into an area she claims to be keen on. Instead she repeats talking points from a PR campaign. For someone who started a movement, she seems passionless about it, no?
All the IG participants, qualifiers and those inspired, have given public testimony about the difference it’s made in their lives. IG has inspired more to use sport to work their way back into society in emotional terms which has led to improved lives.
Saying that Harry’s mental health advocacy hasn’t changed any laws or govt funding is a deliberately obtuse point to make when you know that the royals as constitutional institution can’t work to change our laws directly or work in govt areas directly no matter that Charles is trying. They can only affect social change. Therefore your disparaging point applies equally to Kate.
Magnoliarose: Harry was raised to support William. Always. It’s something we haven’t seen in previous heirs and spares. Harry always differs to William to the point of letting him take credit for his work.
As early as the first humanitarian award he was given by the Atlantic Council in 2012. He included William in his speech when William had verifiably not participated in the activity for which he was being honoured.
42istheanswer: As William told Matt Lauer in an interview, he is much wilder than Harry. A royal reporter, Robert Jobson, has admitted on more than one occasion that the media continually cover up William’s misdeeds.
The heir vs Spare media policy is alive and well because it allows the public to assume that the heir is well behaved and or not as bad as the exposed spare.
There are plenty of William incidents that have been covered up or not allowed to gain public traction BECAUSE he is the heir.
…but you are right, if the public truly knew what has been swept aside and or covered up for William, there would be pitchforks at the gates of BP.
Harry as the spare has no defined role. He has to make his role whatever that might be. William is unlucky to be sandwiched between 2 people, his father and brother, who are determined to create their roles. Then again he lacks the passion and motivation and can easily hide behind the madeup false constraints of his role and being the son of Diana when he needs to undo whatever mis-step he has taken.
@LAK
Of course William has got away with some things. But the notion that there is, in a vault somewhere, pictures or evidence depicting William behaving nearly as appallingly as his brother used to is, I’m sorry to say, preposterous. The British press, by and large, tends to be fairly accomodating to the Royal Family’s heirs because their readership is, by and large, favourable to the continuation of the monarchy. However, there is one thing the British press loves even more than the RF and it’s selling papers. The “Harry the Nazi” frontpage sold millions of copies, an equally incriminating cover with William would have sold double that. Easily.
Is there an heir/spare policy? Of course. Are spares more comfortable targets for the media? Sure. But that principle is not nearly as absolute as you make it sound. It is merely a mitigating factor in the sole truly absolute rule of the UK press : scandal sells.
If there’s a really juicy scandal involving anyone, including a misbehaving heir, the UK tabloids are not going to hide it. Not now, not ever. It so happens that the RF’s spares have a tendency to behave stupidly in more overt and unambiguous ways than most humans, including their elders, thereby providing the media with all the amunitions they seek : Margaret was charming, beautiful and charismatic but she was also unspeakably vain, quite idiotic and stupendously self-unaware; Andrew can be warm and funny but the poor man doesn’t have two brain cells to rub together and is entitled beyond anyone’s wildest dream; as for Harry, he is personable, handsome and social but he, like his uncle and great-aunt, isn’t the sharpest tool in the shed and has no sense of either history or consequences.
Are their older siblings just as bad in their private life? Possible, even likely, but they at least have the basic sense not to make it painfully and obviously visible at every opportunity.
She has a point. The reporter who broke the Nazi costume story was promised a pic of William at the party in a gorilla suit. His editor loved the idea but when he arrived and saw the pics they weren’t clear enough. The source just happened to ask if maybe pics of Harry as a Nazi would do. The reporter was so excited he had to force himself not to overplay his hand. History turns on a dime doesn’t it?
As for Harry, it would be unfair to deny him credit for his work with mental health but it would be equally unfair to deny that Harry has said he wouldn’t even have sought counseling for himself had William not pushed him. Mental health initiatives need all the help they can get.
@ LAK
Yes, I do know that mental health is how he started IG. That was obvious.
Re- All the IG participants gaving public testimonies about the difference it’s made in their lives….. This proves my point that it’s much easier to articulate and show how an event like IG has helped injured veterans. Harry wasn’t toiling around for years on his own, with no resources, desperate to come up with something new and revolutionary to help the cause. The model for the Warrior Games was already there which helped speed up the process so we can now see the tangible benefits of the Invictus Games.
For the particular areas that Kate supports, it’s going have to take something new and revolutionary to make changes because the sad reality is society has to change and that could take many, many decades to come to fruition. Could she have articulated her future plans better? sure, but where do you even begin with that when the task ahead is so complex?
42istheanswer: It is fact that JLP traded bad Harry stories to cover bad William stories going back decades. You choose to be skeptical about the veracity of a journalist willing to say on record that a vault exists of stuff William has done that they aren’t allowed to report on, and that is your prerogative. He has repeated his claim in reputable media, and we have William’s own boasting that whatever Harry has done, William has done worse, but it is not reported on.
My other point regarding the heir vs spare policy which i will repeat is the fact that it operates in such a way that stories about the heir when they emerge and can’t be suppressed, are reported to a public that has already been gaslighted into thinking the spare is worse. It doesn’t excuse the stupid things the spares do, but it goes a long way in shaping the images of the ‘saintly by comparison’ image of the heir.
With very few exceptions, that policy has held since the second world war.
Scandal sells, but the media only breaks the code only if selling out the heir doesn’t damage the media in the long-term and by that i mean steps taken by the royals that could lead to curbing of press freedom. Every royal reporter admits that they can’t report negative stories on HM, *Charles or William as they wish and at any rate, the stories are made to disappear almost as soon as they appear. That extends to their spouses. The media may snark from time to time, but in the main they stay on the right side of the line.
