Natasha Lyonne is up for three Emmy’s this Sunday. Her show, Russian Doll, has been nominated for 13 in total. I loved that show and have started paying much more attention to Natasha but I clearly knew nothing about her. Like that she’s been acting since she was six, or that she’s been dating Fred Armisen since 2014 and they met through her friend Maya Rudolph. I also didn’t know Chloë Sevigny has been Natasha’s best friend through thick and thin. By that I mean Natasha’s heroin addiction and tabloid worthy bad behavior that she didn’t shed until court-appointed rehab in 2006. Now that Natasha is 40, she’s back on top and knows what she wants from life. One thing she definitely does not want is a baby.
On people telling her to have kids: Go fuck yourself. Let me live my life. I maintain that one out of 5,000 people should have a child. To me, that would be statistically more sane. It’s not that I’m inherently averse to children, although maybe I am. I admire greatly all my friends who have kids. But one of the great reliefs about turning 40 is people start backing off.
On Aging: I’m keenly aware that I’m getting older. I’m very into it. I’m much happier on this side. I would say the underlying anxiety I experienced around turning 40 is just looming mortality. It’s emboldening me to really do the things I want to do before it’s too late.
On her mother: Chloë happens to be the coolest person in the world—my mother was not. She was a messy person. It was a very meta trip, to be filming the show with Chloë, looking around our stomping grounds, but now all the trailers and signs were for the show I created. And being in the editing room with the footage and watching her with a young version of me was almost a way to forgive my mother.
On the continuation of Russian Doll: There’s so much in that show that’s deeply autobiographical. So it’s very funny to me that people think that’s the whole story.
On holding other women up: The older I get, the more I feel protective over young people—particularly outsider women. I want to tell them there’s not only space for their underlying otherness, but also that, sometimes, what we experience as lows and rejections are because that’s not actually the best outcome. If I’m not this broken person, then I’m suddenly freed up to be much more available to the world.
I like all of what she said here. As you know, I was one of those people who thought a second season of Russian Doll would ruin it but her comments take most of that worry away. The first season was so well done, I should trust the creators when the say the story isn’t finished. And she nailed it with her comments about becoming protective of younger women. That’s so true, isn’t it? The media would have us believe that all women over 35 resent younger women for their youth, but I’ve never felt that. My first reaction is usually to jump in and defend a young woman rather than join in a pile up.
As for her thoughts on kids, again, I agree. Maybe not the 1 in 5,000 part, (although she might be right about the statistics) but about the go eff yourself to those insisting people have kids. I’ve never understood the argument that a person will regret not having kids later in life – how would anyone other than the person deciding possibly know that? If someone says they definitely want kids, they get universally supported. But if a woman says they definitely do not want kids people tell them they’re wrong or making a mistake. After everything Natasha has been through, I really think she knows what she wants from life.
Photo credit: Williams + Hirakawa/Glamour
I’m not sure what she means by the statistics. If only 1 in 5000 people has a child, civilization would collapse in a generation or two.
Hydrocarbon-fueled societies this complex with everyone being a good little consumer isn’t exactly sustainable anyway. She’s right but that 1/5000 thing won’t happen. Most of us will keep having children and living our energy-intensive lives not realising this: abundant, cheap energy of this type 100% enables this strange “civilisation” and it’s killing the planet because capitalism in its current form isn’t sane in that it doesn’t recognise resources and this planet is finite. Digging up oil, gas, coal, etc and guzzling it up at this scale (7 billion plus) is an abberation, not a “normal” state of things. There’s a bit of oil, gas, and coal in EVERYTHING around you, including the tuna sandwich you had for lunch and the olive oil you used to cook your pasta. And there’s a quite a lot of oil, coal, and gas in your fulfilled visions of a happy family with 2 or 3 kids.
Having said that, I love driving my car, flying and travelling, shopping, grocery shopping whenever I like, and all the comforts we take for granted. But our current civilisation is an abberation enabled by burning hydrocarbons, which will probably turn our planet into Venus II. And I will keep being a good little consumer because I don’t think anything we do individually or anything Greta Thundberg and co do individually can change anything.
Well, certainly if no one tries to do anything differently then nothing will change.
