Well, I was waiting for this! Katie Nicholl at Vanity Fair has interviewed Robert Lacey about his book Battle of Brothers: William and Harry – The Inside Story of a Family in Tumult. The difference between what he says to British outlets versus what he says to American outlets is still pretty noteworthy! Lacey definitely wants his book to sell in America, but will it? Hm. Also, we do have to remember that Lacey’s thoughts are being filtered by Nicholl, who has been a Cambridge apologist and sugary Keen defender for more than a decade. You can read the full piece here. Some highlights:
There’s no chance of the Sussexes returning to the UK: “I don’t think we’ll ever see them leaving their American base. The question is can the monarchy adapt to the challenge of a free thinking couple and arguably the most charismatic members of the family or will they shut them out of the picture?”
Harry knows what’s up: According to Lacey, courtiers never knew how to handle Meghan, who he describes in his book as forceful and confident. And Harry still believes that certain palace courtiers are still speaking against the couple to the media, and have taken William’s side over his. “There does seem to be evidence of the palace briefing against Harry and Meghan. The Sunday Times ran a piece recently quoting royal sources close to the palace saying that Meghan and Harry violated the agreement with the royal family when they made comments about the American election when actually they were very careful in what they said. I’m afraid it seems a decision has been taken to cast Harry as the scapegoat and to justify the solitary emergence of William in the new generation.”
Meghan’s “American advisors”: “We know Meghan does not get on well with palace people. When she brought in her own American advisors it was very offensive to the palace pr. No one has ever done that before.”
Meghan found it difficult to remain apolitical & voiceless: “Meghan is used to using her celebrity platform to speak about issues that matter to her. When she, Harry, William, and Kate were at a Royal Foundation Forum even before she had married into the royal family Meghan was very vocal and spoke about the rights of minorities and rights for women. She’s a self-made celebrity and I think she was just too much for the palace to handle. There’s a systemic challenge there. She’s like Diana but a stage further, and that’s a challenge for the Royal Family.”
Whether Will & Harry will reconcile: When he began writing the book, he said, Lacey believed that there was a “good chance” the brothers might still reconcile, but “I’m more pessimistic now.” A public reunion is on the books for July 1, when a statue of Diana will be unveiled at Kensington Palace. “But the question will be how genuine will that reconciliation be? I imagine most people will feel that they are putting on an act and that could prove fatal for the royal family. I hope that somebody is working behind the scenes to pull things together. There will either be a reconciliation or this rift will continue.”
William asking the Earl Spencer to intervene with Harry & Meghan: “I think it’s significant and quite sad [William] didn’t turn to his own father but to Diana’s side of the family.”
The Ruthless Queen: “At the end of the day we saw a ruthlessness from the Queen over her absolute refusal to allow the Sussexes to use the word royal for their new branding, and we’re seeing the same ruthlessness in William. The challenge for William is whether while being true to his principles he can also modernize the institution by making his brother part of it. That’s what everyone wants, some kind of reconciliation.”
The Ex-Royal Future: “At the moment they are enjoying their new lives. But if there is no reconciliation next year there is going to have to be a cut, and they will have to be ex royals. As the Duke of Windsor discovered, that’s not much fun.”
We talked about Meghan’s “American advisors” yesterday, which Lacey seems to think “came with her” when she married Harry. This is… not the case, but I think Lacey is mostly conflating a few connected issues. Meghan and Harry got their own office in Buckingham Palace, and yes, some of the people in that office were Americans. I don’t think *that* was ever some big issue though. I think the issue (as I said yesterday) is that Meghan was a professional actress with a manager, agent and publicist. She understood how to manage herself like a professional, and she sought advice from her “American team” over the royal years on how to do things differently. Because, I believe, she saw how the palaces operated and she was appalled. And *that* was what bugged a lot of those old farts: she didn’t “need” them, she had her own ideas (which were often better than theirs) and she was ambitious to get to work.
The biggest cup of tea here is that Harry believes there are still people in the palace “speaking against” him. This is true. This has been happening for years as well, and it was one of the reasons why H&M left. William was already trying to “speak against” Harry & Meghan when they were there. Now that William has the monarchy all to himself, of course he’s embiggening himself and terrorizing everybody else. Of course H&M are still Willileaks’ biggest scapegoats.
As for Harry & Meghan being “cut” from the family next year… what the hell else can be done to them? This is why H&M have set themselves up in America – because they’re DONE.
Photos courtesy of WENN.
“They will have to become ex-royals”
Will that really make a difference to people though? I mean most people already consider them “ex-royals” and don’t think they’ll really come back. The only people holding onto this fever dream are the british media and courtiers. And they just want Harry back.
Unless KN means the BRF will stop them using their titles but most people call them “Prince Harry and Meghan Markle” so, again, it won’t really make a difference in the grand scheme of things.
Being “ex-royals” Reminds me of the only quote from The Crown I remember, when David says “with this family, when you’re in you’re never really sure, but when you’re out, you truly know it”
Lucky for H&M, M had a family, both chosen and real, and they were willing to embrace H the way his people couldn’t embrace her.
That’s not true – I’m not British media nor am I a courtier, but I do wish the Royals had smartened up enough to let Harry AND Meghan stay. They’re a real asset.
Wishing they would have stayed and thinking they’re going to come back next year are 2 different things.
“It won’t make a difference.” INDEED. Archewell is live ya’ll!
“Harry believes there are still people in the palace “speaking against” him“
No lies detected, I’m certain they all are.
I’ve got news for you Harry, they will ALWAYS speak against you. The Dolittles run that family and need to be propped up for eternity and someone therefore needs to look bad in comparison to them. There lies the crux of the matter. You marrying a biracial woman made the smear job easier.
I don’t understand the ex-royal thing. Harry will never be an “ex royal.” He’s HRH Prince Harry the Duke of Sussex. Even IF they take away duke of Sussex (which I doubt will happen for all the reasons we mentioned here) then he’ll still be HRH Prince Harry. Maybe he just means they wont be welcome back for the traditional royal events, like Trooping or Christmas at Sandringham? I call BS on that, at least when Charles is king. Charles is going to want Harry back as much as possible, because despite all the vitriol aimed at Harry in the press, he and Meghan are the stars and any event will get more attention if they’re part of it. As we have seen over the past few weeks, Charles and Camilla don’t get attention on their own, and William and Kate are pretty much duds.
