Queen Elizabeth’s death certificate was released this week, which surprised me. In America, death certificates are public documents and anyone can access them. But surely it’s different in the UK, especially with royalty? I guess not. So, here’s QEII’s death certificate:
Occupation:
Her Majesty The Queen pic.twitter.com/4J8TCs9QLn— Peter Hunt (@_PeterHunt) September 29, 2022
She passed away at 3:10 pm, and they didn’t announce it until three hours later. I get that they had to inform the rest of the family before they announced it, but jeez, I really did believe that they were supposed to announce it faster than they did. Also: on a technical level, wasn’t her surname Mountbatten-Windsor? Wasn’t that decision made by QEII at some point? And yes, I guess we’re going with “old age” as the cause of death. It was the same with Prince Philip – the death certificate isn’t going into the nitty-gritty of exactly what was going on, even though several people said “cancer” for both Elizabeth and Philip.
Meanwhile, I read this story in the Telegraph and I found it slightly amusing. There are already people talking about the “need” to build monuments and statues for QEII, and one of the proposals is that a QEII statue should be erected on the “Fourth Plinth” in Trafalgar Square. The Fourth Plinth is where, for decades now, different artists have exhibited their public work. Originally, there was supposed to be a statue of William IV, but that never came to pass. Currently, London Mayor Sadiq Khan has used the space for a revolving door of exhibitions highlighting trans issues, anti-colonialism, racial justice. Well, Mayor Khan says that right now, he has zero plans to disrupt those pieces of public art just to erect a statue of Elizabeth. Funny, right? I wonder how many monuments and statues will go up in the next few years though.
Photos courtesy of Avalon Red.
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- Queen Elizabeth II cuts a cake to celebrate the start of the Platinum Jubilee during a reception in the Ballroom of Sandringham House, which is the Queen’s Norfolk residence. The Queen came to the throne 70 years ago this Sunday when, on February 6 1952, the ailing King George VI – who had lung cancer – died at Sandringham in the early hours.,Image: 659601877, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: , Model Release: no, Credit line: Joe Giddens / Avalon
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- Queen Elizabeth II cuts a cake to celebrate the start of the Platinum Jubilee during a reception in the Ballroom of Sandringham House, which is the Queen’s Norfolk residence. The Queen came to the throne 70 years ago this Sunday when, on February 6 1952, the ailing King George VI – who had lung cancer – died at Sandringham in the early hours.,Image: 659602010, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: , Model Release: no, Credit line: Joe Giddens / Avalon
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- Queen Elizabeth II leaves Sandringham House, which is the Queen’s Norfolk residence, after a reception with representatives from local community groups to celebrate the start of the Platinum Jubilee. The Queen came to the throne 70 years ago this Sunday when, on February 6 1952, the ailing King George VI – who had lung cancer – died at Sandringham in the early hours.,Image: 659635986, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: , Model Release: no, Credit line: Joe Giddens / Avalon
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- Queen Elizabeth II during an audience with President of Switzerland Ignazio Cassis at Windsor Castle. Picture date: Thursday April 28, 2022.,Image: 686853114, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: NO UK USE FOR 48 HOURS- Fee Payable Upon reproduction – For queries contact Avalon sales@Avalon.red London +44 20 7421 6000 Los Angeles +1 310 822 0419 Berlin +49 30 76 212 251 Madrid +34 91 533 42 89, Model Release: no, Credit line: Avalon.red / Avalon
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- Queen Elizabeth II waits in the Drawing Room before receiving Liz Truss for an audience at Balmoral, Scotland, where she invited the newly elected leader of the Conservative party to become Prime Minister and form a new government.,Image: 719993378, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: , Model Release: no, Credit line: Jane Barlow / Avalon
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- Queen Elizabeth II waits in the Drawing Room before receiving Liz Truss for an audience at Balmoral, Scotland, where she invited the newly elected leader of the Conservative party to become Prime Minister and form a new government.,Image: 719993385, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: , Model Release: no, Credit line: Jane Barlow / Avalon
Well she was very old.