*exception rather than rule + willingness of Charles / Diana to be the primary sources to journalists.
Whatever: No one has claimed that Harry was toiling away on his own. No one thinks Kate is toiling away on her own.
Further, you are agreeing with my points regarding Harry being the driving force behind the royal foundation’s programmes because we see the tangible results of his efforts and the other two are able to talk about them AFTER he has simplified their concepts into tangibles.
If WK had similar effort and or vision, we might have similar tangible results from them.
@LAK
Actually no I’m not agreeing with you. We have different opinions and will have to just agree to disagree on this. But what I will say is that the only reason Harry is able to talk about the benefits of IG is because he used an idea that already existed, a previous idea which already showed the benefits he wanted. If Harry (and his team of advisors) had to come up with something completely from scratch, for much more complicated areas of MH it’s very likely we would still be waiting a long time to see what the benefits/results could be.
Mental health awareness with injured and uninjured military veterans is one of those areas where so much has been already been done to raise awareness through various charities and initiatives like the Royal British Legion, Help for Heroes, The Warrior Games etc…that getting the ball rolling for improving what has gone before and getting people interested in this area wouldn’t be all that difficult. Now try doing the same for mental health and the effects it has on new parents for example…you just wouldn’t get the same amount of traction. It’s practically taboo.
Harry admits he “stole the idea” from the Americans. Would it be better in your mind’s eye that the Invictus Games and all the people they help not exist because you want Harry to have no credit? Really?
There is definitely a vault somewhere, likely in Rupert Murdoch’s study.
William killing two different endangered species of bird. William’s sexcapade in a club stairwell caught on CCTV. WIlliam stumbling drunk to a car, snogging Kate Middleton (to take the heat of the Uncle Gary scandal), then getting behind the wheel and driving. William’s reckless driving across another estate. William dressing as an “African Native” for the party as verified by the shopkeeper. KM’s comments about how William was basically absent for the first 5-6 months of their son’s life disappearing into the ether. William’s co-workers complaining that he didn’t show up at EAAA for weeks on end, covered up when a William insider was installed at head of EAAA.
List. Goes. On.
@LAK
Robert Jobson worked as a “journalist” for the ever-so-reliable London Evening Standard and is the self-promoting author of numerous books on the RF which are so heavily researched and cross-referenced that he has been writing a new one virtually every year for the past decade… I don’t just take this man’s word with a grain of salt, I don’t take it at all.
Royal reporters everywhere, be it England or any other monarchical nation, have the adorable habit of making themselves sound important by alluding to scandals they know of but are forced to keep secret. This air of secrecy gives their profoundly dull and quite frankly idiotic job an aura of mystery and importance it otherwise lacks for the simple reason it doesn’t deserve it.
If Buckingham Palace truly had the means to make evidence of scandals disappear, they wouldn’t have had so many befall them for the past 60 years (including quite a few about heirs aside from Charles). If they could pressure journalists into keeping quiet about their trangressions, they would have used all that alleged power to keep their extremely dodgy financial dealings out of the public eye because those scandals are far more damaging to their image than any private life related story ever could be. Yet, every time a new “rich Brits who evade taxation by stocking money in a foreign bank account” story breaks, here are the Windsors: named, shamed and absolutely incapable of shielding themselves. How many tax haven stories involving the Queen herself have broken over the past fifteen years alone?
Again, I am not denying the heir vs. spare policy. It obviously exists. But there is no doubt whatsoever: if the British tabloids had a picture of William supremely pissed , naked at a party, dressed up as a Nazi or anything even remotely that scandalous, they would publish it with glee, heir be damned.
As for William telling the world he’s done much worse than his brother but never got caught, you choose to interpret it as boasting whime I, for one, see that as a fairly standard “normalisation” move designed to make Harry’s transgressions appear trivial in comparison to some more serious (imaginary) offenses. It’s the “we all made dumb mistakes when we were young, why single out X” defense.
@whatever –
RE: “The area’s the Kate is focusing are incredibly complex, it’s going to take more than hosting Invictus style games to solve the issues children, women and new parents are dealing with.”
This stood out to me and I want to add my thoughts and state that W&K’s goal isn’t more complex than Harry’s. ALL 3 of them are simply choosing to **raise awareness** on the importance of mental health for their respective chosen demographics. No one is trying to “solve” anything. The Invictus games are simply a more high-profile and flashy way to raise awareness. However, that should not take away from the substantive part of the subject matter. Nor should it overshadow what W&K are doing, if I may add. W&K could also organize some sort of event (doesn’t have to be reoccurring) or borrow someone’s idea. As you mentioned, this is exactly what Harry did. I don’t discount him, nor would I discount W&K for the same methods if they chose to do so. There’s certainly no need to reinvent the wheel. My overall point is that raising awareness is a less involved task than solving problems. Despite focusing on differing groups, W&K don’t have harder roads in front of them. Showing how mental healthcare helps people (eg. through real people’s stories) is no harder for any of these groups and the examples are out there ready to highlight.
Also, I will add to this extensive back and forth and say that while Harry works harder, they all could do more. As I have read from someone who has worked with Harry, when he actually does show up to work, he works hard and is very engaged. To clarify, Harry simply works harder, but not necessarily “more.”
42istheanswer: For the most part ignore Jobson, but when Charles tries to ban or pulls articles or documentaries in which these specific claims have been made, i pay attention. And when he failed, they were marginalised and the rest of the media didn’t pick up the story and it disappeared.