(to be clear though I doubt Harry and Meghan will ever go to Christmas at Sandringham again. but I do think they will come back for events like Trooping, maybe a garden party, etc.)
As for the rest – of course the courtiers are still briefing the press against Harry. It’s so painfully obvious.
I started reading the Lacey book – its snarky. I think I’m missing a lot of the nuances in his comments because I’m not British. The initial chapter on the Middletons seems okay on its face, but I feel like the whole thing is TIC and making fun of them.
They might go back for Christmas when Charles is king because I could see him and Camilla having less formality and more time with the children. The events published for the Queen’s Christmas make it seem like she doesn’t like having children around.
That’s a good point, if Charles changes things up a bit, maybe they would go back. Or maybe go back for his first Christmas as king as a show of support. I don’t think we will ever see Archie walking to the church though. But the royal Christmas sounds awful lol. I also wonder, once the queen dies, if people like Peter Phillips or the Yorks will go to Christmas at Sandringham, or if the family will start to do its own thing more.
If Charles doesn’t invite other family members, those family members won’t be allowed in. Sandringham is private property; Charles can ban the Yorks, Wessexes, Anne’s kids and grandkids once he owns it.
The Duke of Windsor comparison is especially stupid because while Charles is alive he isn’t going to let Harry languish (not that he will as they’ve shown themselves quite capable) because it will reflect poorly on him as a father. And I would say that the duke of Windsor, as the governor of the Bahamas, was still tied to the BRF in a way that Harry is not.
There’s also the difference that the Duke of Windsor was a former King! Harry is already pretty far down the line of succession. it is not the same. Plus, I doubt that Harry cares much about being an ex-royal. Not like the Duke and Duchess of Windsor did (they were very hung up on Wallis not getting the HRH). I think it is better to leave it all behind. Plus, their brand is going to Meghan and Harry (they like to introduce themselves by first name only, even when working royals).
They are famous enough that they don’t even need a last name anymore! They don’t need the title or the Windsor name to be famous. Harry’s fame was not just grounded in him being royal but in him being Diana’s son. Now his and Meghan’s fame are growing BECAUSE they split from the BRF. There’s a narrative here that catches the imagination. The BRF and the BM want to spin it as the ungrateful divas who were cast out into the cold – but that isn’t how the rest of the world sees this story. Especially because the Windsors have a reputation as being cold and snobbish (the public fallout from Diana’s divorce and death is not entirely forgotten). Rather the story is about the prince who was set free by love – that was the narrative that one of the major Danish newspapers went with when Sussexit was first announced. Who chose love over immense, inherited privilege and status. This is a narrative that is appealing to cultures that aren’t as rigidly classist as the British one.
They are idiots to pretend that it’s the same as the Duke of Windsor. He never worked and basically relied on the Queen’s favour for the rest of his life. He never really wanted to leave that family.
Meanwhile Harry served in the military and set up charities while he was still officially a working royal and seeing him moderate segments of that Time program shows he’s not an empty vessel like his brother and sister in law.
Meghan we know can thrive because she did for most of her life prior to joining that repressed and backwards family.
They will be successful and really show how antiquated the remaining young royals are and how little they do anything of value.
ArtHistorian, something to consider: Prince Harry and Joachim are known friends
@NotSoSimpleTaylor
Didn’t know that.
Charles would have to stand up to his mummy and his eldest son to make that happen.
What is wrong with this family to have such animosity towards Harry? Outside of their echo chamber, don’t they see how terrible it is to treat Harry and Meghan this way while still staying close to Andrew? Or is Charles using Harry and Meghan to finally get Andrew out? Andrew has to stay off the balcony but so do Harry and Meghan? (But Princess Michael apparently can stay?)
Princess Michael is the daughter of an actual Nazi, white, and racist. She fits right into that family.
They are honestly furious about Harry not sticking around to be Will’s whipping boy. He has known his whole life that his role is to take the shit for William. By not fulfilling that role, they see Harry as a traitor to them and despise him for it.
What the heck does this even mean anyway: ‘there is going to have to be a cut, and they will have to be ex royals. As the Duke of Windsor discovered, that’s not much fun’
But they ARE ex-royals. That’s what the summit was about. finding FREEDOM (in my best William Wallace voice). The Duke of Windsor was not really an ex-royal when he was working as a representative of the king as a GG. Plus he still relied on the public purse to support his lifestyle and had to humble himself and grovel for money. This is no way can compare with the Sussexes who are financially independent.
I also think they may not care to go back for the pretty stuff like trooping or Christmas strolls, and their return to the UK will be mainly related to work, their patronages and a vacation now and then.
That’s why I find it confusing, they’re ex-working royals already, so why the need to say “well they’re going to be ex-royals” like its another step? And we already have seen how different their post-royal life will be compared to the Duke of Windsor.
My thought for them is they’ll go back for Trooping, do lots of work around that, and then go to Scotland with Charles or the queen for a few weeks. (or maybe go to Scotland with them for a bit and then go elsewhere in the UK or Europe for vacation.) Next May we “might” have the Invictus Games in the Hague, so I wouldn’t be surprised to see a UK trip planned around that.
I do not think we will see Archie.
If they don’t have a formal role at the Trooping, why come back for it? I don’t see them coming in for Invictus Games in end of May, then sticking around until the start of July. Fly in for Invictus, leave, fly in for statue unveiling, leave. Better to be beat up about the flights than spend almost three months being hounded in the UK.
agree with you on the confusing wording Becks, but overall i see it the way nota does. i think their return may be focussed on work or patronages and not the commonwealth service or trooping and other royal-performative photo ops. I am sure they will be there for weddings, funerals and will meet close family out of the spotlight, but they are not here for the pomp and circumstance. they saw how fickle that type of public adulation is.
Because “… there is going to have to be a cut, and they will have to be ex royals” is all the grey goblins and RR have anymore to hold over H & M’s heads. The Sussexes don’t communicate with Kensington Palace or the British media, so KP has no stories to leak and the RR have no tittle-tattle to report. The Sussexes cut all money ties, so neither KP, Buckingham Palace, nor the media can make threats of support cut-offs. The Sussexes aren’t in the UK, so the RR can’t follow them about and photograph at will. There’s nothing left with which to torture them besides empty threats of title loss. And even if the Sussexes did lose their titles, they’ve already shown that they don’t need them.
Keep squawking, jerks. It’s all you’ve got left.
