Meghan Mania is the name of the game, and I’m personally enjoying all of the stories about her. I forgot, last week, to check in with one of my favorite royal commentators, The Daily Beast’s Tom Sykes, so over the weekend I caught up on his Markle coverage, which was glowing. Meghan Markle is a hit with many royal commentators/royal watchers because, truly, she is pretty good at this from the very beginning. Interestingly enough, Tom Sykes draws a comparison between then-Kate Middleton’s “princess preparations” versus Meghan’s princess training. It was widely believed/known that Kate got a lot of “princess lessons” after her engagement and in the first year of marriage. It doesn’t seem like Meghan will be getting the same treatment. From the Daily Beast:
Meghan is already great as a “media performer”: The interview with Harry showed Meghan the polished media performer. Undoubtedly, her media grace and on-camera affability is a happy quality for a 21st-century royal to possess (the difference between the accomplished Meghan and the desperately shy Kate on-screen is the difference between watching a school play and West End theatre).
Meghan is already great with the public too: On the walkabout in Nottingham it was Meghan’s enthusiasm which shone through. Unlike some other members of the royal family—and William and Kate must be mentioned here—who have an unfortunate habit of making their job of engaging with the public en masse seem all too much like a duty which must be borne, Meghan was clearly having a ball. Meghan appears unlikely to be intimidated by the position which awaits her.
The different kinds of Princess Lessons: The Kensington Palace team [is] headed up by the youthful Canadian Jason Knauff, now charged with helping Meghan transition from private citizen to public princess. It will be very different from the way it was done with Kate. The process of easing Kate into the royal family—in a series of lessons sometimes referred to as “Princess Academy”—was the crowning achievement of the old guard KP team, all of whom have now left royal service. Kate’s initiation was led by Prince George’s godfather Jamie Lowther-Pinkerton and Miguel Head, a former Ministry of Defence press officer with a passion for accurate expectations and clarity, who were both personal private secretaries to William and Harry at the time. Pinkerton, in particular, was known to be unafraid to say, “No” to either of the brothers, and it was he and Head who masterminded the “slow and steady” approach that governed Kate’s incredibly gradual assimilation into the royal way of life—including living out of the public eye in Wales for over a year while making only intermittent appearances.
Meghan will learn on the job: It’s safe to say that neither Pinkerton nor Head would have considered it a good idea to launch Meghan straight into a public-facing walkabout of the type she undertook in Nottingham on Friday in the same week the engagement announcement was made. Robert Jobson, the veteran royal correspondent and author of the books Harry’s War and The Future Royal Family, was in Nottingham on Friday to see Markle’s first public appearance. “I think she did a terrific job,” he told The Daily Beast. “She was charming and relaxed with the general public, totally composed when talking to people and it looks like nothing will faze her,” he said. “But there is no ‘princess boot camp’—she is a capable human being and will simply learn on the job. She will ask and learn from Harry. She will be allowed to find her own feet. She may read the odd book. She will read up on the British constitution but I doubt she will be tutored on it. There are no manuals for being a princess. She is a professional actress, and, from what we saw in Nottingham, I am sure she will pick it up very quickly and perform with aplomb.”
The ten-year-Wait: When Kate Middleton married Prince William in 2011 she was given one-on-one lessons to ensure she had a thorough knowledge of the Establishment. But as Christopher Andersen, author of the best selling e-book The Day Diana Died tells The Daily Beast: “Kate had one huge advantage over Meghan in the princess training department: 10 years of practice. Throughout their very long courtship, Waity Katie got an up-close-and-personal look at what was expected of William and by extension what would be expected of her once she joined the Royal Family. On the other hand, Meghan has a singular advantage that Kate didn’t have: Harry’s future wife is an accomplished actress, and, after all, the role of Princess is just that—a role.”
What does it say about Meghan and what does it say about the royal courtiers if Meghan is basically allowed to “learn on the job,” and expected to just pick it up quickly, while Kate was coddled for years by the courtiers? Personally, I’m enjoying the revisionist history that’s coming out about Kate’s princess lessons, like it was all some grand plan by the Kensington Palace communications office to nurture Kate in her “role.” In any case, I do think Meghan will learn on the job and she’ll be good at all of it. Now I just hope Poor Jason doesn’t get credit for Meghan being a quick study, you know?
Photos courtesy of PCN, WENN.
To be honest they have a lot more to work with…just saying.
I agree. There’s a YouTube video of all the etiquette rules Meghan will have to adhere to, apparently at Nottingham she walked in front of Harry a couple times and that’s a big no-no, she has to stay one or two steps behind him, at least. Also no crossing legs, only ankles, no ripped jeans, and she will have to courtesy to will & Kate’s kids when they’re older.. I wonder if those things will be difficult for her, she seems like a strong woman and having to walk behind Harry because he’s royal blood and “above her” might not be taken well. Hopefully she defies those outtdated rules. Or she’ll suck it up and do as she’s told.
I couldn’t do it. Couldn’t stomach that kind of subservience to my own spouse.
Yeah, I would have trouble with that, too, if I were Meghan…OR Harry. My god, what year is this, anyway? What CENTURY, ffs? I think some of these archaic traditions are just going to crumble. After all, this newest member of the RF is a divorcée, an actress, an American of color, a humanist, and and a feminist.
…and btw, Meg isn’t just being played off against Kate in the press — The Daily Beast is pitting her against Princess Ivanka — title of the piece: “Meghan Markle is Everything Ivanka Trump Wishes She Could Be. https://www.thedailybeast.com/meghan-markle-is-everything-ivanka-trump-wishes-she-could-be?via=newsletter&source=DDMorning
@Lahdidahbaby, that article!!! What a *delicious* burn!! SMACK! Take THAT Princess Complicit! Hahahahhahaha (sorry.. can’t help but love it!) 😊
I know, Imqrious2, isn’t it too delish?
And Barack Obama is everything Ivanka’s lowlife dad wishes he could be — classy, intelligent, respected, admired and esteemed.
I read an article yesterday, kind of funny, about what Meghan got right and wrong. The most serious mistake was that she was walking in front of Harry. The horrors!!!! Many of the more strict Jewish religions do this, too and I could NEVER do that. Also, the curtsying nonsense, to Kate and even the children. Absurd. And that unless she is given permission, Meghan will have to call them all by formal titles when she first sees them, then Ma’am or Sir for the rest of the visit.
I cannot even imagine a 21st century American woman doing all this. That Meghan is willing to tells me that she isn’t as much as a 21st century woman as she painted herself to be.
OK, ducking now. 🙂
These are the same (silly) family rules everyone else in the BRF follow, as do the people in all of the other royal families. I don’t remember people getting up in arms when independent, successful women like Maxima and Letizia started following these rules. Or Daniel for that matter, who technically has to bow to his wife.
It isn’t being subservient to the royal as a human; it is following these silly rules because that’s the way the people in charge (HM, Queen Margrethe, etc.) keep the peace in the family. I expect much of that to go away with the younger crop of monarchs.
It is not subservience it is paying respect to the institution of royalty.