@GIRLNINJA
“Old Age” is a process, not a cause. Causes are the medical terminologies that leads to the stopping of the heart, when her death occurred at 3:10 pm.
I had nine family members die from the effects of Covid-19 and
I’m telling you right here she died from the symptoms of Longterm Covid-19, initially given to her by her namesake Charles. Make of it as you will.
Agreed Long-Covid weakened her immune system and old age did the rest.
But no coroner will record that due to the political fall out by the covid deniers. Liz is too high profile for them to tell the truth.
Because she was the Queen i heard that Phillip was in charge of family affairs to at least retain some of his ‘manhood.’ I am surprised he agreed to Mounbatten-Windsor.
I don’t think there was much of a choice. Mountbatten-Windsor was the compromise.
You know, keeping the “Windsor” name was SO much more important that any other–being chosen by God, and all.
USA death certificates tend to give a cause of death even in the very elderly other than just old age
Yes. Typically you will see “Natural Causes” listed as the cause of death for someone elderly.
The same is supposed to happen in the UK but they don’t seem to follow rules the same way for the royals.
A regular 96 year old British person wouldn’t just have old age written there. There would be more specifics.
Not true: my 96 year old gran, who definitely wasn’t privileged, had “old age” listed as the cause of death on her death certificate.
Current guidelines for UK medical practitioners state it should be rarely given as the sole cause of death.
That’s doesn’t mean never and it also doesn’t rule out that the doctor for the queen would apply the rare circumstances for a variety of reasons including pressure to keep things quiet, as they do with the exception in making wills public for royals.
Iirc in the UK “old age” is very often used for those deaths of over 80 year olds if there are no preexisting illnesses (such as cancer, etc). It’s not usual in the USA, but its very common in the UK.
This very thing was just discussed on the Maintenance Phase podcast this week. According to guidance documents from the NHS/govt, over the age of 80, “old age” can be listed as a cause of death when there is no autopsy or suspicious circumstances.
Also the doctor needs to have been providing the primary care for a lengthy period of time and there is no other possible reason for the death.
“There are already people talking about the “need” to build monuments and statues for QEII,”
Her face is on their currency. Her portrait is EVERYWHERE. Do really need monuments and statues too? It’s all part of the mass brainwashing to get the public to believe that the royals are necessary and part of their DNA. They would probably waste millions on them as their citizens starve and freeze to death as their shit filled rivers roll past them.
Her face won’t be in the currency for long, it will be replaced by Charles’. But I agree that there is no need for monuments and statues. Hopefully this monarchic fervour will die out soon.
Right. I’m just saying it’s not likely she will EVER be forgotten. There is no danger in that happening. She was the longest reigning monarch in history. She’s part of the history books in perpetuity. The UK doesn’t need to waste millions of dollars on statues and monuments.
I think King Louie 14th has the title as the longest reigning monarch in history?
Lady D- he certainly was, but he became king at age 4, lol.
Old age seems pretty generic to me, but sometimes that’s just what it is. It sounds like her body just gave out.
so if she passed at 3:10, then only Anne and Charles were there. William et al arrived around 4 in Scotland, wonder if they found out once they landed or if they were notified in the air? But it definitely seems that she was NOT dead when they took off, right?
Some articles report that the plane with William and co was delayed and so it’s possible they were told even before they took off. They certainly looked like they knew by the time they were driving into Balmoral.
I also think they knew before they took off, I can’t imagine a flight from London to Scotland would take that long? An hour, hour and a half? So if she died at 10:10 and they arrived around 11-1130 (I’m thinking East Coast time here because that’s as I was watching it, LOL) then it makes sense they knew before they took off.
The flight from RAF Northolt left at 3.50pm. So very likely they knew. It also suggests that there would be been plenty of time to inform Harry before he departed for Aberdeen (if anyone was inclined to do so).
