In my opinion, Prince Harry has had knowledge of his family’s many betrayals for the past five years. In 2019, as multiple royal courts attacked him and Meghan, he had a good idea about what was happening as everything was going down. Then, at the Sandringham Summit, he came away bruised and disheartened by how he was treated. Harry has known a lot of what went down at an intellectual level, but emotionally, he’s spent years trying to give his brother and father many chances and he’s tried to communicate with them in various ways. There’s a cognitive dissonance there, and I suspect that Harry has felt that if he could just speak to William and Charles alone, without the courtiers, without the media, without the machinery of the monarchy, that somehow he could talk some sense into his brother and father. Harry’s security case seems to be the end of the cognitive dissonance, and now he’s going public. He spoke to People Magazine about what he’s learned from this years-long fight:
Prince Harry is reeling from the aftermath of a legal battle that has forced him to confront the painful reality he’s never fully escaped since leaving the U.K. in 2020 — a reality that lies at the heart of his ongoing rift with the royal family. Feeling “exhausted and overwhelmed,” Harry told PEOPLE as he left court on April 9 that his “worst fears have been confirmed by the whole legal disclosure in this case — and that’s really sad.”
The Duke of Sussex, 40, spent two days at London’s Royal Courts of Justice, deeply focused, taking notes and closely following the proceedings of his appeal regarding the removal of automatic state-backed security for him and his wife, Meghan Markle, in 2020.
When Harry and Meghan proposed to the late Queen Elizabeth that they live abroad while still supporting the monarchy, they believed they had found the ideal solution to a difficult chapter — one that would bring them happiness, leave the royal family at peace and allow their public work to continue. “We were trying to create this happy house,” Harry tells PEOPLE.
When Harry departed the Sandringham Summit in January 2020, he did so with the understanding that his security would remain in place. Court documents revealed that, in letters from the Queen herself, she expressed support for Harry and Meghan’s need for “effective security.” Yet, just one month later, the government committee responsible for state-funded security, RAVEC, informed them that this would no longer be the case.
In the years since, Harry has immersed himself in the process, including learning about RAVEC, the body responsible for the decision-making. One of his core beliefs, PEOPLE understands, is that the removal of security for him and his family when they stepped back from the working royal family was a deliberate tactic of control — a way to force them back into the fold. Rather than bringing the Sussexes back, the removal of security instead revealed to Harry the lengths to which they were willing to go, and it became the final straw. The prince admits that this realization “was difficult to swallow.”
During the two days of hearings, Harry’s legal team argued that RAVEC had “diverted” from its standard procedure, leaving Harry “singled out for different, unjustified, and inferior treatment.” They also contended that this decision excluded him from the same protections extended to others in the “Other VIP Category,” including pop stars and former prime ministers. Crucially, RAVEC includes members of the Royal Household, including close aides to his father, King Charles. Harry believes his father could intervene to ensure that such protection is extended to him. (Buckingham Palace does not comment on security matters, but a palace source previously told PEOPLE that the suggestion Harry’s security is under Charles’s control is “wholly incorrect.”)
Much of the hearing on April 9 at the Royal Courts of Justice in the heart of London was held in secret. Some of the revelations unearthed during the proceedings have deeply unsettled Harry, confirming many of his “fears” about the situation — a realization he described as profoundly disheartening.
Harry has found a way to move on and forgive much of what’s happened since 2016 — but there’s one thing he simply cannot forgive: the events surrounding the legal battle regarding his and his family’s safety. “People would be shocked by what’s being held back,” Harry says.
The Duke of Sussex has fought several legal battles, most recently securing an apology and admission from the publisher of The Sun newspaper for illegal activities carried out on their behalf, resulting in an eight-figure settlement in January 2025. But this particular fight is one that strikes at the heart of his family life and his future. “This one has always mattered the most,” Harry told PEOPLE as he left court.
The three appeal court judges have reserved their judgment, with the result not expected for several weeks. Regardless of the outcome, Harry has made it clear that he will not stop fighting. His commitment to his causes remains unwavering, and on Thursday, April 10, he flew to Ukraine to visit a clinic supporting wounded military personnel and civilians.
Above all, Harry says he is “driven by exposing injustice,” a relentless pursuit that fuels everything he does. He has long said he can’t simply let things lie — he needs to “get under the bonnet and fix it.” His determination is personal: If anything were to happen to his wife, Meghan, Duchess of Sussex, or their two young children, Prince Archie, 5, and Princess Lilibet, 3, he could never rest.
In 2023, Byline Times did some solid reporting around all of this, how the withdrawal of the Sussexes’ security is connected to Dan Wootton and Prince William’s then-aide Christian Jones, which is also connected to Harry’s refusal to play the game with the British tabloids. It’s all connected. Byline’s sources said flat-out that withdrawing the Sussexes’ security was a gambit by Charles most of all, that his ultimate goal was to put the Sussexes in so much danger that they would come running back to the UK, humbled, broke and terrified. I would go so far as to say that ultimately, Charles hoped to drive Harry and Meghan to divorce. Please, they never wanted Meghan to “come back” in any way.
Photos courtesy of Avalon Red, Cover Images, Backgrid.