Given the way Harry kept pulling Meghan to his side, I’m pretty sure he is throwing that walk behind me thing right out the window lol. There’s a lot of misinformation about protocol out there, Meghan and Kate will share the same rank (as do their husbands) so there won’t be any curtsying involved, basically the only person either of them are really required to curtsy to anymore is the queen.
Hahaha, Avery!!! I just love what you’ve just said. The thing is that I have the feeling that Kate’s preparations are done. No more talks about “private meetings” with charities and “secret visits”. Hahahaha! Thinking that Kate’s been on the job for about seven years, I am only equating the length of her royal role so far with graduating from a PhD. programme. That gives one a PhD. degree in less time. I include a year for a master’s too! So Keen Kate has already graduated from the Princess school! What and how will she do next? Pregnant women work too!
I didn’t mean to sound so callous but the difference is striking even though Meghan is older and more polished. The humanitarian work and advocacy even when she was a lot younger and not even a well known actress really speaks to me. She didn’t have to do that. She was contributing where she could on the level she was on and not that has just advanced exponentially and Harry and Meghan together I believe will do great things. That has always been Harry’s legacy from Diana.
It’s not Meghan that the BRF has to worry about……it’s the likes of Daily mail, who are working tirelessly, day and night to turn people against her that they have to worry about.
Meghan Markle was made for this. She will handle it brilliantly. Just control the peripheral attacks and sabotage attempts and we’ll be fine. 😀
well said.
And Harry should better be there for her and support her just as they stated during the engagement interview. Many have heard that behind a strong/successful man there is a woman alike. In the Sparkle couple, Meghan will need a strong and loving man behind her. With her. Learning from the past.
Daily fail sucks! The hatchet job they are trying to do on Meghan is a shame. I hope they fail spectacularly
+1 million Amen!!!!
Wisteria1 waitie kate is NOT shy. She is strategic to avoid Royal Duties – offend to be left alone to her laziness. Noone who is shy would parade on stage in underwear for a Prince – nor shack up in uni around bodyguards other students who would be whispering in college years and beyond.
Like some stated in another article “who cares if ‘poor’ kate cant cope with Princess Henry Sparkle’…
Bit sad to see decades -from childhood friendship – the other is willing to cheat her own career /life(Ninaka) potential, for a few thousands from DM others by shading TRYING to sabotage who is soon to be the best only American to become HRH Princess Henry, BRF for 15 mins of cash. The backlask from the public – people who respect and appreciate Prince Henry Sparkle work ethics, self made… to Piddy will be huge – she will regret this (and sad for a such a long sisterly friendship).
Even at 18 , Meg sparkle was hustling for a music video – Piddy was there waiting for Princess Henry in waiting. SAD…
I don’t understand what you’re saying. Translate, anyone?
I read Harry wanted to marry someone who was already a celebrity because they would be comfortable with all the media attention. Meghan is gorgeous and seems to be a smash hit with the public. I’m so ready for this wedding!
If she’s a smash hit, you wouldn’t know that by reading the Daily Fail. The comments have been vicious.
The comments were vicious 70 years ago when Princess Elizabeth wanted to marry Philip; a foreigner.
Not saying they weren’t, but didn’t pretty much ALL royal heirs use to marry foreign royals? Since you were supposed to make political alliances and not marry beneath you? And marrying a prince(ss) from your own country meant incest?
I’m not sure they’re much more vicious than the comments about KM on here, though. The disgusting sexism around “Waity Katie” makes my blood absolutely boil. She was a *teen* when she met her boyfriend – the future king of England. Dating someone for an extended amount of time doesn’t make her desperate – it makes her damn smart, and it makes me think more highly of William that he wanted to be absolutely positive that this relationship would work out *for both of them.* I can’t believe how disgusting it is that “feminists” criticize a young woman for NOT doing what they also criticize other women for – jumping in too fast. What, pray tell, is an *appropriate* amount of time to date someone before marrying? What age is appropriate? Should she have moved on from William after her sophomore year in college because he hadn’t proposed yet? They weren’t *adults* yet! Their relationship is healthy because they took their time and didn’t rush into anything. William is protective of Kate because *his mother effing DIED* due to the nightmare that became her life. Diana was a teenager who was betrothed to a horrible man, lived her life in a prison of emotional abuse, and died while having her photo taken because it made people more money. No way in hell would either W or H allow that to happen, even in the slightest, to anyone in their lives, let alone the people they love. William wanted to properly date Kate. He wanted to have a healthy, strong relationship before committing to anything – or asking anyone to commit to not only him, but his entire family. The fact that he spends so much time with the Middletons tells me that Kate and co are 100% everything he never had growing up and 100% everything he wanted for himself, his brother, and his mom.
Why didn’t Kate get a job or do charity work while she was in a relationship with William that was off and on? She knew that doing charity work would be expected as the spouse of the heir of the Prince of Wales. She did nothing with her life during that time and she still has not learned the skills she needed to almost 7 years post marriage. It is not anti feminist to criticize how she does nothing with the extreme privilege she has been provided. She gets to shop and wear new outfits and meanwhile the less fortunate in the UK have to see their health services slashed.
They got married in 2011. It is almost 2018 and she can barely give a speech. Is it still jumping in too fast that she can’t do what she is expected to do, and do what other women like Sophie figured out much sooner than she has this many years later?
She did not just marry William but she made a commitment as future Queen consort to give back to the people of the UK. So far she is failing in her duty to them. That’s the catch with marrying a member of the senior line of the BRF. There is duty to the nation and not just being a lady who lunches. The reason why the Queen is liked and respected is because she dedicated her life to service. Diana was 19 and did not attend university and she managed to figure out to get help and improve. And she worked. We have not seen that commitment from Kate (or William to be fair).
It’s well known that William cheated on, dumped and messed around on Kate multiple times during their “relationship” (sex on a nightclub fire escape with a random etc etc). Kate clung on despite multiple public humiliations, she was the last one standing and the only one who’d have him. The Doormat and the Bully.
If that’s a model relationship then sign me up for solitary confinement!
Let’s not pretend that they had some solid, equal relationship for all of that waiting time–that is the reason for the attacks. She allowed herself to be a doormat and put up with his cheating and humiliating her. I feel bad for what she put up with (and a lot of women do the same), but it doesn’t make me any less of a feminist to point it out.
@ABC I never seen evidence william cheated on kate. No pictures, video or anything else. Only stories from tabloids. That’s no evidence. Dancing a night away is not cheating. Before 2007 they were on/of couple and who knows maybe they were broken up when there were rumors in tabloids.
Imo you can’t judge a relationship from stories in tabloids or guessing how you think they are.
Solitary confinement ftw.
AV – I don’t know what script you’re reading from but it’s very one-sided. KM and her family planned, plotted and manipulated her relationship with William from the get-go. Kate could have worked, continued her studies, traveled the world, whatever but she was going to marry into the royal family come hell or high water. She put up with consistent and public break-ups and philandering from William – it was never a case of William protecting her from the big bad world. She was tenacious though and finally bagged the prize. But even now that she’s married to him she has proven again and again that she’s not cut from the proper cloth to be a dynamic representative of the BRF and to fulfill the work she should be doing with her lazy-ass and petulant husband.