I think if they go back for Trooping or other such events, it will be to support Charles. And I don’t think they’ll go back in 2021, but by all accounts they were supposed to attend in 2020. So I guess time will tell.
I think it’s media spin. Most of Gammon England doesn’t understand that there is a whole Parliamentary Process so the BM are tying to make it so in the heads of the public by saying it over and over.
Much like saying Beetlejuice three times…..
They will go back for the public occasions that they really cannot miss – Phil’s funeral, Liz’s funeral, Chaz’s coronation. They will not be doing the standard annual public appearances, like Ascot, Christmas & Trooping.
Beyond that, there will be private trips to the UK (post-pandemic) so Archie can see his grandfather in person every year or so and the timing of those will be tied to public events like the Invictus games.
this is my thinking too.
Poor Archie- he will inevitably learn of all of this someday. I hope he’ll at least be able to have good memories of Charles and Camilla, and maybe a few others like the York girls, to help mitigate all of this bigotry and ugliness, so he doesn’t take it to heart or feel unwanted.
Lacey, like most of the writers in Britain, is missing the plot. There is a huge difference between Harry and Duke of Windsor in circumstances (Harry was never king) and goals. I’m not well read on the Duke of Windsor honestly, but Harry and Meghan’s approach is outside the royal family, working correctly on their popularity and name recognition. The BRF and BM are so incredibly salty about H&M’s ability to live without their money (I believe Duke of Windsor received an allowance?) and “support” (yes Harry, the courtiers are STILL briefing against you) that I want to roll a few pretzels over them.
The Duke and Duchess of Windors led an idle life, dependent on an allowance and the goodwill of high society. So for them it wasn’t fun to be ex-royal. Meghan and Harry actually want to work – the Duke of Windsor never intended to work and he didn’t have any skills. Harry and Meghan probably find they new situation very freeing since they were very constrained by the BRF.
I often think of William as the Duke of Windsor reincarnated, born 2 days and 88 years apart. Same petulance, selfishness, lack of work ethic, philandering ways, but want all the adulation, power, and money of being royal.
I think so as well. William is far more like the Duke of Windsor in terms of laziness, petulance, arrogance and stupidity than Harry ever was.
@notasugarhere You’re right on!!! Totally. Both also have right-wing sympathies and are perfectly fine cozying up to tyrants (Trump, Hitler). Both have unassuming, more humble younger brothers who would be much better Kings than they ever would be (Harry, Bertie).
In the end I think both William and the Duke of Windsor and Harry/Bertie will end up similarly simply due to their true natures & in 2 cases their massive egos. Egotistical William/Edward will be & are historical jokes, Harry/Bertie beloved for their quiet charm & dedication to the people.
Let’s not forget the Nazi support. Duke of Windsor and Harry are very different for many, many reasons.
As many of the brilliant posters here have said, the problem is with the royal institution and mainly with Wills the dude.
Agreed on all counts. There is no comparison, but the British press seem to have this romanticized idea that harry and meghan are the windsors reincarnated. stop trying to make fetch happen!
“There will either be a reconciliation or this rift will continue.” Genius statement of the obvious there. And since some of Lacey’s own sources seem to be courtiers, yeah, they are still speaking about Harry. Again with the comparisons to the Duke of Windsor? Is he saying they will basically disown H&M and not allow them to visit except for funerals? I don’t think that would be a very good look for the “working royals”. Have they disowned Peter, Zara, Beatrice and Eugenie for making money off royal connections? Also how will they justify this? Say we are for “hate speech and misinformation and against human rights and support of the military”? Will all the people who moan that Meghan shouldn’t have cut off her father, moan that the royals should forgive and practice the mental health and kindness that they preach?
Well yeah. As long as he’s doing better than William, they will ALWAYS be speaking against him in the media. They lost any chance to control them so the only way to attempt to reign them in is through the media. BM is getting largely drowned out by American media though so it’s not nearly as effective as it was last year.
Hear, hear! The dolittles even had the opportunity of the pandemic to surge ahead but all they did was zoom. Even bringing out their children and the queen for photo ops did not work. One of them could have at least made a show of doing something substantial but they did not. Instead we had cosplay, drinking in a beer garden, picking up cakes and more cosplay. So disappointing.
Why is it sad that William didn’t turn to Charles to break up H&M? That would seem to support that Charles likes Meghan.
It also supports there was no real reason to break them up.
I think its “sad” because it shows that William was out of line.
It is outrageous that William actively recruited family members to break up Harry’s relationship. i bet he tried others before the Earl Spencer. It makes William look so bad to anyone outside the echo chamber of the BM.
I suspect Lacey is using that tidbit to illustrate how Charles and William aren’t close, but doesnt realize he wrapped it up as William being alone in his quest to sabotage Harry’s relationship with Meghan.
It’s telling how he didn’t got to Edward or Anne.
Given Edward’s behavior at the Commonwealth services vs. his wife’s? I don’t think Edward has a problem with Harry and Meghan, nor did he notice his wife’s efforts to help shove Harry and Meghan out.
Edward definitely seemed friendly towards Meghan at that event, and I honestly don’t think Anne cares about Meghan – not in a bad way, just in a very Anne way. Maybe she thinks they’re a little too “celebrity” but i don’t think she thinks about Harry and his wife that much. I initially had thought her dig about “reinventing the wheel” was aimed at the Sussexes, but as time goes on I am convinced it was aimed at the Cambridges, because they want to change royal work in a way that means “we don’t want to work as much as Anne does.”
ETA I will add that Lacey does spend some time talking about godparents in the book, and about how Anne was insulted that she wasn’t asked to be a godmother either William or Harry and she skipped Harry’s christening because of a scheduled “hunting party.”
I agree about Anne. She just gets on with it and seems to be the only one to rise above the crap. I remember her seemingly sounding off on Kate at one of their Christmas morning parades years ago. Although I think she is a snob, I rather like Anne for her bluntness and directness.
Anne always makes me think of Alice Roosevelt Longworth, and her famous quote – “If you haven’t got anything nice to say about anybody, come sit next to me.” She has some other great ones, she was quite a force – much like Anne seems to be.
I don’t see Anne’s bluntness as an asset. When the Queen was sick a few years ago, an elderly woman spent time making her a bouquet. Gave it to Anne at an event, Anne told her to her face it was a waste of time. Her uncontrolled dogs attacked a child in a public park, for which Anne had to face prosecution. Let’s her adult kids live off the taxpayers in her St James Palace townhouse when they aren’t living on her country estate. I don’t find those things admirable. Show up, do the job, but don’t publicly insult the people who keep you in your job.