- LONDON, ENGLAND – SEPTEMBER 14: Prince William, Prince of Wales, King Charles III and Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex walk behind the coffin during the procession for the Lying-in State of Queen Elizabeth II on September 14, 2022 in London, England. Queen Elizabeth II’s coffin is taken in procession on a Gun Carriage of The King’s Troop Royal Horse Artillery from Buckingham Palace to Westminster Hall where she will lay in state until the early morning of her funeral. Queen Elizabeth II died at Balmoral Castle in Scotland on September 8, 2022, and is succeeded by her eldest son, King Charles III.,Image: 722661798, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: , Model Release: no, Credit line: Jeff J Mitchell / Avalon
- King Charles III, the Queen Consort in front of the Duke and Duchess of Sussex during the State Funeral of Queen Elizabeth II, held at Westminster Abbey, London.,Image: 724154193, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: -, Model Release: no, Credit line: Gareth Fuller / Avalon
- LONDON, ENGLAND – SEPTEMBER 19: Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex follows behind The Queen’s funeral cortege borne on the State Gun Carriage of the Royal Navy as it leaves Westminster Abbey on September 19, 2022 in London, England. Elizabeth Alexandra Mary Windsor was born in Bruton Street, Mayfair, London on 21 April 1926. She married Prince Philip in 1947 and ascended the throne of the United Kingdom and Commonwealth on 6 February 1952 after the death of her Father, King George VI. Queen Elizabeth II died at Balmoral Castle in Scotland on September 8, 2022, and is succeeded by her eldest son, King Charles III.,Image: 724154654, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: -, Model Release: no, Credit line: Jeff Spicer / Avalon
- Prince William, Prince Harry and King Charles III The State Funeral of Her Majesty The Queen, Service, Westminster Abbey, London, UK – 19 Sep 2022,Image: 724167805, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: , Model Release: no, Credit line: Tim Rooke/Shutterstock / Avalon
- Prince Harry, King Charles III, Camilla Queen Consort, and Princess Anne The State Funeral of Her Majesty The Queen, Gun Carriage Procession, Wellington Roundabout, London, UK – 19 Sep 2022,Image: 724224245, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: -, *** NO UK USE FOR 48 HRS ***, Model Release: no, Credit line: Anthony Harvey/Shutterstock / Avalon
- Prince Harry arrives at The Royal Courts Of Justice in London, England, UK on Tuesday 8 April, 2025 for the start of a two day hearing to appeal the decision over his security access at the Appeals Court.,Image: 985031333, License: Rights-managed, Restrictions: Please credit photographer and agency when publishing as Justin Ng/UPPA/Avalon., Model Release: no, Credit line: Justin Ng/Avalon
- London, UNITED KINGDOM – Prince Harry And Meghan Markle (the Duke and Duchess of Sussex) Attended Their Last Official Event As Working Royals The couple joined the Queen and other family members at the annual Commonwealth Day service in Westminster Abbey, Pictured: Prince Harry, Meghan Markle BACKGRID USA 9 MARCH 2020 USA: +1 310 798 9111 / usasales@backgrid.com UK: +44 208 344 2007 / uksales@backgrid.com *UK Clients – Pictures Containing Children Please Pixelate Face Prior To Publication*
- London, UNITED KINGDOM – Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex, was seen leaving the Royal Courts of Justice after the start of his legal appeal against a High Court ruling on his security arrangements in the UK. Pictured: Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex BACKGRID USA 8 APRIL 2025 BYLINE MUST READ: Zak Hussein / BACKGRID USA: +1 310 798 9111 / usasales@backgrid.com UK: +44 208 344 2007 / uksales@backgrid.com *UK Clients – Pictures Containing Children Please Pixelate Face Prior To Publication*
- London, UNITED KINGDOM – Prince Harry arrived at the High Court in London to begin legal proceedings against the British government, challenging the decision to reduce his taxpayer-funded security while visiting the UK. The Duke of Sussex is disputing the ruling made by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (RAVEC) after he and Meghan stepped down as working royals in 2020. Pictured: Prince Harry BACKGRID USA 8 APRIL 2025 BYLINE MUST READ: Mattpapz / BACKGRID USA: +1 310 798 9111 / usasales@backgrid.com UK: +44 208 344 2007 / uksales@backgrid.com *UK Clients – Pictures Containing Children Please Pixelate Face Prior To Publication*
- London, UNITED KINGDOM – Prince Harry arrived at the High Court in London to begin legal proceedings against the British government, challenging the decision to reduce his taxpayer-funded security while visiting the UK. The Duke of Sussex is disputing the ruling made by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (RAVEC) after he and Meghan stepped down as working royals in 2020. Pictured: Prince Harry BACKGRID USA 8 APRIL 2025 BYLINE MUST READ: Mattpapz / BACKGRID USA: +1 310 798 9111 / usasales@backgrid.com UK: +44 208 344 2007 / uksales@backgrid.com *UK Clients – Pictures Containing Children Please Pixelate Face Prior To Publication*
- 09-03-2020 Commonwealth Day Celebrations Westminster Abbey 2020
- 09-03-2020 Commonwealth Day Celebrations Westminster Abbey 2020
“People would be shocked by what’s being held back”. At what time is Harry going to reveal this? And can he? Is he being prevented from disclosing this?
I read somewhere that the secret stuff will be released with the judgement…. But I’m not sure. Maybe it’s just wishful thinking
I wouldn’t be surprised if Spare: Part 2 comes out after Charles dies.
From past interviews, it seemed like the only reason Harry held back half of the book because he still held hope that he could reconcile with Charles and William. But it sounds like after this week, he might have finally accepted that’s never going to happen. And maybe he no longer cares about sparing their feelings.
@Snuffles, do I misremember it? Harry said, he gave a lot of details to the ghost writer, because he needed to understand some of Harry’s motivations about the decisions he made. He never intended to put those parts into a book, because they were too revealing. Did he say there is another book though? That was the tabloids’ talking point, I thought.
@sevenblue
I believe the ghost writer said that there was enough material for another book. Over 400 pages worth. But, yeah, Harry never said anything about releasing another book.
@Snuffles, oh okay, that is where that came from then. That guy has no media training 😭😭 He even stated all the mistakes he made unintentionally on his New Yorker article with his social media posts.
I bet it’s Chuck’s involvement (and his minions) in Diana losing security leading to her death.
I so want the rest to be released BEFORE Charles dies. Charles should be fully exposed and shamed worldwide before his final breath. He should die knowing that’s how the world will remember him.
Gabby, Gabby, Gabby, that is EXACTLY how I feel. Fuck Charles’ feelings. I believe in consequences, and I believe the Royal Family, Charles in particular, have a certain kind of insanity in believing they can avoid that, and it is insane to think you can control the world.
I saw a picture of Charles in Rome looking back angrily at someone who yelled “Diana” at him. I was thrilled. I will never forget. I am afraid for Harry. I don’t wanna be, but I’m getting there.
@Snuffles … Harry made the deliberate statement that they’d removed at least 400 pages, enough for a second book.
Agree with Gabby. Charles deserves no grace whatsoever.
“I bet it’s Chuck’s involvement (and his minions) in Diana losing security leading to her death.”
Diana dismissed and gave up her Royal Security because she did not want to be “spied on” by the security staff. She believed that the Royal Security Protection staff was reporting every detail back to the palace.
He is fighting in the court now, so I am guessing after the judgment (positive or negative), his team would be more free to make comments on it. Some part of the court proceedings will be out-of-public record due to the sensitive nature of the discussion according to what I have read. So, he can’t reveal it all.
In my opinion, the only reason Harry is talking now is to protect himself, Meghan, Lili, and Archie. If something happens to them now, his finger is pointing to who he believes is the culprit. On the record. Scary stuff.
I agree, I think Harry knows there’s no way this is going to go in his direction. He wants to get as much on the record as he can.
I have the same question. I wonder when he’ll be able to talk explicitly about it?
I’m sure it’s painful for Harry to know just how low his brother and father are willing to go but Harry wanted all the information on who did what and it seems he now has it confirmed. I think Harry’s need for justice will in fact expose his family and I think Harry has come to terms with those facts. I can’t imagine having a family who literally doesn’t care if you die just because you refuse to come back and play scapegoat to a lazy narcissistic brother and a father who lets his side piece take his family apart one by one.
Charles and Clive Alderton are mentioned a lot and obviously Charles is the King but iirc William’s Simon Case was also on RAVEC or had something to do with it too. Am I remembering that right?
Yes, both Charles and William have a rep on RAVEC.
I read somewhere that “the palace” (aka BRFCo) directly controls 40% of RAVEC. Naturally, that doesn’t tell us how much influence they exert for indirect control.
According to UK Gov ‘Companies House’ a 25% share ownership or 25% voting rights identifies “people with significant control (PSCs)” (https://www.gov.uk/guidance/people-with-significant-control-pscs). Of course UK Gov does not regulate BRFCo like other businesses — because BRFCo members (and their associated proxies) have been exalted by God to rule over the rabble.
Unfortunately I can. We experienced similar treatment from my husband’s parents and his brother. Then they let the rest of the family believe we abandoned them when they estranged us and their only grandchild. It’s the actions of a family dynamic deeply rooted in narcissism. I feel for the Sussexes. This type of betrayal by your own family leaves a mark no matter how hard you try to rise above it. I hope Harry’s public crusade for justice will provide some peace and resolution.
