I talk a lot of sh-t about the British monarchy, but I’ll give the current Windsors some credit for one thing: they don’t seem to be homophobic bigots. Their bigotry is reserved for other issues, but King Charles, his sons and the current crop of working royals are all okay-to-good on LGBTQ issues. King Charles has always had gay friends. A huge chunk of William’s staff is made up of gay men. Harry has plenty of gay friends too. Why are we talking about this during Pride month? Well, the British actor Stephen Fry was recently chatting about royals and LGBTQ issues on a podcast, and he had some interesting things to say. He’s not spilling royal tea, he’s just shooting the sh-t and giving a little history lesson.
An openly gay king one day could raise “constitutional issues” but would not be impossible, Stephen Fry has claimed. The broadcaster and author, who is friendly with the royal family, suggested that the concept could be a possibility in the future if the issue of producing an heir was dealt with.
Speaking on the Just For Variety podcast, he said: “I think it would raise constitutional issues in terms of the heir. That’s the only boring nonsense about kingship, is that you’re supposed to have an heir, or as the horrible phrase goes, an heir and a spare.”
The 66-year-old TV personality added that the Prince of Wales and Duke of Sussex are “very gay-friendly” thanks to the tolerant attitude of their father, the King. The broadcaster explained: “Believe me, they are very gay-friendly and charming. Yeah, they’re part of their generation. And they grew up with it because of their father. You know, their father was great friends with, for example, [Sir] John Richardson, the Picasso biographer. He and his boyfriend used to stay with the King. And, you know, they were friendly with them both. They had absolutely no issues.”
Fry added that Prince William and Harry’s attitude to homosexuality is very different to their royal ancestors. He said: “Each generation, including those two princes, is so much more, you know because they had a great-great-grandfather, George V. And if you wanted to know what summed up the casual and hideous homophobia of Britain and probably most of Europe and America at that time, there was a member of the family, the Duke of Westminster, who was about to be arrested and he escaped to France. And someone broke the news to the King because the Duke of Westminster was a friend of the King. And they said, ‘Oh, have you heard that Lord What’s His Name has gone to France because of that [homosexuality]?’ And the King’s words were just to say very coldly, ‘I thought men like that shot themselves?’. Isn’t that the coldest remark you’ve ever heard? And that was William and Harry’s great, great, grandfather.”
That is a cold remark and it speaks to how drastically attitudes have changed in just a couple of generations. The youths don’t know, honestly. It’s an annual Pride Month conversation, with young queer kids being shocked that homosexual acts used to be criminalized and that there was a whole culture of lavender marriages and underground gay scenes (because they had to stay hidden and in the closet). Stonewall happened in my mom’s generation, you know? George W. Bush’s 2004 reelection campaign hinged on gay-bashing.
As for what Fry says about the possibility of a gay king or queen… I think it could happen too, but I think what will happen before that is someone in the line of succession (but not a direct heir) coming out as gay. I’m sure that will happen in my lifetime.
Photos courtesy of Cover Images.