Furthermore, Diana was not “betrothed” to a horrible man, she went after Charles like a heat-seeking missile. She was no saint and manipulated her way into his mild affections by pretending to be someone she wasn’t, i.e. she said she loved the country life, loved horses and riding, loved all his stuffy friends when, in fact, she was a total city girl and loved nothing better than a Duran Duran concert and hanging with Elton John.
Don’t forget there are two sides to every story and painting any of these people in a saintly light is simply naive.
Feminism doesn’t mean approval of everything a woman does. When I think of Kate, I think what if she were my daughter or friend what I would consider if that were the case.
It is fine to like someone, but I think the defense of her becomes absurd when she has been in the public eye a very long time, and William’s cheating is not a secret, and it isn’t only tabloids that reported it. It isn’t her fault he cheated. But I wouldn’t want my daughter marrying a man who treated her that way.
Her behavior of not working and stepping into a high profile role and showing strength and ability is NOT feminist. Waiting around for a man while he dates around and gets turned down by others is the antithesis of feminism.
She still has not earned her order from the Queen. Why do you ignore that? Do you question the Queen’s judgment? Have a good long look at Sophie Wessex and her list of orders and medals and then tell us we are just a bunch of haters.
She is to be Queen consort, and outrank Sophie yet Sophie and Camilla have done more than she has. You can’t think that is right or ok. Camilla has never even had the goodwill she has.
Criticism can get a little petty and bitchy sure, but there is fact within that too. do blame Billy B Normal also, but it is wrong to think that kind of behavior is unassailable.
When you have a lot and have been fortunate, you MUST help others and give. No one is above or better than anyone else. It is pure luck to start near the finish line and no achievement. You can use it to help others across the finish line who weren’t as fortunate and to have compassion for others. S
THAT is what drives me up the wall.
Comments about Prince Albert were vicious. A penniless German, a foreigner etc.
Ditto the vicious campaign against Wallis Simpson that is still running today even if most people recognise that she wasn’t as bad as painted.
The Queenmother escaped vicious commentary because she married the second son and wasn’t destined to be Queen.
Our media is terrible to the spare. Extended to his wife. Always. People are shocked because they havent seen this in a long time and Harry had done slot of work to improve his press.
And the DM has always been vicious to foreigners. Nothing to be aghast about here because same ol same ol.
AV, Diana died that night due to a combination of factors: the worst being an impaired driver. There were reports she was warned by Hasnat Khan himself when informed of spending time with Dodi.
Diana was still angry and bitter about her failed marriage and by age 36, she still hadn’t really matured. She was a user and master manipulator. And the night she died, how could she have been so distressed about the paparazzi when she was photographed laughing in the back seat of the car. It had become a deadly game of cat and mouse. Tragic.
If I want to read vicious comments about Meghan, I would go to the DM. If I wanted to read vicious comments about Kate, I come right here. The DM has nothing on what people say about Kate on here.
(And I don’t go looking for either – just saying.)
@magnolia – excellent point about the lack of a family order. The Queen gave one to Sophie and Camilla only a few years into their marriage because they had worked many engagements, with Sophie almost dying after giving birth to Louise and still working more than Kate ever has that year.
Duchess of Kent and Duchess of Gloucester received theirs within a year of marriage iirc. Diana at 18 months, Camilla at 2 years. Sophie didn’t receive hers until 2004, 5 years in to the marriage, but she and Edward weren’t official “working royals” for the first 3 years.
actually, what really caused Diana’s death was not wearing a seatbelt. the one person who was wearing one in the car survived.
All Tom Sykes proved recently is that he doesn’t know jack! His prediction was an engagement next year, after they lived together for 6 months or longer.
Talie, I wouldn’t be surprised if Tom was fed the wrong info and he fell for it. It’s well known that certain reporters receive some sort of backdoor info from the Firm. The Firm spin the info as they please. But the outcomes cannot be controlled even with further spinning.
Was led/fed up the creek (maybe purposely) to have the nice surprise or commenters matter. HM POW BRF wants Prince Henry Line happy – rather he as the 4d wheel (carol 3d) to the lazy entitled willnot middleton.
+1000
@ Nic919 – ABC – Jaded, above thread.
Still waiting on the actual wedding date would not be surprised her majesty doesn’t say wait a year or insisting waiting a year. As for royal protocol Meghan will have to learn our royal family are not the Kadashians
Well, Kate presumably will be Queen one day, so I can see why.
Oh dear, i read Marklen will be a queen one day and I was like do you know how many people would have to die? And then i felt so bad for the kids…
BTW, if you call Kate Katie waity, you are still using tabloids’ terminology and all this Markle stuff is tabloid heaven.
And Markle won’t change history. She’ll have babies and go on some duties but she won’t be able to speak up. If she does and Harry supports her, it will become a mess among royalists who like things to be in order and they understand the protocol probably better than the royals.
They don’t have to die as has been explained here, several times. They could just step aside, removing themselves and their heirs from the line of succession. Why do people assume only the slaughter of a family in this day and age?
History has a way of repeating…
Lets wait-ie as used by uni students/UK, others view on KM lack of work ethics- in who will be future Consort after King Charles. No death required in today’s age for a change in heirs or Lines. GB CW are appreciative of potential King Henry, and will be the ultimate decision with King Charles and governments.
IIRC, Diana was provided with all sorts of help to make her a future queen, while Sarah was left to flounder along mostly on her own. Diana had stylists and Sarah did not. Diana’s image was carefully protected while Sarah was hounded in the media. It seems the pattern remains. I have no doubt Markle will do a better job than Sarah ended up doing, but it will be because she has better instincts than Sarah. (Diana had amazing instincts, which made her hugely popular).
As you say, the important factor is that Kate will be queen, and Markle will not. I hope the Firm learned at least a little something with Sarah’s miserable experience.
Another lie from Diana about being left all alone to figure out things as the new Princess of Wales in 1981. Looking back it’s no wonder the Queen had enough after the airing of the Panorama interview.
It will also be because she has a better husband than Sarah did.
I agree with you Lacia Can. Kate is expected to be a Queen someday, but in the meantime, be a perfect spouse/mom/human. The Firm really wants Will & Kate to be a perfect example of traditional family values to help people forget about all the scandals. Will, as future heir, has been sheltered and protected much more than Harry (yet I doubt Will is really so different from his brother).
The cynical side of me thinks that Meghan will get less help from the Royal family because she a) brings new tabloid scandals with her (Divorce! Sex tapes! Hollywood! etc) and because b) the Royal family don’t see this marriage lasting much longer than her previous relationships/marriages. I wonder how much Harry has had to work to convince people to give her a chance. He has really put up a strong public “I’m a mature, hard-working adult” front for the last year or so…
I suspect what the firm wants is for them to get to work. Sophie and Edward manage to be modern, have a happy home life, healthy and happy children, and work for the firm. Model family with working parents. Absolutely no reason why HM and Charles would want W&K to play 1950s man-and-wife especially in the face of the mounting criticism about their laziness.