Anne is too old at 70 to have expected/wanted to be a godparent. You are supposed to guide the children through life. The Cambridges mostly pick their aristo friends, although Zara Phillips made the cut at Charlotte’s. https://www.harpersbazaar.com/celebrity/latest/a22095208/prince-george-princess-charlotte-godparents/
Came here to say same thing. Charles was in Meghans corner. William must surely have known that, so behind his back he goes to Earl Spencer. This in reply to @equality
Wait until Harry and Meghan start appearing in public again. The crowds! William is going to be incandescent with rage, again. I hope they make their first big appearance in London for one of Harrys charities.
Will they appear in public like that though? Maybe for something like Invictus but whatever work they do in Britain will be as private people, not any official Royal appearances. The press will sniff around and try to make it a thing to cause them of craving attention, but that aspect of public life is no longer part of their job description.
Has anyone else notice that Toxic Thomas Martyr Markle and Scamantha have been VERY quiet since Harry and Meghan moved to the U.S? I don’t think it has anything to do with the British media not really wanting to talk to them..I think it’s more.
Anyhow, William needs to understand that he can’t force people to love or even like him. Or find him charming. All the things he hates Harry for, and how William is behaving is why William is not likable or relatable. He’s either too dumb or lacking self awareness to realize this.
I think they’ve been told to keep quiet… by the BM. They’re being coached in the background to be the insidious witnesses against Meg at the MOS trial. It’s going to get ugly before it gets good unfortunately, and those gruesome pair are a huge part of the ugly
I agree. There’s no way those idiots wouldn’t be putting in their 2 cents otherwise. The only thing I could imagine otherwise is that Meghan has been in touch with Thomas, or has had Doria be in touch with Thomas, and told them about some of the racist treatment she’s had. If he ever loved his daughter, he should be appalled at that. Maybe Meghan is quietly giving him some money and has “bought” his loyalty back. Without Meghan in the UK, the BM have no use for the Markles anymore, so that meal ticket will have dried up. If they expect Thomas to be a “star witness” on the stand, that actually plays into Meghan’s favor. Thomas will be such a train wreck that everyone will see him for exactly who he is. He would have to show all the times he’s been paid by or coached by the media, and he would even have to reveal what contacts he had from the various Palaces. For Meghan’s sake, I hope Thomas has turned against the media and realized his folly. I wouldn’t count on it, though.
First, William IS dumb as he never put in the effort to excel intellectually. I think he’s naturally lazy and entitled.
I was wondering about the Markles myself. I think at least the one on wheels was served with a cease and desist. I may be wrong, but it’s entirely possible. Her silly appearances did the most damage I think to Meghan’s reputation, and then her dad’s BS and lies. Either they’ve been told to shut it or they’re just simply afraid they can met with legal action given H&M’s status as private citizens.
Samantha was being investigated for cyber-bullying in Florida and banned from Twitter at one time. I don’t know how it all worked out but she may have got a wake up call.
@equality: I surely hope so. She is insufferable. Has been bleating about a book for four years now? There are no words.
I think the comparison to the Duke of Windsor is that the Duke was exiled from the UK but will Prince Harry even care after what he & Meghan have been put through? I doubt it. Harry & Meghan are never moving back. That have a home that is completely theirs. Not a “gift” from Grandmama.
Exactly. Edward VIII was desperate to come back to England but because of his and Wallis’s Nazi and appeasement leanings he was shunted out of the UK immediately upon the threat of war with Germany. The Nazis actually wanted to put him back on the throne in some titular fashion and he would have given anything for that to happen. Meghan and Harry, on the other hand, basically said “well eff this sh*t” and left. They won’t come back except for the Diana memorial and the funerals of his grandparents.
The Duke was sent to Nassau to be Governor General to get him away from Europe.
it’s a shame there will be this big media pressure with the crazy body language experts on loop at the statute unveiling on what should be an event focused on celebrating Diana’s life.
I also thought it was strange that William was allegedly going to Charles Spencer (and insulting as he’s been married thrice) to speak to Harry about his proposed marriage rather than their father. If the Queen approved the union, why wasn’t William staying in his lane? William seems to be in other people’s business too much for someone who said he struggles to spend time with his children.
No kidding the Firm has been briefing against Harry. Gee I wonder why a reunion may be hard…on that note I do think the soap opera around this is sad. The press are only winners of the briefings about breakdown in relationship of the brothers similar to when Diana and Charles had war of the Wales on front pages. Putting aside what’s alleged to have occurred, not sure how William& Harry could reconcile meaningfully knowing that a courtier would probably leak details to the press.
Also putting aside the Firms own role in events- the Sussexes merely quit working for the family Firm. Similar to how Duchess of Kent took up teaching after stopping royal duties & yet is at family events. Sussexes haven’t committed a crime, not the ones who have befriended paedophiles, not consorted with Britain’s enemies etc so why this punitive tone?
In any event thanks to their Netflix deal doesn’t look like they will be like the Duke& Duchess of Windsor having to rely on the Firm for handouts so being cut off won’t have the same effect, although of course sad from a relationship point of view.
“it’s a shame there will be this big media pressure with the crazy body language experts on loop at the statute unveiling on what should be an event focused on celebrating Diana’s life.”
If I were advising the BRF I’d just make it a private event and call it a day. The woman had a constant media frenzy throughout her life, she should be able to be remembered by her own family without a constant media frenzy in death.
It may have been planned to be originally, but William needed another PR move. There was no reason for this event to be announced nearly a year before it is to happen.
Kate’s not going to miss a chance to cosplay Diana.
Nor will W&K miss the chance to parade ‘Diana’s only granddaughter’ for the paps.
I hope Meghan and Harry have a daughter then.
I hope Meghan and Harry have a daughter then.
Considering Will and Harry haven’t personally paid for the statue but created a committee to get private donations and funding, it may well have to be public event so the donors can attend and have their moment in the press sunshine after paying their ‘admission fee’.
Side note – does Will ever pay for anything out of his own pocket?
Meghan would have been a fool to let the courtiers take over her American tax/legal issues, something they know nothing about. Someone said on another post that women should NEVER EVER cede control of their finances to someone else. As inept as these fools are, they would have screwed up her American taxes from here to kingdom come, maybe on purpose as a way of keeping control over her–mess up her money and then threaten to report her to the IRS for criminal activity if she doesn’t heed. These people are NOT to be trusted.
