For two solid years, we’ve been talking about Kate, the Duchess of Karens, and her salty white tears. The oft-repeated and oft-weaponized story was that Kate and Meghan had some kind of disagreement or fight in the days or weeks leading up to the Sussexes’ wedding. We knew the incident happened at the bridesmaids’ fitting for Princess Charlotte. In versions over the years, we’ve heard that “Meghan made Kate cry” and that the disagreement involved the fit of the dress, or tights, or something else entirely. This became its own nasty, racist narrative involving the two duchesses: Kate the “good (white) duchess” versus Meghan, the mean, angry bully who terrorized Kate over children’s tights. Well, in the Oprah interview, Meghan says flat-out that there was an incident… and that Kate made HER cry.
Meghan, Duchess of Sussex, addressed her sister-in-law, Catherine, Duchess of Cambridge, during her interview with Oprah Winfrey tonight, revealing that Kate made her cry prior to her royal wedding. After Winfrey asked Meghan about tabloids reporting that she had made Kate cry days before marrying Prince Harry, Meghan answered, “No, the reverse happened.”
The duchess went on to say that she didn’t want “to be disparaging to anyone,” but simply wanted to clear the air. “It was a really hard week of the wedding, and she was upset about something. But she owned it, and she apologized, and she brought me flowers and a note apologizing. She did what I would do if I knew that I hurt someone, to just take accountability for it.”
Meghan said that the issue pertained to dresses for the flower girls in the wedding. “A few days before the wedding, she was upset about something pertaining to … flower girl dresses. And it made me cry,” she said. “And it really hurt my feelings, and I thought in the context of everything else that was going on in those days leading to the wedding, it didn’t make sense to not be just doing whatever everyone else is doing, which was trying to be supportive knowing what was going on with my dad and whatnot.”
The duchess added that she never wanted the story to receive any press attention. Though the issue between the duchesses was resolved, the most hurtful part of the situation, according to Meghan, was how the media reacted by reversing the blame. “I would have never wanted that to come out about her ever, even though it had happened,” Meghan said. “I protected that from ever being out in the world.”
As Winfrey attempted to press for more details of the altercation, Meghan said, “I don’t think it’s fair to her to get into the details of that, because she apologized. And I’ve forgiven her. What was hard to get over was being blamed for something that not only I didn’t do, but that happened to me. And the people who were part of our wedding going to our comms team and saying, ‘I know this didn’t happen.'”
Despite this, Meghan revealed that the monarchy prevented her from clearing the air. “I think it’s really important for people to understand the truth,” she said. “But also I think a lot of it that was fed into by the media—and, look, I would hope that she would have wanted that corrected, and maybe in the same way that the palace wouldn’t let anybody else negate it, they wouldn’t let her, because she’s a good person. I think so much of what I have seen play out is this idea of polarity, where if you love me, you don’t have to hate her. If you love her, you don’t need to hate me.”
I’m going to say that Meghan is wrong about one thing, which is that she’s laying this at the feet of the media wanting desperately to pit Kate and Meghan against each other. While the media loved the “catfight” narrative, the aggressor and the victim weren’t reversed out of thin f–king air. Even as late as LAST WEEK, there were stories in the Telegraph and Times of London repeating the f–king story about how “Meghan made Kate cry.” It was 100% a narrative pushed by Kensington Palace. And even if Kate didn’t have much to do with the narrative getting out there – which I don’t even f–king believe – she absolutely had the responsibility to correct the record along the line. She didn’t. Which speaks volumes about Kate.
… And then after Kate bitched out Meghan in a dress fitting and made her cry before her wedding, Kate then wore a pale off-white coatdress to Meghan’s wedding. Kate is such a passive-aggressive a–hole, my god.
Photos courtesy of Avalon Red.
So Kate is, in fact, as we have long suspected and theorised, a cow; and Meghan is *still* being nice.
The Royal Family did not deserve Meghan. Far too good for such trash.
Meghan made the right call. Present the truth, no more protecting their racist asses. But making a broader point about problematic media narratives wanting her to be the villain to Kate’s hero.
She played it well. She isn’t granted the allowance to trash Kate and it’s not her MO. But she let’s it be clear that the institution was ALLOWED to run with the fake story. And by what Meghan chose to reveal and not to reveal, we know Kate did nothing to stop it which was hurtful.
Huge respect to Meghan. Not only did she never run to the tabloids to play the game, but she never outed Kate all this time. She took all the hits and we did not get one whiff that all this time, Meghan was the one who cried.
PS I gotta say if someone bitched about flower girl dresses 2 days before my own damn wedding in front of 2 billion people while my dad is causing a media spectacle and ignoring my calls and faking a heart attack…….let’s just say I wouldn’t have handled it as nicely as Meghan. While all that was going on, Karen centered herself and ignored her pain. What a cold hearted asshole
Well then Kate is just like her deranged stans -centering herself and her feelings in anything about Meghan. Like attracts like.
Also I get now why we kept getting these stories about the aides hysterically crying. They’re mocking Meghan for Kate making her cry.
All of this. Meghan is so good for NOT outing Kate all this time. Yes, Kate apologized and set flowers, but then someone from the team used this situation against Meghan, saying Kate had cried. And Kate said nothing, and her team and “Meghan’s” team did not correct it in the press. Very cruel.
True. If someone would complain about flowergirl dresses or tights or anything days before my wedding (broadcast to billions of people) I would make that person cry. I would bathe in those tears and drink them up. I admire Meghan deeply for how she handled things.
Meghan took the high road here and it was absolutely the right move. There are still things she knows she can’t say as a biracial black woman. And boy did she choose her words carefully- enough so we could read between the lines.
Well said, MA. And I think KAISER nailed it here. Meghan is being unbelievably generous, but I still think Kate is just as involved as William in smearing Meghan. KP doesn’t have any trouble getting Jason to run to the press on any number of things, but there’s never been one iota of support or positivity towards Meghan from them.
As another aside, Louis had just been born when this incident happened and hasn’t it been revealed that William’s rose Bush trimming took place when Kate was pregnant with Louis? Maybe the ‘hard week’ Kate was dealing with is that she had just found out about Rose right around the time of Sussex wedding. Even though the story didn’t leak for some time, that scenario makes perfect sense to me. Kate — highly hormonal and betrayed — would have a hard time being supportive or happy for Sussex wedding when it must have constantly been a reminder of William’s infidelity. Also makes me think, the thing with Rose was so much deeper (and thus threatening to Kate) than just another of William’s one night stands.
This is meghan a nice girl who wants to help her SIL, When willie decided to divorce kate, at least the media will not blame kate for the megxit.
Maybe this is her way telling kate that when kate or her kids are in trouble, they can come to her.
When you go on TV and say the other person apologized, sent flowers and an apology note you know someone has the receipts. She didn’t need to say there was physical evidence of what happened but in a court of law that would be proof. Another thing, when Zara got married her flower girls did not wear tights. The Queen’s very own granddaughter decided that her flower girls did not have to wear tights so there is no tight gestapo as Kate implied. Good thing the girls did not wear tights also because it was an unseasonably warm day, too warm for tights.
I think M knows how abusive William is. And that gives her compassion for K and a bit of a blind spot. But horrible people can be abused too. And Kate is not a good person.
– voice of experience within my own family –
I suspect she also has compassion for Kate because she sees how hard it is to marry into this family and survive. Of course, Kate was treated nowhere near as poorly, but I bet it’s easy for Meghan to understand how Kate had to have adapted, for better or worse (in this case, worse), in order to survive in the institution.
– and Meghan is, by the testimony of her friends, a compassionate person.
I think Meghan has had a lifetime of giving the benefit of the doubt by the behavior of her awful father. Thank God she got out of there. Leaving the situation of dealing with an envious manipulative father that you try to appease and going into an institution that is infinitely more sinister and abusive.
Perhaps she felt something at *that* point, after the crying incident… But Kate had a MULTITUDE of opportunities to come out and say/DO SOMETHING this whole time she’s been doing her Early Years “project” (lol yeah…HER “work”). Kate constantly talks about the need to “support mothers/babies”, the support *pregnant* women need… and yet… CRICKETS for her own SIL.
Nah.. Kate MAY be working w/in the somewhat larger lane of constriction of a married in, but she is JUST as complicit.
Yes and I think it’s extremely notable that Meghan took great pains to say “Kate is a good person and I forgave her” and no one said anything similar about William.
I get uncomfortable pitting two women against each other, so I’m inclined to believe that Kate may be complicit, but she’s not the instigator.
Truth – given all the trash that’s been written about them they have every right to tell their side of the story.
This was a bombshell to the RF and the ‘institution’.
Meghan is being far too nice about them, esp Kate – i wonder how Top CEO will respond to this? She and the Mids will retaliate – you can expect a deluge of exclusive photo’s/stories about Charlotte given the confirmation that its a girl.
Honestly I cannot stand this beyond privileged family and I feel for Meghan having to deal with the courtiers agendas and the terrible press but she is saying that it shouldn’t be pitting one woman against the other. Yet here we are on International Women’s Day, ignoring her words and continuing that narrative. I think we need to look at the fact that we have probably been reading too much into certain details and feeding this fire too.
The fact is Kate let a story she knew was false remain uncorrected so that it would demonize Meghan. Kate has issued corrections on many other stories but did not do that here. It’s not pitting one woman against another one when one woman has consciously let the other one get demonized for false information. She could easily have shut it down and chose not to. Not all women are allies by virtue of their shared gender. And letting another woman hang for public criticism and demonization is cruel and deserves to be called out.
Kate did not issue statements. William and Kate’s staff did. At whose direction? I think William’s. I don’t know how much power Kate actually has, or even whether she has any agency. I mean, I just don’t know. Maybe Meghan knows though.
But I do think Kate showed herself with that awful look on her face I don’t know at which event, I am not a royalafile, the one where Meghan was wearing green. That was bad. So…I don’t know.
I agree Darla. If Meghan wasn’t ever allowed to say anything, it’s possible Kate can’t either. Hearing how restrictive everything was for Meghan, it sounds like Kate has a lot less agency than most people think.
That said, I still don’t get the impression Kate was supportive of her in any way, when of all the people there, those two should have had each other to lean on, being in similar positions and all.
Adding my agreement that Kate doesn’t have a say. We can call her complicit in going along with whatever her husband and his family want. But if we’re going to believe Meghan for everything else she said, are we really going to say she was lying when she said Kate doesn’t have permission to speak up for herself either?
Kate is a Stepford wife, though I’ve taken to calling her a Windsor wife. She gave up her agency and she does whatever William or the family via William tell her to do. That’s why they love her there. They wanted an anti-Diana and they got it in her.
Regarding moral support, Diana and Fergie truly had each other to lean on in the years they were both married in but Diana and Fergie also got in trouble for having their own agency and personalities. Kate doesn’t work that way. She’s William’s robot wife.
If Carole wasn’t leaking things and insulting Meghan herself I might buy that Kate can’t control this, but there is no way William works with Carole. Kate is behind what Carole says and she is far more complicit that Meghan realizes. We have seen how Meghan is giving the benefit of the doubt and good for her, but it doesn’t mean she sees the whole picture. She admittedly doesn’t read the articles about herself, so she likely doesn’t even know about the stuff Carole has said about her
I agree, Meghan know’s Kate and we don’t. She said she was a good person. She said theres a possibility she was being prevented from speaking out too.
I totally agree with @Sandra in that Kate is the anti-Diana. She does what she’s told it’s as much about survival for her as anyone else. Meghan also made it clear that things aren’t how they look so I think we have to assume that not everything with Kate is how it looks either. Another important distinction Meghan made is that there is the family and then there is the firm (or whatever wording she used). Aside from the race issue, she didn’t seem to have much of an issue with any of the family themselves and it felt like she was trying to make that clear, which is why it’s annoying to keep seeing in the press now that she’s taking down the family. She’s not – she’s challenging the way the powers that be work surrounding the family.
I’m with you, Nic919. The idea that Kate is somehow a victim here, without the ability to tell the truth because the Palace wouldn’t let her? Completely false. For the past four years, Kate and Carole have repeatedly briefed against Meghan through their connections to RRs and tabloids. Kate benefitted from the storyline, so she willingly let it stay out there. Once a mean girl, always a mean girl. That’s Kate.
💯this!
I watched the interview yesterday with raw emotions, I was cursing Kate for allowing that hateful narrative about Meghan making her crying to fester out there BUT after everything Meghan went through, can we please please cut Kate some slack?
Some people have talked about her alarming weight especially compared to the early days, so she must be going through something similar to what Meghan went through. Let’s please please be kind to her; yes she is more protected than Meghan was but I am trying to have compassion for her
These royal women are thrown in situation in which they are fully controlled. Meghan escaped but Kate is trapped just like her husband is.
I have called Kate mediocre as I think she does not have even a fraction of the skillset Meghan has but she as well is trying to survive!
Thank you
Um…no.
And clearly you weren’t paying attention to what meghan said at all.
Oprah asked her if kate was supportive since they went to Wimbledon together and meghan didn’t answer and said it’s not at all what it seems..in other words, No, kate was NOT supportive.
Meghans facial expression of anger and irritation when she said that she didn’t make kate cry and that it was the reverse also tells the story.
Meghan knows as a biracial black woman she has to choose her words carefully and she knows she won’t be looked at as an innocent victim like kate.
By the way, none of them are trapped. They can leave anytime and spare the poor taxpayers who are TRULY trapped into paying for them.
Kate let Meghan, a biracial woman already being attacked by the media, be demonized even further over a story she knew was false. There is no excuse for that cruelty.
It is only a few steps away from the false stories that white women in the south made about being raped which literally got black men killed.
If Kate had never sent out a press release prior to this, then perhaps she might have had an excuse, but she complained about hair extensions, botox and the Tatler article, but remained silent on a lie about Meghan. No slack given on that.
@Q : I was paying attention, there is no need to question that. I am just asking for some compassion for Kate as well….yes the WW tears narrative was terrible but Meghan said she forgave her as Kate owned up to it and apologized. I was cursing y’day but I think about that Meghan went through, I feel some compassion for Kate.
It is ok if you don’t; there is nothing wrong with that and I do understand it but I do believe Kate as well must be going through the same isolation Meghan is going through. At least she has her family over there and I hope she spends as much time with them as she possibly can.
@Nic919 — maybe Kate was prevented from correcting that as her team was more than happy to let be out there because their goal was to destroy Meghan. yes, I realize it does not show her in a good light but as Meghan said, Kate is a good person. I know as a WOC Meghan can’t go kamikaze on Kate but I just want Meghan to be able to move on from all that negativity. She is safe, pregnant and a life ahead of her
although not said, kate is as trapped as W is
the reason it’s hard to feel compassion for Kate is that she benefited from all the negative press against Meghan, Kate came out as Kate the Great and everyone suddenly loved Kate. Speaking of Kate the Great, Kate sued Tatler and broke protocol by speaking out, when it suited her. Why didn’t she do this against this lie about Meghan?