Feminists are supposed to rally behind something as regressive as being described here. Sign me up. Forget that we are on the 4th wave of feminism. I am a stay at home mother because I worked and I chose to be with my babies. But we don’t get one cent from taxpayers. I have more children and clock more hours in a week on humanitarian endeavors than she does. I have help too, but I don’t have a full staff of people at my beck and call.
I really don’t understand the excuses. Having a baby with a staff of nannies hasn’t stopped anyone else including TQ so pray tell why is it ok for just her?
That’s a good point. Because Harry is Diana’s son, I sometimes forget that he and his wife will be sixth-in-line after Kate’s newest addition is born.
I suspect H&M couldn’t be happier about that fact. As long as they step up and do the engagements expected of them, it is still “3 days a week, 5 months of the year” as a former courtier said. If they play their cards right, they end up like Anne not Andrew, admired for doing the work and living a private life away from the spotlight. Lux life without the politics.
A much better position in my view. More is expected of W and K, and they aren’t stepping up. They get all the extra perks, and they are plenty, but as they are now, they probably will be the end of the monarchy. I don’t even mean that snarky or biased but I can’t see the public taking kindly to their behavior once TQ is gone and the spotlight is bright.
Not as much is expected of everyone else.
I mean seriously, the girl studied this stuff in college and continued it privately after school. Public persona won’t be her issue. It’ll be the safety aspects she’ll have to learn and they’ll help her with that.
ETA: TL;DR – Diplomacy and advocacy are (moreso) learned by practice versus study.
I hope you’re referring to her theater major. If not, as an FYI to everyone: International studies/international relations/international politics/international affairs doesn’t teach one diplomacy and politicking. It’s the study of how others have conducted these affairs. “Others” can refer to Nations, international organizations, regional bodies and individuals. In the same vein, the study of political science isn’t to prepare someone to be a politician. It certainly helps, don’t get me wrong. However, it’s the study of/science of interactions and institutions in this arena (for a simple explanation). Her advocacy during her time on Suits is what truly has prepared her for the role.
Not to mention the fact that monarchies are considered outdated and not studied to a big degree in that major.
+1000
Princess Henry Sprarkle practiced: – work in an Embassy (overseas, she jumped right in, No local US State Dept staff first) – UN, Canadian Charities – social issues – work ethics, etc. as they say ‘Practice makes ‘better’ /perfect’.
Yes to what you said, RoyalSparkle. Plus hardship that Meghan has been able to overcome, with a background like hers: divorced parents, no siblings close in age to grow up with, just that horrible woman from DF. Mixed race and that even in the USA is not easy from what I read. Plus working hard to work as an actress and passing through castings and facing rejections and many “no’s” at it happens so often in the acting field more so in the case of series/movies. In such a big film market as the US market is. I can only admire her for her hard work and thick skin and ambition to overcome challenges. She is the right person for Harry and deserves success. And that Harry is happy too 🙂 I hope they’ll make a happy hardworking royal couple!!!!
SoulSPA,
Do you have a fever? Lol Just kidding I am used to your measured critiques.
What you stated about Meghan is what I like about her and why I root for her. She represents a changing world that is more inclusive, and I like her courage to take on a role that has to be hurtful sometimes. I noticed a diverse crowd at Nottingham and thought it was adorable to see a little black girl smile happy to see her. I know how I felt like a little girl to see a Jewish woman do something extraordinary. In light of all the white Nationalists acting up, it feels nice.
One thing that does irritate about the coverage is the idea that Meghan grew up in a rough neighborhood and I don’t think the Brits understand the type of black woman her mother is. She is a very Californian natural living social awareness type. For those who think Meghan’s humanitarian instincts are fake, they aren’t. She grew up with them.
magnoliarose,
I liked your comment, especially about social justice and Meghan’s mother.
Magnoliarose, I might have some Sparkle fever LOL. I am excited for this engagement!!!
I agree.
Prince Henry Couple /Sparkle will need to manage all she has become/gained Hard working WOMAN – successful businesswoman /actor/philan. She is now Royalty of the BRF starting anew (but yes with all she has experienced, gained, earned) – but no longer a successful substantive star (even without the excess of Hollywood).
When is the next joint Prince Henry Couple appearance…. I am sure the Do little lambridge visit with children -the parents may have hope for Prince Henry Couple.
All of my best jobs were ones that I was thrown into, hopefully it’s the same for Meghan. I’m going to be completely royal wedding obsessed and grateful for something frivolous and fun to focus on.
I agree completely about having something in the news that is frivolous and fun. I’m so happy to have at least one American being a success. She is a lovely young woman who seems to take on the world with energy and good humor. I’m going to enjoy watching her.
I bet she reads her briefing notes. Fnar fnar.
What does fnar fnar mean, Sixer? Thanks.
It means to snicker, esp. at something with sexual innuendo; imitative of the sound of suppressed laughter (according to my right-click dictionary 😊)
If she *does* read a briefing note, it’d sure as hell be a lot more than William does!
Thanks imqrious2. Much appreciated! Now that thanks to you and Sixer I understand what fnar fnar means, I will only have to find the way to gasp those particular sounds. LOL!
It would be such a nice change, wouldn’t it?
Soul – it just means snigger, or a general indication that you’re taking the mickey/mocking. I thiiiiiiiiink, but don’t quote me, it comes from Viz, a British adult comic.
Nota – yes, it would!
Thanks Sixer!
Considering she’s an actress and public figure I don’t think its unexpected. That’s literally her job
Isn’t Meghan also several years older than Kate was when she became Wills official partners? I mean, just in terms of confidence, 30 and 35 can be light years apart for some people. Certainly the confidence/maturity I have in my early thirties I did not have in my mid-late twenties. I can see why Meghan would need less mollycoddling, even her career as an actress aside.
Age does not matter. Most women in the UK from the same background as Kate had a degree and several years work experience by the age of 30. Some reached important paid positions, are doctors/nurses/teachers with a lot of responsibility not only for themselves but other people too. Some may well have their own business and employ people. Some would also have their own family including children. Some would work two jobs. Go and study or work abroad.
By the age of 30 Meghan had at least one or two seasons on Suits and had hustled in a very tough and very COMPETITIVE career. When she was not acting she had to work other jobs to support herself. Earned a degree in international relations and theater/acting and has worked in the field she had prepared for.
Catherine Middleton did nothing other than earning a degree in Arts and working for some months as an accessory buyer at the age of 30 when she got the engagement ring. And allegedly for the family’s company but I for one do not believe it. So no, age does not make the difference.
ETA: Meghan’s CV is absolutely fantastic for the royal role. Work experience, PR and public speaking skills, pleasant demeanor, interest and work in charity plus entrepreneurship. Very good choice for Harry.
