Matt Lauer was fired from NBC News/Today in late November 2017. He was outed as a rapist, a sexual predator, a serial sexual harasser and a completely disgusting man. Savannah Guthrie was his Today Show cohost at the time, and it was widely believed that Lauer hand-picked Guthrie soon after shoving out Ann Curry. But before all of that, Lauer’s most fruitful on-screen partnership was with Katie Couric. They sort of redefined the morning show co-anchor format and for years, they beat everyone in the ratings. As more of Couric’s memoir, Going There, is excerpted, I think I have a better understanding of why Lauer and Couric’s partnership was so successful. They’re birds of a feather, and they both hate women. So, the NY Post has some quotes from Couric’s book about Matt Lauer and they’re just as bad as I expected them to be.
What Lauer told her: Katie Couric wrote in the book that Lauer allegedly said that sometimes women came into his office “crying,” and he worried that if they sat next to him on the sofa, he “can’t even put [his] arm around them.” The former anchor said she tried to “imagine such a scene taking place” and advised Lauer that “he cannot do that — you cannot put your arm around them.”
Couric says one woman told her about Lauer’s sexual harassment: Couric goes on to claim one woman confided in her after she received an inappropriate email from Lauer following a segment with biographer Kitty Kelley for her tell-all book on the Bush family in September 2004. A female producer who retold the story to Couric said she reached out to Lauer to congratulate him on the combative interview. The unnamed producer said that Lauer asked if she was “trying to butter him up” in an email. When she said that was not the case, as Couric wrote, Lauer reportedly responded offering to “show her” how to butter him up and suggested she “spread it on her thighs.” Couric also wrote that the producer told her that he proceeded to invite her into his office, requesting she wears a “skirt that came off easily.”
Couric says that everybody was having sex at the office: This was all part of a culture where sex and affairs were rife in the workplace, Couric said, nothing that she later learned about “a secret office they called ‘the Bunker.’” Couric alleged that only an unnamed “male anchor” had the key to use it for “one-on-one encounters, and I don’t mean interviews,” she wrote.
She quotes Lauer too: “’This MeToo stuff feels like it’s getting kind of out of control,’” Lauer reportedly told her. “’It feels like a witch hunt.’” She added that she thought Lauer was “worried about a lack of due process, people’s livelihoods and reputations being destroyed.”
She heard some rumors: She heard office “scuttlebutt” that Lauer had had a fling at the 2014 Sochi Olympics. In 2018, Brooke Nevils, a former NBC producer in Sochi, accused Lauer of raping her in his Sochi hotel room, prompting his exit from “Today.” Although Couric initially thought it was “gross” that Lauer was cheating on his now ex-wife Annette, and taking advantage of a young staffer, she added: “The general rule at the time was, ‘It’s none of your business. A don’t-ask-don’t-tell culture where anything goes, and everything did.” Couric wrote in her book that she assumed it was a “consensual fling” and didn’t “consider talking to the young employee” for fear of “embarrassing” her.
A rumor about Lauer’s ex-wife: Couric also wrote in the book, out Oct. 26, that she also heard “rumors” that Annette Lauer had called the control room one morning looking for her husband and demanding the phone number of a TV anchor he had been linked with.
She’s not abandoning Lauer: But when Lauer was fired, Couric did reach out to him, calling him a “decent man” whom she felt “heartless to abandon.” After initially texting with him after his NBC exit, she couldn’t bring herself to keep the friendship up, noting she’s “sad” he thinks she “betrayed him.” “But he betrayed me, too, by how he behaved behind closed doors at the show we both cared about so much,” she said.
She spoke to Lauer’s victims: She also claimed in her book that she “connected” with “women Matt damaged” and was able to “hear the shame and humiliation in their voices…I suspect they’ll be dealing with this for the rest of their lives.”
What the actual f–k is all of this??? Matt Lauer harassed, abused and raped women within the NBC News environment. Couric likely did not know the extent of it, but she clearly – and by her own description – had an idea of Lauer’s predatory, indecent and harassing behavior. And she still called him after he was fired (for rape!!) and describes him as a “decent man”? And the way she talks about the women he hurt is disgusting too. It’s like she’s getting off on their degradation.