Yeah show us and shock us all Harry. Let’s see how shocked they will be and how they’ll try to spin this
Yep, I especially hope the ‘wholly incorrect’ lie is revealed. How is Chuck so important he had to sign off on the British steel deal, but can’t pull strings to endanger, or protect (wishful thinking), his child? He is a colonizer through and through who loves that control.
Britain has some of the strictest, at times bordering on ridiculous, confidentiality laws, ranging from laws that specifically protect the sovereign and their household from personal, difficult, or unfavorable disclosures to one of the broadest definitions of “official secrets” (things they can designate as never to be disclosed, under penalty of prosecution, due to so-designated security or other “national” interests) and many, many court cases (especially any involving the BRF, aristocrats, or major politicians) are under gag order from the jump.
And while Charles (officially), and William (effectively) are wholly immune from criminal contempt and/or prosecution, Harry is not, and thus must follow everything to the letter or risk not only losing his court case, but also facing criminal liability, in many cases.
The really sad thing is that people like us won’t be shocked, it will be more ‘I told you so’. It has been clear for some years that the Wails, in particular, are actively trying to sabotage Harry and Meghan’s success, whilst Charles , I believe, is totally in thrall to Camilla, and she totally loathes Harry because he spoke the truth about her. Her friendship, now echoed by Willi, with Clarkson confirms my suspicions on her behaviour.
I think Prince Harry is still unable to believe the degree of malevolence he & his family are receiving from his father & his brother. I think that’s his achilles heel. Anyone else who has witnessed the degree of malice that his mother Princess Diana received throughout her marriage & after her divorce from Charles, from the RF & the British press, will have realized that the extreme toxicity has always been there & will be unlikely to change until the monarchy itself is abolished. The edifice of the monarchy is gradually crumbling. It may happen after Charles dies. The Republican movement in UK is growing.
Malevolence passively from his father, actively from his brother, but don’t forget Camilla… I think hers is the most active of all the malevolence. Just think if what Jeremy Clarkson said about Meghan two days after his brunch with Camilla. He said meghan was worse than Britain’s only female serial killer of children. (Everyone goes on about his “pelted with excrement” comment but the Rose West comparison was disgusting). Camilla has also sent thank you notes to Piers Morgan. It’s deeply toxic. So happy they left!!!!!!!!
I am actually wondering about that. Those court appointments were live on YouTube, so how is there still information not known?
If it meant getting Harry back, I think they would “suffer” through Meghan’s presence.
Respectfully disagree. Getting rid of Meghan, one way or another, is the prime goal. Harry and children will return once Meghan is out of the way.
And the children would be treated as second class citizens. Heaven forbid they go back
If something happened to Meghan, even then, I don’t think Harry would return with the kids.
I doubt harry wants their children near Kate and William and Charles and camilla
No if something happens to Meg Harry will not go back and expose his children to the institution.
Respectfully disagree. In my opinion part of Charles not being in Lili and Archie’s lives is so he doesn’t catch feelings for them. So whatever he “allows” to him to them will essentially be happening to strangers.
Harry has made it very clear that he’s never going back, in any meaningful way. He wants the ability to safely show his children his home country and work with his U.K. charities. What a monster.
If something were to happen to Meghan and he suspected that the family was involved, I think he would turn into a Jason Statham character and extract revenge against all involved. He would never go back. If the family knows what’s best for them, they need to leave Meghan and the children alone. I think having a family keeps his dark side in check.
The biggest miscalculations the PTB in Britain made was: 1) think that Duchess Meghan would never get pregnant or would never love Prince Harry enough to suffer such abuse, hate, racism and vitriol and stick with her husband.
2) that Prince Harry would ever make the decision to remove his wife and child from the danger that is the Firm and that he would leave with his wife and child when all was said and done and go live with them anywhere else.
3) that Prince Harry and Duchess Meghan would thrive outside the Firm
4) last but not least, that no matter what they did, Prince Harry would never willingly come back to that Firm under whatever circumstances.
Charles and to some extent William did everything that was done to force the above not to happen but they hugely miscalculated and here we are. Prince Harry will never come back to the Uk to live, even if him and the Duchess were ever to separate.
And I’m not sure why Prince Harry thinks anything can shock the public now. We all have always been suspicious of Princess Diana’s death and all that surrounded that. The propaganda that the palaces put out that she refused security etc has already been confirmed as lies. Many of us already know that the chase in Manhattan of the Sussexes and Ms. Doria back in 2023 was not random but an attempt to repeat the incident in Paris all those years ago back in 1997 when Princess Diana was killed. When you disagree with king Charles and the Firm, they kpai you; they did so to princess Diana and wanted to repeat in 2023. Nothing is shocking any more.
You left out one thing, Charles didn’t anticipate that anyone would help Harry and Meghan the way Tyler Perry did. He did not calculate that they would have allies outside the British system with enough money and power to help them in the way they needed. He thought they would be isolated, lazy, and greedy like so many of the other royals. They didn’t count on H&M having the work ethic they do and their willingness to eschew the trappings of royalty to maintain their peace and gain their independence. So as Julia Roberts said to the snobby shop clerk in Pretty Woman, Big Mistake! Huge!
Agree with everything you wrote Lawrenceville!
Whatever came out in the Court case means Harry will never come back, IMO. I suspect, sadly, it may mean he will never attend any royal events again either… maybe his Father’s funeral. The stay behinds are so short sighted, imagine if Meghan’s flare and hard work was being put to good use supporting the Commonwealth which Willi and Kate seem totally disinterested in.
I think most of us knew it was them all along so it’s not a surprise but Prince Harry’s comments were absolutely heartbreaking 💔..
Yeah, I’m sure he knew but to have it confirmed was probably heartbreaking for him. No one wants to believe their father and brother are that evil.
Yup. At least he’s seeking therapy, his father and brother are irretrievably damaged souls.
My hope for Prince Harry is he finally accepts if he is not working for his family, he has no value to them. Hard pill to swallow but his reality. He is not valued as a human being but a tool to be used and his created family has zero value to his birth family and he will be able to live his life according to this new (for him) accepted reality going forth.
This 🎯! It’s been apparent to outsiders like us for a long time. But for Harry himself it’s been a longer process to accept the harsh truth with all its implications (has my family ever really loved me?). I do hope he can move on now. And I also hope that at some point this reality causes him to reject monarchy itself. It may help him see that the institution overwhelmed his family to the point that they ceased to be a family.
Of no value but a tool to be used. That, in a nutshell, is the reason so many of us are estranged from a family member. Reply to Maxine branch
Absolutely! I’ve recently become obsessed with the Tudors. I said to my husband that if you don’t have time to read about all the historical insanity of the European royal families, the Tudors are like the Cliff’s notes of how bloody and cruel royal families are. The Windsors don’t have the luxury of imprisoning or beheading problematic family members, but the desire to do so is still coursing through their veins. They just use more modern approaches to it.
I wonder why you think the Windsors have no ability to kill anyone😟 Consider what happened to Diana and Dodi. And Charles is on record saying if anything were to happen to Prince Harry the monarchy would go on with no dent. They’ve not harmed Prince Harry just yet, but they do have the ability and power to do so and Prince Harry knows it too. The Windsors are the British mafiosi.
I literally meant they can’t have people executed for being an annoyance. They absolutely have blood on their hands.