Yep, she has a degree in theatre from Northwestern University Which has an excellent theatre program. Lost of famous actors and actresses came out of that program. Marg Helgenberger, Megan Mullally from Will and Grace and many many others came out of this program.
By 30 most women have been working for a while and have moved beyond the the immature stage. Kate had done nothing of value with her life by that time and didn’t even do charity work much less maintain any significant employment. She went on holidays and made herself available for William.
Kate is 36 in a month and still is bad at giving speeches or working consistently. She had 7 years of princess lessons and still isn’t very good. And the fact that she may be Queen consort means that she should be working harder than Meghan because she will have to be more of a public face. The time to stop making excuses is now. Meghan being able to do on day one what Kate still can’t do is shameful.
Kate’s primary concern as Bill’s wife is that she is surrounded by people who take of her needs. Hence the prolonged duchess lessons.
She has expressed several times that the best thing about the Queen is that she takes care of Kate. Kate’s mother has taken care of her entire life including the courtship and now marriage and motherhood. For a while she constantly brought up her need for someone to take care of her. She has stopped reminding people (ie, Bill) of that for now, at least recently.
By 30 I was a Vice President of a bank. That is ridiculous. If the person is capable, smart and confident then age does not matter. There are 25 year olds that can run circles around her.
:fistbump of solidarity: Cosign alllllll of this. Although the time to stop making excuses for Kate was the day she married. They’d already spent several years grooming her for the role by that point. She *should* have been able to hit the ground running, like Sparkle is doing.
Sparkle is on track to show the world what a hard working royal looks like. I wonder how long before Kate snubs her publicly? You can bet Beatrice and Eugenie will have Sparkle’s back, after the way Kate and Wills have treated both of them.
I think a few things are important to note here. It seems Kate STILL has issues with public speaking. She and Meghan are only a year a part. So that’s not an age thing. It’s moreso to do with personality, practice, and dedication. I know many people think this is a natural skill/gift of people, and I agree. However, I also think it can be compared to professional athletes. You can have all the natural skill and gifts in the world, but practice is what takes one from good to great. Practice is what gets one to professional level.
Also, age would probably be a factor if Kate and William weren’t in their late 20s (28/29) when they married. I agree that one is different in their mid-30s versus twenties. However, professional skirt lengths, appropriate hair dos, and other such missteps are not about age, but practice/experience and seeking good advice.
They aren’t even a year apart. Meghan turned 36 in August and Kate will be 36 in January. They are 5 months apart.
Mathilde married in at 26, Anne-Marie became Queen Consort of Greece at age 18 upon marriage, Jetsun Pema of Bhutan became Queen Consort at 21 upon marriage. Those were high-profile in their country, even if lower profile to the English-speaking gossip world. Plenty of pressure on those young royal brides and they did fine.
King Jigme about Jetsun Pema when he announced their engagement. “Many will have their own idea of what a Queen should be like – that she should be uniquely beautiful, intelligent and graceful. I think with experience and time, one can grow into a dynamic person in any walk of life with the right effort. For the Queen, what is most important is that at all times, as an individual she must be a good human being, and as Queen, she must be unwavering in her commitment to serve the People and Country. As my queen, I have found such a person and her name is Jetsun Pema. While she is young, she is warm and kind in heart and character. These qualities together with the wisdom that will come with age and experience will make her a great servant to the nation.”
What a beautiful and well-said sentiment. You can have years of “princess lessons”, but if you don’t have the basics it will be a struggle. Kate may be a good person, but in 7 years she has yet to show an unwavering commitment to serve the People and Country. Not that William and Harry’s commitment has been that strong either.
That’s a beautiful quote, how appropriate and humble. It’s about service, not self. Can we send W&K back to Bhutan and not take them back until they have learned this? In fact, can’t the Bhutanese Royals be ours too? I’d happily share them with Bhutan and retire our lot somewhere in the South Pacific. Someone fetch a dinghy..?
I love Jetsun. She is beautiful, and their little family makes me smile.
Same age!
Much MORE substance, striving for better life with hard work, and quite determination by way of courage – not fed housed by mums climb, mafia/ hangers on behavior.
She’s competent to start with. Kate was not. Meghan appears to be a hard worker. Kate is not. Meghan has a spark. Kate seems not, although in her defense I think her personality was such that she may have had but it was extinguished.
This princess is actually going to approach naturally the star power that Diana had.
Whereas with Kate, there’s no there there – just hair.
Kate is going to presumably be a Queen ( though not the Queen) one day so that’s one thing that makes her job bigger, she also had no public experience. I do like Megan but I tend to believe once he the kids get older her and Harry would fade to the background.
People keep saying they will fade into the background. They will never fade into the background because there is so much interest and popularity around this couple. W&K are bland and boring, that is just them and no matter what they do that will not change. It is going to be a very very long time before George and siblings take on full time royal duties and so Meghan and Harry will be very busy.
Yeah this girl. They are not going to fade into any background, everyone is obsessed with them like chocolate right now.
I know this is not a Kate-friendly site 😀 however, when Meghan appeared, I realized how much Kate is an introvert and how it must suck for her to be so bad with public appearances. And the whole comparisons of her relationship with Will vs. Harry and Meghan.. I mean, those relationships are apples and oranges. And it is different for the heir, you know.
I am not defending her, I know she has the reputation that she has because of her own wrong-doings. But… since Meghan came into the picture, I find myself really empathizing with Kate.
I am wondering, if the personality Kate had before the engagment was drowned by the princess lessons.
She has fallen into the hands of old KP guard with all their rules as a young woman without any proper life experience (university payed for by the Family does not give you the same selfassurance really working does) and was maybe told hundreds of times what she should be, and how not to behave. Did she have a real Chance to develop a personality? Especially going straight from her mother to the firm?
She was with Bill for ten years and got to know what the role entailed. Bill said it himself during the engagement interview – I could not hear the reporter’s question well because his microphone was off or something. But I understood from Bill’s answer that it was about the looooong Waiting Years. Bill justified the long relationship with the reason that he wanted to give her a chance to know what she was getting into – the job – and back off if she wanted to.
Kate AND HER PARENTS knew what she was getting into. The Firm media spin presented her as outgoing, confident and good at competitive sports. And popular. And good student.
The Kate-related folklore described her as outgoing with good social skills as she mingled with the elites and aristocracy. And that she was also bullied and laughed at for social climbing. She and Pippa were called the Wisteria Sisters for those efforts to climb up the social ladder. Bullying is wrong from all points of view but I think that she did have strong personality and stamina to withhold from all that energy. And all the maniac grinning and laughing while on engagements and flirting with Sir Ben plus the nearly naked fashion show do not show someone who is introvert and so on. This narrative is the Firm’s spinning to deflect from the fact that she is not competent enough for her role. And of course to ease the comparison between her and Sparkle.
But Kate waited on Will for ten years. During that time she could have worked surely, but stopped working at Jigsaw (her mum’s friends run the brand and she got the job via contacts) so that she could have been at beck and call for William and their various vacations. Kate Middleton for all the advantages presented to her during and after uni, has showed no gumption or trace of a work ethic at all.