Photos courtesy of Avalon Red, Backgrid.
She’s quite the little monster isn’t she. Proof that public image is just a mirage.
This can’t really be from her book right? Does she have no self awareness?
I’m both shocked and delighted at how she’s outed herself as such a charmless, venomous, misogynistic, opportunistic, rape apologist. She really thinks she’s something else, doesn’t she? Lord knows what drove her need to burn ALL THE BRIDGES but girl has gone full Thelma and Louise. Lovely to see the reception she’s getting for her “revelations”.
Is she trying to blow up her career and legacy with this memoir or what? You’d think an editor at some point would’ve been like “uh, this book reveals you to be a horrible human being, are you sure you want to release it?”
This reads like she knows a bunch of this stuff is going to come out about her and she wants to get in front of it.
Oh, it’s coming out alright….but it is SHE who is putting it out there, in her OWN words!
How in ANY world can she thinks this makes *her* look good?
I’ve never seen someone bomb their own ship in quite this way. It’s amazing to watch and I couldn’t be happier that it’s Katie Couric.
Oh, you’ve seen plenty of people do it. They’ve just been cis white men who know there probably won’t be any repercussions. And often, they’re absolutely right.
The media still operates this way. She has no idea she is being horrible because it is the lived reality of people in her profession.
Wow, Katie Couric has no self-awareness whatsoever.
Well, Katie Couric certainly comes off as being unable to read the room. Was this included to generate sales of the memoir? If she thought that shrugging off her own awareness of Lauer’s gross behavior with an “it was just the culture at the network” excuse was going to earn her any points, then she deserves to take a seat in the corner with Phylicia Rashad and do some serious thinking about what kind of example they are setting for women, really for all humans, by stanning so hard for their former “work husbands.” If these two don’t have anything constructive to add to the conversation, maybe they should stay quiet.
We’ve spent generations trying to play by the rules of patriarchy, and a few women were able to do it–at the cost of their souls. We need to play by our own rules so we’re not corrupted by success.
So true.
i dunno, while i appreciate what you’re trying to say here, i don’t buy into the idea that women win success by selling their souls and success corrupts women
while it’s possible that katie is successful *because* she’s horrible, it’s equally possible that she’s successful *despite* being toxic
and while it’s possible that she was a sweetheart who became corrupted by success, it’s more likely that she was a jerk from the word go and would have been a jerk even if she amounted to nothing
if we’re gonna play by our own rules, we gotta question if these narratives about the “price of success” were ever true
NCWoman didn’t say that women could only win success by selling their souls, she said that many of the women who decided to play by the patriarchy’s rules sold their souls. And reading these excerpts and how it sounds like Couric would definitely hold another woman down, I’d have to agree with NCWoman.
True. It’s definitely a choice, whether someone is a success story or not. Some women are just crappy human beings period. But I agree with point about those rules getting us nowhere as a society.
I that’s BS, because it presumes that women all start out as decent and some of them get “corrupted” by the patriarchy. Here’s the truth – some women are just awful humans. They’d be awful regardless of where they work, the money they have, etc. They’re just lousy people. Katie sounds like one of them. If Katie were a middle manager in the Midwest somewhere, she would have been backbiting and undercutting her subordinates because that’s who she is. Let’s not make excuses for those who don’t deserve them.
exactly
THIS!
What a horrible human being.
Yes, a horrible human being who lies. Brooke Nevins was an@lly taped with no lube while she said no and crying into a pillow. She bled for days and still has PTSD over the rape, being shunned and loss of the career she cherished. It is in Farrow’s book, Katie has to know this.
On the other side of the spectrum is Meredith Viera. When Brooke told Meredith what happened, Meredith insisted she lawyer up and go to HR. Meredith also felt bad she hadn’t realized what had transpired without being told and she was supportive. Katie’s way wasn’t “the only way” to survive, she is just a sh!tty person.
I’ve met Meridith in a working capacity and she is lovely and so gracious. Katie Couric is trash.
How do I say this?
Look up White Woman in the dictionary and you will find a picture of Katie.
She is making Phyllis Schlafly look demure.
