The Windsors’ line of succession was updated officially 48 hours after Queen Elizabeth II passed away in Scotland. Prince William and Kate’s new “Wales” titles were given to them in the line of succession, even though the investiture has not happened yet. As soon as QEII passed away, Prince Harry and Meghan’s children, Archie and Lilibet, became Prince and Princess. But those titles were not used in the line of succession. It’s giving petty, it’s giving racist. Anyway, weeks have passed since then and it’s one of the dumbest, pettiest and most racist royal stories out there: that King Charles is using Archie and Lilibet’s titles as some kind of bargaining chip. Just like the angst and tantrums about Harry’s memoir, all of the angst and tantrums about the Sussex kids’ titles are coming from Buckingham Palace and Kensington Palace. The latest is a piece in the Sunday Times, in which no news is broken and it’s just more of Charles bullying his two mixed-race grandchildren.
King Charles has not decided whether to allow his two youngest grandchildren to use their new titles of prince and princess, heightening tensions with the Duke and Duchess of Sussex. Harry and Meghan are understood to fear the King may strip Archie and Lilibet of their titles, after his reluctance immediately to recognise their elevated status after the Queen’s death.
As children of the sovereign’s son, Archie, three, and one-year-old Lilibet, known as Lili, are automatically now a prince and princess and entitled to be styled His Royal Highness and Her Royal Highness, something Meghan previously claimed Archie would be denied because he was of mixed race.
But more than two weeks after the Queen’s death, they are still listed on the royal family’s official website as Master Archie Mountbatten-Windsor and Miss Lilibet Mountbatten-Windsor. Harry, 38, and Meghan, 41, are prevented from using the HRH style since stepping back from official royal life in 2020, but that does not affect their children’s titles. It is understood Harry and his father had a “brief discussion” in the days after the Queen’s death, when the King asked if it was something Harry wanted for his children.
Harry is understood to have expressed his desire to let his children decide when they are older, and to have emphasised that would only be possible if they were allowed to retain their titles now. The conversation is understood to have ended unresolved, and to have left the Sussexes dismayed.
Several days later, tensions escalated when Harry received his military uniform from Buckingham Palace for his vigil at the Queen’s coffin to discover his grandmother’s “ER” cipher had been stripped from the shoulder. The Duke of York retained the initials on his uniform at a vigil the previous evening.
William and Kate’s new titles were instantly updated on the royal family’s official website but Archie and Lilibet’s were not. A royal source said: “For [Buckingham Palace] not to make those changes suggests that something is off. Why not just change everything and do it in that moment?”
Asked about the discrepancy, a spokesman for the King said earlier: “Updating love on a website doesn’t quite work. We will be working through updating the website as and when we get information.”
Asked again several days later, the spokesman said: “The King is focused on the mourning period. It’s unlikely you’ll know other titles during that period. I’m sure at some point there will be discussions.” Last night, a senior royal source said: “That is still the status quo.”
My prediction is that Charles is so tone-deaf, he’s waiting to strip two babies of their titles specifically when Harry’s memoir comes out. As in, Harry’s memoir will be published – or it will be the eve of the book’s release – and suddenly Buckingham Palace will make a big, splashy announcement that Charles is pulling the royal titles. And if that happens, so be it. Archie and Lili are safe and protected in America, and while it’s exceptionally cruel for a grandfather to bully his young grandchildren, I genuinely hope that Meghan and Harry have already made their peace with the fact that Harry’s family is racist trash. It feels like November will be a pretty rough month for the Windsors overall – The Crown Season 5, probably Harry’s memoir, and Charles going out of his way to make an ass out of himself.
Photos courtesy of Misan Harriman/The Sussexes, SussexRoyal IG, Avalon Red.
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- Britain’s Prince Harry and his wife Meghan, Duchess of Sussex, holding their son Archie, meet Archbishop Desmond Tutu at the Desmond & Leah Tutu Legacy Foundation in Cape Town, South Africa, September 25, 2019.,Image: 538025348, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: NO UK USE FOR SEVEN DAYS – Fee Payable Upon Reproduction – For queries contact Avalon.red – sales@avalon.red London: +44 (0) 20 7421 6000 Los Angeles: +1 (310) 822 0419 Berlin: +49 (0) 30 76 212 251, Model Release: no, Credit line: – / Avalon
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- MANDATORY CREDIT: Chris Allerton – copyright SussexRoyal NEWS EDITORIAL USE ONLY. NO COMMERCIAL USE. NO MERCHANDISING, ADVERTISING, SOUVENIRS, MEMORABILIA or COLOURABLY SIMILAR. NOT FOR USE AFTER FRIDAY JUNE 7, 2019, WITHOUT PRIOR WRITTEN PERMISSION FROM ROYAL COMMUNICATIONS AT BUCKINGHAM PALACE. This photograph is provided to you strictly on condition that these conditions and restrictions will apply (and that you will pass these on) to any organisation to whom you supply it. There shall be no commercial use whatsoever of the photographs (including by way of example only) any use in merchandising, advertising or any other non-news editorial use. The photograph must not be digitally enhanced, manipulated or modified in any manner or form and must include all of the individuals in the photograph when published. All other requests for use should be directed to the Buckingham Palace Press Office in writing. The Duke and Duchess of Sussex are joined by her mother, Doria Ragland, as they show their new son, born Monday and named as Archie Harrison Mountbatten-Windsor, to the Queen Elizabeth II and the Duke of Edinburgh at Windsor Castle.