I also believe we’ve seen Kate’s true face twice – once at Meghan and Harry’s wedding, where she couldn’t even muster a smile during the ceremony. The photos shown here is her smiling with her family, she did not smile ONCE inside, especially when M&H were exchanging their vows -she was busy reading the wedding brochure thing (forgot the name!). The second time was of the very famous Commonwealth ceremony exactly a year ago today. Nasty woman, who ignored Meghan and Harry in front of the whole world watching.
No we are not going to give Kate the benefit of the doubt on refusing to deny this story about Meghan that only involves herself and not William when she has been clearly able to deny every other story she wants. William wouldn’t even care about this kind of story.
Making excuses for Kate’s cruelty here is not an option. She’s not so trapped that she can’t send out a simple denial.
VS – I get that giving Kate grace is the nice and tidy thing to do, but I suspect many women of color witnessing this, like myself, are beyond sick and tired of being forced to give grace to people who have proven time and again they don’t deserve it. Meghan nearly committed suicide because of people who were bent on destroying her, both directly and indirectly. Kate is one of those people. She has to say she forgives her because it’s part of the game, but I know if it were me, I may say I “forgive” in public because it’s the PC right and polite thing to do, but I sure as hell wouldn’t forget — EVER. And I would not be building her up either. She has plenty of stans to do that for her.
@VS
It’s very telling how we are still expected to compassion for Kate in the face of knowing that she not only benefited from the press maligning Meghan, but was the cause of the entire situation regarding the dresses.
Why? Why does a white women still get to be treated with grace, when it’s obvious she doesn’t deserve.
Also…bringing up International Women’s Day and “Meghan wouldn’t want to pit women against each other is rich. I am not here for solidarity that’s only brought up in defense of a white woman being rightfully criticized for HER actions.
Drew Gilpin Faust did a historical study of white women in the slave-holding South showing how they abused their positions of relative power to do violence to enslaved persons. They deployed their whiteness as a weapon against Black people. Although as women they were lower-class citizens, it often only spurred them on to take out their frustrations on enslaved people, who were not even citizens at all. It is a dangerous path to take to ask for sympathy for Kate, because while she is probably suffering herself, she directly hurt Meghan and also indirectly hurt her by not being there for her (her own sister in law) when Meghan was literally being driven to suicide. Can you imagine? The point is that Kate contributed to Meghan’s suffering, whereas Meghan did nothing to hurt Kate and even tried to hide stories that would make her look bad to protect her. It is a double standard to now ask for sympathy for Kate because the person who needs our sympathy and support is Meghan. Kate is always around her family and she does have a measure of power that Meghan did not have. She is white and conventionally attractive and we cannot discount that privilege.
@swirlmamad — I am a WOC as well; not like Meghan but like Barack Obama.
I am not excusing Kate here; at least not in regard to Meghan
I am asking for us to have compassion because that woman must be going through a tough time as well; look at her! yes she did benefit from Meghan’s pain; her mother certainly, because of insecurity, added fuel to the fire; kate as well, probably because she was so out of depth compared to Meg.
The compassion I am asking for is we don’t know what’s going in Kate’s life behind closed doors.
Anyway, we got a new picture of the Sussex family and per one of H’s friend, Meg is 6 months pregnant so a lot of people were able to really guess when she was due
@VS – You have taken a compassionate and nuanced position. Not allowed here.
No compassion for kate; neither she or her mother-carole deserve nothing less, but contempt. Truthfully, I think Harry & Meghan know something is about to go down & this is why Meghan was more gracious when speaking about kate in the interview.
What I want to know, is who leaked this story and spun it to make Megan the bad guy. That person should not be able to sleep at night for being so toxic.
Kate and Carole, both of whom have no trouble being toxic and feeling absolutely no shame about it.
GOSH. Finally. For year we were sure about that. I hate this family of Karen so much. I hope Carol middleton is having a bad morning.
I’ve always detested this Karen and I am glad I was right to. She is a sly, jealous, gaslighter. Her unhappiness is palpable and long may she wallow in it.
Meghan (paraphrase) says, “Oh, the Waity-Katie thing was so mean! I cannot even imagine what what that must have been like!!!” C.Middleton stands up, walks to the nearest door jamb and bangs her head repeatedly into it.
[Bonus: Harry, last week “I knew Megs was special on our 2nd date and we went from zero-to-sixty in 2 months”.]
If Kate were a good person she would have set the record straight that she had made Meghan cry, but that she apologised and Meg had forgiven her. Instead we got version after version of why Meg made Kate cry. She never tried to clear the air around that except for that timid Tattler rebuttal of “that’s not exactly right”. She can go screw herself. She is just as bad as the rest.
She didn’t even have to do that. Those assholes could’ve just denied the story as an absolute bare minimum but stayed silent or perpetuated the story. It was intentionally malicious.
Yep. I understand why Kate/the firm wouldn’t have wanted to advertise that Kate made Meghan cry, but they could have just said “Meghan didn’t make Kate cry” and ended it.
EXACTLY. They could have very easily denied the story, with no specifics. “Kensington Palace has responded to our inquiry about the story and said that the incident did not occur.” Full stop. They dont need to say that Kate made Meghan cry, they could have just stopped the story in its tracks.
They could have, but they didnt, and shame on them.
Kate wore a colour close to white to the wedding. She had worn the dress before and knew it photographs nearer to white than yellow. That tells me all I need to know about her trifling ways.
The silence in the face of the story is entirely purposeful on Kate’s part. She let it go on this long, without once speaking up against it to set the record straight, because it benefited HER. It benefited HER image to be made out into the victim, rather than the bully for a change. I cannot imagine being in her position, knowing the truth, and just letting the completely 180 degree OPPOSITE proliferate throughout the world without once speaking up. It would eat me up inside. She, I’m assuming, wasn’t being kept up at night about this falsehood.
Just. How the fuck do you let it go on this long without once speaking up?? How? I’m sorry, but I’m just not buying that. Sorry. Nope. Nope nope nope nope.
I can’t be bothered to dig through the receipts but from what I remember camilla T brought it up again only last week. Also Richard Kay (willies DM clean up mouth piece) wrote about it a few months ago, as well as others. You can see the paper trail right there. This was very much put out there by KP, Willie and Kate. We all knew it was BS when the story kept changing.
If kate was a good person (I think Meghan was being gracious) why did she wear passive aggressive almost white to the wedding? I keep mentioning this but if you look back at the wedding, when harry says his vows, Willie and keen don’t even bother to look.
Also what did kate actually say to hurt Meghan? It must have been pretty awful to reduce her to tears. I think kate does see Meghan as her subordinate, and because she so powerless regards to her husband and the palace, thought she could take her frustrations out on Meghan. She’s too scared to shout at her cheating husband, but her “black” SIL is ok to bear the brunt.
KP did issue a denial at the time
Didn’t we also get some story about Meghan giving flowers to Kate as an apology or something? I might be totally wrong but something like bringing flowers rings a bell. There were so many I can’t keep track anymore.
We got a story about Kate hand delivering flowers and Meghan saying she should have done more. Now we know why, because Kate was letting that blatant lie about crying be used by the press to bash Meghan.
oh yes, that was it. thanks
Kate was one of the greatest beneficiaries of the media harassment of Meghan. But the fact that this story got out in the first place means that she talked about it, while Meghan kept the event to herself. Seven months later her team uses something that happened to Meghan against her. She let that stay out there without so much as a denial because it benefited her. She went from lazy Katy to Catherine the Great. I’m sorry Meghan, your sister-in-law is not a good person.
100% agree with MYRA. Kate is not a nice person. She is as ruthless as the rest of them!
A part of me thinks Meghan told Harry that Kate made her cry and Harry called Kate up and ripped her a new one. Then Kate sent flowers and an apology. I just don’t think Kate would do that on her own. Just a feeling I have.
I’d forgotten that LAUREN. Kate could have and should have taken the opportunity of clearing up the misconception when she actually gave that weak little quote on the subject to Tattler. However, it’s obvious that she desperately needs to be seen as ‘Kate the Good, Kate who never puts a foot wrong.’ I’m glad Meghan forgave her, because I’m not sure — after 4 years of letting the lie stand —- that Kate apology was really sincere.
It probably wasn’t. It is such a fascinating example of how white women have an active role in holding up white male patriarchy because it confers benefits on them. Despite the fact that the system oppresses them to.
Good on Meghan for showing compassion(and really protecting herself because she knows that anything she said against Kate could be weaponized against her). But it is such a telling example of how women of colour, particularly black women constantly find themselves having to show white women grace. The same women who often sell them out for their own gains. This could be taught in a college class.
Ah, yes, Katy the Mountain Goat, never putting a foot wrong. May this interview put that tiresome trope out to pasture for good.
I’m still salty about that almost-white dress. Tells me everything I need to know.
I have a hard time imagining Kate telling Knauf to correct the record whenever anyone called for confirmation and it is the sign of a bad character … it’s called a sin of omission. But even if I could imagine that she had the impulse to do so, William controls that office and would have had the final say. We all know he never showed any support. I think William told his staff to mess with Meghan and then he sat back and laughed.
Kate could have sent a denial through Carole (even though I suspect Carole might have been the one who sent out the fake story). She chose to remain silent and is complicit in the smearing of her sister in law. She weaponized white lady tears and gave the rabid racist Uk tabloids more fodder with which to attack Meghan.
There is also a lot William has done wrong but this one lies solely on Kate’s shoulders.
I think William had Harry in his crosshairs, not Meghan. If you notice the majority of the William stories involve him trying to take Harry down, undermine his initiatives or take credit for them, compete with Harry about everything. Kate was the one trying to run Meghan away like she did with those girls who tried to hit on William.
@Harper, let’s not pretend that Kate doesn’t have other avenues through which to correct the record if she chose to. Her mother Carole has the tabs on speed dial. Kate herself has her own media connections, and she’s been in this family long enough to know how to bypass shit if she needs to–which she does all the time, via Carole.
She has her family to run her own covert media campaign on her behalf that doesn’t need to go through Jason Knauf, just like everyone else in the royal family, who has, after decades in the public eye, built up enough connections to fill up a phone book.
All it would have taken is for Kate to put a word in to someone, anyone, to get the real story out. Heck, I don’t even know how she could be complicit, which is why I don’t believe that she was. Because if she REALLY didn’t have that much control over this stuff, then she would still have the kneejerk reaction to correct the record when people came up to ask her about it–which I’m fairly sure people would have. And yet, she didn’t. She kept quiet. Or she just nodded along to the lies–which means she agreed and accepted the lies.
So no. I don’t for a second believe she was just someone who has no say in this shit. This is the details of HER life. She is not as powerless in the face of the palace machinery as people claim. Let’s not excuse her silence and complicity as something she’s doing cuz she had no choice or because she’s a victim. No. There’s no way. This went on for too long for that to have ever been the case. If that were really true, the truth would have come out far sooner, if only by accident. It didn’t. Which means that she was in on it, and it was completely purposeful.
Kate’s not a good person.
I can’t even imagine the shit the palace is going to throw at her now.
They will so make her a convenient scapegoat. The public don’t like her so she hasn’t even got that going for her by way of support. She is a bitter gaslighter and she will get her comeuppance soon. That family will throw her to the wolves, so she better be prepared.
Are you two talking about two different “she”s?
They must be.
“I know I made you cry and here’s some flowers and everything, but could you be a sweetie and take years of abuse for it because I told the tabloids it was you who made me cry instead?”
But hey, the important thing here is that people don’t think I botox or use wiglets!
I guess I always wonder why it would be SUCH a big deal if it was known Kate got botox? Like who actually cares about that?
This exactly, but it made me wonder why someone leaked a bogus story in the first place, throwing Meghan under the bus for Keen’s behavior, and Keen let’s Meghan stay under that bus and get dragged endlessly for it. JMO, but I think it was a petty, vindictive act committed by that so-called PR assistant/wedding planner who was later fired and, being friends with head leaker-in-charge Knauf, it was never corrected in print. And, since the fake story was circulated widely AND believed by many, Keen was like, “Oh, well. Better her than me.”
Kate does not go to tabloids, she gets rewarded for silence. Rose Hanbury? Silence. She is not in charge. Will or other people in the firm liked that story so much they lifted it wholesale and repurposed it. I don’t like Kate any more than the rest of us here, it’s just not her MO. I think the whole lot of them need to get tossed out for being leaches, racists, pedophile-protecting liars and snobs.
I’d like to see a high quality pic but Kate does not look like she’s wearing stockings in those pics. Which might make sense if that was a passive aggressive move re the kids not wearing them and that was the argument. I mean typing that it sounds ridiculous but it wouldn’t surprise me. Oh along with the passive aggressive off white coat dress. She’s all class, our Keen.
I think we also now know why she couldn’t properly smile in the wedding portraits and why she looked awkward and mean AF at the wedding. She knew what she did and she is not used to taking accountability. I’m sure she did cry about it at some point. She was mean and made Meghan cry, then went home and cried about the fact that Meghan might call her out and people might know she was being a B about bridesmaid dresses and now she has to apologize and that’s just so awakened and she doesn’t want to!!! Waaaahhh!!
And now we also know what “Kate even sent Meghan flowers on her bday but Meghan thought it was too little, too late” is about. The flowers were for F-ing up before the wedding and Meghan actually did accept her apology.
Yeah, I’ll have to watch interview again, but I thought Meghan said Kate SENT flowers. I didn’t hear HAND DELIVERED.
If you ask me, the stuff about Kate bringing flowers and a note, that’s just par for the course for the aristos. That’s what they do when they want to be polite and smooth over bad behaviour. They send flowers and write a polite note. Meghan is giving an incredibly generous read of that action if you ask me, bc to me, it isn’t about Kate taking accountability at all. It’s just Kate doing what all aristos do to smooth over ruffled feathers.
I doubt Kate did that out of the goodness of her heart. Maybe she hoped Meghan would keep quiet about the truth if Kate pretended to be sincere in her apology.
As a black woman I feel ashamed that it never occurred to me that the story would be the inverse. I just thought nobody cried and it was made up. I did still thought that Kate was a POS for not correcting the record but yeah lesson learned.
And Kate is definitely a piece of shit and that wedding outfit was not a coincidence. She’s not just complicit, she’s an active co conspirator. I hope she never knows peace.
I think it never occurred to you because Meghan seems so strong and has a good head on her shoulders and was marrying her prince. Little did we know.
Same here Xantha. A fellow Black woman who really thought no one cried. I’m glad to see the strong black woman stereotype being challenged in recent years because of how damaging it can be, depriving Black women of our feminity at best and endangering us at worst (we can handle pain, we can beat up people so we’re fair game to be beaten up, etc), but this shows me that even we need to work on deprogramming ourselves. We should assume vulnerability and even fragility in each other more often, so that we are automaticall kinder. I’ve said this in another comment on this post – the switch to sympathize for Kate seems *instant*. INSTANT. To the point where it feels Meghan has been de-centered from this story, it’s become about how Kate is a victim. I feel that switch within myself! I’m fighting it, but I also don’t know how to empathize with Kate while holding her accountable. The answer isn’t to hate Kate more, only love can drive out darkness like this. But how do we extend the same easy grace and understanding to women of color, especially Black women? What will it take?