Agree. Meghan is still making money from her tv career in royalties. You know her people advised her to keep her finances to herself and keep on top of that. As for advisors, when they hired staff, they hired some Americans, and they realized, quicker then the courtiers, that the amount of global interest in them warranted them having their own dedicated team. She didn’t bring a team with her like a foreign Princess bringing her ladies in waiting the way foreign royal brides used to do. The courtiers bungled this, Will’s raging jealousy and obsessive need to control Harry and Meghan, to this day, is seriously weird. When I read about him being upset about their birth plan, my first question was why. Did he want them mobbed by press photocalls, which would make him more jealous? Why does he need to do that?
Since when do brothers in law get involved with birth plans? Nobody over in the UK finds William’s desire to control Harry strange? Would they all be okay with their siblings acting the way William acted?
According to Lacey’s book, it dates back to William of Orange and the Glorious Revolution and a warming pan. I’m not joking.
‘I think it’s significant and quite sad [William] didn’t turn to his own father but to Diana’s side of the family.’
Seeing how contentious the relationship is between William/Harry and their Spencer uncle? They both disliked him for monetizing Diana after her death. For William to go to Spencer? You know he was getting his uncle to use this card: ‘I grew up with your mum, I knew her better than anyone, she would be against this marriage’. Just another in William’s long run of despicable moves.
I don’t think Charles was against the wedding. He needed someone else in the mix willing and ready to work. Maybe he suspected the competition would get Will and Kate off their butts, which it has (sort of). More than anyone, he was likely to recognize the value to his future monarchy of a biracial woman marrying in (supposedly he has a framed picture of himself walking Meghan down the aisle). Hopefully, he was also happy to see Harry so happy. But who really knows.
Whatever plans Charles had for Harry are finished. I think like the Queen he’s desperate to have them back and come to some kind of agreeable arrangement but I also think he knows Harry well enough to know it isn’t going to happen.
Diana was upset at the way Earl Spencer treated his first wife who had an eating disorder. And WIlliam must know his Uncle was married three times and ditched his second wife right after she had their second child. Not a role model for relationships.
So, it isn’t that William said a small thing to Harry. William actually ran around drawing in all the family and friends he could to pressure Harry about Meghan. Harry wasn’t being impulsive and overreacting. He was fed up with William harassing him and treating Meghan terribly. Anyone would feel the same if their SO was being treated like this.
So the public only saw Harry’s direct responses and not all the sneaky manipulative badgering from William.
After the wedding, William and Kate kept running to the press with negative stories, while also preventing the Sussexes from being able to defend themselves, and shrugged off their concerns by gaslighting Meghan as being in over her head. Harry and Meghan progressively separated themselves and kept going which made the Cambridges angrier because they’re used to people bowing and scraping to make them happy, and finally when Meghan was about to give birth, William picked that moment to strongly push finishing up splitting the foundation. He pressured and harassed and undermined them every step of the way with Kate’s support and help.
Does no one in that family have the ability to tell William to STFU and mind his own business? Stop cheating and plagiarizing and then sending lawyers to force people to delete tweets.
From Lacey’s book, one can infer that William has allegedly become a full blown angry, power mad train wreck. Frustrated at having not achieved anything personally, he is married to his last choice woman and on top of that his whipping boy brother has left. His lurching from project to project being unable to gain the attention or affections of the public must also hurt. Such a shame as he had so much promise and can still turn things around if only he could see beyond the end of his nose.
I’m interested in seeing whether William will actually stay committed to Earthshot. He has signed up for a ten year commitment and I guess the real question is how much of the actual work has he offloaded on his staff? Is it going to be like the BAFTAs where William can get away with doing nothing more than showing up to an awards show?
And in a year or two, when the criticism comes rolling in, will William be able to deal with it? This awards show is about giving people like Jack Ma cover rather than about actually saving the environment. It’s similar to that summit Harry attended where it’s more about wealthy people looking for good pr, concern trolling and celebrating themselves.
Man, Elizabeth Regina! You nailed it. This should literally be front page (mildly edited):
MONARCHY IN CRISIS: William has allegedly become a full blown angry, power mad train wreck. Frustrated at having not achieved anything personally, he is repeating the marriage mistakes of his father, and on top of that his whipping boy brother has left to pursue independent success abroad. He is lurching from project to project, and his inability gain the attention or affections of the public must also hurt. He had so much promise but can he still turn things around?
Why the courtiers are not focusing on and freaking out about this is astounding to me.
How did Will get out of control?
He was never taught humility or respect for others.
@Tessa – it really is just a classic study in entitlement and enabling. He never had consequences, he never was told “no” by all accounts – instead, he was always told that he was destined by god to be more important than everyone else in the country. Now I’m not a parenting expert, by any means, lol, and I would expect it to be kind of difficult to be like, “well you’re going to be king bc that’s how it works bc of birth order and the rules of succession and you get a crown and all these palaces but don’t let that go to your head, you’re just like everyone else!” The two things are just contradictory. But at the same time, there has to be SOME way to do it, because the reality is, life is not consequence-free. I think that’s why William had such a tantrum over Sussexit. It was a pretty big consequence for his behavior (leaking to the press, trying to control Harry, enabling the smear campaign, etc) and while I don’t think Harry thought “I’m going to stick it to William by leaving,” it is still a consequence for William and he obviously does not know how to handle it.
William has never had to face consequences for his stupid stunts – because he was the heir. The RF and the press has covered for him continually. When he was in the air force he took off with one of their helicopters and landed it in the Middletons’ garden. There was zero blowback for this (I even think that his superiors had to scramble to come up with an silly excuse of it being an exercise).
What happens when a child grows up entitled by privilege and wealth, is told that they are the most important bc of birth order + everybody covering for him so he never ever experiences consequences when he does something stupid or wrong? Add the trauma of Diana’s death and the remaining parent being largely absent. William is a lazy, entitled prick who isn’t that smart and who is used to getting away with everything. No one holds him accountable, everybody covers up his missteps and he is used to people bowing and scraping to him.
William is trump but told he was the most important from birth and has a country set up to enable him all the way. Trump wasn’t the eldest and had to fight more for attention. We already know how much of a narcissist trump is and it’s unlikely that William is any different. He just has the media blacking out the undesirable behaviour. Even the comments about Kate having to calm him down should be read as a sign of his uncontrollable temper and arrogance.