Looking forward to the day when entire stadiums of people are gonna sing “Chucky’s in a box.” Anyone who endangers their child like that deserves eternal disrespect.
People won’t bother. His mother was worthy, but this man…what good can be said of him?
William is the one who first sold out their location in Canada via DanW. His awful, racist, manipulative, lying bitch of a wife worked hard to drive Meghan to suicidal ideation. Bill is just as bad or worse than Charles; I wouldn’t wish Charles dead knowing Bill is next in line.
Charles and William hate and envy Harry. Their hatefulness will destroy the Mockery that is the monarchy , and they deserve it! I can’t imagine treating my brother and son the way W & C treat Harry. All because he married a spectacular Black woman who outshone all of them!
I’m always reminded of this bit in The Standard, published quite some time ago.
• King Charles justifies the government preventing his son from having security by arguing that a successful attack on
Prince Harry would not significantly disturb the British public. •
Sadly there’s no date on the screenshot I found on Twitter.
How can a father treat his own son and his son’s family in such a disgustingly inhuman way? C-Rex and the rest of the Left-Behinds are truly sick and depraved.
Abolish the monarchy.
What??? Never saw this before. What a brutal thing to say about your child. Wonder if this is a part of the court record?
I can confirm having seen it.
I saw that years ago.
OMFG! But wasn’t that the assumption about Diana’s death as well. They were certainly shocked by the public reaction to her death.
Entitlement destroys the ability to read a room. Always. 🙄😈
Yes, it was very strangely (confusingly) worded.
I’m afraid that Harry always suspected the truth but he hoped he was wrong…unfortunately, his worst fears have been confirmed..is there any doubt about the role of his brother and father in this? They don’t want him or Meghan in United Kingdom (for a number of reasons, mostly because of his and Meghan’s popularity) and considering that Harry doesn’t want to risk his wife’s or his children’s lives, they are withholding their security when in Britain to keep him away…
IMO they do want Harry, not Meghan and the children. William wants Harry back, under his heel, beholden to him for every crumb on his table. In William’s mind Harry was born to be his permanent whipping boy – and he’ll do anything to crush Harry back under his control in the UK.
I hope somehow everything comes out about the diabolical C & W, and the trash british media, and all the trash institutions over there that are trying to destroy Harry,Meghan, and their two children. I hope this all hastens the end of the Mockery!
Looking at it over the years, I think they literally wanted to scare her to death. If death had been the result of their efforts, it would have been considered unfortunate, but life must go on, right?
I also think Kaiser is right and Harry gained knowledge over the circumstances surrounded the situation with his mother
Is Harry allowed to make personal comments on the case before the judges have delivered their verdict?
Exactly what comments (personal or otherwise) has Prince Harry made about the case?
Noor is not accusing, she’s asking.
It is hard to accept that your relatives would rather have you and your family dead than out of their control. It also, I’m sure, like for many others, makes him question what went on with his mother’s security.
Much like an honor killing?
I would not be at all surprised. Especially given who Diana was dating at the time.
This thing withe Queen’s letters is extra disturbing. I’ve always wondered why Harry was allowed to marry Meghan. Was this a rift between Elizabeth and Charles? If Charles were king at the time, would he have allowed the marriage?
Charles got to marry the other woman he and Camilla were both divorced. He could not take the upper hand
As per CoE rules at the time, Charles was considered a widower. And as per 2002, divorced persons are allowed to marry in CoE.
As Meghan wasn’t married in the CoE, her first marriage didn’t really ‘count’ according to the church. Like Letizia’s first marriage didn’t ‘count’ in the Catholic Church.
Racists and haters were spinning all kinds of lies about the Church denying Harry the ability to marry Meghan. That’s why someone from the Church came out and said they’d welcome a Harry/Meghan marriage months before they announced their engagement.
Charles was no widower. Nor was it generally accepted. Some ultra conservatives felt so. Charles was no widower otherwise Diana s h r h by marriage could not be removed. He could not publicly date Camilla and she could not publicly date d o d I. Charles gave Camilla a very out public birthday party
And why would he pay a divorce settlement while still married to Diana. There was a divorce recognized
Plus Camilla still had an ex husband still living. I think Charles tried the widower card to no avail. He treated Diana horribly
Alte ya William has no jurisdiction over the Sussex children.
If Charles were ruled a,widower Diana would have been entitled to a royal funeral. He also has to pay a divorce settlement to his e x wife. Plus camillas first marriage was legal.and she needed the divorce.
It would be hard for them to say no, they would have been accused of racism. The King married a divorcee so that’s no excuse, Frederick Windsor married an actress so that’s no excuse either, but Meghan is the first mixed racer to marry into the royal family since George III married Charlotte of Mecklenburg-Strelitz. Queen Victoria’s grandmother.
You’re forgetting Lady Davina Windsor’s Maori ex-husband.
Yes you are right, but she is nowhere near the succession, which I think was the breaking point for the royals, Harry was too close to the top. Archie is now 6th and as a close heir to the throne he is officially under the King’s guardianship, he has to ask the King’s permission to marry, and of course by the time he grows up it will probably be William’s permission. When the William is King, Lilibet will also have to ask, unless of course George or his siblings have children and put Harry’s children further down the succession. I don’t know what happens if they marry without permission.
‘Have to ask permission to marry’. Bull pucky! Archie & Lili are both American citizens and they don’t have to ask anybody’s permission to get married. I know, I know, I know their stupid ‘rules’. Doesn’t matter, doesn’t apply to these two because again, they’re American citizens.
Regardless of place in succession, you were forgetting her ex.
BeanieBean, citizenship is irrelevant here. The first six adults in the line of succession must have the monarch’s permission to marry or they forfeit their place in the succession. This was reaffirmed in the 2013 Succession to the Crown Act.
(1)A person who (when the person marries) is one of the 6 persons next in the line of succession to the Crown must obtain the consent of Her Majesty before marrying.
(2)Where any such consent has been obtained, it must be—
(a)signified under the Great Seal of the United Kingdom,
(b)declared in Council, and
(c)recorded in the books of the Privy Council.
(3)The effect of a person’s failure to comply with subsection (1) is that the person and the person’s descendants from the marriage are disqualified from succeeding to the Crown.
(4)The Royal Marriages Act 1772 (which provides that, subject to certain exceptions, a descendant of King George II may marry only with the consent of the Sovereign) is repealed.
I have no doubt William will use this against Harry’s children when he can. To remove Harry’s children from the line of succession is one of Bill’s wet dreams.
Charles does not have custody of those children. That is some ancient law no longer valid. And it only seems to come up on talk Harry’s and meghans hildren no one elses. Charles is not going to claim custody at his age
@alteya: 🙄 I knew someone would point out how wrong I was, listing all the various English laws, yada yada yada. Doesn’t matter. The State of California wouldn’t hold up a marriage license for either of these kids, should they choose to marry, in order to double-check with the English monarch. Stuff and nonsense.
It’s clear that Charles didn’t want Harry to marry Meghan. However he had no say in that decision. If he was King at the time most definitely he not have given permission to Harry to marry Meghan. I think even if it was someone different Charles wouldn’t have given him permission to get married. I think he and William knew that whenever he got married his family would have come first not the Crown.