I have a funny lil’ feelin’ that a “Palace source” will soon be sharing that it came to light that Catherine was very mean to her darkie sis-in-law, and one did hear her say…
[insert actual transcript of Harry’s convo abt Archie’s skin color and changing the rules so that Archie would never have the title of “prince” with an unnamed person]
Things I learned from this website: the married-ins take the fall and the UK loves to find a woman to blame. All nice and tied up in a bow.
I felt very vindicated at learning the “Kate made me cry” story was actually the reverse. I remember my then sister-in-law-to-be made me cry on my wedding day. I was planning the wedding by myself, having just lost my dad 6 months before and feeling very uncomfortable around all my future in laws. I, too, was desperate to make a good impression. Meg’s situation would be that on steroids and multiplied by a factor of a million. I remember thinking when I first heard the “Kate Made Me Cry” story that I would believe it if it were the reverse, but what on earth would Kate have to cry about? It just didn’t make sense. And now we hear it wasn’t true.
I figured Kate was crying cause she was 3 weeks post-partum. I know I was a mess. If a button wouldn’t button, I fell apart. Hormones are a bitch! So I admit, I didn’t care what it was about, I just thought, it’s an emotional time, she’s hormonal, yada, yada. It never occurred to me (I’m ashamed to admit) the whole story had been flipped upside down. The story was never about what someone cried about, the story was, in fact, that it was reversed.
I’m partially on this list too. I did believe that Kate cried but not because of Meghan but because she was very recently post-pregnancy, and it never entered the realm of possibility in my brain that the reverse happened.
While watching the wedding I thought that the flower girls/bridesmaids were missing their tights and the dresses looked too loose so when the story came out I thought it happened like this:
Kate: I think they should wear tights and/or the fit of the dress doesn’t look right.
Meghan: I disagree
Kate: (Just had a baby less than a month before and is emotionally raw and/or possibly sleep-deprived) Boo hoo!
That’s how I pictured that encounter going down and that it wasn’t anything Meghan did but spiteful people understanding how they could use the narrative to their advantage. I also thought that’s why we never got a denial because tears were actually involved even if Meghan didn’t cause them.
This revelation is the one that blindsided me. I’m a black woman too so the racism saddens but doesn’t surprise me. I agree with the posters up thread who said that it was as simple as saying that the DoS never made the DoC cry without giving the full details just like Meghan did with Oprah.
Kate is done. There’s no way she can come back from this. No level of PR or calls to Mummy Carole will save her from this. I’m so glad she’s been exposed for the nasty woman we’ve all known her to be. Truly evil. I’m so glad Meghan is on the other side of this.
Charles stop taking their calls, refused to give them protection, cut them off financially and was asking how dark will Archie be. Kate apologized, Meghan forgave her and said Kate is a good person. After everything we saw yesterday you think Kate is the one who is done and she is the one who is nasty?
@Ella – Where did I mention Charles? This is an article regarding Kate making Meghan cry. Something in which I am commenting on. If you want to go and discuss Charles, you will happily see me expressing my opinion, as well as you, on articles regarding his awful behaviour. Thanks.
I don’t have much (any) time for Kate, but I actually feel really sorry for her now. I imagine that her life in the royal family is fairly close to what Meghan describes hers as being, only with class snobbery instead of racism, and without the loving and supportive husband prepared to do anything for her, including leave. Whereas Meghan left rather than break, Kate can’t leave so has had to bend as much as possible to the point of breaking, hence dieting herself away to nothing, never sticking her head above the parapet, never voicing any of her own opinions, walking on egg shells around a rage monster. This is why her family are omnipresent – because like Meghan, she’s completely isolated and unable to speak for herself. She takes what pleasure she can get from perks such as status, clothes and jewellery, and throws herself into her kids.
Read between the lines. Meghan said she, the actual person who cried, wouldn’t have wanted that story out there that would damage Kate. She wouldn’t have done what Kate did. She would’ve denied the story or protected Kate. That grace wasn’t extended to her by….. guess who
Jane – yes! Thank you. I dont think I ever thought about Kate in that way before. As someone who escaped an abusive marriage, you would think I would have some built in sympathy for someone married to a narcissist. You have really opened my eyes to my own blind spot here. I think we may all be victim blaming Kate here.
NI, respectfully beg to differ. Kate may have been under different sorts of pressure (not racism but def classism) but instead of uniting with a fellow sufferer who was dealing with enormous pressure as a newcomer as well as being a POC, Kate CHOSE to be a Karen and weaponize non-existent white tears. She allowed this story to run without correcting or denying it despite seeing the bashing Meghan was getting in the press. Sorry, not having these excuses for her today.
I would feel sorry for Kate if she hadn’t been such a bitty at the Commonwealth Day event just last year. Whatever is going on in her home with her family should not be extended to Meghan and Harry who were supportive just by NOT spilling the beans on this story.
Kate chose to be silent in a story that was used to attacked Meghan meanwhile she has issued press releases about botox and extensions and even correcting the Tatler article, after this incident. Her silence is complicity.
Meghan may say she is a good person, probably because Kate was mad over other issues and took it out on Meghan, but her failure to correct the record and say the story is false is on her. And only a few people were even there to witness this, so someone from Kate’s camp did go to the media months later and flipped the story. That screams Carole who was likely there to see it.
Ella- Kate can be trapped in her situation and still be a villain here. Where was her team to deny this story? Why did she wear white and smirk at Meghan’s wedding? Why did she participate in that budget plane stunt? Why did she ignore Meghan at polo and go on to plant those incredibly saccharine stories in the media? Why has she not reined her mother Carole in when Carole shades Meghan in the media? Why did she make that rude comment in Meghan’s direction during the radio interview about the birth presentations – especially as we now know from the interview that Meghan and Harry were never even asked for such a presentation? Why couldn’t she muster even an ounce of professionalism at the 2020 Commonwealth Service and instead completely froze Harry and Meghan out?
I’m actually really disappointed that Meghan taking the high road has suddenly created a wave of “oh now I feel sorry for Kate” emotions. More excuses for this white woman. As ever.
Except that Kate’s “team” put out there that she plans to “testify” at the sham investigation that Meghan is a bully. So no, I give no f**KS about Karen Keen and her “situation”. She sold her soul to get where she’s at, knowing full and well who William is.
I feel sorry for Kate. Kate is also a POS. I think they can both be true.
@NI, if Kate actually looked to Meghan as a potential ally and someone who actually would understand what she herself was going through, and linked arms with her rather than throwing her to the wolves so she would be elevated, then and only then would I have some sympathy for her. As it stands, she deserves every bit of criticism she is getting from this. She is no victim in my eyes. Just like “some skin folk ain’t kinfolk”, not every woman understands you can be better by supporting other women. Kate is one of those women.
I hope people rip her to shreds . Never let her have a moment of peace to forget this. And Megs I disagree with you on this. Kate is absolutely a world class bitch.
They all deserve each other, that little nest of vipers. The only ones a feel sorry for are the children, which unfortunately have a very slim chance of becoming decent human beings.
I believe when Meghan said Kate is a good person, it was said with invisible air quotes, lol. Kill em with kindness Meg, kill em with kindness!
I think this is a two things can be true situation.
1) Kate is a world class bitch
2) her life probably isn’t all that dissimilar from what Meghan described and Meghan has compassion for her because of that
For the rest of us…we don’t really need to spend any time on her feeling bad for her or thinking she deserves it a la Don Draper “I don’t think about you at all”.
Yes. I agree with you, Kate is a world class bitch. That is why she is aging like milk, like her husband. It seems like will & kate’s true spirits are showing in their physical looks. When they hit their 40s, they will look like they are in their late 50s/early 60s.
Kate’s fans are mostly white women who will gaslight the f out of everyone around them so they can keep making up fan faction about Charlotte. They will continue in their Serena Joy paradise with their beautiful minds undisturbed.
Edit: Or they will have the damn racist white feminism caucasity to try to use Meghan to shield Kate. For everyone trying it, Kate is wholeheartedly complicit and no one is buying your bs.
I’m not gonna say she’s done, look what Charlie did for Camilla?
Charles loves Camilla. William doesn’t love Kate. That’s the difference between them.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE can we stop perpetuating two things?
1. Camilla was Charles’s first and only true love? All courtier-fan fiction.
She chose her husband and it was her husband who chose to divorce her. She wanted only one role in Charles’ life and Diana dragged her out of the shadows and IMO, the publicity is what shamed C.’s husband into divorcing her.Charles had other affairs,but now-single Camilla was written in to be alternative fairy-tale, post-Diana. I can’t be the only one here that watched Robin Leech and other’s interviewing giddy “royal watchers” enthusing about how two soul mates were finally free at the same time, while showing that stupid pic of Camila and Charles by a tree in their 20’s, and thinking, “WTAF? Are they making this up?”
2. Edward abdicated the throne for the American domintrix Wallis Simpson? All courtier-fan fiction. Homosexuality was decriminalized in the 60’s. Someone in THIS FAMILY abdicated and self-exiled out of love for a woman? hahahahahahhahahahahahhahahahahhahahahhaa
I don’t know much about Edward or Wallis, but you nailed number 1. I cannot STAND this stupid narrative about Camilia. Good god when are people going to wake up about that very sick relationship between two cruel people?
I suppose that Meghan saw what Will is like and what life in BRF is for married-in women and sees Kate’s stupid behavior more as a way to survive in this toxicity and has a lot of understanding for people who are not as strong or mature. And she probably has a lot of pity for Kate. She knows who the worst and cruelest a-holes are and Kate is not even close.
I, on the other hand, am not so understanding and think that Kate is an a-hole. She’s getting her karma probably everyday wondering when and how Will is going to pull the plug on their marriage and make her the villan.
We’ve already seen how happy the media is to pit them against each other, with Kate as the heroine.
If Meghan had used any mildly negative adjective to describe Kate, all the headlines would be like “Meghan eviscerates Kate over allegedly making her cry 4 years ago”.
That’s my take too. This is Meghan’s way of saying: yeah she was part of it, but she’s not the worst, not even close. The enemies were other people.
Ania, I actually feel like right now would be a great time for Kate to leave William if she wanted to. Right after everyone heard how Meghan was treated, and how married-ins are treated, how trapped they all are, how mean everyone in that family is. She could talk about her own mental health and how that’s why she’s been doing stuff with mental health and early years/maternal health bc she’s trying to learn about it that way since the firm is denying her access to mental health care. It looks pretty obvious that she’s sick in some way. And Meghan said Kate is “a good person.” And she pointed all the ways that family smears people and how you can’t trust the press’s negative articles. How would the RF be able to start a whole new smear campaign against Kate now after what everyone saw them do to Meghan and heard what she had to say about it? And people know now that Harry isn’t speaking to William and are speculating that he’s the one who asked what color Archie would be? It would look like she’s leaving an abusive situation and didn’t want to be a part of the firm that did the stuff they did to Meghan.
I think Meghan was too nice to Kate, though. I think she pities her and sees her bad behavior as someone just trying to survive a life of crushing sadness and isolation surrounded by horrible people and held hostage by fear of the press. I think Kate has become part of the machinery of that firm though and liked having Meghan there to take the fall and lift her up.
I don’t think Kate would ever leave William, but if she was going to she DEFINITELY wouldn’t do it before Charles is coronated, making her the Princess of Wales. Then if she leaves Will she gets all the Diana comparisons and has something to build from (from a pr standpoint). Leaving a Duchess? Would never happen.
She doesnt become Princess of Wales until William is invested as Prince of Wales. and that’s not automatic.
Regarding Meghan’s comments about Kate: I believe that it’s definitely layered. Yes, Meghan is not petty and knows that people have bad days so when Kate apologized and brought flowers it was probably water under the bridge in Meghan’s mind until ….. the story surfaced in the media and she was the villain. While Meghan is right to be upset that the lie was never corrected, her kindness and savvy aligned when she said, “Kate is a good person”.
Regarding Kate: I don’t ever see her leaving. I think Kate’s eyes are set on the crown and she’ll do anything to survive until she gets it.
As someone else said up above, I think that Kate is a victim of the institution, and she is also a cog that perpetrates the abuse on behalf of the institution. We all know this shit is a cycle in the royal family. She is yet another wheel cycling that shit forward.
I think she has been let down by her family. Her mother, especially. I think she is also trapped, not by the royals, or by William, but by her own greed. She wants to be queen. She does not want to give the other aristocrats who want to see her fail the satisfaction of her leaving. So I think, in those ways, she is trapped, but the trap is entirely her own making at this point.
Is she a good person? I’m sure she is. I know people will disagree with me on that part, but I don’t think anyone is a bad person. I think we all bear the scars of what has been dealt to us, it’s just a matter of how we process it. But look at the difference between Meghan and Kate. And let’s not say bullshit like “Meghan is a stronger person than Kate,” as if strength is inborn. It’s not. You acquire it. You learn it. It’s like working a muscle. Meghan has done it her whole life. Kate can do it if she chooses. She chooses not to, bc the life she has now is perfectly serviceable for her. But that is her choice. Let’s have the courtesy to acknowledge that she makes her own decisions about her life, whatever shitty decisions those might be. Kate’s a grown woman, not a little girl, who needs excuses made for her. She’s made her bed. She knows exactly who, what and where she is.
Kate’s an awful person for letting the media use that story to monster Meghan and the worse part is she had so many chances to deny this story. But she just kept revising the story even going so far as leaving it in the Tatler piece.
Kris Jenner Middleton was so triggered by Meghan’s naturalness and grace and popularity during the South Pacific tour. Diana was a shining star of an English Rose in Australia. Kate was doing some awkward Sloane Square goes Miss Hawaiian Tropic cosplay during her first tour. But Meghan was comfortably, authentically nobody but herself and the whole world noticed.
It shows the absolute insanity of The Firm that Oprah was so bemused by, as one of the greatest media moguls in the world. It’s great publicity. It’s celebrating togetherness as you attempt to keep the dregs of your grandmother’s empire together. But William/Kate/Anne/Andrew are so fucking threatened by a biracial woman doing it so well that she needs to be eliminated? Self-sabotaging insanity.
Also, notice that Harry refers to them en masse as The Family – there’s something very Corleone about that.
I like the Corleone reference. It seems very apt to me.
Agreed with a comment above that the royal family do not deserve Megan (or Harry).
My take: Megan seems to pity Kate more than resent her. Megan said Kate is a good person. Was that just for political reasons or is it true? I’m torn.
Based on everything said, I don’t think Kate could have set record straight. It sounds like her hands are tied and she’s a victim too. Her awfulness is nowhere near the level of William or Charles.
Edit: MA said it best in comment 1.
Meghan is a compassionate person and she has often come across as someone who wants to believe the best of other people. Just look at how she appears to believe that her father was manipulated by the press. He sold her out to the world press, betrayed her in the most intimate manner – and she excuses him to some degree.
Kate maybe the only person from the BRF that has apologized to her and Meghan respects that because that is what she would do herself. She does indirectly shade Kate with the comment of her not correcting the lie that was published – but I also get the impression that Kate and her behaviour was a minor grievance. Probably because it was petty and passive aggressive while other members of the BRF were actively cruel to a degree that has really shocked me and I’m old enough to remember Diana’s Panorama interview.