The fact that every single one of your examples hasn’t gained traction in the wider media speaks to the power of BP. Story is pulled before it has really gained currency whilst a deflecting PR strategy is employed to gaslight the public that it isn’t a big deal. Including that story about the Queen and tax havens.
If all those scandals were allowed to be examined properly in the same way other public figures are examined, there would be pitchforks at BP. And the deliberate misinformation, downplaying, even putting a lid on those scandals speaks to their influence.
As for William and Nazi costumes…..the shopkeeper told any and all media who asked that William picked out the costume for Harry and didn’t wear one himself because there was none. A detail that keeps getting lost in the mists of time and the horror of Harry wearing said costume. (Yes, i’m aware that Harry had free will and blame lies with him for actually wearing the damned thing). And yet no one has ever wondered why William would think picking out a Nazi costume for his little brother to wear and goading him into wearing it was a good idea.
Harry’s naked pictures? William has peen pics not to mention being caught in France with Kate on a balcony ‘in an act of intimate marriage” as described in court documents.
Harry drinking? William drinking. Infact, William being so drunk at Harry’s passing out ball that he was forced to leave and CH had to soothe ruffled feathers at Sandhurst. Ditto being so drunk at a wedding he broke his front tooth – you can see his fake tooth in close ups. Drunk driving – there is footage. Sexually Inappropriate behaviour in club.
William taking RAF helicopters for joyrides at least twice that we know of, but they blamed that on his RAF instructors.
That’s just afew of his mis-deeds that were downplayed and or pulled before it could gain traction.
And William labelled the good prince. In comparison to Harry.
@LAK
To you, Charles’s decision not to participate in documentaries that give credence to Jobson’s claims is proof that said claims are truthful. I disagree because I suspect Charles would also refuse to feature in those conspiracy “documentaries” that argue he or his mother got MI6 to kill Diana… And perhaps the explanation, in both cases, is simply that Charles refuses to appear in materials he knows to be defamatory. Like any person would. Jobson’s credibility, very much like his integrity, is non existent in all regards so I do not see why I should make an exception and take his word just because, on this topic, the narrative he peddles appeals to our inbuilt conspiracy antennae : the evil older brother sacrificing his younger sibling to protect himself! It’s such a seductive and scandalous premice, even if we have to pretty much make it up from scratch… Did William “goad” Harry into dressing up as a Nazi ? Really ? Or did he just order the costume but let his brother decide what he would wear, like the young adult that he was ?
Scandals that center around the heirs have always gained traction. And then that traction faded. That is the normal life cycle of scandals, regardless of whether they involve heirs or spares. Every time Philip is once again exposed for the racist he is, every time the Queen is shown to be a massive tax dodger, there’s an initial uproar and, within a few weeks, everyone’s moved on. Just like it did for all the scandals surrounding Harry. After his Nazi episode, he released an “I’m sorry if anyone was offended” apology, got out of the spotlight for a couple of months and then came back, as good as new. Same thing after he decided to drop his kit at a party at the young age of… 27. He took a break from the public eye and, when he came back, everyone had “forgotten”.
It doesn’t mean those heir-related scandals weren’t published or given proper echo in the press. It certainly doesn’t mean that Buckingham Palace used its alleged influence to have the stories buried. It simply means that other events occurred in the meantime and that people’s attention span is what it is.
For a scandal to survive the natural turnover cycle and stick, it needs to be hammered home virtually daily over a long-ish period of time. And none of Harry’s transgressions has ever been subjected to that kind of treatment, which doesn’t really fit the narrative according which he’s been repeatedly thrown under the bus to save his brother.
William’s screwed up but he’s always screwed up in much smarter ways than his brother. His naked pictures with Kate were long lens paparazzi shots. Neither he nor his wife decided to get naked at a party where everyone has a mobile phone at the ready! The cases of him being drunk or “sexually inappropriate” (a strong way to call groping and kissing one’s girlfriend) fall in the same category : either there are pictures of the incident in which case their dodgy legality explains why they weren’t published (professional photographers have to abide by privacy laws, unlike random smartphone-equipped party goers, and security camera footage cannot be used to violate an individual’s privacy unless an offense was committed) or there are testimonies but no visual evidence… Harry has, for the most part, faltered in particularly egregious ways that have made it hard for BP to mop up after him.
I also agree that Harry shows more passion like his Dad about conservation issues than shy William who is supposed to have conservation as his thing.
@LAK, all I have to say is that to blame William for Harry, an adult in every single way, wearing a Nazi costume is reaching. Harry made that decision, Harry put that costume on, Harry walked around in it all night.
Harry was in his early 20s when he did this; he was old enough to be in the military, so he was old enough to make that decision himself.
42istheanswer: So what you are saying unless you personally witnessed any and all events, everything is untrue and can’t be verified. Not when Charles’s personal staff participate in a BBC documentary that he later tries to ban which confirms all the reporters’ theories and assertions, and a high court judge sides with the documenterians. This wasn’t the usual crackpot documentary of the type that blames Charles or Philip or M16 for Diana’s death.
And you will disbelieve the shopkeeper who sold the uniform to the two brothers and was a witness to the transaction, who picked and who goaded because you were personally not present therefore that shopkeeper was not telling the truth.
As you were not personally witness to any and all these events, we should disbelieve and discount the high court judge and the shopkeeper.
Ditto disbelieve all transactions in which JLP traded stories to keep the reputation of one brother even where one was a witness. Nope. YOU weren’t witness therefore it didn’t happen.
Discount all the miriad examples of traded stories and or reframed stories that make all the spares appear the worst compared to the heirs.