Who cares anymore? I don’t think Harry or Megs give 2 sh*ts about this anymore. I think they know how petty, racist and overall cretins the royal family is and always been. Nothing should surprise them anymore. They have the money to protect themselves and their babies, they can provide a great home, they can continue with their charity endeavors, they don’t need the royal family or titles for shit.
I ask again. Why is Doria standing next to Charles instead of sitting where Kate is????!
So as I look again at the picture, I think they could have better arranged it a few different ways. Doria sitting where Kate is, Camilla where she is. Or Charles and Camilla sitting next to the sofa while everyone else stands. etc.
I think the main issue was probably that charles and william were placed on the ends, since that does look better, since they are in dark suits etc. I think Kate was probably wearing very high heels that would have made her the tallest person in the back row and it would have looked very “off,” especially with the headband adding more height to her. I think that was the issue.
Otherwise Doria sitting next to Meghan would have made the most sense, for sure. Kate also sat net to Meghan in one of their wedding portraits, wonder if they were going for the same look here? IDK.
I think it’s to not have Charles not look like a muchkin. Doria is shorter than Charles, Will, Kate, and Diana’s sisters all much taller.
Diana’s sisters refused to stand next to Charles so Doria is a buffer?
@Equality they may have refused to stand next to Camilla as well, so she had to sit, and then you had to figure out the rest of it.
I like to believe that this setting is better so that you can crop out the rest trash. The picture would only include Harry, Meghan, Archie, Doria and Diana’s sisters. Just the people who matter. I hope this was deliberately done. Even in the wedding portrait, you can crop out everyone and just have the couple and Doria. The only people who matter.
I suppose there were other choices (and reasons for not doing it differently!), but I kind of like Doria where she is. She and Charles are the actual grandparents, and Diana’s sisters are proxies for grandmother Diana. It looks inclusive, and the man Doria is standing next to is now the king. I can’t decide if Doria would look too isolated sitting where Kate is – or if it’s just that Kate sticks out like a sore thumb, because of her too short skirt and too dark headband and shoes (and very tall Will behind her), plus the fact that, although Meghan and Archie are in the center of the picture, Harry sitting on the far side pulls the eye to the side where Doria is (in her lovely peach outfit), and away from Kate and Will.
The parents of the parents stood next to each other. Shrugs. I can see Diana’s sisters giving a big no to having to stand next to Cams.
A very Keen person took the place of Grandmother Doria, just like she took the place of her Bulliam on the final balcony shots. Just like she shoved away Sophiesta like a gnat. She has to be positioned in the most important place. Rude, tacky, classless…
@Gubbinal: Ms Keen also took the place of Meghan herself in a way, by wearing the earrings Diana had on on Harry’s christening day. Catherine enjoys being a usurper. This piece of jewellery should have gone for Henry’s spouse to wear on Archie’s special day.
I think I’m with Mel. The current placement makes sense and is probably the best option. If Doria was sitting in Kate’s spot she would have looked isolated. And Doria is closer to Meghan, too, and could have put her hand on Meghan’s shoulder.
If this were any other family I think this would be just fine. The trick with family photos is making sure the married ins and their own parents etc. arent treated like an afterthought.
Are you sure that. That the nonexistent Kate Middleton is married to Prince and the mother of Princess of Wale’s children? Somehow I thought Prince William’s wife’s name when he married was Cathrine Middleton. How can we believe anything you are right
about anything you write.
Exactly what I came here to say. Titles are meaningless in the US, we don’t worship a king here. It’s ridiculous, like you said, who cares anymore.
Charles has already made his decision, but is waiting for an excuse to release it. Meghan spoke the truth and I believe there was a lot more she could have said, but in the end I think it will be the best decision ever✌️
Exactly! It’s only a bargaining chip if they care. And I don’t think they do. Security is an issue, but they’ve figured out their own way to manage that, so … no bargaining chip.
Apparently they care, but I seriously doubt they care enough to endanger their income they need for eg security.
I love the photo of the queen, Phillip and Ms Doria looking on Prince Archie. Those were definitely genuine smiles on their faces.
That’s all I got.
Look at Harry’s face in that photo too, pure love and joy
“Grandma! Grandpa! See what we made from love!”
“Updating love on a website doesn’t quite work.”
What the fuck is that supposed to mean?
It’s basically word salad (the exact thing they love to inaccurately and bitterly criticize Meghan for).