A woman who is ruthless in business is nothing like Schlafly. Not even close.
Aunt Lydia on steriods–Handmaids Aunt Lydia, not Testament redeemed Aunt Lydia
You’re joking, right???
Schafley worked outside the home. She was on the road spewing her brand of dangerous a good bulk of the year.
She was a business.
Schlafly was a religious zealot and an apparatchik of the far right. That’s nothing like a TV journalist.
What? No, Katie Couric is showing herself to be a cruel, selfish, horrible human being. Nowhere in the dictionary is that the definition of ‘white woman’. Just stop.
+1
That’s definitely not how you say it.
Couric’s callous attitude toward other women has nothing to do with her race.
So the morning show wasn’t fiction?
This is what I was thinking! My goodness—that show is too real.
I’m thinking they have a former Today Show staffer/producer in the writing room. The truth is too close.
Mitch even has “The Button” in his office.
Only fiction is the part where Anniston’s character stands up to everyone I guess
Katie must know that people will make the comparison to the show: she supplied her own answer to the question, “did she know?” She knew and ignored it because she didn’t want to “embarrass” the rape survivor…wow, couldn’t come up with anything less culpable than that. Hard to believe this lady interviewed people on camera and asked “hard questions” for a living.
So glad this memoir is validating everything I ever said about her. One question though–is she besties with Ghislane Maxwell?
When people ask how these men get away with this for so long, part of it is women like her that are willing to enable, look the other way, and provide a shield for them.
Yeah. It goes to show that you can offer up garden variety sleezyness as a cover for really, really dark stuff. One thing we’ve learned from all of this is that if you have an office where lots of people are having consensual affairs that are “nobody’s business,” it’s really easy to get away with raping people.
I think we should not ignore the countless men who look away and who probably know even more because of the bro-culture. I do not think the real enablers as in the people in charge of the show were female. As a matter of fact I think the lack of women in positions of power contributes to women feeling that they have to become “one of the boys” in order not to be excluded professionally.
She’s a terrible person. It’s clear she saw no problem with Matt Lauer preying on women.
aaaaand this was what I was waiting for after that horrible first excerpt – of course, a woman who felt she had to keep other women down in her scramble to top conveniently ignored, excused and minimized sexual abuse by male colleagues
she’s a monster
Couric reminds me exactly of the women Adrienne Rich describes in “When We Dead Awaken”—the ones who achieve “special woman” status and are so insecure and territorial about their token presence in the boys’ club that they undermine any woman who manages to get a foot on the ladder, too. “Patriarchy poisoning. Not just for dudes!” I think it’s gotten a bit better in recent years, and there have always been women “sisters” who are clear exceptions, but some of the most egregious malfuckery I’ve experienced in my career has been directly at the hands of older women who felt professionally threatened. In a landscape of scarcity, those who should have common cause will often eat their own. Very sad.
Thank you for sharing your experience. I’m sorry you’ve had to put up with that. That problem you mentioned- trying to earn status as a respected ‘special woman’ in the boys’ club by treating other girls and women badly-is often spoken of as if it’s something that will just magically stop after a few years or a decade or two of adulthood. But really, people of all ages are capable of it. You see it in the backlash to a lot of today’s causes and movements too. In their distorted worldview, modern women and others not accepting certain behaviors is just a bunch of divas saying they’re special. They don’t want to understand that those behaviors toward certain groups of people just shouldn’t have become the norm in the first place, and need to be stopped.
At this point I am wondering if this is a Matt Damon way of getting ahead of a story she knew was coming out. You can’t cancel me if I cancel myself. Other than that or just blatant narcissism, I cannot understand why you would be so open about your abusive behavior.
Matt was harassing the women that Katie was always worried would take her job, so why would she interfere? I went from she seem okay to she is revolting the longer she was on the Today show. My instinct was not wrong, she really is revolting.
She really is revolting.
Wow….I mean who does she think will read this and come away thinking she is some kind of hero or female example to aspire to? She is so deluded she somehow thinks she comes across as likable. I never liked her before, but I loathe her now. She seems like a legitimately terrible person.
On another topic, The Morning Show seems to have pegged this story from the get go. Who knew the show was so close to reality?