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- USA Rights Only – London, UK -20181025- Gala Concert at Buckingham Palace to mark Prince Charles 70th birthday Royal Tour of Tonga -PICTURED: Prince Charles, Stephen Fry -PHOTO by: PA Images/INSTARimages.com -39329850.jpg This is an editorial, rights-managed image. Please contact Instar Images LLC for licensing fee and rights information at sales@instarimages.com or call +1 212 414 0207 This image may not be published in any way that is, or might be deemed to be, defamatory, libelous, pornographic, or obscene. Please consult our sales department for any clarification needed prior to publication and use. Instar Images LLC reserves the right to pursue unauthorized users of this material. If you are in violation of our intellectual property rights or copyright you may be liable for damages, loss of income, any profits you derive from the unauthorized use of this material and, where appropriate, the cost of collection and/or any statutory damages awarded Featuring: Prince Charles, Stephen Fry Where: London, United Kingdom When: 25 Oct 2018 Credit: PA Images/INSTARimages.com **USA Rights Only**
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- USA Rights Only – London, UK -20181025- Gala Concert at Buckingham Palace to mark Prince Charles 70th birthday Royal Tour of Tonga -PICTURED: Prince Charles, Stephen Fry -PHOTO by: PA Images/INSTARimages.com -39329849.jpg This is an editorial, rights-managed image. Please contact Instar Images LLC for licensing fee and rights information at sales@instarimages.com or call +1 212 414 0207 This image may not be published in any way that is, or might be deemed to be, defamatory, libelous, pornographic, or obscene. Please consult our sales department for any clarification needed prior to publication and use. Instar Images LLC reserves the right to pursue unauthorized users of this material. If you are in violation of our intellectual property rights or copyright you may be liable for damages, loss of income, any profits you derive from the unauthorized use of this material and, where appropriate, the cost of collection and/or any statutory damages awarded Featuring: Prince Charles, Stephen Fry Where: London, United Kingdom When: 25 Oct 2018 Credit: PA Images/INSTARimages.com **USA Rights Only**
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- The Prince of Wales and Prince George watch from the box during day four of the second Ashes test match at Lord’s. Featuring: Prince William, Prince George, Stephen Fry, Richard Thompson Where: London, United Kingdom When: 01 Jul 2023 Credit: PA Images/INSTARimages **NORTH AMERICA RIGHTS ONLY**
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- Tribeca Festival ‘Treasure’ premiere and pre-reception held at Cooper’s Craft and Kitchen. Featuring: Stephen Fry Where: New York, New York, United States When: 08 Jun 2024 Credit: Marion Curtis/Starpix/INSTARimages
I love Stephen. All tongue in cheek. I’ve been binging on Jeeves and Wooster lately, btw.
I love that show so much. Seeing Hugh Laurie as House blew my mind after seeing him as Bertie for so long. That’s *acting* 😂
My intro to SF came in A Fish Called Wanda and later Peter’s Friends. He’s done a great job on the myths and advocating for depression as well as the LGBTQ+ community. And his recent statement on how the Greek marbles in the British museum are akin to the Nazis stealing the Arc de Triomph is fire!
Been plowing through the Wodehouse oeuvre, on audio.
Charles may not be a bigot when it comes to LGBTQ issues, but what about the firm? Are they gonna be tolerant if a senior royal is gay or ask them to hide it? My guess is, they won’t be that tolerant when it happens under their roof. We know what happened when the first black person married into the senior family member.
Yeah, unfortunately my suspicion is the BRF are very tolerant of wealthy white men, which in practice means:
1) tolerating all sorts of behavior, including terrible behavior, from rich and/or famous white men (see: Andrew’s pedophilia; Charles’ public support of numerous infamous pedophiles, including Kevin Spacey and that bishop who raped and impregnated a teenager; their friendship with Piers Morgan, etc.) ** and
2) absolutely nothing in terms of tolerance for poor LGBTQ+ folks and/or LGBTQ+ of color
**To be absolutely clear, I’m in no way suggesting homosexuality or any other non-heterosexuality is “bad behavior,” nor am I suggesting homosexuality has anything to do with pedophilia, rape or whatever we would classify Piers Morgan’s brand of cruel hatred & inciting folks to violence as.
I’m just pointing out that what we have is a famous, wealthy white man saying “King Charles and his kids are nice to me and others like me,” and not a whole lot of other evidence for their support for LGBTQ+ folks, especially for trans folks and LGBTQ+ people of color in particular. So this could be due to his wealthy whiteness, and not have anything to do with his being gay.
I think Kate and Wills did an event related to Pride years ago and got slammed in the comments for it by their Tory fans, and…haven’t really done much since? (I could be misremembering. But I don’t think anything in the last say, 2 years or more at least.)
What I think I *am* remembering correctly though is again, it was a pretty white-middle-class event, too.