Meghan may say that Kate is a good person but Kate’s silence damns her in my eyes. Meghan is a genuinely good person, she’s kinder to Kate than Kate deserves but Meghan has generously forgiven her.
@ArtHistorian – possibly Meghan has compassion for Kate because she knows what a sh*ty situation she’s in married to William, regardless of what Kate knew about him when they got married, or any “arrangement” their marriage was based on. At least Kate took responsibility for something she did, unlike, apparently, anyone else. Agree overall Kate is likely a very minor player in what went on.
A question for you – can’t find where in these specific threads you touched again on the dysfunction of the British RF, but have read with interest at other times your take on the subject. Am curious if even you are surprised at the depth of the ugliness revealed in the interview.
Meghan is a very compassionate person and I do think that Kate’s life isn’t really that great in terms of her mental health. I do have a certain degree of compassion for her regarding that because I do think that she isn’t entirely well.
I’ve posted my musing about the dysfunction of the BRF many times – but I think their family dynamic is so embedded in the hierarchy of rank that for some of them (especially Charles), their rank becomes their entire identity. I think it is very hard for them to relate to each other as a family because the Crown and its hierarchy always comes first. This institution is managed in an abusive and inhumane manner, which creates emotionally mutilated people – and I think that Charles is probably the most damaged of them all.
And, yes, I was actually deeply shocked by the interview – it painted an image of a situation that was much much worse than what I imagined. I’m appalled of how cruel the family has been towards Meghan.
Am very interested to hear you say that about the magnitude of your reaction; you’re one of a number of people here who know so much more in detail about the BRF than I do, and I understand that you’re in Europe, not the US as I am.
The absolute irony is, there was a moment, early on, when there was a choice to go in an entirely different direction. But if what you suggest is true about rank/hierachy/identity, it seems none of the family were capable of considering the longer view (e.g., that the newness of Harry and Meghan would ultimately fade) or creative enough to figure out a way to use their popularity to everyone’s benefit, as they watched global interest in the monarchy on the rise for the first time in years. Not only that, unlike past spares (Margaret, Andrew) – Harry wasn’t jealous of his brother, and was happy being a supporting player as long as he and his family were treated fairly. Instead, the RF were incapable of tolerating for even one moment the thought the spotlight was on someone else. Charles especially, may rue the decision that was made here for the rest of his life. At least, I hope so.
As I said, I was deeply deeply shocked by Harry and Meghan’s revelations – I was a teenager when Diana made her interview so her revelations made me see that the BRF was comprised by callous and emotionally stunted people who can be very cruel, and that their senior staff has a GREAT deal of power. However, this new interview revealed to me the degree to which these people (and hence the institution) will sink to, how immensely cruel they can be – and they key thing here is Racism. The race aspect made them sink even lower.
The fact that Charles was willing to deprive his own son, DiL and grand-child of security (and funding that could help them get security not financed by the tax-payer) at a time when the press was whipping up racist hate against them and when their location had been revealed shocked me to the core. I knew he was horrid to Diana but I didn’t think that he would be this abusive to his own child. He left his own son unprotected in a situation where real harm could very easily have been done to Harry, Meghan and Archie. This made me realize that Charles is at his core an abusive person. He was an abusive husband to a wife he didn’t love and now an abusive father to a child I do think that he loves. Why? I think that Harry stepping back and choosing his wife over the Crown (which means duty to the Queen AND the Prince of Wales) is seen as a deeply personal betrayal by Charles because being Prince of Wales is WHO he is (not just what he is). And he punished Harry with an abusive tactic that was probably also designed to make him come back into the fold. Being a father and being Prince of Wales came into conflict when Harry left – and the Prince of Wales won because that is Charles’ core identity, not even any paternal love he feels for Harry could win over Charles’ own self-importance. That is because this family raises the heirs to believe that they are more important than everyone else in the family (apart from the Monarch). Charles is famously self-involved, surrounded by sycophants – and so is, I suspect, William.
Furthermore, this interview really revealed to me how fundamentally abusive the institution of the British monarchy is. Both in terms of how its members are being indoctrinated and treated – and this extends to senior staff. Individual members only seem to have value in this family based on what rank they hold (and that can lead to their rank becoming the core of their personal identities psychologically speaking). Their basic humanity is less important than their rank. I think we all can see how damaging this is.
1/
I think that you really cannot separate the family from the firm (the institution) because they are only given value as a rank and not as human beings. That is why Harry has been emotionally abused by the institution his entire life by the way he has been given less attention as a child (fx by the late Queen Mother) to the way that he has been served up as a deflection for William’s bad behaviour since he has been a teenager. That is so profoundly abusive. Being the scapegoat as the spare was Harry’s role (a way that he “supports” a person of higher rank who has never been given any incentive to change his bad behaviour because William has never met any consequences for his actions – they have just been buried). This family/institution is unable to value anyone just for themselves because rank always comes before individuality and the Crown comes before all.
The latter doesn’t necessarily mean that the person who inhabits the office of monarch, i.e. embodies the Crown for a while, comes before the dignity of the Crown (which seems to be interpreted as optics). In 1936 QEII, King George V was murdered by his own doctor with the tacit approval of his wife Queen Mary and his heir The Prince of Wales (later the Duke of Windsor). I say murdered because legally euthanasia was and is still just that, murder. Why? The reason given by the doctor in his diary was to ease the King’s suffering and let him die with dignity. However, this murder was was also timed with optics in mind because the doctor (and most likely the royal family) thought that the king’s death should be reported by the respectable morning papers and not the afternoon tabloid reporters. The doctor even instructed his wife to contact the Times and ask them to delay publication! Whether he did this on royal orders is unknown – but the doctor was an important member of the royal staff and thus a part of the larger institution.
This is almost 90 years ago – but we need to factor in the extreme longevity of not only the Queen but also of her mother who had enormous influence on her daughter to the day she died. We also need to factor in Queen Mary who died in 1956 and who took an keen interest in Elizabeth and Margaret’s upbringing and definitely influenced them as well. THIS is the mindset that has been handed down to the royals who are alive today.
2/
Then there’s the issue of class and the class system is deeply entrenched in British society to a degree that it is hard for us non-Brits to truly understand. The royals are the top of this system – and they have historically found their staff from the aristocracy and gentry (though that seems to be slowly changing). These kind of people have a hard time changing because the class system itself doesn’t reward change. Other posters here have spoken of how ossified and resistant to change other British institutions are and the monarchy is the epitome of this – because the very foundation on which the ideology of the institution rests is the idea of unbroken continuity, which is reinforced by the reality of this institution having existed (in various incarnations) for a millennia!
This idea underpins all monarchies. But why have other European monarchies managed to adapt more successfully to the times than the British one? I suspect that is due to historical circumstances as well as the socio-economic differences between various nations. Fx the Danish monarchy is quite successful and it is even older than the British one, which I suspect has something both history and socio-economic circumstances. During a period where Britain became an empire on which the sun never set, Denmark was a state that diminished – both in political importance and in actual territory. In 1801 Denmark lost a naval battle with the British fleet, which resulted in the loss of the Danish fleet – and that was deeply humiliating because Denmark had a long history as a naval power. It made Denmark enter the Napoleonic Wars on the French side. This led to the British fleet returning to Copenhagen in 1807 where they bombarded this city in a horrific manner. This led to the state going bankrupt in 1813. And since Denmark was an absolutist monarchy, that meant that the King was the State – and they were both bankrupt. Napoleon’s defeat meant the loss of Norway (which had been ruled by a Danish monarch since the 1400s).
In the mid 1800s, Denmark fought 2 wars over the duchies of Sleswig-Holstein (the King was the Duke of those). The second war was against the military juggernaut of Prussia and we lost – which led to the loss of about 1/5 of the Danish territory.
So when the British expanded their Empire into a global power, Denmark lost international influence, suffered severe economic and territorial loss. Unlike these changes in Denmark, the loss of British power and influence has been much more gradual and thus harder to acknowledge. Britain has been much diminished in the 20th century but I get the impression that they still haven’t let go the mentality of empire on the level of national identity. It is also a much more conservative country than Denmark in terms of politics. Denmark established a strong social-democratic political culture in the early 20th century and that is still important, even when we’ve had right-wing governments.
In terms of the prestige of the royals themselves, the Danish royals also suffered losses in the early 20th century. 1920, the bank that the Danish royal had a lot of the financial assets in went under and they experienced significant financial loss. The same year King Christian X made a huge political blunder in firing the government, which almost led to the abolition of the monarchy because of public outrage that was very much fueled by the strong Social-Democratic Party. The King remained deeply unpopular because of this. In personal terms, the King was a rigid man who ruled his family with an iron fist and it is no coincidence that both of his children became alcoholics. In terms of family dynamics, the game changer was when Ingrid of Sweden entered the family as Crown Princess. Unusually for royals at the time, she had been raised very warmly and lovingly by her mother the late CP Margareta of Sweden, whom she lost in a traumatic manner when Ingrid was 10. Ingrid could manage the cold and rigid king like no other, she raised her daughters like her mother raised her + Ingrid had a natural flair for PR. She’s very much at the center why the Danish RF has managed to adapt to the times combined with the fact that the royals had gotten a clear warning shot across the bow in 1920. The British monarchy and RF has always been much more protected and insulated from “harm” by the fact that the class system is much more rigid in Britain and that the ruling establishment is requited from the a very limited circle – the same boarding schools and universities that the royals themselves have attended.
Fin.
At the end of the day, Kate is a White Feminist who only believes in her own empowerment. Believe she’s a good person all you want but she’s not an ally and she has only ever used her power to better herself at the expense Of others. I think Meghan was extremely generous here but I’m not going to forget Flybe or the Commonwealth service or the Middleton family trashing of Meghan or the weird lack of acknowledgement of Archie from the Cambridges. Meghan in the 2 hour interview showed more grace and generosity to that entire racist institution than they did over the courted of 5 years
I dunno. I think Kate might be as overwhelmed by the system as any outsider. She might not feel, thanks to lack of support from her husband (like Meghan has), that she has any real say so. Weirdly, this interview made me MORE sympathetic to Kate. This is a cruel system and Kate was as much a victim as Meghan. #FuckTheFirm
Don’t you dare.
KKKate will not hide behind Meghan yet again.
Don’t go there! Trashy behavior is never good to heap on another individual, no matter what YOU are going through.
Kate victimized Meghan with her silence. Do we excuse child abuser by saying it’s ok because they were victims themselves? Kate is an adult and chose to do nothing. It’s on her.
Ok, you totally went off the rails with that “Kate is as much of a victim as Meghan.”
NO. SHE. IS. NOT. Drop the fragile white flower in distress BS for just 2 seconds. Meghan can’t even speak of her own truth and victimization without Kate being inserted into it? Give me a break.
Kate is not in any way, shape, form, or color a Feminist. Unless she calls herself one to give cover to her terfiness.
I think Meghan and Kate had some good moments together, enough for Meghan to push all the blame and hurt feelings onto William.
I honestly don’t think Kate thinks of empowerment at all, her own or anyone else’s. I think she’s getting through as best she can (which is not well and not by doing good), but I don’t think she thinks of much but white knuckling it through her days.
And no, I don’t think Kate is a good person.
I think it’s basically that Kate wasn’t actively cruel towards Meghan, she was passively cruel. Like she went along with whatever everyone else was doing, never questioned anything as long as things were going well for her, and never actively tried to make anything easier or better for Meghan like by denying smear stories that she knew were lies meant to uplift her at Meghan’s expense, or telling her mom, husband, or staff to stop leaking and lying. Like she allows cruelty to be done at Meghan’s expense and to her benefit, but she doesn’t actively incite the cruelty. I don’t know if that’s a distinction that even matters though, honestly, when the results are the same for Harry, Meghan, and baby Archie.
I think she might be trying to say that if Kate was left to her own devices, or was calling the shots, she would basically just live quietly with her head in the sand, buying clothes and barely working, and ignoring the people around her. She wouldn’t actively try to ruin everyone around her.
I kept getting the sense from both Meghan and Harry that they think the members of the royal family would be okay (or in Kate’s case “good”) people if they weren’t in the institution. Like they feel like the family is racist and sexist, acts racist and sexist, doesn’t own their racism and sexism, but they’re not really hatefully choosing to be racist and sexist, it’s just that they’ve been raised to be racist and sexist by parents who were raised to be racist and sexist in an institution that is racist and sexist and that destroys any innate goodness in its members and instead amplifies and rewards their worst qualities, and they are just reflections of the centuries old toxicity that has been passed down generation to generation for hundreds and hundreds of years, and rather than actively try to better themselves, they just continue on in this way because it’s what they know and they know people will cover for them. I felt like they, especially Harry, were struggling with labeling these people who act absolutely cruelly in the most racist of ways, as “being” cruel and racist vs just “acting” cruel and racist because they’re trapped and scared. And again, does that distinction even matter when the results are the same?
Kate and Carole have been actively cruel towards Meghan from the start. Refusing to give someone a lift shopping? FFS. Refusing to let her children interact with Meghan and Archive, because Kate Keen wanted the PR shots of herself with her kids and no Meghan?
Kate is not innocent here.
Meghan wouldn’t have made it so clear how much Kate made it up to her if Kate had gone on to do more crap. I think William is the one sending slanderous missives out of KP and the one most of which can be laid at his feet.
But Kate did go on to do more crap, much more. Meghan told that story not to show that Kate is a “great” person but to show that Kate was aware of the bullshit right from the beginning, that Kate knew right from wrong but she was willing to throw Meghan overboard to make herself look good. Sometimes people need to read between the lines. Meghan knows we saw what happened at the Commonwealth ceremony….
Pointing out this whole machine went into over-drive to cover up Will’s affair!!!
Meghan made clear that Kate was the one doing the wrong thing, and later in the interview made it clear that Kate chose not to tell the truth about it.
The way Meghan discribed life in there as a married-in actually made me bring out the tiniest of violins for Kate. Kate breathed a sigh of relief when Meg entered the equation. But she too has experienced the control,silencing and dumbing down of herself. And the fact that she came into this life barely out of her teens she was easy to brainwash and manipulate. The fact she has never had an independant life and is terrified if she ever puts a foot wrong or what might happen in case of a divorce is also something to think about. No one is safe as a married in. It doesnt excuse her nastiness but she obviously didnt want any heat on her.
^^^ THIS
What would happen if Kate divorced? Please you act like they will lock her in the dungeon. What will happen is the same that happened to the other wives, shell get a nice big settlement, some jewelry and she’ll find a rich guy like her sister. I’m sure her family knows plenty of divorce lawyers. And Kate, unlike Diana has no ambition to be anything other than a pampered poodle. Even Diana talked about using her position to do good in the world. Y’all kill me trying to make her into a victim in this.
Kate chose to belittle and dumb herself down for a decade in her prince hunt. It wasn’t the palaces doing that, it was Kate herself. She was already cardboard Kate by the time the wedding happened.