Charles had a lot of say in a lot of decisions before Elizabeth died – evidently, not on this one particular decision, which I think is interesting. I think it comes down to what we’ve always said here – Elizabeth loved Harry (and by extension, Meghan) and Charles and William have always hated Harry. Harry danced around it in Spare, but it looks like the revelations in this security case have solidified it for him. And if Charles could be so ruthless with his son, then how much more ruthless would he have been with Diana.
I think Charles has always seen Harry as a tool, a cog in the machine, but doesn’t hate him. William is the one who has hated Harry since the first moment Diana told him she was expecting a younger sibling for him.
I’m pretty sure that Archie & Lilibet would be fine about not being in the line of succession when they grow up! LOL!
I think that the Queen genuinely liked Meghan and had a true love for Harry and so she said yes because she wanted him to marry the woman he loves. I think that is why they always kept in touch through Zoom and phone calls. That’s why they were able to sneak into the UK to see her and why they named their daughter after her. She was one of the few in the family who loved them and wanted them to be happy and safe. She is the one who provided them security for her Jubilee and she’s the only one to write the courts to give them the security they deserve. She knew that their security was wrongfully taken away from them and she went outside her norms to try and rectify the situation. I think Charles was okay with Meghan at first because he believed that as an American she would be so impressed with being royal that she would take whatever abuse they threw at her. They look down on people who aren’t like them and she was as far removed from being like them than anyone else who has married into the family. They thought they could draw her into their cult because as an American they assumed she could be easily manipulated.
I agree with all of these points… this is how I’ve seen it as well.
Very distressing but not surprising.
The answer is to subdivide RAVEC. The two royal goons on RAVEC should only get a say in the security of ‘working’ royals. They will be given no information about any other VIP security arrangements, no more demanding Harry give 28 days notice when no one else has to. All other VIPs (including Sussex family) and their security should be decided by a royal minion-free RAVEC.
THIS is exactly what needs to happen. There is absolutely no reason for royal private secretaries to be on such a committee, even if one could conceivably understand that they might be involved with arrangements for their principals. But that’s where their involvement should end. I’ve worked with people like that before, who take great pride and pleasure in being involved with “important” matters, even if it’s nothing to do with them and is none of their business. Once they get on such a committee, they cling to it with both hands for dear life, just to keep “in the know” about things that other mere mortals never get a chance to learn.
Yes, let us not forget “The Bee”, Sir Edward Young, then Queen Elizabeth’s private secretary, who deliberately failed to pass on the offer Harry made to pay privately to keep the armed officers. When Harry first went to court in 2022 the Judge, Peter Lane, threw out the case but it showed that Harry’s offer had been discussed with top government aides in 2020. His request was then rejected by Cabinet Secretary Sir Mark Sedwill, the head of Britain’s civil service and a top adviser to the prime minister. The chair of RAVEC agreed with the decision. It appears Charles has everyone who thwarted Harry’s request in his pocket.
Not just Charles. Billy’s boy on RAVEC is on board with destroying Harry’s security too.
It calls into question what happened with Diana’s security. The Palace has always said that she refused security meaning they were willing to continue to give her police protection. So why was the Palace unwilling to give Harry and his family security?
What the palace claimed and the reality can be two different things. Diana was suspicious of Charles for good reason imo
I think that was a misleading lie. Looking back at articles about it, you can find that it mostly says things like insiders say and maybe one ex-security person quoted but I think that’s about it.
If the BM and BRF’s methods with Diana were anything like they are with the Sussexes, I also don’t believe that Diana was offered security. Again, that same security issue with both Diana and her son. Or, if they did offer it to her, it had unacceptable strings to it, like expecting her to give a month’s notice before doing anything. My goodness, even Chuck’s reaction to prospective harm to Harry is similar to Diana, Nah, no one will really notice.
Absolutely. At best, she refused a security offer with untenable strings. But I think they barely offered her anything and then lied after the fact to cover their asses.
Harry was alone with William he mentioned one of their encounters when William punched him.
What bothers me is that they’ve created this bespoke situation just for Harry. No other vip entering the uk has these rules made just for them. He’s being singled out and punished. And it’s obvious.
Exactly. To look at the extended version? The current situation allows Charles and William to deny security to any other VIP they want. Let’s say some of their buddies in Saudi Arabia or UAE want security denied to Salman Rushdie? It would be allowed to happen.
Do they or do they just decide on Harry?
They control RAVEC with their goons. That is one of the many things Harry’s lawsuits and discovery are showing. The absolute unearned level of control Charlie and Bill have. They have the power to remove the security of whomever they want if overseen by RAVEC (Royal And VIP Executive Committee), because Home Office bows down to RAVEC decisions.
I guess what I mean is does RAVEC get in anyone else’s business like this except for Harry. Technically they could. But it’s only him so far.
It’s even more obvious when you consider Andrew, who is also a “non working royal” and the King’s own Spare (even if he’s not high up in the line of succession anymore). Andrew has full 24/7 security, arranged AND PAID FOR by Charles. RAVEC is A-OK with that as long as Charles is. So singling out Harry for this discriminatory treatment isn’t just comparing Harry to Taylor Swift or whomever. It’s disciminatory within Harry’s own immediate family!
I am so sorry for Harry. The day when you find out or finally accept the truth about your family’s toxic behaviour toward you is a terrible, terrible day. Thank all the Gods he has Meghan and his children and a good therapist, and a truly lived and wonderful life but nothing can make up for that wound. You have to just deal with it and move on
Inerestingly, this has escalated to this point because the Windsor men are too whimpy to simply step up and own their own decisions. Instead they tried first to hide behind their courtiers, then the government when in fact Chuck and his grey suited advisors eere too clever by half. The both wanted to control Harry by restricting his security. The truth always was that it was Charles’s perogative to decide who gets protection and who does not. Harry had to spend a fortune on lawyers to extract this truth. Like it or not, it is Charles’s game…he just did not want to be tainted by his stupid choice to put his son in danger, even though Harry and family face a real threat in the UK and two people were sent to prison for a real plot to hurt or kill them. What a bunch of vile and incompetent advisors on staff at the palace.
I hope Harry finally accepts his birth family’s treachery and follow Meghan’s example to cut off toxic relatives for good. Going to Charles’ funeral is a toss up, but William’s coronation is a no go. Thr Sussexes’ not attending those events would dominate the news. You saw how fast the coverage on the Sentebale scandal went away when Harry and Meghan are out and about and are doing good works and securing the bag. The Firm and Windsors are mad no manufactured scandals aren’t sinking them. Those remaining 400 pages need to be used as an insurance policy: should any happen to a Sussex Spare part 2 comes out.
If I was him, and decided to attend, I would show up for only the funeral but skip the pomp procession, and instead walk in, sit and leave with The Spencers.
I like the idea of him sitting with the Spencers.
But would the Spencers even be invited to Charles’ funeral?
The Spencers didn’t go to the con-a-nation so I highly doubt they’d attend his funeral unless it was to make sure he really was dead!
I don’t see the Spencer’s being invited to Charlie’s funeral or heaven forbid Bill’s crown party.
I can see The Spencers showing up solely for Harry and William….especially to support Harry if he were to attend.