Yes, @punkp, that is my question: did they inform Prince Harry of the Queen’s death before his flight from London left (approximately 2 and 1/2 hours after the queen died)? If they did not, and it appears as though they did not, that would really suck. The Palaces are trying to use Harry’s being in the air on the plane as an excuse for not being able to reach him but they had approximately two and a half hours before his flight even left London to let him know his Gran died and didn’t?
The Mountbatten-Windsor name is for descendants in the male line without ‘styles or titles’ whatever that means.
This is a smokescreen for what was really going on probably since she was mysteriously hospitalized. In the US, a death certificate must list a medically defined, specific cause of death even if there’s a lot going on. You may have ten known morbid or comorbid conditions, but a medically defined and specific one must be listed as the immediate cause of death. “Old age,” which is essentially meaningless, is not legally acceptable in the US. I went through this with my mother’s physicians when she died. The cause of death listed was to satisfy legal requirements even though she had several catastrophic, contributing problems. Not buying this BS for a second. Something was happening to her for probably quite a while that they stupidly want to hush up. Cui bono? Wouldn’t it serve the public better to understand her true medical state?
I agree. And if she *did* die of cancer imagine the potential for a push to get more funding for research, etc. That could really have done something good.
Not saying this is the case for the queen, but most seniors with cancer die with it not because of it.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the version they made public isn’t the full version. The UK also requires more explanation than this for any regular British person.
Her father,George VI died of cancer. I don’t think it was ever hushed up. I have a very elderly relative (98) . He has multiple things wrong with him, but basically his body is just shutting down. He sleeps most of the day and night. When he dies, it will essentially be of “old age”.
Sorry to hear about your relative, I hope that he goes peacefully in his seep.
Anyway, regardless of his age or number of conditions it’s still illegal to use the term ‘old age!’
Sara, you are absolutely correct by the official laws for England and Wales but I’m not sure about Scotland. ‘Old Age’ is not allowed to be used and when my mother died in 2006 there had to be three items listed.
We are definitely having the wool pulled over our eyes!
As always, the Brits will accept every stupidity and secrecy regarding the royal family.
Nobody will formally question this lame explanation as the cause of her death. Everybody, the hole system is in place or is invented as they go, to suit this family; every rule, every law is bent for them.
An old woman will always die AT old age. FROM old age is not the medical cause of her (and her husband’s) death.
But this is the UK. And in the UK, it is very common for people over the age of 80 with no serious health issues (like cancer) proceeding their deaths to have their cause of death listed as ‘old age’. Not everywhere works like the US, and it’s frustrating to see people needlessly speculating based on that expectation.
I worked in a morgue for years and have a degree in criminology. All my textbooks were from the US and it’s completely different in other countries. I’m not from the UK but I am from a commonwealth nation, and in my country old age is also listed as the cause of death when a person over 80 dies with no remarkable health issues prior to their death.
At some point she experienced cardiac death, and after that brain death. The specifics aren’t particularly relevant unless they are remarkable. If a person dies from an extremely common health issue in old age, they’re not going to always go into meticulous detail to find exactly what chain of events led to the event of death. She was elderly, her health had been failing since she had covid, and despite the political hoopla around covid it’s essentially just another form of infliuenza, which kills millions of elderly each year. It doesn’t have to be political, and it doesn’t have to be insidious.
My family is similar to this. They think that someone dying of a disease or issue is somehow a weakness. For example, I have no idea how my grandpa died. He had 15 children. The story I get is that “he took to his bed and eventually passed away.” As though him being human would lessen their extremely bizarre reverence for him. I said – you know even Jesus died of something. They didn’t like that 😂 but their father can’t be common enough to die of something other people die of. Or perhaps more to the point, they don’t want it know he died through their negligence and lack of follow through on medical care.
It’s all very cult like and bizarre.
Hm, it’d be a really good thing to know if he died of something that you might need to be screened for as well!