I wondered if it wasn’t throwing shade at KC for waffling and not letting them know how to proceed with updates. Since his only statement about H&M was about his supposed “love” for them, it left his employees not knowing what to do.
Idk that line is just a distraction. The website and the titles technically have nothing to do with love. So if he updates their titles on a website, that shows he loves them? I thought it was just updating the protocol according to the LP? Oh but it’s about love now? Oh really. Well that just makes it worse and also nonsensical. But but the protocol? Lying liars who shift the protocols to serve their intemperate whims and emotions. Abolish the monarchy.
I doubt that H&M are “fearful” about the titles but whatever KC decides will likely have a big impact on their decisions going forward in how much contact and respect that KC gets from them.
@equality
This is why the rumor that ChuckyCheese3 is waiting to see whats in Harry’s memoir before going public about the titles is so plausible. Either way (i:e whether H drags the royals; or doesnt mention them except maybe peripherally; or if he mentions them but says nothing bad abt them) either way, it will provide cover for whatever Chucky decides to do, especially, as we all believe, he revokes the babies’ titles (because lets not get it twisted, REVOCATION is what it will be, NOT acknowledgement of that which already exists, which is the case re the babies’ titles.)
@kingston, I was actually very surprised that the Times article states that, without a doubt, Archie and Lilibet are currently a prince and princess. So much fudging on that issue has been happening (both from the palaces and the Press), and I believe it is precisely so Charles can try to lead people to believe that he is choosing to not give them titles as opposed to his actually taking them away. Buckingham Palace is probably peeved that the Times laid the titling facts out there.
Mary, we had the media in the US talking about this during the circus funeral. They already explained that upon the death of The Queen Archie and Lilibet automatically became THR Prince Archie & Princess Lilibet.
I wonder if the Times is wanting to get some credibility with the US media? After the bm fiasco during the “hide-the-casket” show, it’s given a very interesting view of the bm by the rest of the global media.
The easiest solution here for Charles is what Harry suggested (supposedly obviously according to this source ) – that Archie and Lili make their own choice as adults, which probably will be to NOT use the HRH Prince/ss, because I think at that point it will seem meaningless to them, but its not taken away. That’s a win for Charles (he doesn’t look like a racist asshat pulling titles from the mixed race grandchildren) and a win for William as well, because his children will be the only ones who use HRH, which I think is what he wants.
But Charles is gonna Charles so it will probably be messy and petty and racist.
Also, this line: “Updating love on a website doesn’t quite work. We will be working through updating the website as and when we get information.””
Like WTF does that even mean? “updating love on a website”?? that’s such a bad comment that I can’t believe it came from his actual spokesperson and not just a random “royal source.”
It’s a clown show over there. Charles cannot get out of his own way and doesn’t know how to win hearts over to himself, because he tilts with the wind. Oh, people think it’s wrong for Harry not to get to wear his uniform at the vigil? Well then, okay. He can–but I’ll strip off Lizzy’s initials, tee-hee. Oh, other people think this dinner should only be for working royals? Well then, okay. I’ll disinvite Harry and Meghan but not tell them they’re disinvited, tee-hee.
He doesn’t know what to do about the titles because the right wingers in the UK are the loudest, but the common sense of the rest of the entire world is even louder. Lizzie and Diana were right. He’s unfit.
I don’t believe what H is reported to have said to C because this story was clearly leaked by C. IMO H&M are taking a hands off approach to the titles. They probally want C to make his decision and then take full responsibility for it without using the Sussexes for cover.
Charles doesn’t tilt with the wind, he’s a massive wanker who dials it back slightly when it’s overtly obvious he is a wanker.
Are you sure that. That the nonexistent Kate Middleton is married to Prince and the mother of Princess of Wale’s children? Somehow I thought Prince William’s wife’s name when he married was Cathrine Middleton. How can we believe anything you are right
about anything you write.
“In accordance with the 1917 Letters Patent, the grandchildren of the sovereign through the male line are entitled to use HRH and Prince/Princess titles. At the request of the Duke and Duchess of Sussex, their children will remain styled Master Archie and Miss Lilibet through the age of 18.”
GOD, IT’S NOT THAT HAAAAAAARD.
Right? Just say that and end the whole “will he or won’t he.” It’s not that hard.
I wonder if part of the current discussion is around Louis’ kids (and a second son of George’s if he has two sons). Like if Charles actually may want to issue a new LP that only the children of the heir are HRH and have that be in place going forward, which would affect Louis’ children. I could see William pushing back against that, he probably wants LP that give Louis’ children automatic HRH. (since its not guaranteed that william will be king when Louis has children.)
I think Charles is trying to get Harry to make a public statement that they won’t go by titles now but can decide when they’re older. That’s best case scenario for Charles because then he isn’t the one making the decision publicly, and I hope Harry recognizes that and is doing his father no favours.
This is Charles’ court and he can do the work. As we saw with the William not bullying statement, if they’d still been in the firm, such a statement would have undoubtedly been put out whether they wanted it or not.