BM keeps saying that Harry thinks his father, the king, has the power to restore his security, and obviously one would conclude that it was his father who took away his security in the first place. Apparently RAVEC’s decisions are not not subject to any law, but the “king’s prerogative.” So, to put it bluntly, Charles does not care if Harry and his whole family lives or dies if he cannot control them. Because Harry was born into the monarchy, the price of his happiness and his desire to do good in the world is eternal insecurity. It is heart-breaking. I pray someday, this will not be the case, for the sake of Archie and Lili and their parents’ peace of mind. Charles has no love for his sons or their mother. He is a terrible human being and a vile parent.
“He is a terrible human being and a vile parent.”
And not much to look at either.
William is absolutely no better.
What will Chuckie say if there is an assassination attempt on H&M? What if, God forbid, it was successful? Doesn’t he realize that it would be the end of his monarchy, and all that it would be known for? What a great guy, denying security to his son. Chuck and Willie’s jealousy is heinous. It is beyond disgusting all the way to depraved indifference .
It wouldn’t be the end, they’d have him abdicate like Juan Carlos II.
They’ll go through the heirs until they find a willing one. Willie is and the grey men are willing to overlook his laziness to support him as king.
Not sure about the public though.
They wouldn’t make Charles abdicate over Sussex family.
Charles has already said that if something were to happen to Harry it wouldn’t be a huge blow to the monarchy.
The event in New York a few years ago where they were hounded by paps driving crazy for hours might have been one. Big dark colored SUVs driven recklessly with a camera flash out the window every now and then could easily have been an attempt to Diana them or at least be a warning. Honestly that happening after Harry revealing his security being cut off is what made me understand there might really be a diana conspiracy.
It wasn’t just then. When Harry was back to unveil the Diana statue, William delighted in Harry’s motorcade being hounded by paps. He even trash talked Harry at the second event the following day when Harry wasn’t there.
Harry, only the heirs are allowed to be “happy.”
Your mother pointed out that your father was to blame if she died.
Your father and your brother are willing to sacrifice anyone, including you. You cannot choose your birth family but I hope you find peace eventually. Your compassion does you good, but they are the automatons supporting a system corrupt in its core. Feel pity for them but know they want you broken and lonely.
Charles always had the Princess Anne model for the spare sibling. The spare being a blood royal would be a working royal but their spouse and children would not be royals. That’s why he wanted a sister for the heir. William on the other hand wanted his spare sibling to be unmarried so that his perfect family man image would remain unchallenged. He thinks he is already contrasting himself to his father in that regard.
Both Charles and William would have made the life of any bride of Harry’s hell even if he married a blond English rose, even if Kate handpicked a Harriet Smith (Emma ref) for Harry. I think this is where Harry was in denial. Because the racism was so loud and undeniable, he thought his family’s rejection was specific to Meghan. It wasn’t. But the rejection was so intertwined with racism that, Harry thought if he challenged the racism (or unconscious bias) he would challenge the rejection.
I think despite her shortcomings Queen Elizabeth held no agenda about Harry’s married future. She gave her consent and that consent is used by Charles and William as evidence of her “misjudgment” and they used that consent to gain power in the family and the courtiers were happy to help when there’s changing of hands of power. Harry realized this a bit too late. A significant part of the smear campaign against Meghan was to show the Queen how wrong she was of giving that consent.
The ultimate goal is causing divorce and getting Harry back alone to act in the role of the spare sibling originally conjured up by Charles and William.
Now the palaces can’t say recollections may vary. Harry has court evidence. I hope he uses it to his advantage without caution.
Before the birth of Wills and Harry, Andrew was the spare, and Edward the extra spare. Anne was third, after her two brothers. The Queen made changes prior to the birth of William’s children so that first-born would be heir regardless of gender.
I know that Anne wasn’t Charles’ spare. Because Charles only had two children, he wanted to customize the “Anne model” for the only sibling of his heir. Maybe I wasn’t clear in explaining.
We don’t know what narratives are being written for the Wales siblings yet.
Gemini I don’t think that Charles had the “Anne model” planned for his sons otherwise Harry and Meghan wouldn’t have been given their dukedoms at marriage. Them both having their dukedoms put them in a different position from Anne’s husband. They were both doing tours and working on behalf of the royal family immediately after their wedding. They were even doing royal engagements together prior to their wedding. Charles was part of the planning process for their huge globally televised wedding, which wouldn’t have been needed for someone who wasn’t working on behalf of the royal family. Meghan’s very first engagement as a royal was at a garden party hosted by Charles.
I also think Philip liked Meghan and he supported the Queen in approving the marriage.
If we look at when Charles started to have the Queen make decisions on his behalf it really was after his father died. I think the Queen lost her main support and her health started to fail more too.
I’d say the stage was set when Philip retired to Wood Farm (at age 95) and, just few months later, Charles and Andrew succeeded in bouncing Geidt as TQ’s private secretary and elevated Edward Young in his place. That must have been a significant loss for TQ as well; the well respected Geidt had been in her employ for 15 years, and officially her PS for 10 years. Definitely downhill from there.
I always hear about how Andrew and Charles worked together to oust Geidt and put in EY. But how did that happen? I’d love more details on that. Bc why did the queen capitulate to her sons? Why didn’t she just say no? This was right before Meghan entered right? If the queen could give into that then what else was she giving into? I don’t excuse the queen for a lot of things in relation to Harry and Meghan. I think she could’ve done better. But there are so many signs that she was not on top pf things for the last few years…understandably considering she was in her 90s.
Geidt got in big trouble with Charles and Andrew in 2017 over Philip’s retirement. He called a meeting of 500 staff, told them Philip was retiring, and made it clear how important Sophie and Edward were to the future of the BRF. Charles wasn’t going to forgive that since he wanted to offload them – and that Geidt had left Charles out of the process.
Thx for the background! But even with those details, couldn’t the queen have still potentially told Charles to f-ck off and keep Geidt? Why didn’t she?
They created the “bespoke” arrangement without completing a procedural risk assessment so it was fundamentally inadequate from inception: it was deliberate and malicious.
If Harry, Meghan and the children’s security was set to the lower than royal criteria as given to high profile visiting VIPs, they’d be getting a consistent approach rather than the case by case basis being used now. Obviously, that suits the institution because they can deny any security for fraudulent reasons to limit the Sussexes returning to the UK whenever they want.
As to those 400 pages cut from “Spare”; wait until the case with the Daily Mail is finalised and then hold on to your butts.
It seems to me that King Charles wanted Prince Harry to end this review because it puts him in such a poor light.
Same as the Spare book, they weren’t apologetic for what was done to Prince Harry; they were angry for being exposed.
What a toxic environment. Petty, churlish and narcissistic
But what if Peg needs a liver transplant? He’s a heavy drinker, and he can’t take a peasant’s liver, that would be low-brow.
William would use one of his own children for the donor, justifying it as believing his life has more value than theirs.
Peg can have Zara or Mike Tindall’s liver. I’m sure each is in excellent condition.
The press made a HUGE fuss about the cost of providing security for Harry. They were clearly intent on stirring up public sentiment about it, just as they did with Frogmore. I’ve always suspected that pressure played a role in Charles’ decision regarding both things.
As per the agreement, there was supposed to be a one year trial period, so technically they were still working royals who had a year to decide whether they would walk away entirely, continue as part time royals or return as full time working royals. Charles removed their security prematurely at a time when they were at a greater risk of being harmed or worse with their infant child.