William sounds like a terrible person. I don’t have a strong relationship with my SIL but William sounds like a nightmare for Meghan. Combined with his equally insecure wife and MIL I can only imagine in my worst dreams what life must have been like for Harry and Meghan. Especially Harry because he had a relationship with these people prior to meeting Meghan that must have at least been cordial if not close. But now, it seems hard to believe he doesn’t hate their guts. And what a disappointment Charles must have been to Harry to let William run free like this. I hope for Harry’s sake that the truth lies somewhere in the middle.
Charles should be concerned, William is ruthless and power hungry and “taking charge.” If he behaves this way with Harry, I don’t think Charles will be free of the plotting by William.
I agree, Tessa, and I also think the Tories are counting on this.
I think that because if the conduct…..past and present… of will and kate, we WILL NOT see Eugenie and Beatrice do more in the royal family. Those two ladies will not take on bigger roles.
If I were either of them I wouldn’t be lining up for the job but who knows. These people prioritize wealth and prestige over everything, maybe it’s worth the headache that’ll come from working in close quarters with W&K, especially K who they already have a not so great history with (allegedly)
They were eliminated as working royal prospects in their late teens, not recently. That was part of Charles’s slimdown plan, to not have any nieces or nephews on the team. Until their late teens, they had been raised to think they’d be working royals.
Honestly, at this point Beatrice and Eugenie should be over it and it’s on them if they’re not. Those two women have had all the privilege in the world to set up good lives for themselves. Eugenie and her sex trafficking podcast, and Beatrice and her coaching Andrew for his interview, can fade into the background forever as far as I’m concerned.
I still suspect Eugenie is trying to undo some of her father’s evil with that podcast- but then again I haven’t listened to it. Still, this is the kind of gesture one would make. It would be unimaginable for her to denounce her own father (who has loved her and fought for her all those years), especially when he’s at his lowest point- but she is symbolically rejecting his acts.
Beatrice and Eugenie are forever tainted by association to their parents, especially Andrew. This Epstein thing will keep coming back to haunt him as Ghislaine Maxwell nears her trial date. More lurid details will continue to become public so the best thing they can do is just retire into the woodwork, have their babies and STFU.
The Duke of Windsor is only brought up because he is the worst person they can think of.
The Duke may have regretted giving up his crown, he never found another purpose in life. Diana died too young to know if she would have regretted the divorce and giving up a future as Queen Consort or if she would have found a happy life.
Harry gave up a future of being a show pony for William as he fell further down the line as the years go by. Meghan gave him a gift by saying ‘yes, I see what you see and it doesn’t have to be this way’.
I think the Duke was happy. His sole purpose was to marry the woman he loved. That was it. I don’t think he regretted stepping down. Diana had no choice but to move on. Charles outed Camilla and Camilla I think was at that point set to be his second wife though it took some years. Charles also was not treating Diana very well and nobody needs that for the rest of one’s life.
If you mean the Duke of Windsor, he regretted it almost immediately and made some sort of attempt to conspire with Hitler to win the throne back. Hence he was shipped off to the Western Hemisphere, right next door to the watchful eye of Uncle Sam.
Edward/David was a Nazi, and Wallis liked Hitler and boasted of her descent from a family of slave owners. This couple should have never been romanticized.
We can take some consolation, at least, that Diana did find true love, however briefly, with the gentle and kind Hasnat Khan- although sadly his family refused to approve of her as a possible wife for their son. I like to think she would have found another great love had she lived, and she likely would have, she had a passionate and devoted heart.
Is it really a revelation that the palace is still briefing against Harry? I’m sure that Harry was not surprised when he saw certain comments coming out of the palace. Lacey and the rest of British press believe that being a royal is the ultimate goal and to live outside of that bubble is somehow a bad thing. But the way it’s been going so far, it looks like Harry and Meghan are thriving as ex-royals. Harry and William’s relationship is over and as I said on a previous post, I can see Harry not showing up for the Diana statue unveiling because it’s going to turn into a media circus with William behind the scenes manipulating the whole thing. I just don’t see Harry wanting to be part of that. In fact, the KP maneuvering already started when they announced the statue unveiling one year in advance.
I hope you’re right. Though I’m not so sure. I think he is too kind and loyal for his own good. Remember what he said about Will in the interview with Tom Brady? “He’s my brother, he will always be my brother”… and something that they’ll stand for each other. I’m sure he already knew then what a backstabber his brother is, not just to him but to his family. Still he didn’t badmouth bully Bill even a bit.
I with Meghan and Harry would visit Britain for coronation of Charles. Though Will tries for this (Charles’ coronation) to not happen, it seems.
He said that before knowing William’s office would leak their exit plans to the press (most likely with William’s permission) and also before William’s reaction to H&M filing the lawsuits. Bet if you ask Harry now, he might have a different answer.
Harry said that because he had no choice..do you want him to say that he hates his brother when millions of people watch him ?? Harry is a nice man, and no way he would say anything bad about that bald man , although I think Harry did not need to exaggerate and say that “we’re brothers, we’ll always be brothers” “I’ll always be there for him and as I know he’ll always be there for me.” “I love him dearly”🥴🥴I think these quotes are exaggerated, but I understand why Harry said that
I’m still just so happy for Meg, Harry & darling Archie that they’ve pulled off this (narrow) escape! Like they’re Katie Holmesing this shiz all day & I am loving it. Go get that best life Sussexes!
I imagine next year on July 1, Harry with Meghan & Archie, and PWT, Karen & their children ,they all showing up to unveil the Diana statue and act as the happy family…. Oh goodness, Harry please don’t do that!!… The British media and the crazy sick people don’t deserve to see Archie… I really hope just Harry shows up for the Diana statue..
I think if Harry goes he needs to take his family. He would be seen as backing down and also there would be floods of pleas for the usual trashers for Harry to Stay There and the Queen can claim Archie. These awful comments are going on right now on social media.