As for the argument that William deserves privacy and or is smarter in how he chooses to misbehave, the same can be applied to Harry. Why is privacy and the rule of law applicable to William, but not Harry? Being in a hotel room is a maximum expectation of privacy. Ditto being at a private party dressed as ergregiously as one wishes to dress. Saying that one deserves more privacy than the other is exactly the point about heirs vs spares. And by sexually inappropriate i didn’t mean with his girlfriend nor was i referring to the acts involved, but where he was and recording devices that caught it.
Trixie: I’ve made very clear that i blame Harry. It’s buried in my comment, but i guess you missed it.
The discussion with @42istheanswer is about the part played by William in the decision, and how that often gets overlooked. I’ll repeat that it doesn’t excuse Harry’s decision to go along and it especially doesn’t excuse his decision to wear the uniform. The shopkeeper who sold them the uniform was eyewitness to the fact that William chose the uniform and goaded Harry into wearing it. Those are the exact words the shopkeeper used.
Given his age, Harry was too old to have been goaded into something that stupid, but according to the shopkeeper, that is what happened. So i ask again, what person chooses a Nazi uniform for someone as a fun costume to wear?
Ps: and asking that question doesn’t negate the responsibility of the person too stupid to understand the ergregious nature of the costume and the commonsense not to agree to wear it.
And by the way, he wasn’t in the military yet.
@LAK
In every instance, I consider the source(s). If they’re a) reliable and b) willing to bring more to the table than their own personal interpretations/feelings/theories, I am interested to find out more. If not, I ignore them.
So just as I dismiss every single negative thing Meghan’s “former friends” have told the press about her due to their personal grudges and blatant financial interest in making up”interesting” stories up, I dismiss anything that comes out of fired members of staff and Richard Jobson.
The Leveson Inquiry taught us one thing (not that it was news but still): the British press rarely double checks. Any story can and will be published as long as it sounds “interesting”. And the more “interesting” editors deem the stories, the more the source gets paid. A shopkeeper comes with an uneventful story about Princes Harry and William buying the infamous Nazi costume in his shop ? 200 quid. A shopkeeper comes with a story according which it was the future king of England’s idea to dress up as Nazis, that he would have done it himself if only the shop had carried his size (as if the costume Harry ended up wearing wouldn’t have fit William himself) and that he’s responsible for his brother’s abysmal choice ? 2000 quid.
In any situation where there is a blatant incentive for people to add more “colour” to their stories, I become extremely suspicious.
As for the argument relating to privacy, you misunderstood me. I am not saying that one brother deserves privacy while the other one doesn’t. It is a simple matter of legality. “Professional” footage (taken by professional photographers, including paparazzi, or security cameras) are limited by the law in regards to how they can be obtained and what use can be made of them. There are plenty of pictures of many famous people that simply cannot be published because of the illegal way in which they were taken. If a newspaper released them, they’d be sued and have to admit in court that someone on their payroll violated the law… Same thing for security cameras.
Non professional photographers, including drunk party goers, are legally allowed to take whatever pictures they like. And once those pictures are taken, the rights are theirs unless declared otherwise in a court of law so they are legally entitled to sell them to whomever they wish.
William screws up in front of security cameras or is long lens’ed doing something naughty in a location where the assumption of privacy is fair and reasonable ? Illegal footage.
Harry screws up at a party and is photographed by one of his fellow party goers ? Legal footage. Immoral maybe but completely legal.
It’s the law and it applies to both brothers in the same way. It’s just that one of them has made it a habit of screwing up in front of people who have every right to record evidence of it. Because learning from one’s mistakes is beneath royalty, it appears.
William choosing to have sex in a club stairwell was his personal choice. Whether or not any footage obtained is legal, he chose those actions.
William went to the party dressed as an “African Native”, not the lion costume the kowtowing press published. Shopkeeper admitted that was the costume William wanted for himself.
Charles was reportedly furious with both of them, but made Harry take the heat. Only Harry made an apology and went to Auschwitz on a learning expedition.
Harry’s strip poker escapade was in his hotel room not the middle of a busy club, where no one was smart enough to confiscate cell phones. It was prior to deployment with his men, to a war zone where the enemy had vowed to hunt him down and publicly torture him. Still stupid but slightly more understandable. 3000 people filed complaints *on his behalf* with the PCC. There was an entire military meme of other people in the military posing the same way in support of Harry and his actions.
When HM dies, Murdoch will open the floodgates on everyone from Charles to William to the Middleton’s and the real facts of their cash. There is plenty of dirt being held back out of respect.
Yes, i think William often belittles Harry because he is envious of Harry’s easy manner and charm, and although I love the Fab Four I can see that the Cambridges are a bit worried about being outshone by H & M.
Great statement, very straight-forward and effective. Great dress, too. I would totally wear something like that.
Just here to say I enjoy these photos because they 1) make it abundantly clear that Meghan and Kate have two completely separate senses of style, like apples and oranges and 2) show Kate *gasp* smiling at Meghan! In a perfect world, both of those details would put a lot of nonsensical commentary to rest, but… it’s not a perfect world.
No, its not a perfect world, where everyone thinks and comments alike. Hence is called diversity of opinion and the right of people to have differing opinions outside of “group think”.
On a positive note.
@Shambles
I think they get along and the event went along nicely.
Shambles! I love it when you stop by the royal threads 😉
You rock.
A lot of pablum and word salad….as we used to say in the UK, a load of cobblers, coming from a family, whom despite having a woman as the head of it, never did one thing to empower women. In fact the one member that did seek empowerment, Diana, was told to shut up and get on with it. Yes, yes, I know times have changed and all the usual excuses for this lot.