So while the press made a big deal about the security, Charles was in lock-step with them on that imo. The press has complained about Andrew’s security, sure not quite to the same degree, but Charles still kept his security on. I can’t remember if he still does? The press and Charles both wanted to squeeze Harry back by using the security issue.
Jais, dare I say Charles was not in lockstep with the press, they were in lockstep with his wishes. This fish rots from the head.
Fair point. You’re absolutely right. That’s actually one area where I’m consistently confused. It’s technically better for the press to have Harry and his family return for visits with security bc it means more Sussex content which gets more clicks. And yet they are, as you say, in lock-step with Charles and William? They should be annoyed af with them for denying them clicks. And yet they back the monarchy so oh well.
@Jais, Andrew’s security wasn’t removed after he stepped down. I think, it was removed after Harry’s security case started. But, according to the reports, Charles is paying for his security now. So, he was never left without security. I think, if Harry never sued for security, Andrew would still keep his without any media asking him questions about it.
I guess the question is what type of security is Charles paying for? Is it strictly private or RPO’s through the govt?
Even if Harry loses this case he is clearly demostrating the corruption that lead to him losing security to begin with and raises pointed questions about Diana’s lack of adequate security after her divorce. A high profile person should have additional security/police protection when needed for the public good. Period. If the UK can roll out extra protection for celebrities (like TS), they are obligated to protect the spare that has been made a target of wingnut hate by a deliberate smear campaign orchestrated by Willy and Charles/Camilla. Their abuse of power and level of media/politcal manipulation is horrifying and mind boggling. Harry was kinder towards the Windsors in Spare than they deserved, yet the media campaign orchestrated by the leftovers continues. I hope that Harry drops a book and documentary that uncovers the political/media corruption he has been subjected to before Charles passes and burns the house of Windsor down.
Waaay back when, Harry said, as he was leaving (i think this was their 2nd to last engagement, when H wore red uniform and M wore red cape dress) “if you knew what I know”.
So Harry had an inkling even then. His brain knew, but his heart needed more information and more time to catch up.
Harry always assumed it was the gray men making those decisions, telling QE2 if she lets H&M be half in / half out, it would damage monarchy, for example. He was thinking, it was them convincing his father, grandmother and brother to make those decisions, to leak lies about Meghan, etc. He learned his brother’s involvement later on. He even shared his suspicions about his brother’s aide leaking to tabloids with William and he was happy Will listened to him intently. He didn’t know at the time, Will approved of the attacks. I think, Jason’s involvement in Daily Mail court case made it apparent, since he couldn’t give that info without breaking NDA with his boss.
heartbreaking
I still don’t understand why the RF didn’t agree to the half in- half out idea. What was so wrong about that? Anyway, if your father is King, and worth billions, & won’t cover you & your family’s (necessary) security while visiting your home country, there is no love from father to son. I truly believe only Diana & Q Elizabeth loved Harry. This often feels like a mob story, where if you leave the mob, you are dead to them, or they want you killed. Why release their location in Canada unless you wanted them killed, you know? As a spare, he has every right to pursue his own happiness & purpose. Did they want another Princess Margaret who was miserable & an alcoholic. As hurtful as it is for Harry, I think it’s a good thing he got out. But if you really loved him, you’d provide him security, there is no question.
I used to wonder about that, but the closer we get to Charles’ demise, the more we see how weak William would be as King and how useless Kate would be as Queen, the more obvious it is that they’ve always needed Harry to be full time. When their plan to destroy Meghan (or at least get her to divorce Harry) didn’t work, they went to their other usual tactics – withdrawing every kind of support and getting the press to escalate their attacks. And when that didn’t work, it was really too late for any kind of reconciliation. So, now they’re stuck with W&K and I don’t think Charles really cares anymore one way or the other. He just wants to live last few years in peace and after that it’s everyone else’s problem.
Charles did tell them not to make his last few years a misery or something like that. But you know what, if Charles didn’t foresee that Harry wouldn’t go hard at watching his father put his family’s life in danger, he never knew Harry. Which I mean…yeah.
“Did they want another Princess Margaret who was miserable & an alcoholic”? Yes. That much is crystal clear. Bonus points if he went full Andrew with cocaine and trafficked teenagers and became an utter disgrace. I wonder if Harry is reeling from that as well. Your forties are full of those kinds of realisations when you’re finally old enough to process them, let alone someone like Harry and the family/country in which he was born. Poor man has to process A LOT.
I bet Charles is much like the Queen, who was 90+ years when Charles forced Geidt out. She probably thought “Fuck it, I’m out.” First of all, she always respected the hierarchy and wouldn’t challenge her own heir, however difficult their personal relationship. Second, I think the Queen at that point in her life just wanted to nap and play with corgis and watch horse racing on the telly. She certainly earned a retirement (even if she had no real-world positive accomplishments from her reign IMO).
Charles isn’t that old but I do believe he has cancer, it’s terminal, probably sooner rather than later. All he wants to do is victory lap trips to France and Italy, go to Scottish Disneyland at Balmoral and other places where he and Camilla can go on vacations before and after “tours”, dress up, drink good wine and eat fancy food and basically run out the clock. The rest is William’s problem
Charles didn’t out their location in Canada, William did. It came via a leak from William’s boy DanW (via Christian Jones and his boyfriend getting a kickback from Wootten for sharing the info with him).
Which would suggest William wants Harry’s family harmed. Which, yes. But I wonder if they make these decisions out of pride and ego and anger and don’t think about that it means. Or maybe they do which is of course scarier.
I suspect that at that point (when the half in/half out offer was made), the RF was still thinking that “no one would leave this cushy royal arrangement and go work for a living.” The BRF would have been scared, and they would not have had a road map, so they assumed that Harry and Meghan were too scared to leave as well. And, since the other royal family members had always returned to the fold with their tails between their legs or after scandals before, they thought that Harry would opt to stay (with or without Meghan). I don’t think the BRF expected the Sussexes to leave, much less to survive and thrive after their exit.
They underestimated Meghan. Harry too. But they really underestimated Meghan.
Why do children leave their parents?
What we see of this family worldwide is neither warm, nor empathetic, nor loyal.
There seems to be coldness, punishment, infidelity, harshness and a lot of anti-social archaic feelings in this system. Harry was never a power person, but always a responsible person who has an artistic and social talent that only he and his mum have in this family. In this system, he had to be the stupid August and the stupid rebel. None of this had anything to do with him. There is no self-reflection in this family. This family and this country owe this veteran, from whom they have taken everything – jobs,
security, military dignity, his home – a whole lot for the mistakes they made in front of the world with this son of a king. As long as there is a monarchy, it is despicable what these governments, the country, the press and the head of state are doing to this deserving soldier, an honourable man and family man.
Karma has already come knocking on both Charles’ as well as Saint Catherine’s door. Wait and see, and this fate will befall William as well, and soon.
Their betrayal, hate even, of Harry is astounding. They are diabolical, evil!
Next Karma won’t just knock!
In fact, this pity full lot of RF are already paying, living with the sword of Damocles over their heads. The expression of Saint Catherine’s eyes is not healthy at all, Charles’ face is deforming with each passing week, Dorian Gray!
With William it will be fulminating!