If Harry takes his family, I hope there will be no pictures… I love and appreciate Harry because he does not use his child as PR… I imagine if Philip is still alive next year and when his 100 birthday come, there might be picture with all his great grandchildren, the same picture they published on Betty’s 90th birthday, and I imagine Archie would be there in that picture with Philip and the other children
Do people really believe that a court would allow the Queen to take guardianship of someone else’s child because of a rule that was established in 1717 when the monarchy had full power? It’s not even an act of Parliament; it was some type of “royal prerogative” and involved grandchildren not great-grandchildren. Even if UK courts would uphold her right to do so I couldn’t picture any international or other country’s court upholding it. It might make some haters very happy but I think it would also create an international outrage that the monarchy wouldn’t want to deal with. I doubt she has interest in any of the children outside of George anyway.
Archie will not be there
Harry and Meghan jumped before they were pushed and appear to be completely in control of the direction of their new, successful lives. Saying the monarchy will cut them out of the picture is so bizarre. What is he talking about? They cut themselves out. Will their British patronages be taken away? Is it events like the commonwealth service or trooping the colour that he’s referring to? I’m not informed enough to understand this comment.
“At the moment they are enjoying their new lives. But if there is no reconciliation next year there is going to have to be a cut, and they will have to be ex royals.”
Harry and Meghan weren’t going to be pushed out. What some members (W&K) wanted was for Harry and Meghan to be under their control, required to do the work while others took all the credit.
i think that’s the case. they were to be obedient servants serving the heir and giving all glory and honor to him.
Well exiled then. My point is they left while they still had some control to shape the exit rather than have the palaces make all the decisions
The only thing I can think of is they would tell them they can’t use Frogmore? I mean what else is left? And I could see William being sh*tty enough to do something like that. But whatever I’m sure Harry and Meghan won’t have to sleep in the park or whatever when they come to visit.
It’s so obvious that what these royal reporters (and probably the royals themselves) want is for Harry to WANT to come back, and then for QEII to DECIDE whether to take him back. They don’t want Harry to have any power at all in this situation, let alone the most power — the power of refusal. What they don’t understand is that Harry had and has the most power here because he is willing to walk away, and ALREADY DID. Reading these royal reporters is like hearing from an abusive husband who cannot believe that his wife a) actually left him, b) doesn’t want to come back, and c) he can’t exercise his “right” to decide whether or not he will take her back. Dude, she’s already GONE!!!!
But that’s bc they are trying to save face and brainwash the public into the narrative that they’re (BRF) are in control, as to preserve their standing of an institution of the highest coveted brand of prestige. @DeeKay. They are an outdated relic that needs to go. My hope is this is the beginning of their true and final end. Even better if they go before the rest of the European royals. That will rub even more salt in the wound. 😂
I wish Charles had put a stop to what William was doing. Especially his running around complaining about Harry and Meghan to Charles Spencer. William is not in charge.
Apparently William had no complaints about Beatrice’s relationship with Edo. Edo had a fiancee and a baby with her, soon after the breakup he takes up with Beatrice. One standard for the others another one for his brother.
If the York girls have any sense at all, they’ll steer clear of William and working under him for the Firm. Besides, Kate isn’t exactly besties with them either. Also, both of them are married to white men. Will is fine with that. I don’t understand this fixation William has on controlling Harry’s wife, because that’s what this is all about, controlling Meghan.
Well, Edo is rich, a business tycoon and an Italian aristocrat and, of course, a white male. Even the media hasn’t been harsh with him like they are with married-in women.
“The question is can the monarchy adapt to the challenge of a free thinking couple–”
Lol, no, just gonna stop you right there; that’s why they had to leave and, in fact, did leave. Do whatever “adapting” the monarchy attempts now will be about damage control. They’re GONE and they’re FINE.
“and arguably the most charismatic members of the family or will they shut them out of the picture?”
Again, this sort of implies the royal family has the last say. Queen: “I hereby banish thee” Sussexes: “Dude, I quit last year. I literally put an ocean between us. Stop calling.”
“Dude, I quit last year, stop calling!”
That should be the headline next year when the “year review” happens. Perfect!! If the Queen decides to come at them with “I banish thee,” then I would pay some serious money to see Harry, Meghan, and Archie invite some of the royal rats to Montecito, stand on the front lawn of their beautiful home, do a sharp about face to turn their backs to the camera, and then moon them. Three butts in a row. Then pull up their pants and sashay into their house and slam the door.
Look. Elizabeth has been part of the monarchy since before WWII. No one even considers getting rid of her. No one likes Charles or William the same way. When the Queen dies I believe that the UK will consider getting rid of the monarchy. The majority of them are already questioning why they still have them. Without Meaghan & Harry there is no way William & Kate can keep the interest of the people to keep supporting them.
This is in line with everything I’ve heard. Harry has zero interest in having anything further to do with the royal family and doesn’t really care what happens as far as that is concerned. He made it clear to his grandmother and father that royal life is not for him and in a sense there is forgiveness with those two and personal relations with them are ok. The Queen is desperate for Harry to return and for this PR nightmare that she knows she and her courtiers created to end. The realization is now upon her how serious Harry’s contempt for the monarchy was. Harry is not coming back. Harry doesn’t want to come back. He tasted freedom and he is making something of himself outside of the royal family. The only sliver of hope now is for some kind of part time deal but even that seems a fool’s errand given how they’ve treated him. What’s worse, is that she knows Harry is beloved outside the UK and the rest of them are…not. Her decisions and mistakes have had major consequences with commonwealth relations in the Carribbean. I think she is realizing that SHE has damaged the monarchy – possibly beyond repair.
Everything I’ve heard is that the one thing Charles, William, and Harry can all agree on is that there needs to a clean break if there is to be a break. I think Charles is not-so-secretly proud of Harry and will always be his father, same with Elizabeth being his grandmother. William will never forgive Harry. Ever. However, I think the regret is forcing Harry into a royal roll when he never really wanted one in the first place.
My prediction: Harry has no problem being the one to go to parliament and personally requesting his removal from the line of succession the removal of his titles. However, he would do further damage if he did. All signs are pointing to parliament being forced to review the constitution and the succession plan next year once the Covid crises are calmed which could be bad for them but is necessary to prevent everything that happened in 2019 & 2020 from becoming full-blown crises down the line. Harry and Andrew will no longer find themselves in the line of succession. Harry will be a worldwide superstar and the royal family will remain in tact for a time but I do think the changes they are forced to make to the succession plan will severely weaken Charles and William.