@DP: It wasn’t an event it was a video that was released on the last day of pride month. It was primarily a mental health video involving gay people.
My exact first thought as well!
Charles chooses to be a bystander around a perverse elite group of powerful males he knows are guilty of illegal sexual preferences far worse than Europe’s widely accepted heterosexual adultery or being a traditional gay.
There is a conservative guy online I don’t like at all but he somehow interviews royal family haters regularly and I kept rewinding the video in shock at their details of how sexually abusive the British elite are.
Sara Poulton, Norman Baker, Maggie Oliver, Andrew Lownie report on this stuff and the sinister elite forces, monitoring, and blockages they themselves encounter.
Is it inevitable that wealthy men misuse their sexuality upon women and children and their power silences all for centuries?
No wonder Bernie Sanders says billionaires should not exist.
The Queen Mum was besties with a number of gay men, and staffed her household with gay men. Perhaps that’s where Charles learned not to be a homophobe.
I also can’t help but think of the sneering speculation — pure speculation! — by the RR that Harry and Meghan would raise their children in a gender-neutral environment. I think some of them may have even conflated “gender-neutral” with “nonbinary” (most likely with the full knowledge that it was incorrect)? Like, the mere THOUGHT of that was treated with disdain. Doesn’t bode well for a hypothetical genuinely queer royal.
@Miranda, RRs were using all the keywords to rail the right wingers against H&M. They also said that H&M aren’t gonna have a 3rd child because of the client change. H&M never said something like that.
She probably wasn’t the first, the wife of George III was known as the black Queen, grandmother to Victoria, she came from the Portuguese royal family, who used to marry into Africa, there is also talk that Phillipa of Hainault was Moorish, wife of Edward III and ancestress of both Meghan and Kate. I have had a look and I’m not sure about that so don’t quote me. But the envoy who was sent to look her over said she was brown all over,
“Queen Charlotte (1744-1818), wife of the English King George III (1738-1820), was directly descended from Margarita de Castro y Sousa, a Black branch of the Portuguese royal house.”
The portuguese royal family used to marry into Africa? That’s new. When? When? Says who? There are some posts on the internet saying Queen Charlotte descended from Madragana ben Adroano a mozarab royal concubine of king Afonso III (XIIIth century) the conqueror of Algarve, Portugal’s southern province). She wasn’t black, though. Another says Queen Charlotte descended from Margarida de Castro e Sousa, a noble woman who married into european nobility. D. Margarida was born is 1422 and if any non-portuguese ancestry it would be also mozarab, since the portuguese comercial trade with North Africa only started after the conquest of Ceuta in 1415. Try as you might and in spite of internet posts there’s no references in portuguese historiography about a black branch of the portuguese royal family. Nothing against it, though. Children of mixed race, were tolerated, even among the nobility. I personally know of some cases in the North of Portugal, either descendants of former slaves or people from the African colonies. Racism only became stronger in the last couple of centuries.
Stephen speculating on a gay “future king” certainly is interesting.
Yeah. I think he has given enough tea for the future 😉
Have the royals done any pride month events?
When is William coming out?
@Krista My thought exactly. And you know what, it would provide a totally different perspective to all of his anger issues, attitude towards Kate trying to grab him, a lot of pressure they both would be living under. And, a lot of hopelessness growing up with the burden to be king and living in a glassbowl. Well, to sum it up – that Stephen Fry comment did not come out of the blue. Let’s wait and see.
Stephen fry together with mark hamill were people who I liked until their masks slipped. Hopefully someones sexuality or how they identify should never affect how they are treated, their opportunities or rights in life. A good kind heart is what matters.
What did Hamill do? Other than openly endorse Joe Biden?
Yes, I’m curious what either of them did??
There was a Twitter thing about Mark being a Zionist, openly supporting Israel in posts & supporting Biden=condoning genocide.