So sorry for those sad looking kids …
I wouldn’t put anything past Charles at this point. I think it’s safe to ascribe the worst motives to him and William. They’re monsters.
It’s so sad that Harry now knows the depths of their depravity.
As much as this will hurt, it will pass and most importantly free him from any feeling of official responsibility towards the RF.
In the UK court system, parties are informed long before the court/appeal case will start, about each parties outcome during discovery, and which part of what is discovered/disclosed, will be allowed during the court case. So Harry knew already about much of this horrendous stuff when he came to London for his appeal. He even said so/hinted about this during his stage interview at the New York Times Dealbook Summit on Dec. 4th of last year.
What Harry did with that little interview with two members of the press after his appeal case ended was that – now that his suspicions were proven and documented in court – he strategically let the public, the press, the firm, his father and brother, ánd the govt/Ravec know that he’s now ready to expose how all of them colluded to mishandle and compromise his safety and that if his family.
Now let’s see what he’s gonna do next after the judge’s ruling, either way (a pos./neg. outcome for him. He promised to continue to fight, so let’s see how.
By the way, I think the judge may have to look at these options – even a combination of some might be possible:
* Overthrow the current arrangement and Grant RP/Met security when H & family are in the UK, asap and unconditionally, when in the UK;
*Old Ravec “case by case” scaled down security stays in place;
* Demand a new risk assessment from Ravec, and a new ruling for a more suitable arrangement, taking H’s concerned into account;
*Urge the govt to dismantle Ravec in it’s current (power) structure and modus operandi, since it’s proven in court that Ravec doesn’t follow it’s own rules and regulations. Create a new body, which will have to operate more independently from the royal households.
I don’t think the courts will do anything about this to be honest. No judge is gonna make decision on how RAVEC should make decisions or its independence. I understand Harry’s need to see this case to the end and get all the info about how he was left with no security. It surprises me if he expects a positive outcome.
I agree He’s not expecting a positive outcome. What would that even look like honestly? Say he gets full security for himself and his family. Who’s doing the protection? Can they be trusted? That would be a big HELL NO if it was me. I wouldn’t trust anyone but my own security that I brought with me, and that’s NOT going to be allowed. No, he knows there is no safe way to take his family to the UK in any scenario that this Court orders. No, this is all about exposing the truth.
Not a lawyer, but this is a case on appeal, not on the merits. This means the panel of judges have to rule on whether the initial judge wrongly decided on the merits of the case according to UK law. A successful outcome of an appeals case boots it back down from the appeal level to the original judge level, who then has to look at it again and can rule to change RAVEC or not or whatever. An unsuccessful outcome of an appeals case results in the appeal judges saying “Yup, you got it right the first time, it ends here.”
But I’m sure a UK lawyer can explain better…
I am sure Harry will choose to do as he wants and I personally send him best wishes.
It also is none of my business but I think he should move on and continue to build a happy home in California or wherever he wants to live.
Of course, I am only guessing but I think that Royal Family doesn’t care about Harry, his wife and children at all. There are a few members of that family who do care about Harry and I am sure they will continue to do so.
I think he is moving on and building a home in Cali. Their home-life looks lovely. But as a fellow Virgo, I get it. It’s beyond unfair. It’s medieval. His kids should be able to freaking visit the Uk in safety. They’re half-British. So yes he can move on but he’s shown that he is not someone who sits well with that type of injustice.
Meghan should be able to go not just harry Nd the children. She should not be treated as second rate by those dysfunctional royals
Agree. Meghan too.
As has been said numerous times here, it was the best thing for Harry and Meghan to have the half-in plan rejected. The RR, the courtiers, and Harry’s birth family would have tried to scupper or destroy every project and deal. They are trying to do it now, except that they can’t succeed because the Sussexes are not beholden to any of them in any way. Ultimately, Harry is a man who fights for his country, his family, and for justice. Charles is a mouse. I don’t know what exists between Camilla and Charles, but it shouldn’t be dignified by the word love. He is dependent on her, in whatever way his neediness is defined, and thus looks after her very well.
These people of the royal family better pray for mercy on their souls if they have any-to put Harry and his family in security jeopardy is to be unloving, hateful, and evil-I admire Harry and Meghan’s steely resolve in the face of evil doers-Whatever Harry found out in court is so hurtful to him and his family this info will never leave his mind and cause out of this world distrust and distance-Harry may have been born and raised in the monarcy system but his birth and rearing was very different than his brother’s-there is a reason Charles acts the way he does towards Harry-as long as nothing happens to the succession plan Charles is okay at whatever happens to the Sussexes-he is not going to lose any sleep or worry about them-I pray that God keeps his hands on the Sussex family and keep them safe.
PS_someone mentioned why Charles does not do everything he can to be close to his American grandchilren-because if anything happens he won’t have any feelings about their fate.
This situation highlights the complex intersection of personal safety, public duty, and family dynamics within the Royal Family. While Prince Harry’s concerns about security are understandable—especially given his high-profile status and past trauma—it’s also clear that the institution operates under rigid protocols. The tension between his desire for autonomy and the Crown’s structured approach was inevitable post-Megxit.
That said, the ‘worst fears confirmed’ framing feels dramatic. The UK judiciary’s role is to interpret laws, not arbitrate family disputes. Both sides—Harry’s plea for tailored protection and the Home Office’s risk assessments—deserve scrutiny.
Perhaps the real takeaway is this: No one ‘wins’ here. The system failed to adapt to a unique circumstance, and Harry’s sense of vulnerability is genuine. But without reconciliation, these legal battles may only deepen the rift.
Your choice of framing is interesting. You do not choose your parents. This man inherited the risk based of who his parents are/were. Therefore, he should be allotted proper surety at least while visiting his home country.
And yet they aren’t following their rigid protocols. They created a wholly unique and “bespoke” situation for Harry. That’s actually not protocol.
The late Queen had no problem being flexible and expressing her desire for the Sussex family to have adequate security. It makes one wonder why his own father was so against his son & family have high level protection. Let’s face it, the lawsuits aren’t the cause of the rift, but rather his father/brother’s complete disregard for his safety.
Huh? You say “rigid protocols” were in operation? @Daisy girl you sound like you’re in delulu land. And you’re totally on board with taxpayer funded security for life for Liz Truss whose PM tenure didn’t even last as long as a head of lettuce?
@Daisy – Your statement, “Harry’s plea for tailored protection,” is completely at odds with what’s been argued recently in the judicial review. Are you trolling on purpose here?
When did Harry ever ask for “tailored” aka “bespoke” protection? Shaheed Fatima called his “bespoke” (aka “tailored”) protection inferior. And it manifestly is inferior because no one else whose public security is considered by RAVEC is subjected to a mandatory 30-day notice period to request protection that frequently gets rejected.
And why are you referring to the “Home Office’s risk assessments” when this case clearly involves RAVEC (which you conveniently ignore)? RAVEC is clearly not dominated by Home Office if “royal” personnel comprise 40%. And if the “Home Office’s risk assessments deserve scrutiny” what about scrutiny of the 40% royal contingent?
Finally, in your tut-tutting about “reconciliation,” why, oh why, have you said nothing about the RMB (Risk Management Board)? RMB assessment was supposed to be done for everyone whose security is determined by RAVEC, per their own protocols. @Daisy girl your wordy judgement has a few holes.