Although it’s a public record, many states have requirements in place to obtain a copy of a death certificate. You have to show proof of relationship and need for recent death certificates. In doing genealogical research, I’ve found some states have time requirements in place before they’ll release the record.
Erm, currently the fourth plinth in Trafalgar Square has a sculpture of John Chilembwe and European missionary John Chorley. Chilembwe led an uprising in 1915 against British colonial rule in Nyasaland. “He is wearing a hat, defying the colonial rule that forbade Africans from wearing hats in front of white people, and is almost twice the size of Chorley. By increasing his scale, the artist is elevating Chilembwe and his story.”
Going from that to the Queen would be a nope.
* I quoted the Mayor of London’s website.
Yeah, no. Dying of old age is not a thing. There has to be disease process present. What’s interesting to me about this is even though she’s gone, they’re still covering up what eventually killed her. Why can’t they just say it was cancer or cardiovascular disease or whatever it happened to be? What’s so terrible about dying of those things? But, frankly, I’m a little surprised the death certificate doesn’t list “mobility issues” as the cause of death. At least that would be consistent.
The royals love to play these games where one minute they expect everyone to stop their lives and mourn their mummy, and the next minute, we plebs aren’t even worthy of knowing why she died. They demand to be adored and celebrated, but they can’t be questioned.
My personal guess, something Covid related. She seems to have gone downhill ever since they admitted she had gotten Covid over the winter. Unfortunately, a bout with Covid seems to trigger a lot of other morbidities in even health elderly people.
I’m leaning toward covid also, but they don’t want the tabloids accusing someone of spreading it to her and endless blame.
Maybe? But remember she started pulling out of events last November, a few months before she had COVID. So maybe she was already declining and COVID just kind of pushed her along?
And wasn’t the overnight hospital stay sometime last September or October? Didn’t we hear about her being advised to cut back on alcohol around the same time? Can’t remember when the weight loss became apparent. So something else likely going on, before whatever impact Covid had.
Oh don’t be silly, of course dying of old age is a thing – no-one lives forever, eventually bodies just wear out.
It’s not literally a cause of death, obviously. But certain failures and processes are both normal and expected in the elderly and are seen as natural, because they are. Our DNA degrades over time and our bodies aren’t equipped to repair that damage longterm.
Autopsies are generally performed in specific circumstances, such as an unexplained death, an unnatural death, or sometimes as a control measure in hospitals. Autopsies are routine in certain situations but in the elderly, generally speaking, they are not. As such, they can’t list the specific sequence of events that lead to cardiac and brain death unless it’s very obvious, such as stroke or a massive cardiac event. In the UK in this instance, as she was over 80, they listed her cause of death as old age. At 96, that’s not unreasonable. I promise you that many a commoner has had their dear departed nan’s cause of death be listed as the same.
It’s not feasible to perform an autopsy on literally every elderly person who passes, especially those who were in failing health like the Queen, where death isn’t sudden and unexpected. Her medical team knew her declining health in far more detail than we did. It would be very undesirable to perform an autopsy on the Queen unless absolutely necessary. I mean, from the perspective of someone who respects the position and the institution (not me, them). Having been a morgue worker myself, they probably didn’t relish removing her organs and stuffing them back inside her in a plastic bag, it’s not exactly the most dignified thing in the world to be stripped naked and opened from sternum to groin.
If they’d needed an autopsy because she died completely unexpectedly or in a way that made no sense or was suspicious they absolutely would do one. But doing them on elderly people in failing health is seen as largely unnecessary in many countries. I don’t see why they’d open up the Queen to see exactly which event caused her death without just cause, same as any elderly person.
Gosh, I never would have guessed 🤷🏻♀️ but but but I heard that she died from listening to Meghan’s podcast.
I laughed out loud 🤣
I did too. Good one, Kittenmom.
Same!
I think they all went omg she died. How gauche. How common. It can’t be known she died from anything other than excellence!!!!
As messed up as it is, I think that is basically what happened.