Kate and William were together for seven years when they got engaged not ten.
Lara, that is my take on Kate. She isn’t really a grown up person. She is like an extra limb or kidney for Wills.
She was and will always be in his shadow. She was most interesting when they broke up. At least she was doing sth on her own, even if that meant going clubbing.
With Carol – Throne Idle /I am a Prince Willnot the middleton decoy – waitie cannot snowflake keen middleton laziness – doubt any ‘ old hands ‘ Courtiers/The Firm telling her what to do … All Orders must come from HM by way of BP CH.
Cant wait to see when will Princess Henry receive HM Royal Order … yes, she is not yet married HRH but… and, Lazy keen middleton should Not receive HM Order for third pregnancy.
Mafia boss Carol Middleton has Wisteria sis2 pipppa, the royal wanna be mafia – out at hospital touching sick kids and starring at paps for photos. The Firm – BRF – POW need to have I am a Prince Willnot remove the middleton mafias – out of the news. Pippps is no royal – go away middleton hangers on”!!!
Poor Kate had it drummed into her that she should not try to emulate Diana or be like Diana. The story going around was that the family did not want another Diana and wanted to downplay glamour and celebrity which attracts the paparazzi, so Kate and Carole worked on a very sober , quiet and demure image that would not overshadow William, the queen or anybody else. But i don’t think that this is the type of future Queen consort the British public want.
Royalsparkle: mafia boss Middleton! ❤️ It! I spit out laughing in the doctor’s office!
Kate is not an introvert – an introvert does not flash her ass to the public at war memorials, nor parade down a modeling runway wearing a see through dress. She is not shy!
As for her personality, she had one back in the days at University where she was known as quite the party girl who was lots of fun.
The Kate you see know is the one she turned herself into to keep William
While I agree with the last sentence, I have to say being shy and being introverted for me are two very different things. And when it comes to her ass, I still think that was her being completely dumb repeatedly, not looking for attention, which is so much worse! but let’s agree to disagree 🙂
An introvert is simply someone whose energy is drained by other people.
I disagree. She clearly draws her energy from being home or being with just her family. If she was extroverted she wouldn’t struggle so much with being in public and interacting with people. If she was extroverted she would have a bunch of friends and you’d be seeing her out and about with them. Just because she partied in college does not make her an extrovert.
She has no problem having a great time and being extroverted when it is something she wants to do. Playing tennis in front of kids, going yachting with Ben Ainslie, at movie premieres and charity parties with celebrities. It is when she is required to pay attention and pretend to care about something serious that The Attitude comes out. That doesn’t say “introvert” to me, it says selfish, self-centered, and really dislikes being around anyone who is in need.
+100 Digital Unicorn. Agreed.
Not a Kate-friendly site, ok. I express criticism towards Kate Dolittle because she works very little while taking into account the fact that her lifestyle is sponsored by taxpayers, has not made enough efforts to prepare for her public role, flashes out her almost naked bum, she and her spouse, prolly the future king, lie, pretend they have obligations but spend a holiday during which photos of her naked are taken by paparazzi and then published in the press. And oh, she was definitely an introvert when she caught Bill’s eye during that fashion show when she was almost naked. Super introvert during parties, holidays and such. The most consistent effort she’s ever made was to wait 10y for Bill to marry her, while living a lifestyle paid for by her parents.
Agreed with all you said Pumpkin fsp, plus that Bill/taxpayer also funded part of her lifestyle before the engagement. See holidays with Bill, some chunks of time living with him but I am unsure of that.
Plus indirectly RPO protection there for Bill during all the time he spent with his new family (a lot of time from what he’s hinted with a lot of appreciation about Carole and Mike) at the Middleton’s house. Catherine Middleton now known as Kate Dolittle and Snowflake and Kannot benefited directly and indirectly from loads of money during the Waiting Years. Plus the fortune that she cost her maternal uncle and parents but that’s another story.
“I am not defending her, I know she has the reputation that she has because of her own wrong-doings. But… since Meghan came into the picture, I find myself really empathizing with Kate.”
I appreciate your saying this. I feel the same way. Obviously, she’s no wallflower to have endured ten years of waitying and now six years of royal life, and I don’t think she’s a victim, but I always felt sorry for Kate living out her mother’s fantasy.
And you may be right about the introvert thing. That faraway look she gets, that staring into space that she does and gets criticized for because people think she’s bored, or not paying attention, or self-absorbed— I recognize that stare. I do the same thing when I’m surrounded by too many people/too much stimulus, even if I’m having fun. It’s an automatic physical response for me, like a recharging/regrouping thing. And yes, the roles of the two women are markedly different and will only diverge more as the years go on.
Her own cousin said it was because she struggles to find interest in other people or to be interested in the world around her. That is not being an introvert, it is having no interest in anyone but herself, what she wants to do, and her immediate circle. As told by one of her own relatives, the university professor.
@notsugarhere What cousin said that? Because i don’t believe it for a minute. If a cousin said that don’t you think they have fallen out and that’s why she would say something like that. Come one…
We don’t need to listen to what her cousin said. Her own actions in the last seven years show that she doesn’t really care to take an interest in people. Has she visited her neighbours at Grenfell Towers yet? Is there a patronage that she has attended more than once and some of them at all this year? She attends a lot of movie premieres and Ben Ainslie events, but she couldn’t even be bothered to attend the St Patrick Day event every single year. Her actions show us that she doesn’t really care about the world around her.
Notok: the cousin wasn’t saying it to be unkind. She said it as a way to praise Kate for being able to withstand her public duties.
She said it immediately after running into Kate at an engagement at Cambridge. Just before Kate announced her first pregnancy. It was the first time William and Kate had visited Cambridge since receiving the title.
William and Kate did a walkabout during which they ran into Kate’s cousin and had a small exchange which was pleasure at meeting and Kate promising the cousin that she would tell Michael Middleton about running into cousin.
As soon as William and Kate left, the media besieged the vousin who was very happy to meet Kate unexpectedly, and shared that bon mot about Kate’s “struggle to be interested in people”. Those were her exact words. Made the news. Video is on youtube.
All these people speaking publicly about Kate aren’t doing so to be unkind. They are usually trying to elicit sympathy and end up revealing information that makes Kate look worse eg taking the Jigsaw job on consition it was flexible enough to allow Kate to be William’s beck and call girl.
That same thought occurred to me as I read down this thread with all the Kate-negative comments.
Meghan is clearly extroverted (compared to Kate’s much more introverted personality). Comparing the two in their abilities is similar to comparing apples and oranges. Queen consort or not, she will never publicly perform in same the way.
@notok – okay, Kate waited on Will for seven years, and still did sweet FA whilst waiting on the ring, and now still does sweet FA. The odd poking one’s head out at the end of the year isn’t enough – not for the privileges the Cambridges enjoy (especially in Food Bank Britain, tbh)
I also feel a bit sorry for her. She strikes me as an introvert and gets drained by being around people. I watched the video with Meghan after one of her auditions and was struck by her energy. More specifically, when she described seeing someone she knew and described it as a ton of fun (or something along those lines). She’s very extroverted and leads me to believe that interview they did wasn’t her being actressy.