I recall something was off with Fry, he said something & everyone was mad at him for a bit but I don’t remember what it was about.
I hope he’s still married because they seemed so content with each other, even with so many mocking the age difference.
I’m not sure what I’m allowed to write here but they have both been very open with endorsing what is going on in gaza which I think is genocide. I was also not aware of Stephen Fry telling vicitms of SA to grow up and stop complaining until recently.
Mark Hamill retweeted this comment by a Jon Cooper: “I’m pro-Palestinian AND vehemently anti-Hamas. I’m also pro-Israel AND vehemently anti-Netanyahu.” Zionism means that one believes Israel should exist as a country, NOT that war is good or that killing people is good.
What are you talking about?
Sure. I’d still like to see them say more about it though. Charles and Cam could go to a pride event. Why not? It’s great that they’re not homophobic but if Charles can talk about the environment as an issue why not lgbtqia issues. How about trans issues. JKR is a blight on humanity.
They’re not brave enough to attend a pride event. The press will brand them as being political and attack them for supporting trans people.
Yeah, I know. The press would do that. But idc. I’d like to see them grow a spine and do it. Not saying they actually will though😂
I was going to make a joke about booking Camilla as a guest judge on Drag Race UK, but honestly? That could be such a fun PR move for them. The fact that they saw fit to appear on a show like American Idol could even be cited as precedent.
They may be tolerant and “gay friendly” but there is no way even today an heir (George?) would be able to come out and love and marry a man.
Of course the royals have to be ‘gay friendly’ how else would they get staff, who have to be prepared to accept low wages, work all the hours that God sends and dress up in 18th century costume.
🎯
@louisa absolutely, gen a dgaf
I don’t think the monarchy is here for much longer so I don’t believe there will be a chance for gay monarch to be on the throne. Plus, they may be ok with gay people but it’s not known how they feel about trans people. Camilla opened an event with a quip about if she’s still allowed to say ladies and gentlemen so I’m not sure the Royal Family should get a cookie for being tolerant of gay people.
I think Ivar Mountbatten was the first to come out openly as gay but that was relatively recent, within the last 10 years. But he is pretty far down in the line of succession.
Of course they don’t mind it.
Why is William called Peg?? And haven’t there been photos of Charles making out with a boy?
I believe he meant an “openly” gay monarch, as there have already been gay monarchs:
King William II
Richard I
Richard II
Edward II
James I
Mary II
William III
Queen Anne
Historians seem to agree that the above all had same sex lovers.
Monarchs have died without producing an heir many times, so in theory a gay king/queen should not produce constitutional issues. COE issues, I don’t know about.
Stephen Fry is gross and I can’t believe he’s having a resurgence in his career. He’s an underage predator and worse than Kevin Spacey if that’s even possible.
Yes! Had to scroll all the way to the bottom for someone to mention it.
He’s one of many predators who cozy up to the royals for cover, he just hasn’t been outed yet.
Oh, I didn’t know that about Stephen Fry! I have been disappointed in him because I used to consider him funny, charming and very smart. Certainly smart enough to know just how deplorable the RF are, and yet he seems cozy with them. He makes good arguments against religion but has a massive blind spot when it comes to the monarchy.
I wasn’t aware of these allegations so I googled “Stephen Fry groomer” and the following link came up. It’s a link to a discussion about Fry’s comments to sexual abuse victims to “grow up” and get over the abuse already. This is absolutely disgusting.
Oops, forgot the link!
https://www.reddit.com/r/GreenAndPleasant/comments/18qrgl7/reminder_that_stephen_fry_demonised_victims_of/
I don’t think homosexuality is an issue in the UK (at least not in London). Maybe in sports like football… other than that, no one really cares.
Recalling Diana’s friendship with Elton John and her support of the LGBTQI+ community affected by AIDS, I imagine she shaped her sons’ attitudes as much as Charles.
Yeah, it wasn’t just Charles. Wonder why she wasn’t given credit.