Katie and most (all?) women had to endure this sh*t if they wanted to keep their jobs and climb the ladder. The media industry has always been awful for women, pitting them against each other if they wanted to get ahead. Katie came out on top because she did what she had to do — turn a blind eye to gross men and undercut other women who could/would have replaced her in a second. It sucks and yes, makes her a shitty person in a way, but also allowed her to survive/thrive in a game created by men, for men.
Pre the Me Too movement, any woman who became that successful had to be cut-throat and sell their soul to get ahead. If she continues to be that shitty post-Me Too, then we can trash her all we want. In the meantime, blame the men who gleefully created the culture that pitted women against each other and added locks to the doors of their f— offices.
Yes. People are judging her story from what we know to be true in 2021. She set out to have a career, not be a crusader for women’s rights. She’s never claimed to be RBG. Sexual harassment was not the crime it is today. Society (men) know better now even if they don’t do better.
In the late 1980’s my parents’ friends’ daughter worked for a Japanese company in New York. She was an administrative assistant. I have no idea if she had a business degree or not Her boss asked her to bring him coffee. She told him to get it himself. He slapped her. (Now I’m wondering if there was more to the story, but I digress.) She sued and won millions. My point is we knew physically assaulting an employee was illegal 30 years ago, but sexual harassment was the norm. Katie is telling her story. If anything, it can be used as an example of how not to behave.
i address this up thread but believing that women *have* to be cutthroat to get ahead is part of the problem and the advances we’ve made in recent years didn’t come out of a vacuum – they happened because women *chose* to stick together in spite of incentives to do otherwise
ill save my respect for women who were trailblazers without burning everyone else around them
I agree with what you are saying, but certain industries have always been more cutthroat than others. NBC was obviously a shark tank. Remember this was before network tv news became unimportant. Katie shouldn’t be judged for choosing to not just survive, but thrive in a shark tank. And definitely save your admiration for women like RBG who deserve all the praise they get.
@Fitmom
I disagree she knew what was happening to her “competition” and look the other way because it suited her. There is a reason why accessory to murder is criminal offense. Did they commit the crime no, but they knew about it and did nothing to stop it or worn the victim .
I’m not disagreeing that the industry is competitive, I’m taking issue with the narrative that being competitive necessarily means being *cutthroat.* There is a difference and conflating the two is what perpetuates abuse.
People who perpetuate toxic cultures and punch down to get ahead should absolutely be judged for that.
@Ellev
See Jane Pauley’s story. She basically was deemed old and replaced with Debbie Norville. The culture at NBC was toxic. She would be replaceable if she were deemed a troublemaker. She wasn’t willing to sacrifice her career on principal. Men in power have a way of doing what they want even if it’s in a round about way. Really.
I worked on Wall Street – you didn’t have to be totally cut-throat, but you had to put up with a lot, keep your mouth shut, stay focused and pick your battles. There were no women to “choose” to be together – you were alone and not in charge of the rules. Any complaints and you were dropped down the ladder, any real challenges and you had to be prepared to leave the business forever – which is what happened to me. Not that I’m complaining at all – I learned a lot and it turned out to be a good thing that I was always an outsider. I was able to move on easily to something else.
What kind of dirt do people have on her I wonder. This is definitely someone trying to get ahead of something
Everyone is that business knows exactly what is going on, at all times. I worked in media for many years, and nothing can be kept a secret.
Watch Mrs. America on Hulu. That will change your mind about Schlafly.
I propose that we introduce the ‘Katie’ as being someone who’s even worse than a ‘Karen’
noooooooo
Is this the part where we blame women for something a man did while not listening to the woman at all? That story is so old though.
I was a lowly executive assistant at a media company in NYC during the late 90s-early 2000s, and I think the entire media world in New York knew about Matt Lauer. I went to a dinner with a bunch of assistants from various networks and listened to several of them warn one girl off from accepting a job that would put her in the Today Show orbit because of Lauer. It’s not a surprise that Couric knew, though I am thoroughly disgusted at the overall tone of the excerpts from her book and wondering what the hell she was thinking. I think she’s trying to come off like she’s laying it all on the table but it ended up more like she is being flippant about all of her poor, cowardly choices.