Honestly, none of this makes any sense to me. Charles and William are right there, William has 3 healthy children, the succession is fine. What more do they need from Harry? In all these Harry come home, this is so bad for the monarchy spiel, what exactly is Harry supposed to do for the monarchy and what exactly is his official role to be? He’s not the future head of state, he honestly has no official constitutional role, and the taxpayers have clearly said they don’t want any funding going toward him and his family ( we know exactly why, no need to pretend otherwise). If they had just let him settle into his marriage, they would have found their groove and eventually settled. Will and Kate are never going to get hit with the charisma stick but they should have learned to share the space and make nice, but they couldn’t even do the bare minimum, because they’ve never had to in regard to work or relationships. In the end they get all the toys and privilege, but giving Harry and Meghan a little space was too much, so now they’re gone, creating their own space. Instead of, if not adapting, just keeping quiet and waiting and see, the Brits are still losing it and denying their own ugly actions, acting like the Sussexes are just on an extended vacation.
The entire world outside of England sees what you are describing. That is why the Americans are making Harry one of their own, two Caribbean countries are leaving the commonwealth, and the press outside of the England is not good.
Harry was the family’s ambassador. They are so out of touch that they need the spare to be the modern thinker for the entire family, they need the Margarets (50s-60s contemporary), the Andrews (80s contemporary), and Harrys (current contemporary) to function and to be relevant. The attacks on Harry are a defense mechanism to prevent reporters from figuring out just how toxic and messed up this family is (and trust me, I’m starting to really hear how bad it is). The toxicity is so bad it could threaten national security.
“The toxicity is so bad it could threaten national security.”
They’ve proven again and again that they are a toxic family. However, I don’t understand how that could threaten national security. Edward VIII was a national security threat because he as king had access to sensitive information and he was highly sympathetic to a foreign power that was on a collision course with his own nation. Andrew has shown himself to be corrupt but a threat to national security? I’m not sure what you’re getting at.
The next decade will be pivotal for the United Kingdom. The warring royals are rather indicative to the state of things.
As far as the UK is concerned, the royal family might be seen as the glue that holds the whole damned thing together. Their fighting is symbolic of the state of things on the UK and it is falling apart. In the next decade IndyRef2 is coming and at this point could very likely pass. IndyRef2 could lead Northern Ireland reuniting with The Republic and even Wales is showing some distance from England which is unprecedented. The United Kingdom as we know it may not survive this decade and if it doesn’t, I doubt the royals will have a throne in end.
Also, I have a theory that is fast turning out to be fact: alcoholism is a serious issue for the Windsors to the point that it is a national security issue (who wants a drunk on the throne?). We all suspected that Margaret had issues with drinking and pills but apparently Andrew is a hard core excessive drinker and loves cocaine. Apparently, William to this day can’t go a single hour without a strong cocktail. Harry, on the other hand, quit drinking. This unhealthy behavior has been supported by many inside and outside the monarchy to keep certain people…compliant but is in fact incredibly exploitive.
No joke, if I get more info I may stop writing on here and write a book. What I’ve learned about that is…shocking.
Yikes! Uncontrollable alcoholism was one of the reasons why the Danish succession was changed so that Prince Knud didn’t inherit his brother’s throne. Before WWII, Knud was the commander of the fort in the town I grew up in . It was then a very very small town and everybody were in each other’s pockets. My grandfather knew people who ran in the same circles as Prince Knud in this town and it was well-known (but kept quiet) that he was a raging alcoholic.
It’s an old story and there does seem to be a correlation between addiction and radical changes within the monarchy. Knud is a prime example (that I was going out of my way to avoid…did it get warm in here?). The reason Marie Antoinette was a problem is that her drinking bill was sending France into economic ruin. It’s said that even in prison she was given 2 wine bottles per day to keep her from going into fits. Another is Tsar Nicholas and Tsarina Alexandra who had opiate addictions. Another example is in fact Edward, Duke of Windsor. People like to say that it was his Nazi ties and affair with Wallis that forced his abdication. However news of his affair didn’t get out or become an issue with parliament until they saw two things: his astronomical alcohol expenses and that his time attending to state matters amounted to less than 2 hours per day. Also, Philip’s father was supposedly a mean drunk. The royals are to socializing what socializing is to parties and what parties are to alcohol.
The fact of the matter is, these people all know appearances matter. Their one job is to look respectful and show up. But behind that curtain is a lot of booze to keep them going. I believe William has fallen victim to that.
Taylor, I’m surprised TQ cares that much about Harry returning given how spiteful she’s been. She can’t have been so stupid not to realise the consequences?
And doesn’t Camilla love a drink or 5? Not bio a Windsor but will be the consort very soon. William doesn’t look like a drinker but Andy does
The Queen Mother was also a heavy drinker.
I read that as ‘squawking’ against him🤣🤣🤣 sorry, English is not my mother 👅
Hee hee. ‘Squawking’ is more fitting.
I don’t think William is an alcoholic, but I do think he has mental health issues and needs therapy.
I don’t think William has mental health issues. His issues are characterlogical ie. selfish, entitled, jealous.
Alcoholism does seem plausible and it certainly exacerbates belligerent and narcissistic tendencies. And in those circles especially, holding your liquor is a required skill, so it wouldn’t necessarily be apparent to anyone that you were impaired.
I will say this to my last breath-the courtiers have all the power over the royal family-they know how to keep them in line to keep the monarchy in line.- RANK is the only thing they care about-WHO will sit on the throne is their main mission in life-The queen, Charles, William, and George is all they really care about-Everybody else are chop liver so to speak-the so called spares and lesser royals don’t have a prayer against these people-don’t fall in line you will be villified and dragged through the mud if you don’t tow the line. Royalist, biographers, and apologists are just as ruthless as the courtiers-they walk hand in hand with a willing press to denigrate and smear others not apart of the throne sitting.the queen did it to her sister Margaret-Charles does it to his siblings-William is doing this to his brother with the blessing of ruthless evil schemers inside the palaces and outside of it. If the mental health and well-being of the Sussexes is more important than living in the bubble nightmare then so be it. During this pandemic the money that was used to support the Sussex family and the money for Beatrice and Eugenie who have rich husbands should be put in a fund to help the British people-Prince Andy will be supported by his mother-so his share should go into the pot too. God continue to bless and keep the Sussex family .
Wrong post.
They wanted H&M to be social pariahs like Edward and Wallis Smith. They didn’t count on H&M retaining all of their popularity and landing a Netflix deal that secured them financially for generations. There is no comparison to Duke of Windsor, and not only because H&M haven’t actually done anything wrong.