I know it seems like a Kate unfriendly site, but maybe a lot of people made it here because on the other sites you can’t say anything critical.
Being an introvert means you aren’t equipped for a public role. The role won’t change. Kate has to change. It is like working to get a job as a vet and getting the job but really you aren’t that good with animals, and you would rather have the vet salary but stay in the office all day.
Never in history has the job been any different. It has always been a role reliant on public approval.
I understand empathy or relating to someone who seems to be getting beat up, and at times it can seem rough, but she was given so much adoration and good will. It didn’t dissipate on its own. If she were married to Linley, now Lord Snowdon it wouldn’t even matter.
Her parents shot higher than her capabilities.
I agree with everything you said. My comment on Celebitchy being “unfriendly” was just out of knowing people will disagree, but still, I am pleasantly surprised by the constructive conversation. And. There is a point to be made and that is: I don’t know anything about the Royals other than what the media in my country and Celebitchy told me. So… I probably am not the one to speak about Kate 🙂 because I believe in the fairytale the media fed me, I am appalled by the “William cheated on her all the time” and I have a tough time believing it! 🙂
I find the comments nicer than the article itself. The articles about Kate have been so tedious and derogatory.
I know croatia.
We wanted a fairytale and I admit I love a good love story.
Where I have sympathy for Kate and a lot of it is she wasn’t given solid loving motherly/fatherly guidance. Kate has suffered from eating problems and her mother threw her in his path without considering if he is a good person or is this path healthy for my child?
My oldest daughter could be president with her personality and she is a leader. So I take that into account with her activities. She needs challenges but places to shine. My feisty daughter needs team activities to learn to work with others, some individual very competitive sports. Room to express her individuality, firm rules but careful not to break her spirit. Some parents would break her to make her mind them all the time. We think it is a strength that needs the right outlets.
My oldest son is a like his father’s mini me and likes to look after everyone and is very mature. Very intelligent and thinks outside of the box, is quieter but is a fantastic athlete and deeply compassionate. He cares very little for material things but can stubbornly hold his feelings inside.
You see what I mean. I can’t push my own wants or needs on them. They have traits that are there already. Being a parent is hard. The hardest part is the emotional work.
magnoliarose, your children are so lucky that you understand them so well and enjoy their individuality rather than try to change them. You sound like a great Mom.
From the time I hit puberty I became more introverted and shy. It dogged me through my 20’s but in my 30’s I got promoted to a position that required public speaking. It was very difficult at first but practice does make perfect and I practiced! Got help from a friend in Toastmasters and was so proud of myself after I made my first presentation to a group at work. It CAN be done but requires work and perseverance.
I remember reading that Carole advised Kate to lose weight as part of the last successful push to get William back (culminating in the lingerie modeling to show him what he was missing.)
Being told at a vulnerable moment that one must *minimize* oneself to be accepted can be a trigger for a life of eating disorders and depression. No wonder there doesn’t seem to be as much to Kate as when she was a healthy schoolgirl playing field hockey. A very sad dynamic, and not worth the trade.
I’m just loving these two at the minute – I was gobsmacked with their public appearance in Nottingham – the week of the engagement! And Meghan handled it brilliantly. It is very unusual to see a royal couple so affectionate with one another – loving it. Long may it last!!
I mean, I think part of it is that, almost a decade on, they’ve realised all the talk of etiquette and ‘princess lessons’ doesn’t exactly help them when they’re pretending to be relatable.
She’ll still have to learn all the etiquette (a lot of it’s fairly odd and arcane and not the kind of stuff you naturally pick up) but they’re just presenting it as a more casual thing.
The etiquette guy in the DM had so many things for MM to change. I could understand some, but when he said her wave to the crowd was too enthusiastic I wanted to scream. She enjoyed the crowd and being in that special moment with Harry. I thought they were lovely together and apart as they both handled the crowd beautifully.
I actually don’t think this engagement will go to marriage.. recent articles have made me side eye Meghan
I’m guessing you also thought they weren’t getting engaged.
Recent articles, no doubt from the Daily Fail, that are 99% fantasy.
You’re really mistaken if you think a couple articles is going to stop a royal engagement. They will get married.
Loool! This little conversation here is so funny! Lool!
Wrecked! lmao
This is such a dumb “competition”. Clearly Meghan and Kate are very different just as Harry and Will are very different. Kate was a lot younger and let’s not pretend they are stepping into equal roles. Kate is a future Queen giving birth to a future King. Meghan and Harry are exciting now, but they’re bound to be a side note in a decade. Who can name Princess Anne’s kids or Prince Edward’s? Kate isn’t a trained, poised actress, but I think it’s clear Will loves her, they’re happy, and she’s doing her job of looking nice and having babies.
I think the one advantage Kate has over Meghan is that she’s British. When national feeling comes into it, I think a Brit will pick a Brit over an American just as an American will pick an American over a Brit.
Nonetheless, it’s always hard for me to tell how many British people actually care that much about the royal family to begin with. I mean, I’m sure they care about the weddings and funerals, etc., but when it comes to Kate vs. Meghan, I can’t see an average Brit actually bothering to discuss this issue in a pub. This seems more line a debate for online discussion.
If Kate will be Queen consort she will have to do more than just have babies. It is Meghan who will have a less public role so at this point Kate should be much better at her job 7 years later. Kate supposedly had princess training at the same time Meghan was acting, so why isn’t Kate currently as good as Meghan was on her first day? Kate hasn’t put in the work and many are trying to excuse that as being shy. No. Shy people can give speeches if they practice and it’s part of their job. Kate has not bothered.
Yes Nic919 all you said +10000000000!!!
Absolutely – Diana was terribly shy and terrified of public speaking but she put her mind to it and got on with the job splendidly. Kate seems permanently stuck at the mental and emotional age of 16.
Anyone who thinks simply having babies is going to be enough or that Meghan and Harry will fade are dreaming. The signals are loud and clear from Charles, TQ and Firm.
They have dropped a lot of protocol for her and didn’t go against tradition just for kicks. Charles can’t stand his own brother and kicked the Yorks out of any chance of meaningful public roles. With good reason as we can see from Andy and Fergie’s tawdry behavior, he doesn’t want them using their daughters for leverage.
If the Middletons have any brains, they will push Kate now because a divorce is not something Bill would hesitate to do IF he felt like it. Everyone else has been divorced, so it is not out of the question.
Maybe they aren’t giving Meghan “Princess lessons” because, as posited above, they don’t really care all that much. She is going to marry the 6th in line. She is a future Sarah Ferguson and Harry is a future Prince Andrew. Give him a few more years, some more hair loss, let Meghan put a step wrong in any way, and the media will be just as vicious as they are/were to Sarah F, who has an advantage over Meghan in that at least she is British.
I think the royals just shrugged, knowing that fighting Harry on this was going to be a losing battle. They will let Meghan sink or swim on her own.