Also discussed at this dinner: Les Moonves.
I re-read the middle section multiple times and I’m trying to understand Katie’s point. Is she saying that someone told her about an incident but she STILL thought it was all consensual? I mean that’s just wow. Is she trying to make the point that until someone told her about the abuse that she only believed he was cheating consensually? I mean we can all deduce that the work culture was toxic and trash. This is disappointing but this should have been figured out years ago, that Katie is a horrid person.
She heard in 2014 that Lauer had a “fling” at the Olympics and assumed it was consensual. In 2018 the woman came forward to say that she was raped.
Ah, ok. Thank you, Kate. I was trying to grasp where she fell in this because if you have a work culture that condones cheating you won’t automatically think “oh that’s a product of sexual misconduct” it would appear normal but screwed up in your world. Ok.
Crazy, but this posting reminds me of Sparkle, who had her entire life upended after reporting R. Kelly after she saw the video of him and her then-14 year old niece. The world can be incredibly unkind to women who don’t play by men’s rules, and elevate others that turn a blind eye. I’m cautiously optimistic that the tide is turning.
So… Jennifer Aniston’s character in The Morning Show is based on Couric, right?
That’s what I was thinking as well.
Yeah, my jaw dropped — it’s basically 1:1.
I understand the urge to judge her and she probably is not a particularily good person but we should not forget that she did not create the culture at NBC. There were a lot of men who probably knew a lot more than her who shut up about it and that is much worse. Also where where is the judgement for the people in charge? I feel like we do ourselves a disservice by focussing our dissapointment on the women instead of the men who created the strucutres in the first place and for whom it would have been easier to act.
She didn’t create the culture at NBC, but it sure seems that on her upward trajectory/journey she forgot how to be human.
Persephone she probably could have done more but let’s be honest if she had gone to the enablers and complained they would not have changed the culture but they would have made things unpleasant for her and probably replaced her. I think it’s easy to say we would have intervened as this is a theoretical scenario for us. When faced with the reality of losing one’s job things often look different though.
Basic, I actually lost a job because I complained about sexual harassment. So YES. I would have. A lot of women at my workplace stayed silent and submissive and I don’t blame them entirely but it was embarrassing to watch. And guess what, a LOT of women lost jobs because of this vile culture at lots of workplaces. This harassment by powerful men is designed to keep women out of work and out of money and out of power. Just because Katie Couric had a successful career doesn’t mean she wasn’t an anomaly. She isn’t solely responsible for the rape culture at her workplace — no one has said that. But if you know or suspect a crime is being committed you ARE responsible to report it. And yes, sexual harassment is a crime and rape is a crime and forcing people to have sex with you or lose their jobs is also a crime. I am not here for downplaying violence toward women because it is truly a crime and a moral and ethical failure and just because it happens all the time and people (MEN) get away with it all the time does NOT make any of it okay or normal nor is it okay or normal to be an accomplice or complicit in a crime.
She is claiming she didn’t know — she is one of the most prominent and highest paid American journalists of her generation and she didn’t see what was right in front of her? Let’s be real. She knew. She completely knew and didn’t do a thing about it. She is just trying to put forth every possible excuse.
Couric’s lack of self awareness is pretty shocking. I think it would have been easier to understand if she talked about the pressure to keep her job because she became a single mom after her husband died so young. I have no doubt this played into her decision to go along with the toxic environment and keep her mouth shut. Instead she comes off as a callous apologist for a rapist. It’s a very strange tone for a memoir. She’s blowing up her personal and professional life for what, to sell a few books? She doesn’t need the money, so I wonder what is driving this need to unburden herself in such a destructive manner?
I think the problem with the excerpts is not just the facts she is stating, but her emotions. There is no regret, apology, empathy, understanding. She comes across as cold, uncaring, and selfish. She was in a toxic work environment and at a time when cutthroat behavior was needed by women to get ahead. But she doesn’t say, ‘I felt horrible that I couldn’t mentor other women’, or ‘I now realize Matt wasn’t having consensual sex, but raping women and he should be in jail’. She is telling us about awful behavior and agreeing with it!