@Kate, the way I see it, the only possible solution is the suspension of democracy, which of course won’t happen. Carbon trading, driving electric cars, solar panels on your roof, changing your lightbulbs, etc – too little and too slow. David Wallace-Well’s Twitter feed is a good account to follow for how dire it is. Also renewables are supporting energy-consumption expansion, not actually replacing hydrocarbons. They will have to geoengineer eventually and it’s not going to be pretty. My great consolation is I never had and will never have kids.
….and thats bad?
Whats worth upholding of what weve made?
Personally Id be happier to live in tiny communities with lots of nature in between.
Our civilisation is all about quantity over quality.
She really looks terrific. I know she had struggles in the past. I loved her in The Slums of Beverly Hills with Alan Arkin, Marisa Tomei and Jessica Walter. Devilishly funny.
That was a great movie! And Alan Arkin is a national treasure
LOVE LOVE her. She is the best part of anything she’s in. Her delivery is always great.
Live and let live, If she doesn’t want kids
Somewhere in this world Alec Baldwin has misread her statement and congratulated himself for doing his bit by having 5,000 kids.
😂
Hahahaha!
Lol!
Oh my God, best comment..!
I’ve never understood the argument that a person will regret not having kids later in life – how would anyone other than the person deciding possibly know that? – I think this people usually frame this question wrongly. It’s not that someone childless will actually regret it, but that usually it is quite transformative experience where you can not imagine and anticipate the internal shift that happens when you have a child. It’s like if people who never tasted icecream would write icecream reviews. I did not want a child now I can’t imagine myself missing out on that experience. Having said that, I support every woman who sticks to the decision of not having any kids. And I never ever say something like “you will regret this” or that you should have kids or you are lesser person for not having any kids. I think the people who do say “you will regret this” are often very possessive over their own kids. It is perfectly normal not to want to be a parent and people should not be shamed for it. I find it to be responsible approach to life and towards yourself and kids, more than anything. In any case, looks like the Baldwins are planning to populate a small island anyway so no need for everyone to have kids.
A couple of decades ago, one of the columnists, either Abby or Ann, polled her readers and asked, “If you could go back and do it all over, would you still have children?” About 50% responded that they’d never have children if they had a do over. Sounds like a lot of people regret having them.
And, reading almost every day about the abuse of children by their parents or stepparents or boy or girlfriend, a lot of people shouldn’t have them.
That statistic makes total sense to me based on the neglectful and/or abusive parents I see out in the world every damn day. It breaks my heart.
It was 66% Jerusha. Two thirds of the people she polled, and most were women, said if they could do it over, they wouldn’t have children. I was shocked about the stat and mentioned it to my senior neighbour at the time. She said, “when you have little children you have little problems, when they are big, you have big problems” She had three children and she wouldn’t have one of them over again. I remember that day, it was a little distressing for me.
@LadyD. Iknew it was a big number, but couldn’t recall exactly. I wasn’t shocked at all, especially since reading a large percentage of pregnancies are accidents anyway.
LOL – I highly doubt that 66% regret having kids. What kind of poll was that??
Ann Landers and Dear Abby were sisters who wrote advice columns for nigh on 40 years each, and each had a huge following. It was one of them that held the survey, and I’m sure you can find the letter in their archives. I started reading their columns in the ’70’s so you might have some research on your hands. As for your question, yes 2/3 of the replies said they wouldn’t do it again. I still find it shocking almost 30 years later. I love my son with all my heart and I’m very proud of the way he’s turned out. I can’t imagine life without him.
I apologise in advance for being negative but I disliked the 2 episodes of Russian doll I was able to watch. The caustic humour gets tired very quickly for me. I automatically disliked her character and reading her also makes me queasy although she doesn’t say anything bad. Can’t put my finger on it really.
Anyone has the same issue?
Snowslow, I watched 3 episodes of Russian Doll and hated it. I don’t know why, just not interesting to me.
And I think if you have not had kids you will have no idea of how it feels, the intense love and protective feeling. So I don’t think you will miss it if you never had then.
But not everyone who has kids has the kind of intense love that you do for your children. That’s why I don’t think pressuring or shaming women to have kids is a smart idea. So I get what Natasha is saying here.