Kate should have and could have set the record straight. It would have been so easy for KP to say “Meghan was stressed and Kate was dealing with pregnancy stress so tensions were high and they got into a spat about minor things. However Kate apologised the next day and they both have no issues”
This! Anyone can understand that emotions run high around weddings in the best of circumstances and Kate was post-partum so she could have been on edges. BUT Kate, or her people, could have shut down the story a long time ago. Instead, they allowed the story to be repeated (incorrectly) multiple times over the years.
The worst part in all of this is that, even in the version of the story that’s true, KATE ACTUALLY COMES OFF QUITE WELL!!!!!!!!!!
That’s the part that really really fucking bothers me! If all that people around Kate wanted was good press for Kate, then they could have put out the true story, and Kate would have come off GREAT.
The reason the truth was not put out as the narrative is for the SPECIFIC purposes of trashing Meghan. And Kate kept quiet through ALL of that. If all Kate wanted was to look good, she could have made the correction and still looked good. But no. She was perfectly okay to get public sympathy off the back of trashing her SIL. That is another added layer to this that makes everything about it so much worse.
Ha. Karen Middleton memes are all over Twitter and I’m so here for it.
As others have said Kate could have set the record straight and she didn’t – given that Top CEO has NO PROBLEM sending out official press release denying botox and hair extensions tell you everything you need to know – Kate had a choice and a voice. She choose not to defend Meghan.
Good point. This makes sense, sadly.
And let us not forget that POOR KATE —- as of just last week —- is named on the list of people testifying to HR re charges around Meghan’s supposed bullying of KP staff. Kate continues to smear Meghan and I just don’t feel sorry enough to turn my thinking around on her. She has used Meghan from the very beginning to strengthen her own narrative as Good White Kate vs. Bad Black Meghan.
Kate’s willingness to publically add her name to HR review was revealed AFTER Meghan spoke to Oprah. I’d love to know Meghan’s current thinking on POOR KATE now that this has been revealed.
I didn’t know about this.
Don’t forget it was Kate Keener who was a willing participant in the FlyBe stunt aimed at making H&M look like high-flying hypocrites.
Kate is a scheming, jealous POS and, in my opinion, she loved turning up the heat on Meghan with leaks to the tabloid press. She and Baldy McRagerson so deserve each other! I hope she loses everything she waited all those years for in the divorce – including losing her kids to the Crown.
I am absolutely NOT a fan of Kate.
Meghan was very careful and very smart in her interview. She only had a kind word for a couple of people in this institution – the Queen (and even there, she was careful to separate the person and the position) and Kate. Whether Kate is actually a good person in a tough position, I don’t know. But Meghan seems to think so, and I don’t see a reason to doubt her. Maybe she just feels sorry for Kate and is speaking out of pity. What Meghan described yesterday is a life from hell. I think whoever “Kate” used to be was lost a long time ago. I don’t think she has any (public or private) decision-making authority at all.
I agree.
I agree. And I think it’s easy to see how Kate, having to deal with just a fraction of what Meghan did from the Firm marrying into that family, she would have just retreated and submitted. The thing that the courtiers seem to hate most is any woman outshining the Queen or future kings. We’ve seen that with Diana and Fergie too.
And I think if we take Meghan at her word on some things, we should take it on others. Like Meghan, Kate is a good person in a bad situation, but who maybe doesn’t have the kind of husbandly support or the tools to fight back in any way. Kate didn’t have the life experience Meghan had; what could she do but retreat under the pressure.
“I think so much of what I have seen play out is this idea of polarity, where if you love me, you don’t have to hate her. If you love her, you don’t need to hate me.” This is so true and so many people here and in the UK will continue to ignore this wisdom and hold on to the misogynistic polarity.
I think Meghan, with her impressive emotional intelligence, sees clearly that if Kate has never been able to defend herself against the underhanded machinations of The Firm, she would never have been able to defend Meghan against them.
Lahdidah I think you are spot on with that.
Kate and Carole have been going after Meghan through tabloids for four years. If Kate wanted the truth out, it would have been out. Kate is no victim here.
Yes, I feel like Meghan made it known Kate gave her flowers and apologised so at least there is some humanity in her. Also I know see why Kate runs away and prefer to live far far away
if Kate doesn’t do anything, she doesn’t do anything wrong. Duchess Do-Little makes more sense now I suppose
I’m not sure there is much left of Kate at this point. If they did all of this to Meghan in 18 months then no wonder all Kate does is play dress up. I think this institution is just god awful.
Nope! Oprah asked Meghan if the Wimbledon appearances were as happy as they seemed and Meghan basically said no. It was for show. A lot of people here are looking for ways to excuse Kate’s behavior and still make her a victim when she was the villain in this story. You are taking Meghan’s pain and using it as an excuse to absolve a white woman for her bad behavior.
sipnbubbly
or maybe some of us are taking Meghan at her word that Kate is a good person.
Ps: I am a black woman
Agree sipnbubbly. Some posters here are hell bent on trying to make Kate a saint out of this sh*tstorm. Kate is complicit, and was soaking up the good press she was getting, while Meghan was portrayed as a villain. Kate is not a good person. Periodt.
Kate is literally shrinking away. Meghan could have seen the same pictures we saw of Kate over the summer with her chest exposed that showed how shockingly thin Kate is. Meghan might know what is really going behind the scenes with Kate’s mental health and does not want to cause further harm to her in this interview.
So the matter was settled shortly after the incident with Kate apologizing and sending flowers and Meghan put the matter to rest. 6 or 7 months later after the Oceana tour, the story comes to light but this time with Meghan being the demon who made Kate cry and Kate let this story run without denying or correcting it. That’s mean girl behavior and if I were willing to give her the benefit of the doubt then, her bitch face behavior at the Commonwealth service ruled out all doubt that she was behind the smears of Meghan. Jealously is an evil drug.
Weirdly this all made me a little bit more understanding of Kate. I don’t absolve her at all because she had a duty to correct the story or not even have her staff leak it in the first place but that family and life there is hell and she does what she must to survive. She sacrificed Meghan just so she could survive for a while longer.
Meghan still sees the good in her, probably because Kate still seems to have a conscience, enough to know to apologise and make amends. It’s just that she’s living a life where if you don’t throw someone to the wolves it will be you and her character wasn’t strong enough to withstand that.
If Kate ever wants to divorce William, Meghan just gave her a huge boost.
I go back and forth on Kate, but now I just pity her. I can understand, from her POV, why she would be jealous of Meghan. Meghan is everything Kate isn’t—she has a voice of her own, her own career, she’s self assured and confident. Meghan is everything Kate was expected to be but isn’t. I can see she and her mom panicking over losing likely the one thing Kate likely enjoys—being the pretty woman who gets fawned over. Kate traded her own agency, identity, and self worth to be adorned with jewels and pretty closed and doted on. The most lauded traditional place for a white woman is on a pedestal, and Kate had the ultimate pedestal. For that, she put up with a rage monster of a husband, infidelity, likely a brutal diet, being silent. Along comes Meghan, and Kate likely thinks she has a perfect scapegoat. After all, if she’s suffering, the only solace she can have is to make sure someone else is suffering more. So she likely reveled in Meghans suffering. She couldn’t even see an opportunity to make a friend. Meghan was likely kates only chance to actually fight the system. Imagine what they could have done together to push back against the palace. I don’t think the palace would have risked having 2 princesses coming against them. But Kate has no courage, and this tells me also that she is ill equipped to handle the situation when her children grow up. She has consigned herself to a life of walking on eggshells, looking the other way, and pasting on a fake smile. Hope it’s worth it to her. Her life sounds like utter misery.
The infantilization of Kate can’t 100% be blamed on the RF, both she and Carole have to take the lion share of that. Carole is a narcissistic mother who pretty much groomed her children to chase after a life that Carole wants for herself – look at how she stage manages their lives, esp Kate’s.
I do blame Carole a lot too. She probably encouraged Kate to be quiet and stay quiet because women who have opinions either leave/get kicked out or are knocked down until they submit.
It’s why the Midds have stayed silent for most of the time – they’re desperate to be a part of the royal/aristo world and know saying anything will make the royals/aristos hate them even more.
I totally believe Carole is a narcissist. She wears Kate clothe’s, took care of Willi as if she were his wife or mother. If she could, she would date William herself. I think Kate may have some emotional disorders, as results of being raised in a narcisistic family and marrying into another sociopathic family. People (children) in this situation often to what’s called the “Gray Rock”: they make themselves as unnapealing, bland possible, so they won’t feel the narcisistic rage, and I believe it’s what Kate’s learned to do for survival. People like that also suffer from identity issues and low esteem, if not healed properly. That’s why Kate is often infantilised. The other possibility is that they may turn narcisists as well, and join in the victimisation of other people.
I don’t think any of this excuses Kate, since she is an adult and could chose psychological treatment, and her actions are all decisions she made herself. Abused people can turn abusers too. Silent people are enablers
@Lyra: You say Kate could’ve chosen psychological treatment, but we just watched an interview where her sister-in-law was told that that was not possible, so I don’t know where you would get that idea from. They don’t have any freedom; that much is clear now.
And it’s all so sad.
@MISSMARIEROSE
Kate has way more support than Meghan in UK: a better position in the family as future queen, a close family, more free time… While Meghan would get worst treatment no matter what. Double standards were a thing in that family. What I’m trying to say, though, that most abusers have a toxic background, so we can understand why they act like that. But it doesn’t take the responsibility of Kate’s ‘Karen’ bullying, since she is an adult. It can explain how she acts this way, but doesn’t justify.
If Kate wanted to heal, and became a better person, she can, but she choses to be with this family while enabling, and even taking part of the abuse of other women and people. She does this because she wants the luxury and is a doormat. I can’t even imagine the amount of mental abuse that Kate needs to deal from every side. Pressure from family, deal with snobery from nobles, rage from husband, criticism from strangers etc…, but so did Meghan and Harry, they had it worse, and Kate did nothing to help them. A lot of people got in shitty marriages and have toxic families, and a lot of people break free from it. It’s hard but it’s life. It’s choices that we do everyday. Diana did the right thing, Meghan and Harry did it too. Kate always has choices.
I agree with you completely Ianne, and also you DU. The question I have, especially as I read all the comments so far on this article so far, is how do we hold white women accountable for their complicity in injustice while acknowledging their victimhood? It seems so easy for white women to escape accountability for their racism and victimisation of others – whether it’s the women’s league of the KKK, the woman who accused Emmett Till and is still alive somewhere even after confessing that she lied, Amy Cooper, possibly Catherine of Cambridge, and on and on. The switch to sympathy for white women is *instant*, truly. What do we do about this? Or, how do we offer this sympathy to all women, all people? (I’m a Black woman, if that’s relevant here)
I’m reminded of this Bill Burr clip, calling out white women for their sense of self-preservation, to put it mildly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yO9pGBYxg4A
This is a good point. I mean, in this specific instance, I don’t know how much power Kate has, where she can correct false information, etc. How explosive is Will’s temper? What kind of fear does Kate live in? This isn’t just like light family gossip in a regular family; it’s an institution that will always do *everything* possible to protect the line and its reputation. But I also do not have a strong enough memory to remember *which* Middleton placed stories talked about what. Did Ma Middleton place the flower girl story, or was that Will/KP? If it was Ma Middleton, that’s Kate’s fault, full stop. If it was Will/KP, I’m going to go with the fact that Kate’s not moving under her own power. Her husband does not love her.
I don’t think anyone extends the woman who lied about Emmett Till and Amy Cooper any sympathy, nor do they deserve any.
No one made Kate give bitch face to Harry and Meghan at the Commonwealth Service. Even William didn’t do that so we need to stop acting like Kate isn’t allowed to do mean things on her own.
She remained silent on purpose.
This, Nic919. Kate and Carole have the ability to get stories out in the tabloids, through their connections to the Fail and various RRs. Kate chose to let the original story stand and be repeated. Kate chose that. So many people on this thread insisting Kate is some kind of victim, when all I see is a schemer and manipulator.
And I have said before in the past that I do feel bad for Kate in the sense that she really doesn’t have any other life than the royal one. She has no other identity beyond William if we’re being honest. Her life has revolved around him for almost all of her adult life.
So I get why she clings so hard to the royal life. It’s because she wants to be Queen but it’s also because she doesn’t really have any real options outside of the royals.
Plus if she leaves of her own choice, William and the establishment will turn against her. The smear campaign happening to Meghan will happen to her. And unlike Meghan, Kate doesn’t have powerful friends like Oprah and Tyler Perry to help out. She’s also going to need money and she doesn’t have the work ethic to pull off a Netflix or Spotify deal like the Sussexes have
She’s trapped, which is sad, but she also has autonomy which she uses to cause harm. Meghan could have died, from suicide or pregnancy-related complications from the stress of it all (or worse). How do we hold Kate accountable for her role? Do we just ignore her? And would a non-white woman get the same pass? I don’t have the answers to this, but I’m struck by how understanding everyone is being to Kate (understandably so!) to the point of absolving her of benefiting from a deeply harmful stereotype. There was enough abuse towards Meghan which protected Kate, Kate could have killed this one story. Why didn’t she? And what’s her responsibility now that we know about it?
Oh I wasn’t trying to absolve Kate of anything. Yes she’s stuck but she also has some power like shutting down that crying story and coming out with a statement that could have cleared the air. She also did not need to act like a bitch during CW day last year.
I was just saying that I understand the situation she’s in but I still don’t think it erases or justifies her behaviour.
@Lauren, exactly. If Kate were a good person, but yet couldn’t verbally rebuff the claims, she could have had the both of them perform joint duties over a period of time, not just go to Wimbledon once, where her body language was that of lording it over Meghan. We know Kate is not a woman’s woman, never has been and never will be. I wouldn’t be surprised if she had some racial bias, as she kept the company of Emma Sayle, the seedy sex party organiser, who was cautioned by the police about wanting to shoot illegal immigrants see link to article (https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1343017/amp/Kate-Middletons-friend-cautioned-police-joke-shooting-illegal-immigrants.html )
As my mother said to me when I was 16 years old, ‘show me your friend and I’ll show you your character.’ We really are the company we keep.
Wow— There have always been rumors re UK high society but are sex clubs and games in fact the glue that holds them together? Profumo affair, Jimmy Saville, Prince Andrew, Ghislaine Maxwell and Kevin Spacey posing on thrones in BP, W referring to K as “good sex waiting for him” when she accompanied him and his mates on a ski trip but stayed in his room, Rose trimming and allowing their mansion to be used for more, etc.
“Events organiser Miss Sayle is the head of The Sisterhood, an all-female charity group which Miss Middleton joined in 2007.… On The Sisterhood website she is listed as the ‘fearless leader of this merry band of girls’ as well as the ‘brains and brawn behind a very successful company in the upmarket adult industry’.… [Sayle] was the subject of a London council investigation earlier this year over claims her Killing Kittens firm used a £30million house for sex parties. She has described herself as ‘one of the world’s leading sextrepreneurs’ and sells sexual aids and ‘kidnap role play experiences’ for £3,500 through her company.”
Any sympathy I might have had for Kate Middling Middleton evaporated when she refused to do the very least she could do for Meghan. Kate is NOT a feminist .