I’ve said this before, but I just can’t believe this is the kingly shit Charles has been waiting his whole life for. Publicly debating just how cruel and racist you can be towards toddlers because you think you have absolute right to control their parents every move? Especially since once season five of a TV show (that’s definitely FICTIONAL, the king wants everyone to know, sure Jan) hits, he’ll be a huge villain. It’s not like he doesn’t know what’s going to be highlighted on the crown. Anyway, the monarchy is just proving that it’s a soap opera only. Cancel it.
To Chuck: Just do whatever racist thing you want to do and Harry and Meghan can just release a statement saying K. Leave them alone. Or you like to talk about them so that nobody can question your workload and function?
Truly despicable . Children are innocent and not bargaining chips with their parents. Children also should not be denied their birth rights on account of their parents action.
It really shows you that this family doesn’t view children as people or even care much about them other than props doesn’t it?
I mean the press has been saying for weeks that Charles is waiting until the book comes out to decide on whether to strip Archie and Lili of their titles. Now that Harry and Meghan live in the US, I don’t think they really care about the titles. But it’s good to see the press no longer call Meghan a liar as Charles has proven that she was telling the truth when she spoke about the titles in the Oprah interview.
I dunno. Using the phrase “previously claimed” still makes it sound like she was being dramatic and was wrong, even though the rest of their article goes on to demonstrate how right she actually was. When they start saying “meghan previously stated…” it’ll feel more representative of the truth. (Not that they will because they are wedded to the idea nothing she says could ever possibly be true even as the palace confirms it with their actions.)
Press knows she wasn’t lying. They all but admitted that Archie and Lili are Prince and Princess now. Hence why they keep asking the Palace about the titles.
The press knew she wasnt lying and I am SO GLAD she said what she did in the interview, bc she blew all the excuses out of the water. It has nothing to do with California, or being a working royal, or whatever other excuse Charles comes up with. They didn’t want Meghan’s children to be HRH from the start.
Yep, that’s exactly right. Meghan sure has been proven right about a lot of things in that interview, hasn’t she?
At this point the Sussexes are probably done with salt island. They can go to other places to see the relatives they want to keep in touch with like Eugenie, or have Eugenie and fam come and visit them.
I’m REAL interested in the attendance for the coronation this spring. (Especially if the UK economy stays like it is.)
The palace can talk and talk about how “small” it’ll be to lower expectations, but Charles has waited his entire life for this, and he absolutely needs the Sussexes (including the kids) there for the global media to GAF.
Charles can play all the power games he wants with titles and uniforms, but he needs Harry far more than Harry needs him at this point.
Yes, and finally in the last couple of years Harry has figured that out. He knows his father needs him more than he will ever need to dial into that drama. Harry has the power in that family. Meghan just made him realize it and they will never we forgive her for that .. and also being mixed face…and beautiful… and showing them all to be dummies…
Charles does not have to go ‘out of his way’ to make an ass out of himself. He doesn’t even need to change lanes. Charles has ALWAYS been an a$$ that’s why he fancies Camilla. The resemblance to that particular beast is stunning.
@Renae
Ooooooooooooooooohhhhhhhhh Zing! LMAO
If you are still livingin the past, King Charles III, was particularly forced to marry a woman, born in different decades, he needed a wife to bear the heir, William and spare, Harry. Diana used the excused she felt she was married to an 80 year old man and that’s why she cheated first, Diana had many lovers. King Charles had 1, the woman he loved for years. In my book Diana broke up Camilla and Charles.
“Harry and Meghan are understood to fear the King may strip Archie and Lilibet of their titles, after his reluctance immediately to recognise their elevated status after the Queen’s death.”
LOL. They made it clear back in the Oprah interview that they already know what’s up and they don’t care about this anymore: see Meghan’s “so much has already been lost” comments. She revealed the truth about the titles for Archie because of the racist implications (worsened by the RF refusing to give her a reason for denying him titles), and because the RF publicly claimed it was her and Harry’s decision. I still see royalists elsewhere trying to claim that they rejected ‘lesser’ titles for Archie when it’s clear they weren’t given a choice at all.
Exactly.
Amy, Archie wasn’t inline for a title, because of his father not direct line to be King, what Meghan said about race being the reason, Archie didn’t get a title other than Duke of Dumbarton, Meghan like it because the word Dumbin the title. That was ?one of the lies she tells as she always has, when she doesn’t get her way.
I wish Harry and Meghan would call that toxic institution’s bluff and quit their own titles. Just wash their hands of the whole racist, elitist, and classist clown car and walk away.
No that’s what the Royal Family wants them to do. They should keep them and let the family strip them of their titles.
No, let Charles do it. He has already disinherited Harry.
He should do it before the coronation.
The Sussexes are estranged from the royal family.
Just make it official, attack the children.
Charles hasn’t disinherited Harry, he cut off funding him from the Duchy of Cornwall grant. Harry is still in the line of succession, as are his children.