Lol my thoughts exactly:
Cause of death – Archewell podcasts (all 12 of them)
Comorbidity 1: Harry’s memoir “FAFO”
2: Naming Camilla Queen Consort
3: Andrew’s incessant daily begging and whining, oops I mean loving visits
Seriously tho, I’ve always thought that she caught Covid from her idiot heir or his wife which led to her decline and subsequent death. The insistence on secrecy surrounding COD makes me think that’s right. Wouldn’t look good for rumors to swirl that the new king killed the Queen. But I’ve also heard rumors of cancer. The level of disrespect this family keeps showing to their *beloved” mother post death. Its just embarrassing. They just can’t be straightforward about anything!
More LOLs re: your first paragraph, Chantal.
It was Prince Andrew, in the castle, with the Corgis.
– A 90-something woman announces that after decades of having dogs, she’s done, wants no new ones.
– Her son goes ahead, defies that wish and presents her with not one but two puppies.
I’m going to pin the blame on Andrew 😉
Interestingly releasing cause of death and the timing of death certificates and making them public is quite different in Scotland vs England. It is public even for royals and released soon after death. She lost a lot of weight so my medical surmise is cancer metastatic to the bone, hence mobility issues.
One of the most agonizing ways to die out there. She did not appear to be suffering debilitating pain or hardcore painkiller use. My sister and I watched our mom bite into a piece of watermelon and heard her jaw snap in three places as it turned out. My mom didn’t notice.
I wonder if listing a human ailment like cancer would threaten TRF belief that they are ‘better’ than the rest of us. What’s the point of that ‘blue blood’ otherwise? 🙄 #abolishthemonarchy
Wait….so Meghan DIDN’T kill her?
That sound you hear is that of the very fabric of reality coming undone.
Twitter had tons of comments similar to yours and I am here for it. COD: old age ( they’ll never tell more) NOT the Oprah interview, Not any forth coming book, NOT the Sussexes relocation to California, NOT having Lilibet use her nickname, NOT from Meghan bully her or anyone else etc. None of the bullshit espoused in the press.
Now that 3:10 is probably the official time. I know folks said staff and others were in all black seemingly pretty early as if QE2 was already deceased but they were waiting on the official announcement. I don’t think they are forthcoming about much if it doesn’t fit their narrative…
So only Anne was there when the Queen died? Not Charles, William, Andrew etc.???
So she died before any of her traveling relatives arrived, but the announcement was deliberately timed to make it look like Harry was the only one who wasn’t with her at her deathbed. I really hope he’s done with them. Charles keeps dangling those titles because he wants both sons at his coronation, but I will be surprised if Harry is there.
According to the Operation London Bridge documents leaked a couple of years ago, they need to inform her family, the prime minister, the BCC and 14 heads of state, before they announce it to the general public. That’s what probably took all 3+ hours.
I meant the BBC, of course.
Mountbatten-Windsor was a compromise. The children were supposed to be Windsor but Philip objected. The bigger story about the Queen’s death is 3 hour gap between her death and Harry finding out. They let Harry fly up to Balmoral when the Queen was already dead.
I hope the family chooses to return just to the surname “Windsor”. Mountbatten-Windsor is a mouthful.
It already is Windsor for the vast majority of the family. Mountbatten-Windsor is only for Philip’s descendants. And out of his grandkids/great-grandkids only Archie, Lili, James and Louise are going to use it. Every one else either has/will have a title to use as their last name or has a different last name entirely.
And I feel like even for Louise she’s just referred to as Lady Louise Windsor for the most part. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out for James and his kids.
Do Earls and other aristos usually have last names? I know the Percys are the dukes of Northumberland, Rocksavage for Cholmondely 0 would it be James Mountbatten Windsor, Earl of Wessex?
@Becks1: Yeah a lot but not all have a different family name compared to their titles. Exceptions include the Spencers (their last name is Spencer and the Earl is Earl Spencer) and the Cholmondeley’s. David and Rose’s titles are Marquess and Marchioness of Cholmondeley but Cholmondeley is also their family last name. Rocksavage comes from David’s courtsey title that he had when he was heir (Earl of Rocksavage). Aristos will sometimes use their titles in lieu of last names. David was called “David Rocksavage” when he was heir because he was the earl as heir. Rocksavage is not the family last name.