Wow wow wow! I saw the video and wasn’t expecting much from all, what more newbie Meghan, but she rocked that forum and even elicited some laughs! Very articulate, clear, confident, and I understood her points and direction. Kate seemed the most nervous and least clear (it was too obvious) but it’s an improvement (we have to encourage Kate lol). Harry and William were decent I guess, with a slight edge to Harry. All 3 of them fidgeted on their chairs much more than Meghan, so I think they are still nervous. It’s getting quite ridiculous, I can’t help comparing all 4 lol. Anyway, good job all!
Hope they don’t do joint events like this alot. You see right away the difference between the two couples. Meghan is very articulate. Kate has never been. Harry has passion, or at least is the better actor, vs William. That being it was a nice event they all looked nice.
Lol….nice to see Meghan getting praised while the bitters from dm and royaldish seeth.
Exactly my impression too, they are very different couples but the Royal Foundation needs Harry and Meghan’s star power.
They all look gorgeous, have an excellent group dynamic and project great confidence but dear lord do they sound vapid as hell! Poor sods, royals truly have no room for doing anything even remotely meaningful, do they?
The perpetual use of the word “empowerment” by public speakers makes me laugh, which I suppose is still better than cry. It’s one of those terms that are both complex and interesting in their academic acception but have been stolen by the self-help crowd who turned them into lamentably trite psycho-babble. Peoples’ empowerment, be it in relation to sexual abuse or mental health, can only be truly supported through material changes. Gently nodding your head as people tell their horrific tales of woe, be they sexual abuse or mental health related, makes zero difference; organizing the creation of structures or the alteration of institutions to allow those tales to be a) performative and b) socially and legally accepted… That matters.
These four, university-educated adults sound like they’re quoting passages from a Deepak Chopra book. It’s as amusing as it is profoundly disheartening.
Only three are university educated. Harry is not.
Very true, I shouldn’t have taken a shortcut. Allow me to rephrase : “These three university-educated adults and 33-year-old Harry who didn’t attend university but did go to 32.000-pound-a-year Eton sound like New Age hogwash-peddling children who believe that clapping saves fairies’ lives”
Kate has majored in History of Arts. William changed his programme from History of Arts (I think) to Geography. Both at a very prestigious university. Kate did a stint as an accessory buyer for a fashion brand and allegedly worked in her parent’s party merchandise business. And now they are experts in mental health? Any university education and years of relevant experience in the field? They shouldn’t tackle this issue. Way too big when they don’t show any knowledge in their academic fields. I’m cutting Harry some slack because he’s had some experience but nevertheless it’s not ideal. Leave it to the experts.
@SoulSPA
All four of them, William, Kate, Harry and Meghan, are grown-ups who have received the best kind of education money can buy. They have learnt to learn which is a gift not enough people have the privilege and advantage to receive. And all they can muster is that it’s important for people to be empowered ?!
I rewatched their conversation, I reread Meghan’s intervention as transcribed here and all I see is a vast expanse of nothing. No meaning, no substanc, nothing even remotely performative. Just a long exercice in benevolent wishful-thinking peppered with nauseatingly pointless buzzwords (cf. empowerment). That’s what royals do, that’s what they have always done. That’s the only way they can legitimately exist in a democratic system. I am not as benevolent as you, it seems. I don’t feel like making the effort of imagining depth where there is none.
That’s exactly what Royals should do, their job is to shed light on the different topics and bring in attention/donors. It’s impossible to expect them to know all the deep details of all their charities. I like to think of them as the marketing department in the engineering firm. The know enough to bring customers but not as much as R/D
Harry didn’t receive the best education money could buy. His rumored dyslexia went un-diagnosed until he was 18. He spent most of his school career thinking he was dumb and not being educated in a way that met his needs. Beatrice’s dyslexia was diagnosed early and addressed.
There are several royal families where both dyslexia and traits on the autism spectrum have been diagnosed, addressed, and admitted. Sweden and Luxembourg as examples.
@formerly known as Amy
I agree. Which is why I’m amazed at the downpour of admiration this particular interventon of theirs seems to attract. They smiled and told people that certain topics are “very important” and should be taken seriously, they waved and they left. They added nothing to the proceedings aside from their presence and the spotlight tha accompanies them wherever they go. That’s what royals do. That’s what they’ve always done. Yet, it appears that some people are utterly transcended by this display… It almost seems like there’s a belief that something performative was actually said or accomplished on that stage. It wasn’t.
@notasugarhere
Harry may be dyslexic but the reason why he wasn’t good at Eton is simply that he’s not that bright. He has demonstrated that on many occasions, usually through a degree of tone-deafness that is just one step below “let them eat cake”-ness. My personal favorite was that time in Cape Town a couple of years ago when he told a group of children in a youth rehabilitation center that he would have preferred to spend his formative years in said center rather than Eton… The man who was born a millionaire and pampered beyond belief while a student at his independent school told a bunch of kids who have to study in a special facility to escape gang violence that they have it better than he did! Way to push his foot down his larynx.
Admittedly, he’s not the only none-too-bright royal. If anything, it seems to be a fairly common trait among them. But the idea that he didn’t receive the most exclusive of educations in the friendliest and most cajoling of environments is inaccurate.
@42
Then you don’t understand dyslexia.
You can’t stand Harry, and that is your choice but don’t dismiss truths to support your disdain. It is typical for dyslexics to appear dumb when they aren’t and the longer they are left to do with it without help the less interested they become in academia.