It has a clever plot. I was kinda relieved this wasn’t Lost type purgatory nonsense. The ending was satisfactory. The trouble with groundhog day plot is it becomes tiresome waiting for all the clues. Russian Doll doesn’t even give enough clues why it keeps repeating. It will lead you to one then the next episode, nah that wasn’t it. Like I thought the homeless man and Oatmeal were big factors in the time loop.
My therapist always says, people who ask you stuff like, “So when are YOU getting married?” or “When are YOU having kids?” often do so because they themselves have done that and don’t want to be the only ones in that boat, which would force them to face their fears that they perhaps made the wrong decision.
Interesting! That’s how i’ve felt about those questions too. Specially when they take it so personally if you decide to do the opposite of what they did.
That’s probably true in most cases. I think so much of what people say to others is just projection of their own stuff.
I think that’s true. I think it’s the “misery loves company” thing. They want everyone else to be as miserable as they are.
I do think others are so wrapped in their own lives, they think the rest of the world needs to do what they are doing. Either way, it’s annoying listening to these people.
Or they’re just trying to make chit chat and they’re bad at it
Yes! They want you to join their Misery Squad! Lol J/K..kind of.
I tuned 40 last year and in the space of six month first my mother, then my aunt both did the ‘let me tell you about my friend who didn’t have children when they could and now…’. Mum went first so when my aunt started I was able to jump in pretty quickly with ‘let me stop you right there’ and tell her mum had already tried that one. I have never wanted children, it’s just not for me and you both know this, why would I change my mind because some friend of yours (WHO IS NOT ME) feels differently about her choices? We could always adopt or foster further down the line IF we feel differently. Sigh.
Having a child should be a privilege and something no one can take lightly. A person should be financially responsible, IMO if you can’t afford to take care of just yourself you shouldn’t have kids. A kid doesn’t deserve to grow up in poverty because you were to irresponsible to take bc or have your partner wear protection. My husband and I talked last night and until I pay off my personal debt I have, he wants to hold off on children. If only more people thought like that. We’re too overpopulated and there’s too many kids running around who I hate to say it, are walking abortions. What I mean by this is they were never wanted in the first place, but due to pressure or personal beliefs they kept the unwanted child now the child grows up being treated poorly and resented. It happens a lot sadly.
The second issue is a lot of super right winged might as well be white supremacists are having kids which as we know hate isn’t born, it’s taught. I am fearful for the future of the next generation or 2 so I still question whether I even want children. I think 1984 will soon not just be a book, but a reality and I don’t want to have to put a child through that.
I agree with you. The problem is, poor people usually have less access to birth control. And should we say to people with less money that they can’t have kids until they reached a certain wage ? I don’t know. I agree people should be careful about having kids but if we start monitoring people then it’s not a freedom of choice anymore and only rich people will have kids and they will all look the same… Eugenism it’s called right?
There are SO many reasons why a person might be poor, and SO many reasons associated with systemic racism, cycles of poverty, location of birth, and myriad other conditions outside of a person’s control. Why should these exclude someone from reproducing? It’s almost a eugenic attitude as poverty and minority race status are highly correlated (at least in USA).
Yup..so apparently only middle class to rich people should be allowed to have kids. Fabulous…
+1000.
I’m so glad to be reading about her and hearing she’s in a good place. I’ve been watching her forever…since maybe late 80s, early 90s? She’s very good. And her relationship with Chloe makes complete sense. And as for telling people to eff off when asked about kids, bravo. I realize there’s no intention to hurt, but it’s very old school thinking, and it’s nobody’s business. Furthermore, if anyone has made a decision to not have kids, they deserve a standing ovation.
Yes, I agree. It is very sexist when people ask women those personal questions. The decision to have children is a private, intimate matter, but many people feel entitled to ask women those questions freely. I’m a woman who has chosen not to have children, and I have had this experience many times. It’s amazing how people I barely know feel free to drill me about this, even in an impersonal setting, like at work. The implication is that there is only one righteous answer.