He is still in the line of succession, which means, he’s still a counsellor of state, as are Andrew, and Beatrice. Seems to me fixing that to include as counsellors people who make a little more sense, starting with Anne, should be a more significant issue right now.
That’s likely complicated for Harry. The titles are a link to his family and his birthright. They were a gift from his beloved grandmother. And, with other royals behind him in succession keeping titles why should he and his family be singled out again? It also serves as a test of KC and how much he values PH and his family. If KC does strip titles, PH will then know where he stands with his supposed family and any reconciliation.
I agree with equality. And yeah, the monarchy is a joke, and titles are meaningless in the U.S., but it still will be a bad look for Charles if he strips his mixed-race grandchildren of their titles. This IS a test for Charles that I fully expect him to fail.
These a-holes cannot get out of their own way. For the sake of his family, and for PR, of course Charles should give his grandchildren their titles.
I truly wish that Prince Harry would apply for citizenship in the USA if they continue this, take himself and his children completely out of any BRF and rota control, blackmail and let the racist deal with PA being number 5 in LOS. What they are doing to this family is so racist, evil and so cruel.
Harry and Meghan have always said that it’s not for them to decide and that they want it to be Archie and Lili’s choice when they turn 18. So, I doubt Harry and Meghan are particularly stressed that the website hasn’t been updated. Their kids have no use for the titles and won’t for a long time.
Charles is just making unnecessary drama for himself. He should just leave everything as is according to the Letters of Patent, update the site accordingly to represent the current law, then approach the topic again in 15 years when Archie turns 18. Which would most likely be William’s problem by then.
Charles is so pathetic. His ego, entitlement and snobbery is a detriment to that entire island. Harry is the best thing that EVER happened to him after Diana and he will try to destroy Harry too. He will NOT be successful. Archie and Lili deserve those titles as their birth right, but they don’t need them. They don’t need anything from that trash family or island.
It would be hilarious if C3 wringed his hands and then finally gave the titles only for the Sussexes to never acknowledged nor refer to any of their kids by said titles, 🤣🤣
Once again BP & KP are deluding themselves thinking they hold all the cards here. They know a public negative statement from the Sussexes will lead to international blowback if Charles strips the kids of titles. The BRF needs the Sussexes to publicly sign off on any decision Charles makes. I also believe Charles using the press to stall for time to see who in the family he can throw under the double decker bus to mitigate the bad optics.
Why, should PC III, give anything to the grandchildren he never sees or don’t live in the country where the titles come from? Not to mention the Gruesome Twosome felt they had to leave the TOXIC country, for the safety of Meghan and Archie.
Really tho, I don’t think Charles has to go out of his way to make an ass of himself. He’s pretty much doing that just by breathing
I said what I said
Updating love. Lmfao. Uncoupling anyone?
What he would be actually doing is to legally remove the inherited titles from Archie and Lilibet Diana.
This is a threat, to Harry to return to accept the abuses of his brother, their rf employers tabloid media scum and accept his place as their inferior by under performing.
Harry must accept mediocrity as the rule and understand that he does not deserve a healthy loving relationship.
He should work hard and be unrecognised until it pleases his brother to pushes him out improvised and downtrodden.
Harry should stop all the nonsense about mental health, agency and just repress his feelings, whilst he’s at it serve the staff coffee, make his decimated family to be the laughing stock instead of the envy of the rota.
When all else fail, drink hard liquor, do drugs and unsuccessfully repress.
What love got to do with it? Ditch the wife and kids.
Pack on the pounds.
/s
There are bots on the DM who talk about Harry being so happy with Will and Kate and Kate was like a “sister” to him. If Harry ever thought that about Kate, he certainly does not now.
Yeah, I’m squarely in the let tampon strip the babies of their titles camp. we all know he was a wasteman husband to Di, wasteman father to his sons (yeah I’m including Skull, f**k him though) and a wasteman grandfather to Archie & Lili. He’s an idiot, a tone deaf ass hat and so yes, let him profer even more proof of those facts for current and future history.
H&M are thriving and so are their babies. They’ve not needed their titles to be thoroughly decent human beings; a lesson they’ll definitely pass to their children in due time.
Exactly. Charles comes across as a creep, and I don’t understand why he doesn’t lean into at least pretending to be “Papa England” at this point. His only play right now is to be seen as a loving and jolly grandfather (in the style of the current King of Norway), and he’s blowing it with all of this talk about titles. It makes him seem petty and small. Bad advice, poor instincts, and bad PR.
He seems to be promoting himself as the “lovable” old man who is funloving and guffaws and laughs around the “public” that he visits. And he gurns and pulls those faces. Who does he think he’s kidding? He’s ruthless and cold. IMO. And he got a lot of “points” for Louis sitting on his lap and yet “Grandpa England” uses his younger little grandchildren as “bargaining” chips hinting about taking their titles.
Charles messed up when he allowed William to call the shots and did not protect Harry and Meghan and their children. It was all down hill from there. And also his allowing the media to continue the daily slamming of Harry and Meghan, which he could have stopped when they got engaged.