He’s not a genius, but he isn’t dumb either.
Real intelligence comes in countless forms. Harry’s emotional intelligence is through the roof. Besides that, if anyone thinks he is thick and would care to sit for the Blackhawk helicopter pilot tests he aced in the military please feel free and then get back to me.
@magnoliarose
I have nothing against Harry. He seems like a charming man but I suppose not praising him to the high heavens for successfully doing things one would normally expect a 15-year-old to ace without breaking a sweat must look like disdain/dislike to people who, for a reason that escapes me, view him as some sort of folk hero.
As for the dyslexia/stupidity debate, ‘m sorry to say it’s hogwash. I taught adolescents and adults with dyslexia and they do not appear any dumber than other students. If anything, that’s the most obvious warning sign for dyslexia: a student who sounds perfectly normally intelligent in conversation, who gets every oral lesson they’re given and is utterly pertinent in their comprehension but, when time for the written test comes up, they fail spectacularly… Not because their answers “appear dumb” but because they border on the incomprehensible. The idea that dyslexia makes its sufferers sound/look thicker than they are was invented by rich parents who use it to excuse away their precious progeny’s academic failures.
@Enough Already
Dressing up as a Nazi for fun + ok-ing the use of a 56.000-pound dress that will only be seen once in pictures at a time when the NHS’s budget is being cut left, right and centre + telling disadvantaged children that they have it better than a strikingly privileged man used to = “through the roof” emotional intelligence ?! I’m amazed by how low the bar appears to be. It seems to me that, as long as Harry doesn’t show up in Nazi gear *again* and manages to tie up his shoelaces on his own, he’ll be considered a resounding success.
On a side note, the only way I can justify calling him a bit thick is by sitting for a military piloting test? Can’t I rely on the degrees I already have instead ?
As discussed multiple times by people in the industry, the dress would have been no more than $5000.
Not sure how Harry gets to be singled out as the bad guy here. W&K spending 7 million in taxpayer funds on a massive KP home they proceeded to abandon. Her living with her parents so much of the time, requiring massive taxpayer costs for securing the Middletons private residence. Her 1 million wardrobe in seven years.
42 incredibly offensive comments about dyslexia. I’ve also worked with kids and teens and have close friends with dyslexia. When the educational establishment fails to recognize learning disabilities, they fail that student.
All of Harry’s schools failed him until age 18. They all failed to diagnose his dyslexia, failed to make the effort, failed in his education. Whether other schools do better isn’t the point. His schools failed him, therefore he did not get the best education money could buy.
It was reported to be one of his military trainers was the one who helped him learn this. It was when he was guided towards helicopter and gunner training, learned he has the kinesthetic intelligence suited to flying, that he finally stopped thinking of himself as being so dumb. Your degree gives you no expertise in determining whether or not he’s a good pilot. He earned the top award as best gunner. Not a popularity contest, but based on actual proven skill.
The BRF are some of the least prepared for these roles. Former Queen Beatrix of the Netherlands has a degree in Constitutional Law. Most of the monarchs/heirs in the 35-50 year range have multiple degrees in things like History, Law, International Relations, International Development. In many ways, Harry is marrying up.
A Ralph and Russo couture gown for 5.000 pounds?! The shoes this brand sells go for barely half that so no, that dress does not go for 5Ks. It costs ten times that. Why is it so hard for people to admit that the choice of this dress was a dumb mistake ? I’m genuinely puzzled. Is the mere idea that Harry and/or Meghan may have flaws or not be stupendously socially woke individuals that mindboggling to some ?
I haven’t made a single “offensive” comment about dyslexia, neither incredibly nor otherwise. Harry benefited from the best of the best. Eton did not fail him in any way, shape or form. He got private tutors and, quite frankly, was given passing grades he didn’t deserve just so the third in line to the throne, as he was back then, wouldn’t be known as having been held back. He never confirmed he has dyslexia and the simplest explanation for that is that he doesn’t have it; he’s just not that good academically and has never shown any inclination for intellectual endeavours. Again why is that so hard to fathom?
In regards to his military accomplishments, he’s very good at spatial recognition and eye-hand coordination and that’s great. Like all pilots and snipers. Like most athletes as well. Tom Brady has formidable “kinesthetic intelligence” and, lo and behold, he’s dumb as a bag of rocks. The two are not mutally exclusive.
As for Harry marrying up, Meghan Markle has a bachelor’s degree from a prestigious university, it’s undoubtedly true. A BA in international studies and… theatre. Interesting double major, especially considering that Northwestern only offers international studies as what they call an “adjunct major” which, given the description of the course, amounts to what any other university calls a minor. So, for all intents and purposes, she is a theatre major with a minor in international studies. Let’s just say that based on that alone, I wouldn’t put her degree that far above a History of Arts or Geography one… If I want to find a royal who can understand a complex international situation, I’ll put my money on Letizia and her master’s degree. If I want a royal to tell me everything there is to know about Rent, I’ll ask Meghan.
Many in fashion have admitted the gown would have cost no more than that. Just the DM getting people to foam at the mouth.
Several people in this thread have expressed concerns about what you’ve written about dyslexia. Each person gets to interpret and decide for themselves. You don’t get to decide what other people find offensive.
If I was seeking help in International Relations, my first choice would not be someone with a Masters in audiovisual journalism. I might ask her husband, the one with the Masters in Foreign Service from Georgetown.
This is starting to sound like like that silly tumblr rant from last year re. Meghan Markle’s education.