Nope waiting 10 years for a man to complete you is not a feminist action and she sure didn’t stand up for her fellow sister-in-law.
The only pass I’m willing to grant Kate for all of her shitty behavior is if she was truly in an abusive relationship with William, and afraid to leave.
Unlike Meghan I don’t think she’s a good person (her coldness and body language at the service they attend together) but that’s the only benefit of the doubt I’m giving her.
Kate chased and clung to the man for 10 years. She had plenty of opportunites to leave and chose to keep chasing him every time he dumped her. She is no victim.
Toxic Piers Morgan was saying in GMB that William is seething with rage after Meghan’s take down of his wife and will never forgive her for this. What ??? Who’s William not to forgive? Is he dense to understand that it was his wife who wronged Meghan? He’s such a big ego that he couldn’t fathom the idea that his wife apologized to someone he thinks is beyond his station. Well Meghan fixed the story for Kate. She and William should be grateful to her for her kind words and was more than gracious to call her (Kate ) a “good person.” But, after this interview, I believe William and Kate are not credible advocates for mental health. Nobody is going to believe them after not lifting a finger to protect Meghan and Harry’s mental health.
Straight up DARVO!!!!! Had always figured the story was made up or heavily fabricated, but did not occur me to the *reverse* happened. Classic, textbook DARVO. They are abusers, all.
That story was brought up again in the Tatler article. And not only did Kate not correct the narrative – either herself or through her friends that were authorized to speak- but they elaborated on it!
Meghan is being very gracious. I imagine that Kate was generally kind to her face but would then turn around and do all sorts of passive aggressive bull-$&-
And she + Will didn’t demand that this story was removed like so many other quotes!
I don’t see how meghan was overly sympathetic to kate. Did you guys not see her facial expressions? Especially when she said it was the reverse and when Oprah mentioned Wimbledon and meghans answer? Basically saying kate was NOT supportive.
I don’t think kate came out looking so good in this. Meghan was very smart about this. She knows she has to be careful with her words. Her pauses, what she doesn’t say matters as much as what she does say.
Also, people will look up WHY didn’t kate deny this story and they will see her wearing almost-white to meghans wedding and put two and two.
I am SO happy that most people weren’t seeing it for Kate even after Meghan said “she’s a good person”. I think many understood that Meghan couldn’t have said anything else because of the racial dynamics and how she’s already compared negatively to Kate.
My daughter and I immediately turned to each other and said “her non-answer is the answer.” Kate was clearly NOT supportive or welcoming.
Am I the only one who finds disturbing how Kate is a white canvas and literally tried to steal Meghan’s identity by saying that what happened to herself was in fact something she did with Meghan? This is pure jealousy but I’m starting to believe it’s a disorder. It’s not the first time that Kate emulates other women. She simply has nothing going on to herself.
Also Kate is at fault, any decent person would had denied it though her PR team. She didn’t it because she is a horrible person. I would be ashamed if I were Kate.
I’m having flashbacks to “little fires everywhere” in which a white girl uses a black girl’s experience with prejudice and racism for her college application essays.
People want Kate to be a victim so bad in the same way that people want Melania trump to be a victim. Melania just doesn’t try to pretend otherwise. We saw how Kate behaved at the commonwealth service. That is who she really is. She did not say anything because it benefitted her and she leaked the cry story out of jealousy. Kate let that story ride out for years. She let it ride just LAST WEEK knowing she was the one in the wrong. She should get no passes.
Thank you. At the end of the day, Kate Middleton is self-serving, calculating trash. One apology and some flowers does NOT absolve her of everything she’s done since then.
Spot on with the Melania comparison.
Yup. I am reading some of the posts in this thread and the way people are using Meghan’s measured, careful comment to try and absolve Kate of everything is…interesting.
Meghan neutralized Kate and Carole with her comment and let the world know Kate ain’t shit. Kate can’t come at Meghan with racist Karen condescension anymore.
And Kate stans are gagging to figure out how this is Meghan attacking Kate so they can freak out but they can’t do anything with Meghan calling Kate a good person.
Exactly. Kate and Melania have both used the white woman victim image to escape blame for truly awful actions.
Thank you! I’m speechless reading all these comments using this story that clearly shows Meghan as the victim to turn Kate into a victim of circumstance. Kate had Tatler remove all those stories but left this story in the article. Why? People refuse to accept evil when it’s staring them in the face. Nobody made Kate wear that dress to the wedding, nobody made Kate be rude at the Commonwealth service. People won’t even allow Meghan to be the victim in her own story. It’s all “What about poor Kate?”
Duchess Melania.
Shrugs William’s hand off her and is amused about not visiting her charity for 8 years.
Kate is complicit. She’s Fergie 2.0
It’s disturbing to see. She can have her mother leak all kinds of bullshit about not only Meghan, but the entire RF as well, but she can’t slyly say that nobody cried. Give me a break. Then she turns around and appropriates Meghan’s tears as her own…and people want to defend her! For real?! She’s over here trying to skin Meghan and wear her like last years Versace in those zoom calls, while getting praise for it, but she’s a victim in this? Ridiculous.
Why is it so hard for many of you to believe that she is awful? Or that Kate has lasted this long in the RF because she’s just as shitty as the lot of them? Homegirl has stuck it out because she is as ruthless as they are, as was stated in the Tatler article. Meghan couldn’t survive because she is a decent person. Kate is who she is and what she has shown herself to be.
Kate stole Meghan’s story and her staff mocked Meghan by pretending they too cried and it was all Meghan’s fault. We all saw her snub Meghan. Kate actively participated in the bullying. But I guess people really like Kate’s hair.
Kate had no problem letting people reverse the story, and this came at a time when Meghan was pregnant and receiving daily abuse. She consented to adding fuel to the fire to get people to hate Meghan even more. So if the fact Meghan made Kate cry was a straight up lie, what else was a lie? It completely invalidates those bullying claims because we now know they are willing to lie.
I feel so vindicated right now. Does anyone feel the same way? We all knew there was something wrong with that narrative AND we all called Kate out for her passive-aggressive behaviour at their wedding. And hey, we were right while everyone else tried to gaslight everyone who felt something else was going on.
I may have texted to a few friends that I was right all along.
I have this mixture of being glad I was right but being so angry at being right. I actually cried so much during the interview because I couldn’t understand how they managed to survive such a violent and dangerous institution. They wanted her DEAD and no one will convince me otherwise. The BRF is dead to me.
“The Duchess of Karens, and her salty white tears.”… I snorted out loud, lmfao.
I love how all the dirt is coming on the surface and they can’t hide behind lies and excuses anymore. Charles, William and Kate, the Queen.. what a bunch of awful people.
I think that Meghan called her a good person because I strongly suspect Kate had the initial fit over the dress because it would have been around the same time she found out about the affair with Rose, which we know she learned while pregnant with Louis.
That said Meghan is being to generous in saying that because remaining silent when the false story goes out is complicity in the attacks against Meghan. She deserves all the criticism she will get for this.
Meghan also said that she and Kate could not just speak freely, there were constraints. Kate may have no problem getting permission to shoot down botox stories about herself but not about stories involving Meghan or anybody else in the family.
Meghan knows much more than we do about Kate’s real situation and the constraints on her, so that may well be why she is not painting Kate as a bad person because she did not shut down the whole ridiculous story right away. Honestly, if this crying incident happened with non-royals, would anybody be so bent out of shape about it? This is a manufactured problem and the response to it illustrates the deep dysfunction in the royal family and the campaign against Meghan, but really doesn’t tell us anything about Kate. She is not anywhere near as strong or smart as Meghan and she does not have support from her husband, quite the opposite. Support from her commoner family is not the same as having Prince Harry on your side. Even Meghan, despite her much greater internal strength and sheer intelligence, still had to stuff it until she escaped back to the New World.
I can’t imagine Kate being able to figure her way out of this as some have indicated . Yes, just denying that anybody made her cry would have been sufficient without revealing any untidy details. But knowing that requires a level of social intelligence and cleverness that introverted Kate just doesn’t have, and even that very likely requires permission to say in the first place. If her husband and the other royals are telling her to shut up, she shuts up.
Parents, don’t let your children marry into dysfunctional royal families. That’s the message I get from this.
Kate and Carole have freely gotten plenty of anti-Meghan stories out to the tabloids for four years. If Kate wanted the truth out there, it would have been out there. She chose to keep perpetuating the lies, outside of Palace control, for years.
Kate. Is. No. Victim.
What I thought was interesting was M’s comment “She ‘s a good person ” to describe K.She could have sidestepped making a comment about the relationship but didn’t .
But did you notice her response when Oprah asked her about Wimbledon and asked if Kate had been supportive?
At the end of the day, I feel for George, Charlotte, and Louis. They are being raised by complete asshats all around. I shudder to think how they will be as adults. Thank God Meghan and Harry got out and are giving Archie and his future sister a chance at normalcy and sanity.
Kate is a disgusting person. I’m pleased most people reacting on Twitter are seeing her for what she is. She has done too much shit to Meghan *after* the dress story to be given the benefit of the doubt. I don’t feel sorry for whatever she’s going through. She wants to be there, so let her be.
I cannot believe the Kate stans on here trying to make Waity a victim! Unbelievable! But lets see how much comes out in the next couple of weeks, how many “Meghan was mean to my staff!” stories come out. So sick of her, her manipulative mother and husband! Kate put Meghan through this while Meghan was pregnant with her first child, all the while Kate is claiming a “passion” for the plight of pregnant women and the “early years”. On top of being a ” mental health advocate”. Y’all come get your white princess because she is all kinds of trash.
All this right here. Kate wanted that life and she got it. You can be in that world and still be a good person–look at Harry! A “blood-prince” and compassionate as ever. Power just reveals who you are and Kate is a garbage person and I don’t have to be diplomatic like Meghan.
I may be one of those people that you are bringing up. I’m no Kate stan, nor am I trying to make her a victim. What interests me about Kate is how she fits into this bigger narrative. She’s no ally of Meghan, obviously, and she has likely done some reprehensible things. Whenever I have spoken up for her, it’s not with the intent of absolving her. I’m curious about the dynamic of how women behave in a patriarchal system–what choices they make and why, and what are the consequences of those choices.
If it’s a Kate vs Meghan battle, then Meghan won. She’s married to a man she loves, has a beautiful privileged life where she can make her own choices. Like Satre’s No Exit, Kate is stuck in a system where she may be liked by some (and is actively disliked by many), but is respected by no one. It’s funny that Meghan talked about The Little Mermaid last night. In the original HC Anderson story, when the mermaid got legs, those legs would come with pain that she would feel as walking on knives with each step. That’s what I think of now when I see images of Kate. She may be wearing a tiara and a gown, but every step she takes is excruciatingly painful. She has to do work that she has no aptitude for, stuck walking on eggshells with a monster of a husband, knowing she has no power over her children’s lives. Can she decide where they go to school? What they wear?
What I try to point out in my more sympathetic-sounding posts about Kate is not that she’s a victim–she’s made her own choices. I’m curious about the price a woman has to pay in order to survive within that system–what she has to destroy about herself in order to fit in. Ultimately, she is no more than an ornament, and I don’t believe she’s given any more consideration that a trinket on a shelf is given. But trinkets, however costly, are ultimately expendable, as is Kate.
It’s easy to come with the pitchforks, and I get that desire. I also think there’s a deeper, more insidious story here. Diana was killed by it. Fergie was shamed. Kate was utterly diminished. Only Meghan has been freed.
@lanne if there was any diminishment of Kate Middleton, it was done by her mother, not by the royals. Where is there any evidence of Kate wanting to be anything other than Williams wife and Queen? And even Kate can’t lay the blame at her mothers feet for this Faustian bargain forever. Sometimes there is no “there” there. Diana and Fergie had the life snuffed out of them for sure. I think the royals figured Meghan would get sick of it all and leave for sure. But Kate, damn its like something is missing inside and its hard to tell if “it” was ever there in the first place.
I think Kate is a problem and was a problem for Meghan, but she’s not the worst problem. She is both a problem and a symptom of a larger problem. She acts this way because it is the easiest way to survive in a toxic marriage, within a wicked family, within a horrific institution, within a hugely toxic patriarchal , racist, colonialist, classist country, in a messed up world-culture. Her husband is a bigger problem them Kate is. But he, too, is a symptom of bigger problems: his family. Charles and the family is a bigger problem than Kate and William are, and also a symptom of bigger problems: the monarchy. The monarchy is a bigger problem than William and Charles and Kate, but it’s a symptom of a different problem: white supremacy, classism, colonialism in the U.K. as sustained by the media. That culture of racism, classism, and colonialism in the U.K. is a bigger problem than the monarchy and everyone in it, but it’s a symptom of the cruel and unfair world we live in.
Kate is a victim of the problems that are bigger than her, but she then victimized Meghan, who is ALSO a victim of all the things Kate is dealing with PLUS now Kate. Kate did not have to victimize Meghan. Just like Will doesn’t have to victimize and abuse Kate, and Charles doesn’t have to victimize and abuse his children. The current monarch and her consort didn’t have to abuse Charles. The press doesn’t have to abuse and exploit the monarchy in this devil’s bargain thing they have going on. With strength of character, courage, and the valuable conviction to do what’s right, you can choose to speak up against/fight against/challenge the people and institutions above you in the power hierarchy and try to affect change, even if it means you may make an enemy of the powerful people that both abuse you and yet give you status by associating with you. She does not choose to do that because she is a weak-willed person who is not willing to stand up for her convictions IF she even has them. Instead, she chooses to turn around and victimize someone else because it builds her up just that little bit more to have someone underneath her in the pecking order, makes her look just a little bit more valuable and powerful to the people around her that she wants to impress even while knowing that the way they treat her is wrong.
But so does William. And so does Charles. And so does the monarchy, and the country, and the press. They all choose to abuse and victimize rather than attempt to affect change. And the thing is that if the monarchy, for example, fought against the abuse of the press, they would be saving the monarchy, Charles, william, Kate, and Meghan. They have more power, so they can help more people by trying to make changes. It would be like 5 vs 2. Kate could help herself and Meghan, and she doesn’t seem to think that the risk of a 2 vs 5 fight is worth the proportionally smaller reward. Meghan could only help herself by fighting, and yet she did it anyways, even though it was a 1 vs 6 fight. She felt that strongly about her conviction that this was wrong.
I’ve been thinking this over. My take is Kate was terrified word would get out that she made Meghan cry and made the apology with flowers but she shared her concern with the firm and they ran with we will just spin this as Meghan made Kate cry. Could Kate have corrected the story is the big question and the firm have corrected many stories about her.
Kate benefited the most from the dehumanizing treatment of Meghan.
I think it deplorable that people say well, Kate was bullied by the media and took it. Like that’s a some kind of badge of honour. From the looks of her now she’s clearly in some kind of duress.
Mental and emotional abuse shouldn’t be celebrated.