The fact that the Sussexes children will grow up and see these articles showing that their fathers side of the family is actually trash and further dissociate is the only pro to articles like these
Meghan never said that the reason they were discussing not giving Archie a title was bc of his race.
Outright? No, neither she nor Harry ever used those words in that exact order. She did, however, heavily imply it and Harry confirmed what she said. Harry even doubled down on what she said, and went further, and with more specifics. It’s blatantly obvious if someone does the barest minimum of reading between the lines.
Well at the point when they were talking of it before Archie was born, the only way they could not give it to him is if they altered the Letters Patent, which would end up affecting the whole family, and if they didn’t want to do that but only wanted to do it for hers and Harry’s kids, add 2 and 2.
I mean, she put all the dots out there for anyone who wanted to connect them. She said they wanted to change the convention for Archie so he wouldn’t be a prince, she said something about how that would look for the first member of color of that family to not have a title, and then she went into the part about how there were also conversations about how dark he might be and “what that would mean.”
But sure, she didn’t explicitly say it was about race.
PH would be in a position to know more. He may have been previously told that he and his children would be in Charles’ slimmed-down monarchy. If he was then told differently after he chose to marry Meghan, it would make the point.
If something like that happened then I can understand why C is fearful of H’s memoir.
You can’t bargain when you have nothing to give. Every day, Charles shows why titles are worthless.
Who are the women between Doria and Peg?
Those are Diana’s sisters Sarah and Jane. I don’t know who’s who.
Jane is next to Doria and Sarah is next to William.
Big Picture: Harry’s House Sussex could last a thousand years via the *aristocratic Dukedom and that inherently comes with both ‘cache and entrée into a world that won’t accept you if you don’t have that…
Thru Princess Diana their Sussex dukedom and future descendants :^) will always help connect them forever to 3 of the most important (and richest )aristocratic families in England = the Earls Spencer , Dukes of Marlborough (spencer churchil including Half American PM Winston Churchill) and the Dukes of Devonshire. This is soft power that Harry and Meghans great/grand/sons and their families inherit as long as the Dukedom lasts.
Prince/Princess by law, ends literally at Archie and Lily. Their Children can’t inherit that title.. but Dukedoms last forever as long as son marries and has a son. THat is something Chuck Bill egg and BP is 100% trying to prevent Harry and Meghan and Archie Lilly and future descendants from having.
That is why Liz, Charles the Turd and Bill Egg and BP grey men have refused to call Archie the Earl of Dumbarton and Lady Lily since day they were born! (and as posters have pointed out before, they Stole Meghan’s name off Lord Archies English birth certificate!!)
THey refuse to follow the ‘precedent about their “Spare boys” they announced when Prince Edward married Sofa in 1999.
James Viscount Severn and Lady Louise are in same “position” as Archie Earl of Dumbarton and Lady Lily .. No talk about taking THeir titles away. (yet)
If they remove the titles i think everyone on internet should start referring to Harry and Meghan and family/future generations as ” House Sussexit .
Perpetually throw it in English upper class twits faces :0 that they are not very good at game of thrones.
As a younger sibling I totally emphasize with Harry. Parents can be really stubborn and one-sided and feel completely justified. Being an actual spare cannot be easy when it’s the law and written down. It’s easy for people on the outside to say he’s being spoiled but for me I couldn’t imagine growing up that way. I already have my resentments toward my older sibling based on my feelings of not getting equal treatment.
As for Marie and Joachim I personally am not a fan but it was short sighted and ungracious for the Queen to do what she did in the manner she did it. Everyone should have been on the same page regardless of if they liked it or not.
The only reason Meghan brought up the topic of titles in the Oprah interview was because it related to Harry and Archie’s security. Meghan had every right to be upset about it. She was told no titles = no security. They were receiving death threats, white powder by mail and 2 men were literally arrested for plotting an assassination on Harry for being a “race traitor”. We recently just heard about a court case involving 2 podcasters who threatened to kill Archie and called him an “abomination”. As an expecting mother, you would be TERRIFIED! Planning to take away titles that come with security from a mixed race child receiving racist abuse and threats is the cruelest thing Charles has done. Especially seeing how unprotected H&M were by the institution, it’s plain evil! Now that H&M are independent and have their own security, I don’t think they care about titles anymore. So, this isn’t about Charles holding anything over their head. He’s just gearing up to use Harry’s memoir as a cover-up for his racism against his 2 mixed race grandchildren.
Charles, if you’re reading this, I hope you understand (or can have one of your flunkies explain it to you): punishing Harry by stripping his children’s titles will not make him less inclined to share more of your dark, shameful past with the world. In fact, the more you push, the more likely he is to reveal your lifelong casual cruelty, racism, misogyny, narcissism, and all the rest. Harry is a good man, far, far better than you. But he is neither a patsy nor a pushover. You do not have as much power as you think you do.