She attended Northwestern, she interned at an embassy. Whether a dual major or a minor, a few hours or a few months? She is better educated and more experience in this area than Harry, hence marry up IMO. She appears smart, well-written, well-spoken, and capable of speaking on the fly without sounding like she’s parroting another person’s elevator speech. Again, marry up.
I hope someone in education would understand these basic concepts. Harry may have attended some of the best school, but he did not receive the best education money can buy. When an educational institution fails to recognize and address a student’s learning needs, the institution has failed – not the student. If a teacher gives a grade a student hasn’t earned (either positive or negative grade), the teacher has failed – not the student.
@42…..Very unfair to call Harry thick because he had a rough time at Eton, a lot of that was to do with growing as a teenager at a time when your dead mother’s life story was continually being retold a thousand times . Harry is not stupid at all, I actually think he presents himself better than William when talking, he has great passion very similar to his Dad Charles, they are very much alike.
@Princessk
I call Harry thick because of all the times when he has shown himself to be so. Eton was just one instance among many. As for the challenges he faced, I don’t deny them Losing one’s mother at such a young age can only be profoundly traumatic. But William went through the same trauma and no one sheds a tear over him or excuses away his failures by mentioning it.
Harry is handsome and is marrying a lovely young woman people hope a lot (cough way too much cough) from. I understand the sympathy and interest. But let’s not lose our critical thinking over a few smiles and some utterly useless but vaguely nice-sounding words.
42istheanswer—late posting but are you new here? Because I LOVE everything you’ve written.
Eton is a prime example of an educational institution failing their student. All of Harry’s schools failed to recognize and diagnose his dyslexia until he was 18. How you keep blaming that on Harry is astounding and offensive.
Erased to avoid double posting.
It is important to remember that Meghan will be able to say much more than Kate as Harry is not expected to ever reach the throne. Much like Fergie could. Kate has to walk a tightrope. Harry has always been allowed much more freedom then Will.
This is just another excuse for Kate to be lazy. It’s important to note that H&M will be judged more harshly than W&K when they make mistakes. The establishments job is to protect itself and that means protecting W&K.
Any excuse in a storm from Kate’s fans, eh? Kate cannot support MeToo, but hey, here’s Meghan openly addressing it.
I really love that shot of Kate smiling at Meghan. I hope they’ll be supportive of each other.
That would be a nice change. Diana supported Fergie until Diana decided to turn around and stab Fergie in the back for PR.
-1
The positive experience would all be from HRH The Henrys covering Cannot/the Lambridges. Comments from Willnot also suggest otherwise – HRH Prince Henry/s want to do good give back globally (which magnifies Willnot, I am a Prince/middleton hen decoy), while Willnot wants to use all Duchy taxpayers entitlements/perks/mansions/Palaces for family of five + hangers on middletons – and give back the bare ordered minimum, to GB/CW.
I wonder if Kate has struggled with post partum depression. Do we know anything about that? Maybe the last few years were hard for her in that respect. Hormones are a funny tricky thing. This pregnancy it looks like she is so happy and content as others have said. I think they all did great and I am ready to enjoy them all for who they are
There’s been absolutely nothing to suggest she has struggled with PPD, some people have suggested it as a possibility as an excuse. If anything, based on her previous comments, I don’t think she finds motherhood all that it’s cracked up to be and it probably didn’t help that William wasn’t around much for George’s first year. I think she mostly expected fatherhood to finally change William but instead now Kate has 3 young children and a 4th on the way.
It’s very nice to see the two women smile together. I hope it’s not just all pretend and that they actually get along behind the scenes. I hope the fact that they they did a joint event together will stop the silly comparisons between the two. They are two very different people, and I have never seen the point in comparing them in terms of their clothes etc.
Le Duchess has been extremely happy this pregnancy, which it great to see actually. I hope she has a healthy baby. Unlike many other parents who have full time help, she actually looks like she has a very solid relationship with both her kids. That is something I can’t criticize her for, I hope no matter what happens between her and William, the kids will remain strongly bonded to both parents.
Middleton is cancelled for me beacuse she didn’t support #MeToo movement at BAFTAs when she had a chance. Megan – good for you for not being like Kate!
I like Kate and Meghan more than William and Harry. They think that because they are royals anyone who ends up with them should be thanking their lucky stars or something. No royal is better than any regular everyday person. Kate (even though she is not liked on this site) probably puts up with a lot and I would say she handling the strain of the firm as best she can.
I’m having a hard time with planning a wedding, they act like that is all they are doing. Don’t they have handlers, courtiers, I am missing something and then of course hitting the ground running after the wedding. This is just absolute crap, they won’t do anything, but will be on one long holiday, I am not even giving these freeloaders the benefit of the doubt!
MM has already done twice as many engagements as Kate Middleton did during the same period in their lives. How’s about we wait a few more years and see if she ends up being as apathetic and workshy as KM.
@Msthang …you have no idea how busy they are , having staff makes life even busier.
Kate seems as though she likes Meghan as much as the rest of the public do. Kate seems kind of smiley around Meghan. Maybe she likes having a new girlfriend who is closer in age to her to hang with.
notasugarher, what 2 more!!
Point is, she’s already done more. If we’re going based on her life before now and what she’s shown since the engagement? Her work ethic isn’t going to disappear post-marriage. Middleton, however, has never had and *will never have* a work ethic.
Also, wanted to say that I have no idea if Kate has performance anxiety or not, but she also seems more soft-spoken in that way that some British people seem to be. In general, some British people of certain regions (well, anyone who isn’t from Essex, I guess?) strike me as more on the softer side (whether they’re secretly sending daggers from their heart while we’re not looking, I have no idea, but unless they’re swearing or drunk in a pub somewhere with friends, they’re not really “loud” and direct). Heck, even when they swear they seem kind of “nice” about it. When Liam and Noel Gallagher swear I wind up more amused than offended. Put those same swear words in an American person’s mouth, and I’d probably think they were the worst people on earth.