Kate’s reputation is fragile and everyone knows it. Meghan generally supports women and it is clear the intention of this interview is not to attack or put them leaving on Kate, so as not to feed that horrible narrative of female vs female. Meghan is very compassionate and you can see clearly she was upset and disappointed for being depicted as the villain, but she stuck to the simple facts without going into attack mode. That restraint is super strength. I believe that Meghan knows Kate is not some innocent player, but she also pities Kate at the same time because she dislikes media attacks on females. Kate may be ambitious or ruthless, but she is also miserable and trapped. Maybe we don’t feel sorry for Kate, but maybe Meghan does. I’m not excusing Kate, I’m just saying maybe this is how Meghan is thinking.
Kate’s no ally, and likely no friend to any woman, but I also believe that she has no power. I don’t think she could have gone against her husband and her mother without facing consequences that she wasn’t able to handle. This is a woman with no power, no money, no friends, no influence. She’s trapped exactly in the way that they hoped Meghan the “showgirl” would be–with no recourse. I imagine she avoids upsetting William because she would be at the mercy of his rages. If he put his hands on her, the Palace would protect him, not her. (An out of control rage monster is likely violent as well–William is someone who cant regulate his emotions because he has never been taught to. I wouldn’t be surprised at all if his rage has been directed at her) If she leaves, the children would stay with the monarchy, not her. She has seen what the Palace would do to her–she has seen what the Palace has done to her mother in law and her sister in law.
Perhaps she has completely checked out–lost herself in narcissism and dieting and coloring books as a form of self protection. We see that this family is far, far darker than we could ever imagine. It’s really no different at all from the Sheik Mohammed guy in Dubai who is keeping his daughters prisoner because they tried to escape.
I think if Kate tried to leave, she would be “offed” in some way. Not killed, but likely called “crazy,” or some other slander, just like Diana was. She could be locked in an institution. Her own mother would likely haul her back to the Palace if she runs away.
Charles believed it was his right to cheat. William does too. Even if William is outed as a cheater, and I believe he eventually will be, openly, nothing really changes for her. She will be expected to forgive him, stay silent, and smile. Maybe Kate’s lack of work is the only protest she can make. I’m reaching here a bit, but I can’t in light of everything revealed, believe that Kate is in a healthy or safe environment.
I don’t mean to hijack this threat, and as a black woman, I sure as hell don’t want to try to center Kate within the narrative of Meghan’s story. But what if, as we finally see what happened to Meghan, we also end up seeing what happens to married-in women in a larger marrative? That’s a discussion for another day, because we are engaged in Meghan’s story right now. But I wonder if Meghan telling her story might also open up that bigger narrative? Maybe Meghan’s story will shed some light on what Kate could be facing, and could untimately protect future married ins? And Charlotte, who even as a born Princess, will face the wrath of social media in a way that Anne never had to. Charlotte won’t be shielded from any of her transgressions, and she will likely be thrown under the bus to protect George.
I don’t think Kate is as trapped as Meghan actually. I believe if Kate really became suicidal, Mike and Carole Middleton would be there in a flash to take Kate away. William and the BRF might do nothing but the Middletons would step in. James Middleton has openly talked about how he was suicidal. Pippa and her husband gave James a place and a job (that estate in Scotland??) to keep him busy. We might criticize Kate for being overdependent on Carole but if Kate was that mentally desperate, Carole would get Kate help, 100%. They already had one child reveal thoughts of suicide, there is no way they would play if Pippa or Kate came forward to admit the same.
Thing is, no one asked Kate to be Meghan’s BFF. But you’d think that as someone who was mistreated by the press she’d reach out to Meghan once in awhile to see how she was doing. And I understand the wedding preparation was highly fraught and emotional with it being a royal wedding. Kate was less than a month post-partum and was probably super emotional with all those hormones. Meghan was dealing with the public fallout of her father’s shenanigans. Kate apologized and they “moved on.” But Kate never went out of her way to check in on Meghan or help her in any way. And that was Kate’s choice, not the courtiers or advisers. Maybe she didn’t want to get into it since Harry and William were fighting. And I get she may have been between a rock and a hard place and diidn’t want her husband to blow up on her. But is Kate really being monitored 24/7 that she couldn’t sneak the occasional text or call to Meghan? Is it so hard to say “Just checking in to see how you are doing. Let me know!” I know Meghan was defending Kate and trying to make her SIL look good but this just confirmed to me that Kate, at heart, is a Mean Girl.
I think she’s a Mean Girl too, and sees all women as threats, and likely has no friends. I don’t think her parents would take care of her through. I think Mom uses her as an extention of herself–she even wears Kate’s clothes! She told Kate to go back to William when he cheated on her. I think Carole’s eyes are on the throne, not Kate, and if Carole had to choose between Kate and William, she would choose William every time. I think Kate didn’t reach out to Meghan because she was caught up in her own vanity. How many times do we see miserable people take solace in the fact that other people are more miserable than they are? And Kate has likely bought into the “There can only be one of us” nonsense that so many women in patriarchy buy into–the “I don’t care if other women go down, so long as it’s not me” and the “that other women getting taken down means that I’m safe now.” That mindset, as damaging as it is, is a survival strategy at heart. Kate is likely experiencing emotional abuse if not worse, and I think she has accepted that as her lot. She’s a cautionary tale for sure: be careful what you wish for.
Kate had enough power to leak a seventh month old story in which she was the aggressor to damage Meghan. She was so comfortable in doing it, that she didn’t even consider that Meghan would push back on it. Think about it, she knew nobody would challenge her narrative and Meghan would stay silent. That is so devious, I can’t believe people want to describe her as helpless. Then she had the nerve to smile at Meghan at a tennis match. To this day people think Meghan is and abusive person who not only makes white women cry, but tried to poison little white girls too.
Kate may not be the most powerful in the institution, but she certainly wields whatever power she has viciously.
Kate and Carole have power, including two past editors of the Mail on Sunday who have been their private media advisors for over a decade. They’ve spread plenty of lies and attacks about Meghan for four years.
Kate chose to let the lie stand, while she had the ability to get the truth out, because the lie made her look like the victim.
I have no sympathy for Kate.
I actually think that Kate’s mindset is the following: I’m still here so I will make all the suffering worth by turning queen one day. Also unlike Meghan she doesn’t have much for herself other than marrying William. the other problem is that Kate has children that are part of the monarchy , her oldest will turn a future king. So she doesn’t want to lose access to them. And as you said, there’s her narc mother who would for sure side with William. I really dislike Kate though, she gives mean girl vibes.
Meghan handled this beautifully, telling the truth while also saying Kate apologized/she accepted and that’s not why she was telling the truth, but rather to show how the media narrative has twisted her image in such a ridiculous way. She’s pure class.
But who put the media narrative out there in the first place? The fitting was a private event, somebody went to the press with that ugly story and that person let it twist out there for two years. Keen and her mom have been running to the press to push these puff pieces making Kate into a saint all at Meghans expense.
No doubt Kate, Will, or Carole did this. Which is horrific. But I thought it was very kind that Meg didn’t throw her under the bus.
Am convinced that story came from Kate and the Mids, William never leaks anything that embiggens his wife or her family.
Miss me with the sympathy for Kate. She benefited from every abusive, racist, misogynistic article on Meghan. Not once, through her media contacts, did she dispel that Meghan made Kate cry narrative. Not once. Her mother even joined in the bashing. Kate, and many white women, like her support the white patriarchy because it’s the safest place for them to maintain their status in the world. If Kate is miserable, it’s an even trade off for her life of luxury and status. Kate never gave a thought for Meghan’s suffering when she clearly knew Meghan was suffering. So, I don’t care if Kate is trapped in her gilded cage. It’s where she wants to be. She doesn’t want freedom. She wants the crown.
I don’t get the mental gymnastics to make a kate a victim as well when in Reality kate did nothing to help or support Meghan . When Meghan was getting dragged for how much she spent kate would show up in a rewears almost immediately when Meghan had her first Royal event with the book kate and her team leaked hours of the announcement about Kate broken Britain project. Kate knew Meghan was getting trashed daily by the press and did nothing Kate gave the lie a new life when she and her mother decided to do that kate the great article . They continue to further pass the narrative that Meghan made kate cry again just like week if Meghan didn’t come out with the truth this week kate and her family would have continue with this smeared this Racist lie that the black duchess made the white duchess. Kate is a liar a bully who had no problem helping the firm destroy another human being she not a victim of William she a willing participant in every things .
I haven’t read all the comments so idk if someone else said this: Did Meghan say it took like 7 months for Kate to apologize?
And just from a gossip perspective didn’t Kate leak that she sent her flowers? I swear @Kaiser wrote about that a long while back. But it was in the media, not as an apology, but as Kate being a supportive sister in law.
It sounded like the apology happened not long after the incident. What happened 7 months later is that the story went to the media flipping who made who cry.
Thanks
There’s just no excuse for allowing this story to be perpetuated for so long, over and over again. It’s disgusting.
When we thought Meghan made Kate cry I thought, “Meh, it was a high stress situation for her and Kate was still pretty newly post partum. Meghan possibly got testy, Kate was overly sensitive.” Fine. In reverse I think the same thing basically. Kate was post partum, adjusting to having 3 kids now and possibly had a nasty outburst to a very stressed out Meghan, who was also very sensitive at the time. Shit happens. She apologized. But then to let a straight up LIE get published and NEVER corrected. And to benefit from that? Nope. GROSS.
The cruel part isn’t necessarily the original incident, but the omission in correctly the false story. I think we can sort out many reasons as to why Kate acted the way she did, and some of them may be sympathetic, but her failure to correct the lie is entirely her fault.
Exactly. My daughter was incredibly stressed the week before a wedding of 150 people. Imagine the week before a wedding of millions and millions! Looking at a bride sideways can make some cry in those last few days. BUT. Not correcting the narrative was and is mind boggling. And the fact that she wrote a note and sent flowers shows it must have been more than a comment about bare legs a little girl. And yeah, the pale yellow dress and hat was a mistake.
I would like to address the elephant in the room. There are a lot of Kate supporters trying to cosplay as Meghan supporters here today. They are actively hijacking this thread as damage control. Yes many of them are White. But a significant number of them, based on Kensington Palace instagram, are Asian.
I saw filipino, chinese, thai, koreans out in full support of Kate post interview. One would think the Covid-19 anti-asian backlash would have taught them that racist white people do not like them anymore than any other POC. They are merely biding time until they can find something to malign you with. One would hope they would show solidarity with the real victim. Nah, lighter and whiter skin is still preferred in Asian communities.
Colorism is a huge problem in Asia. I’m Asian and Kate is fawned upon as the beautiful white Princess. Racism against black people is a huge problem!!! This is why I’m invested.
I wouldn’t be surprised if most of them are bots too. There was an uptick in the leadup to this interview on Twitter.
I really admire that Meghan was doing her best to avoid the messed up ‘pick a side!’ binary between she and Kate, even saying ‘if you like me you don’t have to hate her’. I think nursing hatred or anger towards other people, even if they deserve it, is just unhealthy. Meghan seems to get that. I do think it’s a shame that some people seem to go straight to ‘Kate is awful’, even when Meghan herself said Kate might have been silenced the same way Meghan was. The whole structure seems deeply messed up, and we can choose to make Kate the canvas to project all our feelings about people who do the wrong thing (claiming she’s a white feminist and a TERF when I don’t think she’s ever said anything about either of those issues) or we can choose to think she’s probably a regular person doing her best in a messed up system and making bad moral compromises and losing bits of herself along the way. Do whatever feels best to you I guess.
This horse-faced doormat. Karma is racing for her.
I think this interview left me more sympathetic to Kate. Yes, she’s still problematic, but you can’t tell me that Kate didn’t experience being controlled and restricted and silenced. The whole institution is rotten and I’m sure what they did to Meghan they did to Kate minus the racism. At least Meghan has a husband who respects her and has her back and wants her to excel. Kate has a rage monster who likely controls her way more than we can ever understand. I feel like William would not ever want her to shine too brightly, lest she eclipses him. Kate has the personality of a doormat and is quite content to do nothing, so it kind of works for her.
Meghan saying she is a good person was quite frankly shocking to me. It had me wondering what Meghan knows about her that we don’t.
Kate turned herself in to Cardboard Kate nearly twenty years ago, in her ruthless pursuit of a man who never wanted to marry her. Who cheated constantly, still does, and Kate still pursued marriage with him for a decade.
No one in the Palace turned Kate in to who she is. Her own cousin stated years ago that Kate has no interest in the world around her, only has interest in her personal tiny circle. That’s how Kate is, which sounds like a classic constrolling narcissist to me.
Kate made Meghan cry and quite happily went along with the story reversal, despicable. No wonder they couldn’t keep their story straight. Kate went along with the smears cos she benefited them, I fact she was the only one who really benefited from the Meghan bashing.
But the whole family look gawd awful, I don’t think any of them have any redeeming qualities, it’s amazing harry has turned out the way he has.
But with Kate, she’s on her own, well and truly. The middletons may have their mouthpieces but most of them are joint mouthpieces. In a divorce they would probably all migrate on to willies team. Also the issue around security is very interesting. It can cost hundreds of thousands a year for one person. Kate would never be able to afford that should she ever leave. Also she would have to leave her kids behind in that environment. Meghan and harry were so lucky they had each other and had a plan. People always assume royals are so rich, but I don’t think that’s the case at all.
Have you ever actually followed what he did in the past? He went to a costume party as Hitler. He’s no saint, not even close.
I’m glad someone brought that up, because when harry did that, he was well and truly under the influence of the firm and aristocracy. He hadn’t experienced life away from that environment. That’s sort of thing was totally normalised in that environment, I mean didn’t William dress in blackface or something? Once harry started to grow up and spend time away in the army, he evolved so much into the person he is. Most of them haven’t experienced life outside the bubble hence why they think their racist behaviour is totally normal.
Everyone who follows Harry knows about that and I wish they’d brought that up in the interview. Do I think he was a Nazi sympathizer, especially after what we’ve seen these past four years in Trump- land , no. Was he a privileged git who never had to think about race, totally. There was a huge outcry at the time and he was rightfully raked for it.
William went to the same party as a Zulu. But unlike Harry, who was raked over the coals, William was protected. Harry grew from his mistakes, while Williams were covered up. Personal growth’s a thing you know. Most of us hove done stupid things in our past that we wouldn’t want known.
Why wouldn’t Kate have joint custody of her kids? Does William seem like such a doting father that suddenly he’s going to be hands on and want to be with the kids all the time? He was saying he wished he could spend more time with them and they are still married. If they divorced it would be the best thing that ever happened to Kate. Again, stop making this woman a victim saying she’s trapped.
Anyone on here who knows me knows I’m no kate fan. My point is when Kate eventually gets the boot, what would she do when she has to set up on her own. Technically they would have joint access but the crown officially has custody of the children. I think harry and Meghan were lucky they were all able to leave together. I can’t imaging what it must have been like to leave your kids behind in that institution even if it’s only half the time, like Diana and fergie did.
Harry said he wouldn’t have been able to do it had it not been for Diana’s inheritance. Kate doesn’t have those funds so it’s probably a major part of the reason why she’s hanging on so hard. Police protection can cost like a couple of hundred thousand a year alone. I doubt she would be able to afford that so it’s up to the firm to decide if they want to provide it. Unless she gets a half decent settlement she’s financially f*cked and that’s probably part of the reason she’s clinging on for dear life. She’s never gonna get any major Netflix deals so Ma Middleton will have to hunt for some trust fund millionaire as a backup plan just in case.