And yes James’ legal last name will be Mountbatten-Windsor but once he’s Earl then he can be called and use “James Wessex” if he wants to.
I’d read* that some of the delay in informing Harry was that he was in the air and thus not reachable by phone. I mean, I guess they could have radioed the pilot, but it seems callous** to tell him of her death that way – it’s not like the news wouldn’t keep until he landed.
* So take it with a boatload of salt.
** King Charles’ legal name is Charles Phillip Petty Callous, so Harry’s feelings likely were not part of the calculus.
Makes sense considering she was you know, 96. Did she have another illness that may have contributed greatly or even wholly? Probably. But it also wouldn’t surprise me if she was just on a general slow decline over the last 18 months or something.
as a general rule if you’re 96 years old you die WITH cancer, not OF it.
Did anyone expect a “real” reason to be given? The royals are given a pass to live in secrecy — their wills are sealed for a century, their death certificates won’t reveal any real cause of death, they get super-injunctions against news stories, etc. And we know they will not admit to being anything but genetically perfect. The queen was never going to be seen using a walker. They will never admit to her having cancer. For all William and Kate like to pretend they care about mental health, they will never admit to needing therapy themselves (although it’s very obvious that they do). They will only ever present a false image of genetic perfection, because that’s the kind of shallow, arrogant, artificial people they are.
Exactly just like they try to hide that hemophilia was spread to every royal house in Europe from Queen Victoria
I feel like I’m repeating myself ad infinitum but this is a normal thing in the UK for elderly people over the age of 80. It’s not unique, it’s not unusual. Elderly people generally are not autopsied to ascertain the actual, specific cause of death, as it is natural for organs to fail and for certain biological processes to cease due to the decline of the body in old age. I don’t know why everyone assumes autopsies are done on everyone and everywhere has the same procedures as their home country but they are not and they do not. Former morgue worker, degree in criminology, etc. I’m no fan of the royal family and have no doubt they kept a lot about the Queen’s health private but this seems utterly normal.
If the statue isn’t a recreation of her stabbing this cake, then don’t bother.
+1
My paternal grandfather also died at 96. He died in his sleep, went to bed, didn’t wake up and as the queen, his death certificate mentions “old age”. more specifically “Related to old age”.
Of course, I’m neither from the USA nor the UK.
But I guess it is a possibility to just be registered “old age” as the cause of death.
My mother just passed away at 98. We have two different death certificates in Florida. One has the reason for her death and contributing medical conditions. These are used for financial institutions and life insurance. The second death certificate doesn’t list cause of death. That’s to shut down utilities and non-financial entities.
As always, the Brits will accept every stupidity and secrecy regarding the royal family.
Nobody will formally question this lame explanation as the cause of her death. Everybody, the hole system is in place or is invented as they go, to suit this family; every rule, every law is bent for them.
An old woman will always die AT old age. FROM old age is not the medical cause of her (and her husband’s) death.
Please don’t do this. Old age is listed as a cause of death commonly in many, many places in the world. This is for many reasons, but to simplify: 1) autopsies are invasive, and unneeded when a person is very old and in failing health because death is expected and doesn’t need a thorough investigation. 2) It would be an unrealistic strain on the time and resources of the people who perform autopsies to have to do them on every elderly person who dies.
Believe it or not, old age is a natural cause of death, even if there is a technical event or chain of events that causes the heart to stop and the brain to die. As we age, our DNA isn’t able to keep repairing the problems with it. In very, very simple terms we age because of this. Since we can’t repair our own cells, that means our organs begin to fail, our health fails, and eventually this will cause our death. This is a wholly natural and expected process. I am anti-monarchy but I am a former morgue worker with a degree in criminology, specific to death.