Meghan is direct and confident, but I do think the more neutral American accent in general comes across as more assertive. I have a feeling she’d sound “softer” if she had a British accent. I wonder if it might simply be an accent difference that makes one person seem more confident than the other one. Diana was pretty assertive (Panaroma interview, anyone?), but she always came across as deceptively “softer” because of the accent.
Kate’s accent just sounds fake to me, as if she is trying to remember her elocution lessons, her husband is posher than she is but speaks normally.
I could barely understand a word she said.
Kate’s accent was much better this time. She seemed more relaxed. Maybe Meghan is helping her.
He’s posher but he also sounds more soft-spoken. Maybe I just perceive British people in general as more soft-spoken, but I acknowledge that could be a matter of perception on my end, not an actual truth.
Gasp! But what about the protocol. /s
Like I said in the bafta, it’s her prerogative what color gown she wants to wear, but the excuses were lame.
Saw a snip of the event and they all seemed very fidgety – Meghan least so among the four. I kept seeing headlines on twitter saying that Meghan and Kate supporting TimeOut and MeToo, but could only find Meg’s quotes. Did Kate even say anything?
Nope!!
It’s more excuses being made for Kate. This was all MM.
Oh please! You’re putting MM on a pedestal she doesn’t deserve. This Me Too and Times Up is a pile of crap. I work in a Man dominated industry and my employees are all men. Yes I put up with some sexism but wearing a black dress does nothing. Demonizing another pregnant woman for not wearing one is pathetic. MM talking about it is pandering to the gullible who think there will be change.
Claire: Other poster said twitter was claiming MM as well as Kate talked about TimesUP and #MeToo and i was saying that only MM said it.
Confirming who said what at a press conference is not the same thing as giving praise them for saying it nor is it putting them on a pedestal.
Please try to keep up!
I noticed,that too. Meghan was the only one sitting still with her hands clasped. She is a pro at doing press.
I was in central London when this event happened and I saw them leave in a convoy of cars. William and Kate’s vehicle was not blacked but Harry and Meghan’s was. Anything to read into this? Or is it because Harry does not have ‘cars’, ….
Not even a third of the way thru the video and I am IMPRESSED.
Maybe I had too low a bar, but I love them all. Go Princeps!!!
The four make a great team. As if Meghan was the one ingredient missing.
team Kate – love her
but this team of four is very impressive
I have great hope here!
I am so skeptical, not feeling the love fest!!
OK – i get the concern….you might me right
She said campaigns like #TimesUp and #MeToo sine a light on women’s voices, but I don’t think I actually heard her say that she’s directly aligned with them. I mean, I assume she supports them in that implicit way I assume most women do (most likely even Kate), but I didn’t actually hear her say she herself is part of the campaigns or will be. I guesss I was expecting more from the headline (not that I expect her to go beyond protocol either).
Very true Perplexed….what Meghan said has been misinterpreted to make the headlines.
She spoke out in support of woman and on this issue, but we’re condemning her because she didn’t state, “I am a formal supporter of MeToo”? Spliting hairs.
I never expressed condemnation against her.
I simply said that the headlines led me to believe she said more than what she actually said. This is a critique of the headline, not her.
There’s a difference.
Hopefully, in future, I’ll have the self-control to stay out of these royal threads. I can hope, but I can’t promise unfortunately.
Again, it strikes me as belittling the fact that she said anything at all. In the face of the silly “kate middleton’s Saudi emeralds were in support of Metoo and Suffragettes” coming from some commenters? At least MM said something, anything, instead of ignoring the situation.
Note to self: I hoped I would exercise self-control. That’s what I’m going to trying to do. Note to self: Keep on going.
I find it disturbing they’re transitioning into something like celebrities or reality-tv stars or at least media personalities. The fact is, they hold incredibly, incredibly levels of wealth and political power (access to top secret briefings that can assist with insider trading), and they’re literally above the law, and no one is asking questions about accountability. It’s disturbing in this age. So what’s Kate wearing this week? Creepy family and I think all this is deliberate to keep you from looking deeper.
I’d respect them more if they protested against the pedophile rings found in thenUK and while the police didn’t take the girls seriously.see to talk big, lets see them push for change to protect girls in the uk. come out against genital mutilation worldwide
You do understand they are not allowed to get near politics, right? That stated, we’ll see. The BRF is one of the most conservative in what they take on, including avoiding overly-religious things and not working with the UN. That is why Meghan Markle had to quit her work with the evangelical charity based in Canada and stop her UN Women work. But Camilla has started working with sexual assault survivors, which I wouldn’t have expected from the BRF.
There are other European royals who work in these areas, so we might see something from the BRF in the future. Sylvia and Madeleine of Sweden have an anti-sex trafficking charity, founded by Queen Sylvia a decade ago. Mabel of The Netherlands works on a GirlsNotBrides program. Maria-Teresa of Lux and Mary of Denmark do anti-FGM work, usually disguised under the banner of “maternal health”.
What nota said. Camilla does anti-FGM work, and she is senior to both Kate and Meghan. That’s her wheelhouse. And the pedophile rings in the UK, that is 100% political here. Both in Rotherham and down south. The royals can’t go near that stuff, at all.
I can’t help but wonder why forcing children to have sex with adults is considered a political issue. Are UK politicians into pedophilia?