As long and she and her family go quietly, no problem. Kate would be given the ability to live in a grace and favour home, either Anmer or Wood Farm, until she remarries or the youngest turns 18. If William paid for her parents new home, that would be perceived as a post-nup. She wouldn’t need a London home or office staff, as she’d stop the sham of ‘working’ completely. It isn’t like she’d be out there doing charity work and pretending to care.
So many ppl trying to be sympathetic towards Kate, and I’ll I’ve got is eff her. We all remember the Tatler debacle. The Catherine the Great article was a passive aggressive slam piece. W&K put it all these denials and threatened to sue. Eventually, the online version was trimmed down bc of the pressure. Even after forcing them to remove stuff from the article, they let the story about the tears about the wedding stay in. It doesn’t say Meghan made Kate cry but they knew that was the story out and that’s what they were referencing. They intentionally allowed that story to keep running. I have no sympathy for that.
This is what’s terrible about this. She and everyone else knew the truth and then they dropped this lie months after the actual event took place. That seems to be their MO. Save embarrassments or information that can be used against you, and utilize it when it’s convenient. This is how royal courts have always operated have always operated. Every article with Will and Kate a,ways swipes at or trashes the Sussexes.Camilla Tominey, who has a serious vendetta against Meghan , seems very familiar with Carole Middleton. I’m glad they barely mentioned them in the main interview and called out the crying Kate lie.
When Carole Middleton is inserting herself into the mix by making criticisms of Meghan’s ability to give speeches, we have moved well beyond “oh poor Kate must have been a victim and William and the courtiers attacked Meghan”. You cannot pretend that Kate is innocent when her own mother is going to the media and slamming Meghan.
Nor can the keep pretending Kate has no ability to get the truth out, when all she’d have to do is have Carole Jenner get it out via her tabloid connections.
Also the passive aggressive outfit rewearing when Meghan was getting slammed in the press for building her royal wardrobe. Also the jabs about why THEY the superior ones decided to do their duty with the the Lindo presentation when Meghan was getting heat. I mean that’s not dictated by the palace.
Kate benefited from lie.
Kate could’ve made a show of support to Meghan. Could’ve taken her out to lunch or made some show of support, but didn’t. I don’t feel sorry for her.
The reversal of that story is straight out of the playbook of an abusive partner.
Because clearly, they couldn’t risk the possibility that she would someday tell the truth & be believed. They had to get the lie out there first… to undermine her credibility in case she wanted to speak out, and to paint her as someone who is the aggressor, not the victim of aggression.
Exactly like the abusers who spread lies about their partners just in case they ever find the courage or voice to tell the truth.
I liked her better in her Waity Katey days and I didn’t like her then.
Agree! At least then she had some spark of life
Kate is abhorrent. She did the bare minimum apologizing, but the very fact that she did apologize shows she’s head and shoulders above the rest of that rotten royal bunch. She’s a mean girl Karen, but she pales in comparison to the rest of the sharks and that is what I think Meghan was trying to convey. Doesn’t excuse her subsequent refusal to set the record straight but Meghan does make clear that she at best was an irritant and maybe victim herself as much as I loathe to say it. I’d rather focus on eviscerating the rest of them who are holding all the power – Incandescent, tampon, the Murdock press, and the RR and sycophantic courtiers and aides. That’s not to say that I won’t call her out the next time she and her family participate in the smear.
Also, I really really loathe the comments at Dlisted. I love Michael K. and his wit and lighthearted humor. His writers are pretty good too, but I don’t think I’ll visit that site again. People there are toxic and the stuff that comes out of their mouths are exact talking points the British rags use to just annihilate Meghan. I’m done with that site. Will stick with Celebitchy and Pajiba for my gossip fix from now on.
I think Kate is a victim in many ways. Her mother’s ambition. Her value of herself by what wealth she attracted. To obsess about her appearance. And by default and by example of her mother she was raised to be awful towards anyone perceived as competition.
I am no Kate fan, but how Meghan spoke… a part of me wonders if she’s just so beaten down by this institution as well. Unable to have true freedom and has regressed. Unable or too afraid to speak against it. And knowing if she does she could be next.
We’ve seen her at events, on tours or on zoom calls next to William and she has been seen nervous or cowering in his presence.
Kate never was a strong individual like Meghan and never had to or allowed to be an adult. I have pity for her.
I also wonder if she too felt suicidal from the demands and isolation. If you’re made to feel like a prisoner you could be tickled pink the focus of torture moves off of you and onto someone else.
Kate may be a victim, but she was also a victimizer. Meghan was being generous in excusing her behaviour.
That she isn’t the biggest monster doesn’t mean she is a decent person.
Nic
100% agree.
I both have pity for her and believe she’s not without guilt.
I feel like we’re assuming that everything they did to Meghan they’ve done to Kate, control-wise and isolation-wise for the past 10 years when we know that isn’t really true. She and Will lived alone out in Wales for awhile. They weren’t even working royals, so they didn’t have to deal with the palace and the press and scheduling and getting permission, and living on site being watched like Meghan and Harry did. Will and Kate had years to just be together, even after they were married, before they were expected to work or do anything. Meghan didn’t get that. Kate was allowed to basically move in with her parents when pregnant and after George was born. Or her mom lived with her. Back and forth, over and over. Meghan didn’t have that. She couldn’t just go “move home” for months because 1) her family isn’t in the U.K. and 2) it wouldn’t have been allowed bc it would be bad optics for a full time working royal and all the mandatory stalking like press coverage that comes with that. Kate was living in her own country, Meghan was not. Kate had two parents and two siblings to stick up for her who already had relationships with the press and had ten years of practice at manipulating their own “storyline” and talking points for Kate. They had practice with the press and had perfected the image they wanted to convey. Meghan did not have that. Kate had william, who while likely an awful husband, is at least very into making sure “his family” (he, Kate, the kids) are in charge of their own life, privacy, when they see people, when they work, if they work, and seems not to let anyone tell him what to do and isn’t afraid to tell his dad and the firm to F all the way off when he wants to do something different. Meghan had the younger brother that no one respected or listened to and whom they were very used to bossing around and dictating to. His job was to be a fall boy/third wheel/press distraction when will and Kate needed it. Kate and William got to shape the entire narrative for what having kids would be like in that family: we do the steps after the birth, we do the christening with the press, then we show our kids once or twice a year in photos dressed as Victorians, and then Meghan and Harry were held to that exact template and criticized for doing anything differently. Kate and William and Kate and her family vacationed A LOT, and no one batted an eye at that. They could move around quite a bit in secret and only have (truthful) tidbits about their life or movements come out about them months and months after the fact because their own family wasn’t constantly leaking their whereabouts and their every move to the press. Plus they weren’t working royals so they could basically be anywhere. Kate was trusted by the firm. She had been around for ten years and had apparently “proved” that she wasn’t a fickle, gold digging, celebrity-seeking woman just looking to her worm her way in so she could leak things like they thought Meghan was. They trusted Kate because they molded Kate in the image they wanted her to take. They had used and abused her and she had been “good” and stuck around. She was British, she wasn’t going to run home to Hollywood like they thought Megan would. She didn’t have a job or any other prospects so they knew she was pretty stuck and keen to stay stuck, whereas Meghan could always move onto a plan B, C, or D if she had to/wanted to. They didn’t trust Meghan, so they treated her differently.
I feel like Kate might not be in a perfect, rosy situation *now.* She’s a working royal and there’s so much more press coverage (because of the interest Meghan and Harry brought to the family) but she had a lot of freedom, away from the press, not having to work, moving around freely for years and years before she had to move into KP/Anmer full time and be a working royal/mother of three who has to justify her spending and whereabouts to the taxpayer vs just to Charles or her husband. But there was even some kind of pact with the press that they needed to leave Will and Kate and their babies alone until Will and Kate became full time working royals, and they were able to delay that for a LONG time by being “part time” for years after they had already spent years as “non-working newlyweds.” So they didn’t have to justify everything to the press and taxpayers, and thus think about “optics” like Meghan and Harry had to from the start. H and M were already full time working royals with the scrutiny and press coverage that comes with that from day 1 of their engagement, basically. And then because there was so much press, that was the reason why she wasn’t allowed to go out—because she was “already everywhere,” whereas any glimpse of Kate in the first 6 years of her marriage was fairly rare and thus she was pretty much allowed to do whatever she wanted and go wherever she wanted to “create content.” Whereas Meghan was being forced to stay home isolated to “REDUCE content” and press saturation. She was being isolated for reasons that have never applied to Kate, so why would Kate have ever had to follow the same “remedy” if she didn’t ever have the same “problem” as Meghan?
I just really don’t think people are comparing these two situations fairly or properly. We can’t assume Kate went through the exact same control of movement and isolation in the house alone things as Megan because 1) we have a lot of evidence to the contrary and 2) she wouldn’t have had to since the circumstances were totally different.
AmyToo
You can be a prisoner in more than a few forms.
People with resources and family and friends can still psychologically be prisoners in unlocked palaces. Prisoners will commit more crimes to remain in jail.
I’m not excusing anything Kate participated in and lord knows I’ve been a critic of hers for about a decade, but why people do things… she was raised to be awful and weak. That’s her norm. She’s a victim of circumstance imo.
That said, as adults we are expected to do better, but some never mature. And some never become strong enough to break free.
@Kari I also quit going to Dlisted and I loved it before. Someone mentioned that another site trolls were high five-ing each other for infiltrating Dlisted. I see the trolls try it here too. Fortunately, it gets called out and we keep a haven of sanity here.
I think Meghan was too nice about Kate, but I understand.
I stopped reading over there for the exact same reason.
Camilla Tominey was questioned on This Morning earlier it was priceless, Holly called her out by saying she told them about de crying story first ,she reported this story constantly, Camilla said it was from a reliable source ie Middleton’s and you know Kate was crying too , v defensive, she seemed really rattled…. so there u go folks we where right, Carole and Co !!
Camilla said it was from a reliable source ie Middleton’s . FUNNIEST COMMENT TODAY.
Meghan is able to compartmentalize issues and address each one separately. Hence her defense of Kate’s apologia, note and flowers after the spat. However Meghan’s response to the Wimbledon event with Kate was completely different and she got across in a subtle way that it was not a “friendly” kind of event and that she and Kate never bonded. Kate continues to shirk the benefits of having a friend like Meghan who would be more than willing to share her skills. Kate missed a golden opportunity to up her game because of jealousy and spite, pure and simple.
Jaded: to be fair i don’t think Kate cares for friends. Seems like that woman does what she can to survive in a dysfunctional system, and that includes piling on anyone who is deflecting negative attention away from her.
I hate that out of the entire interview, Meghan’s relationship with Kate is getting the most notice. Vis-a-vis Meghan, Kate is no victim. There is no excusing her behavior toward Meghan.
But if people are being sympathetic toward Kate here, it’s because I think many of us did not realize just how dark and controlled life in the Firm was. I think back to how this family broke Diana (mentally and physically), and how terrified she continued to be after her divorce that she would lose her kids or be in danger. Diana was independently wealthy, aristocratic and arguably the most beloved woman in the world. Maybe we thought things had shifted since then. Meghan’s interview made it clear they hadn’t. What choices or support would Kate have if she left? Her own family prepped and sent her into this life. Meghan has a loving (non social-climbing) mother, friends, and Harry, knows how to live and thrive on her own, and still her description of how isolated and unsupported she felt is heartbreaking.
My jaw hit the ground when she said Kate was a good person.
Same. This trash person didn’t speak about the allegations. That is not a good person in my book, at all.
The laziest royal for a decade now loves to spend her life vacationing – too bad she won’t be getting any invites to Montecito.
If Kate went to Meghan and Harry, asked for help getting George, Charlotte, Louis and herself out of there, they would provide it in a heartbeat. But Kate is in this way deeper than Meghan and trained since birth to go after William. My husband calls her “The Empty Suit.” She will never leave and is too brainwashed and insulated at this point.
Ok it’s just aired in the uk. I’ve just finished watching it. Omg!! I do have a question for those in America how long was the whole programme? I thought it was suppose to be 2 hours but it was only 1hr 45 mins with ads. There was a bit I saw online where Meghan says ‘waity katie’ which wasn’t in the uk version. Did Itv cut the show down?
It was 2 hours and she did mentioned Waity Katy in the contact that tabloids went after Kate but it wasn’t the same.
I thought so, but I don’t think in was in the version I watched. I reckon itv did cut out a chunk of it.
I think Waity Katy may have been from the CBS morning show clips today. Could be wrong, losing track. Maybe ITV had fewer ads last night. CBS had quite a lot.
Yes, the Waity Katy clip was from the interview with Oprah this morning.
The Waity Katie bit was in the extras released this morning on the CBS Morning News.
CBS aired it over 2 hours with ads but there were a lot of ads. Oprah said the interview was cut down to 1 hour 25 minutes so perhaps ITV aired fewer commercials.
The waity katy bit where Meghan says there is a difference between being rude and racism was one of the extra scenes aired this morning on CBS This Morning.
Kate is absolute TRASH in my book for not speaking up about the false allegations against Meghan. How could you do that to your sister in law? Kate is trash. Period.
With how M said the institution is one person, and something like there’s a couple others – who are they? Is their authority beyond Queen, Charles & William?
At best, Kate’s days are probably a haze of vodka and xanax.
I’m not exaggerating when I say the way one makes it through this kind of life are by being drunk and unaware of what’s going on most of the time.
Kate is one hard woman who is not nice in the least.
IMO, Meghan/Harry was speaking to ONE person, The Queen. It was if they finally had the opportunity to lay it all bear to her. It’s as if they said to her we tried to reach you, we tried we tried so we had no choice but to go this route. Ultimately I think the Queen will offer a distant olive branch to them. She will punish them of course but she will acknowledge their pain and express her undying love and support. The Queen will survive this. Charles and William want…Harry/Meghan know this.
I’m sorry, but this Kate as victim narrative lots of people here are trying to float is the same as the Melania as victim narrative we heard for 4 years. Finding out Kate let this false story spread, even in that Tattler article she cooperated with? The Flybe stunt? Carole taking side snipes at Meghan? Commonwealth Day 2020?
Those are all “I really don’t care. Do you?” moments. But alas, when white women do malicious dirt, they are never held accountable for their actions. They are always the real victims of something.
Hard pass.
Exactly, Lanie! Kate’s white tears helped to stoke the continuing flame of racial animus. Every time one of these racists heard that story, they condemned Meghan. The hatred grew and grew and one word from Kate could have squashed all of this, but I doubt it would have been believed. The Angry Black Woman trope had worked too well to demonize Meghan & uplift Kate.
This site has become boring for people who don’t give a shit about the royals.
I’ve never liked kate. Selfish, boring, embarassing.
No sympathy for Kate. She has been a mean girl since Meghan came into the family. Kate deserves every negative exposure she gets. There was a picture of her driving out in the public & her facial expression didn’t look too happy.