The bottom line is, I don’t believe in having children unless I feel strongly that I can do so responsibly. I like children, but I have had tough conversations with myself, and I know it’s not for me. Having accepted that, I would rather be the best aunt/ friend/ daughter/ citizen I can be, supporting children in a role other than motherhood. There are days my decision feels a little bittersweet, but since I’ve been honest with myself about my life and choices, at the end of the day, I’m content with my decision.
I also know that I am privileged to make this decision. Around the world, including in the US, too many women and girls are denied their bodily autonomy and reproductive healthcare choices/ access. An open society cannot function when women are denied basic human rights. That’s the urgent issue. That is the real horror show, not my personal choice, or anyone else’s, to be childfree.
I like her acting, she is good in almost every thing I have seen her in. OITNB, she was great.
She seems smart, and has come thru a lot. And yes, I completely agree with her that the decision to have/or not have children is an absolutely private and personal decision.
The theory that “you will regret not having kids when you are older” is total BS.
As we get older, I challenge you to find anybody without regrets. Not gonna happen, life is messy and difficult.
I really enjoy her interviews – she’s an interesting person, and I’m glad she came through all her struggles. She’s doing great work now, and seems to be doing very well.
Im 39 and while I still am open to having kids I have to come to a point where if I didn’t have them my world wouldn’t collapse. And it took me a bit to get to that way of thinking. I do think having children is a transformative and amazing experience. But if a woman doesn’t have that experience that doesn’t make her life any less interesting or fulfilling. I know so many women who are childless who live amazing exciting lives and if that’s my future that would be awesome. And if I do wind up having kids that would be awesome too. It’s not a zero sum game for me.
Also I loved Russian Doll and I do feel like the way it ended left a lot more to be explored. It’s great to see Natasha having this sort or career renaissance and doing it on her own terms and through work that she helped create. That to me is always the way to do it.
The “1 in 5000” plan only works if you accept that older people should be killed off as soon as they can no longer work, otherwise the strain it puts on the younger generation, physically and financially, to take care of them is unbearable. That or we invent caretaking robots to slowly replace humans. I’m surprised more people don’t think of Japan as example of a country heading for a major crisis because the birth rates are dismal.
That being said, people should absolutely be free to choose if they want kids or not. If our social model was based on education, solidarity and sharing instead of spending our existence with the sole focus of making money to buy as much stuff as possible, destroying the planet along the way, it wouldn’t matter if some people decided to have no children and others decided to have five.
We’re already inventing the robots. Why do you think Japan is so invested in robotic development? They know they have a demographic problem, and they’re trying to automate their way out of it.
I recently saw a tv documentary on robots and it’s amazing what they are already able to do today. So I can imagine in 10-20 years a lot of tasks can easily be done by robots.
Everyone who doesn’t want kids has their own reason or reasons for not wanting them. So I don’t understand how an outsider can say “you’ll regret it later” when they don’t even know what the reasoning was!
Yeah I’d rather regret NOT having kids than regret HAVING them !
I am not sure about the 1 in 5,000 stat bc like others are saying it would essentially kill off the human race (which might not be bad but I digress…). But I do think people became parents that shouldn’t be parents. I have 2 nieces and honestly as much as I knew I never wanted kids it pretty much cemented it. I have no idea how my brother is “happy” as bad as it sounds. His girls are wild. I am also sick of spoiled people taking their babies to bars and 5 star restaurants. Especially the ones who don’t behave. Hire a damn babysitter or sit in the family section FFS. Stop trying to put your misery on others.
My family has pretty much accepted I don’t want kids, but once in a while a friend jokes that I should have them with my longtime partner and its not amusing to me. There is nothing funny about wishing kids on someone who doesn’t want them. My mental health would be in the basement.
I’m sorry but her statement was stupid. At the very least you need to replace the population you currently have to ensure a good tax base to pay for social security and other “entitlements”. Go ask Europe and Japan how well low birth rates are working out for them. I don’t know what it is about children that makes people so judgmental. If you want kids, by all means have them (or try). If you don’t want kids, by all means don’t have them. Some people may regret having children, some people may regret not having children. Some people want children and may never have them. But can we please stop trying to make other people make reproductive choices that we like.
I’m from Europe and we are just fine. The only people who have a problem with stagnating or decreasing population are economists whose only way of living is to grow. The planet has limitations and so there must be a ceiling to this reproduction madness of the last 300 years.