If this is Charles’ bargaining chip then he has nothing. Archie and Lili will not need those titles as privileged American children and Archie will inherit the Duke of Sussex title one day. All Charles is doing is confirming that he is a racist and a shitty grandfather. Nice job….
“Updating love on a website doesn’t quite work. We will be working through updating the website as and when we get information.”
LMAO
Updating love..?
These people are crazy.
Best part of the holidays this year? New pics of Archie & Lily! They must have grown so much since last year’s cards.
Charles will be hard pressed to explain why he needs to strip the titles from grandchildren he does not support, nor does the taxpayer support. What exactly is being “saved”? Revenge will be the only motive and what kind of “grandfather” takes revenge on grandkids. Anyway, if he does that then that just provides even more justification for Harry never to come back, not that he was going to anyway.
Charles really is a turd.
Archie and Lilibet have the best titles of all the so-called royals.
They are the son and daughter of Harry and Meghan!
Charles can withdraw the titles and the ‘people’ will still call them prince and princess. What is he going to do about it. Doesn’t he know how many princes and dukes and archdukes of former kingdoms and dukedoms are still kicking around. Hundreds of years later, they still calling themselves count habsburg or something.
I honestly hope he does so when Harry doesn’t come to the coronation or any more RF events the RR can finally let go and realize that Harry and Meghan are good and they can finally stop writing articles about them.
Meghan laid low during her pregnancy, still articles about her. They left being “working” royals and the BM doubled down on hate articles. Why, as long as they are making money and in bed with the RF, would they stop?
Lol even if Charles strips Archie and Lili of their titles, I think Harry will still attend the coronation. Charles doesn’t care about Harry, that’s why he and William were racists and talked about the baby’s skin color with Harry instead of Meghan.
I think if Charles requests him to come as King then you are only seeing Harry. His kids won’t be made to feel unsafe.
I don’t think Harry would go without Meghan. ALso there are “diplomatic” illnesses.
It would be very humiliating if these kids met with this despicable man again. Charles has abused Harry all his life and Harry should protect his kids from his father. Charles is worse than Thomas Markle.
I am constantly reminded of a line in the movie Cool Runnings: “If you’re not enough with it, you will never be enough without it.” The line refers to medals, but it could just as well refer to the title issues with the BRF and DRF. PH is enough without his title and his children seem to be enough with them. Chucky and PWT only have their titles, decorative medals and sense of self-importance. They, especially Chucky, can’t understand that withholding Archie and Lili’s titles will only hurts the BRF’s image.
What kind of person truly is this? King Charles’ actions are really unbelievable. His character shines brightly through now. It amazes me to say that he is a vicious nasty jealous small minded mean dishonest little man who has should never be admired or acclaimed. He and William are one and the same and should be thrown into The Tower and never be seen again.
All he cared about was having heirs he did not care that he was marrying someone he did not love. And not even telling his girlfriend/prospective bride that to give her a chance to know all the facts before he proposed.. I think he sees marriage and having children as a concept not any sort of reality or their having feelings. I think he will pay the most attention to George. He sees Lili and Archie as “title holders” and he apparently does not care how they feel when he uses their titles as bargaining chips.
They continue to do everything that they accuse Harry and Meghan of…..leak to the media
They continue to fight their battles in public through the media (through sources) but are appalled whenever Harry and Meghan have their say.
Charles is so cold hearted. How could he even think of treating those little children that way. Not to mention his son and daughter in law.
I thought Queen Margrethe was right to remove the titles of her grandchildren even if the way she did it was wrong. They’ll have to go through life as regular people who don’t receive any government funding. It’s healthier to not be styled Prince and Princess and the same is true of H&M’s kids. All those royal families need to slim down and adjust although the process of adjustment for the spares seems pretty brutal. Better to sort it out now when they’re unaware than to be stripped of your title when you’re older. The Wessex were smart to never style their kids as Prince and Princess. After all it’s not like any of them earned their titles.
If in removing the titles they are also decreasing funding for the RF then it is good. If it’s just performative and the royals will still cost the taxpayers the same or more, then what does it matter? The SG in the UK can supposedly not be decreased so if Charles’ plan is to have fewer “working” royals then he needs to address that and stop worrying about titles for people who aren’t receiving public money.
Sms, I thought the Wessex children can make the decision whether they will use the titles or not when they reach adulthood. Louise hasn’t said whether she will use her HRH Princess title, so I guess we’ll need to wait and see. Same for her brother when he gets older.
Let’s be clear. If they want to strip titles, then strip all of the titles except for the heirs and their first born going forward. Yes, that means a LOT of people lose titles including the two youngest Cambridge/Wails children. If you really want to slim down, then slim down. Otherwise, it’s just putting lipstick on a pig. Everyone will know that’s what it is.
I agree they should strip all of them. I can see keeping the younger Wales titles since their father is a future king but strip the York girls, Wessex kids and Harry’s kids. I do think it’s mean though to not give Edward the Duke of Edinburgh title since that’s what Philip wanted.