Basic, I was thinking the same thing. Not making excuses for her, but knowing (what we know now) about the incredibly toxic, male-dominated culture at NBC, it’s very possible she went along with the “don’t ask, don’t tell policy,” not only for her own self-preservation (as a single, working mom), but also in a misguided attempt to help Lauer’s accusers keep their jobs. She knew what would happen to those women if they made waves – they’d be ignored, dismissed and likely fired. As a woman who experienced a very similar corporate culture in the 90s and early 2000s,
it can’t be overstated how different things are today for women in the workplace (thankfully!).
Having said that, I’m astonished – even shocked by her candor, which is why I’m withholding judgment for now. It’s obviously in the publisher’s best financial interest to advance-release some of the most salacious parts of the book without providing context. Unlike many here, I used to like her on the Today show and I really hope she doesn’t wind up being an unrepentant asshole.
I don’t particularly care for her. I’m more interested in how the Daily Mail(in the other post) obtained a copy of the manuscript-she didn’t give them an exclusive-per the story. Same with the NY Post saying they obtained a copy of the book. Story by Sara Nathan who has connections to the Daily Mail Neither of these tabloidesque outlets would be ones to give advance-release excerpts to.imo
A lot of this being shared is problematic for KC. It all could be in the book or framed completely different in the book. With all the misinformation these two outlets put out, it would be kind of funny to find out if a false manuscript was shared with someone suspected of being a leaker.
Like a lot of other corporate cultures, NBC News was bad. They put the kibosh on Ronan Farrow’s Weinstein story that the New Yorker ended up publishing.
Some people here are referring to Katie Couric as a single, working mom, like she’s Jane Smith. She was not just some anonymous working mom, she was Katie Couric, a woman who was senior to Matt Lauer when they worked together. She was anchoring the Today Show with Bryant Gumbel, while Matt was doing the news on that show – like Ann Curry later did. Her show both w/ Gumbel and later with Lauer were juggernauts in morning news. As such, she was well respected, well paid, and had a fair amount of clout.
Now, she did not physically rape or sexually assault those women on that show but she knew a lot of what was going on and said nothing, and did nothing. She even acknowledged that in the excepts above, so stop trying to use her gender as a shield.
Okay this sends me over the edge. We all know she’s a major bitch and selfish, but this is different. You can’t say and do shit like the above with a cutesy dimpled and toothy smile and not be the vilest creature on the planet. I put up with a lot of crap in my day from men, and I let a lot of shit slide because yeah, the boys will be boys fracked up mindset reigned supreme. But I NEVER just stood by and watched other young girls and women struggle with harassment of any kind. Being complicit would have meant so many terrible ideals. And not every woman has a mouth on them like I do, so yeah, being quiet was never an option. The fact she divulged this in her book is, on so many levels, bewildering. F*ck her. F*ck her complicit ass. And f*ck all remaining years she has left to roam this planet. She deserves nothing positive for the rest of her days. God I’m heated to boiling point.
She’s gonna go on an 11 city tour to talk about this book?? And presumably do interviews to promote it?? And you know that she, as a star journalist, had a say/approval over which excerpts were published in advance. So….she thinks this is juicy?? That her outing herself as a terrible person is going to drive pre-order sales?? I am stunned by how vile she is and shocked by her arrogance. I can’t wait to read the book reviews.
I know this is a tangent, but good lord, The Morning Show on Apple TV+ is barely fiction, apparently?!?! edit: Cee mentioned the same thing upthread
Someone’s got some serious dirt on her or she’s dying and this is a deathbed confession.
No one is that “perky” without a hell of a dark side.
💯💯💯💯
What is couric thinking?!
I could never stand her and now I know why. What a bitter hag.
I hate how she described the victims as shamed and humiliated. Their abusers should wear those tags.
$$$ worth more than integrity……
No one should be fooled into believing that Katie didn’t know what was going on in regards to sexual harassment at NBC while she was as there.
She’s credited with saying “Who did Diane Sawyer have to blow to get a certain interview.”
The better question is who did Katie blow all those years to keep her job. I’m sure the list is long and noteworthy.