I love her! <3
I didn’t take her ‘1 in 5000’ number literally. I think it was more a combination of, “We’re overpopulating our planet” and also, “Some people have kids when they probably shouldn’t.” But, maybe I read it that way because I agree with both. Some people are just bad parents–they’re neglectful, abusive, are in cults like the Duggars that promote breeding uneducated religious zealots, or aren’t well-equipped for an infinite number of reasons. And I say all this as both a survivor of an abusive parent and a parent myself who recognizes I’m not the ‘perfect’ mother I’d hoped I would be (I’m convinced approximately 100 times a day I’m ‘ruining’ my kids).
One time my sister gave me this Very Serious Lecture about why my husband and I should have kids…and her theme was “sacrifice.” Like, “You can never know how much you love somebody until you sacrifice your whole life for them.” I thought that was great. Because it completely solidified my decision to not have children. If you’re a mom of two kids and the best argument you can make for ME having kids is that I need to learn how to sacrifice my entire self, then…no thanks. Um, I can think of other things to do with my time.
The bonus is that I really love HER kids and am so glad she had them, haha!! Being an aunt is waaaaay better than being a mom, for me anyway.
I’m an aunt with no kids of my own and I agree with you 100%!
Hopefully she doesn’t follow Hilaria Baldwin
She’s been through hell and back and here she is now, killing it. Hopefully she’ll win something on Sunday!
I didn’t get around to having a kid till I was 36, so endured at least a decade of that “you know, if you don’t have a kid you’ll regret it later,” B.S., very often from complete strangers. It made me furious, because while I was one of the lucky ones, i.e. a person who was childless by choice, the same couldn’t be said of some of my friends, and the thought of anyone saying that stuff to a woman who’s recently endured a miscarriage makes me want to punch someone.
Now I have a kid who I love beyond measure, and I genuinely love being a mother, but also parenting is so unbelievably difficult that not having a kid is obviously a saner choice, also the idea that you HAVE to have a kid to be fulfilled is incomprehensible to me.
I am 44 years old and there hasn’t been one day that I regret not having children. I have never experienced so much selfless love for my dogs. I have been going through hard financial times and sometimes I have to choose between feeding myself, or my dogs and believe me they will always have a plate of eventhough I won’t eat for two days, sometimes a few more days I love them more than anyone or anything in this life. Sounds very one dimensional that women say that is the only time you feel an enormous love just by having children, it’s offensive question people’s love only reserved for baby humans.
I don’t understand why people make such truly personal comments. I always thought I would have children (providing I could, until you try you don’t know) but I only really wanted to have a child at around 28. When my older sister had a child, I remember telling my husband it’s okay if we have children or we don’t and he agreed. I have 2 sons now and I can’t imagine not having them but that’s because they are real people with a personality. It’s just really interesting to me. I’d be able to live without having children but now I can’t live without the children I have. I have 2 autistic sons who are so wonderful. It’s about choices and going with what happens.
I am 37 years old and have been terrified of having children my whole life. Where I live, having children is a must and not having them can feel isolating. Most of my friends are childless or single and that’s because they are the only friends that are available to me. All my other friends are just not available. We talk on the phone maybe once in 10 days but forget even meeting for coffee. Parenting has taken over all my friends lives. No room for a social life outside of other school mom’s. And I know for a fact that many of their sex lives are non existent. After kneeling down to family and social pressure I finally relented and my husband and I tried for a child. I got pregnant very quickly but once I found out I was miserable. Two months or so later I found out that something was wrong with the pregnancy and I had to abort. I was horrified at myself for being relieved. A year later I decided that perhaps this time I was ready and we tried again for a baby. Just as before, I got pregnant really quickly but had that sinking feeling again. It just didn’t feel right. Another few months later and I found out the fetus had abnormalities and I had to abort. Again, I felt relieved but this time I felt even worse about the fact that I was relieved. I wanted to want a baby but couldn’t get there. It also didn’t help that the young women in my family were getting pregnant and glowing from happiness. I felt like I was in an identity crisis. Not sure why I am different than other women and I may not ever learn why but I want to believe that I have a purpose to fulfill that is not in any way less important than having a child