Sms, why let the two younger Wails kids keep their titles? I don’t agree. They are just the side kicks to George, who won’t need them when he has children and they get old enough to exploit. I believe that’s 7 years old, right? Charlotte and Louis can be working royals until then, and then they can be cast off. Just sameo sameo.
SMS, you seem to approve of the Wessexes decision to retain their children’s titles while styling them as the children of an Earl. How is this different from what the Sussexes have indicated they would do — leaving the decisions about using their titles up to Archie and Lili when they are older? In practice, the issue of titles isn’t related to receiving “government funding”.
As to what’s “healthier “, I’m not sure that most of us are in a position to really know. I will say that it’s rarely viewed as “healthier” to single out some members of a family as “less than” others — which taking the titles away from the Sussex kids would surely suggest.
As to being “unaware”, I’ve wondered at the potential dynamics and repercussions as the kids get old enough to independently access the internet. George and Charlotte are already pretty much there.
I’ve been re watching The Crown in anticipation of the next season and it’s astonishing to me how little has changed in the last 100 years with this family! You would have thought that Charles would have learned his lesson with crap parents but clearly not. And it really looks like William will be the same.
Maddie, and isn’t that the saddest thing about all of this? It’s as if to be the heir you have to eat your young. Chuck is exhibiting what he believes is power by deciding the fate of two toddlers’ titles, when he would be better served getting his wails grandchildren some counselling to learn to handle the pressures of the position they’re in. My hope is that Charlotte and Louis each get a REAL and good education with Masters or Ph.Ds and make lives for themselves separate from the institution. Leave the monarchy to the heirs only.
What am I missing here? If it’s true that Charles is delaying decisions about titles for Archie and Lili until Harry’s book is published, does he not get that Harry can write other books? Would that be an ongoing threat — that with each book, or interview, or international accomplishment, GrandPa will yank the children’s titles? Then William, at some point, gets to do the same? As many have said: Not a good look for Charles or for his leadership skills and judgement.
I’m looking forward to reading Harry’s book(s). The dynamics of this family are fascinating, and I’m more than up for reading any insights into Harry’s formidable survival skills that he’d care to share.
Archies christening photo. Diana’s sisters are both tall women, why are all the back row people minimised in size, Harry and Meghan are smaller too, Kate is shown as the dominant and largest person, followed by Camilla. How did Camilla become taller than Harry ? Very photoshopped picture. Why does KM have so much power over the others that she is always made to be the dominant person in photos ? Queens jubilee balcony photos are a good example, KM dominating in a white suit, looking taller than William and overshadowing the Queen. She is slightly shorter than Charles yet is usually shown to be a head taller, does she have a platform she stands on, heels do not increase your height that dramatically. Is KM running the show and leading the attacks on Harry and Meghan ?
I don’t like this christening picture. I don’t think the Sussexes should have released a picture with people who obviously hate Archie. They could only have released a picture of them as a family of 3 and another pic with Doria.
Meghan told us this would happen. I think there will be a standoff, and it won’t be pretty. The BM will attack H&M for being “demanding brats” or a variation of.
It’s the people around you – who on Earth is advising Charles? Does he honestly not see/comprehend how bad this is – removing titles from his grandchildren who are at least 25% black?!?!!! Never mind the fact they’re toddlers. If the monarchy is going to last he has to modernize. Exiling his own son, DIL and grandchildren won’t help his image, legacy or the monarchy. Someone please save these people from themselves!
All the royal stories, are the media actually present to record conversations and behavior behind closed doors ? What is the truth, who are the insiders, we have been told the employees are all required to sign non disclosure documents. Essentially they should all be fired and sued in the courts for breaking their agreements. Most of the royal reporters stories seem to be based on a lot of heresay, for example, in Australia, the royal expert reporters/journalists live in Australia yet she declare that all their stories about British royalty are absolutely true. Are any of the royals actually discussing their innermost thoughts, feelings and research over decisions they need to make with the royal resporters ? Are any of them real journalists or will any lie they tell be declared to be the truth. Harry and Meghan recently stated that they would only be making statements through their their personal media and anything else was not from them. This statement was barely acknowledged and the gossip monger reporters continued with their own manufactured stories.
Surely that line about the website is a typo – updating LIVE..?
They should re-do the titles so the children of Royal Dukes carry the title of the children of Dukes, like Edward and Sophie did for their children (even though their two are technically a prince and Princess). That keeps the Prince and Princess titles strictly to the family of the heir. And Princesses should be offered an hereditary title upon marriage just like the men are. Equality and all that! So their children are then treated equally.
Charles the Turd really wants to demonstrate to the UK, the Commonwealth, and the whole world how eager he is to punish Harry for fathering mixed race children. How dare Harry sully the lily-white blueblood of the Royal Family! Non-white Britons and Commonwealth nations: take note. Stripping royals with African blood of their birthright and royal titles speaks volumes! This “very much not racist” family cannot wait to remove the “undesirables” from the line of succession.
Megan told the TRUTH.