I can easily see William divorcing her if doing so meant preserving the monarchy and his perks. The kids are born, he gets control and there are nannies to help if necessary. The danger for Kate is that is William really does fall for someone who is willing to be the second wife, he would dump Kate in a heartbeat. The scenario already exists with his father, with the children of the first wife in line for the throne, so there is no impediment for this to happen again.
Prince Andrew is genuinely awful. I can’t see Harry ramming his car into a set of closed gates and please let’s hope he’ll never spend time with someone like Jeffrey Epstein. It’s not just bad press that gave Andrew his reputation.
I really hope Harry doesn’t go down that path. And I hope that Meghan has better self-discipline than Fergie.
@nic919. I don’t think William would divorce Kate because of the scrutiny he’d get from the press. I can see them living separate lives or doing something similar to Andrew and Fergie but staying married. I think William is too selfish to sacrifice anything even if he were in love.
I’ve always thought they talked about the Princess Lessons with Kate so that she could never use anything against the royal family like Diana did. Diana claimed she never received any training at all. Thus, when Kate married into the family, they emphasized how much they transitioned her into the family so that in case she ran to the media like Diana did they could always use the Princess lessons as proof. I’ve never thought discussions about the Princess Lessons was a slight on Kate, but rather a way to make sure she could never use ammunition against the royal family like Diana did.
I don’t think the princess lessons exist, they were another smoke screen to hide the laziness of W&K like the “two years off just like Malta” nonsense. Basic info about protocol, that’s it, not months of prep time and practice. Other members of the BRF have said there is no way to train for the job; you learn the job by showing up and doing it.
It has always been made known, and the courtiers made it known about Kate Middleton specifically, that royals set their own work pace. The individual royal decides which invites to accept, which work to do, how hard to work. HM and Charles likely took a hands-off approach, so they couldn’t be held accountable for overworking precious snowflake, but the choice to be lazy from day one was W&K’s personal choice.
I’m not really talking about work ethic or anything like that. Prince William obviously wouldn’t receive Princess Training so I’m not even sure how he’d fit into the discussion. To be honest, I have no idea if Princess Training actually exists. What I mean to say is that I thought the royal family always put out stories about Princess Lessons to protect themselves in case Kate decided to go rogue like Diana did. And, if she did, they could always point out that they did in fact give her training and everything possible to make her comfortable.
If Kate ever decides to tell-all, the royal family has put out every defence to make sure she can’t counter that they weren’t there for her. Diana often said the royal family did nothing to help her. By contrast, with Kate, the royal family has gone out of its way to emphasize the training they’ve given to her. If the marriage ever breaks down, it will be much harder for Kate to claim no one was there for her or that the royal family didn’t try their best to accommodate all of her wishes. The royal family doesn’t want a repeat of what happened with Diana, and I think have effectively countered anything that could be said against them in the future.
I think the spin about training came from W&K’s team, along with the “just going to be a housewife” but rarely living in Wales.
From the HM/Charles palace perspective we’ve gotten silence and a bit of grumbling, not stopping the ridiculous helicopter charade after William sprang it on them, Philip saying in his 90th birthday interview that he wanted to retire (took place a few months after W&K’s wedding, clear signal to please step up which they selfishly ignored for 6 more years), etc.
They can say years later that they put no pressure on W&K; the choice to dither and be this lazy was W&K’s.
I don’t know about Princess lessons other than what I’ve read. Including some blood royals saying there is no preparations or support for the job.
In case that’s true, I think that’s a huge mistake. And it shows. Blood royals do learn how the job it’s done. It’s called education or informal education. You live in an environment, look at how others behave and speak and you learn. By sheer presence in that environment by observing and doing. And some coaching of course.
With married-ins the situation is different. They enter an institution with clearly set and rigid protocols and rules. The basics are from what I see: curtsy according to the Order of Precedence. Call people by their official title. Walk behind those who are higher. Respect hierarchy when you speak. Don’t say controversial things/insult someone. Someone who does not have experience in public speaking should either make the effort or receive coaching. The Danes have mentored the ladies who married in. The Dutch too. Why are the British different? I don’t see Snowflake making requests and I doubt Bill never advised or helped her. Just from looking at his mother’s experience who was thrown in a hole with lions when she was still a teenager!!!! Yet Diana at 19 with no education accomplishments as she herself admitted, spoke a lot lot better than Kate at 30, coming from a solid family and privately educated even at university level. And she has a degree from a top university. Arguments don’t stand. The BRF had they been a company they would have disappeared from the market ages ago.
I think the BRF mentors through joint appearances and always being there for advice – when asked for it. Sophie said something along those lines.
This was from the interview she did for her 50th birthday, with HarpersBazaar UK edition. “It doesn’t matter how tired you are – carry on. In the early days, I used to rush around as quickly as I could, but when you observe the Queen, she does things in such a measured way, and I hope I’ve learnt to try not to bounce into the room, but do things in a slightly more elegant way.“ “The Queen would never let anybody down, and that means that you feel the same way. Because there’s that part of her which I’m sure is like the proverbial stick of rock… the word ‘service’ just runs through her.” “The art of talking meaningfully is one that has to be learnt. It’s hard to make people feel that the conversation you’ve had with them was worthwhile, but the Queen is very good at that – she makes everybody feel very special.”
Princess Lessons seem like such a no-brainer, if I were marrying into that family and hadn’t grown up in the aristo life, my first request would be for someone to fetch me an etiquette coach, protocol guide and history tutor stat! It’s not shameful to admit you need help with the finer points, especially since all the insiders will snark at you if you flub the finer points. But maybe that’s why the newbies are usually left to sink or swim. The family doesn’t recognize what a minefield this kind of stuff is – to them it’s just daily life and they don’t give it a second thought – and all the courtiers are royalty-adjacent snobs who can feel superior when someone from the outside tries to navigate said minefield, and inevitably makes a misstep or two.
I don’t know how it worked with Diana but given what happened with her and Fergie, I bet that Kate and her family (parents and siblings, maybe extended to siblings’ partners) have signed very tough non-disclosure agreements. Plus all the stories that came out throughout the years from royal household staff. It should be a non-brainer. Most job contracts in the West have some sort of confidentiality clause, public jobs but also in the private sector. So I don’t believe that Princess lessons were given to Kate to avoid situations like going out to the press and spilling the beans.
Well I think Meghan has been having some Princess lessons, and the instructor has been none other but HRH the Prince of Wales himself. We know, from that nugget filled engagement interview, that she has met PoW more times than she can remember and they clearly made a distinction between ‘teas’ and ‘meetings’…..ahem!
I have a vision of well set ‘teas’ at Clarence House, possibly at Highgrove too, with a relaxed atmosphere in which Prince Charles makes a huge effort to get to know his future daughter in law ( I bet she did not wear ripped jeans though). The ‘meetings’ would have been a bit more formal, with possibly senior staff present and the PoW explaining the aims and objectives of his charities, how the Duchy of Cornwall works, how she may wish to appoint her own staff, the possibilities of taking over some of the patronages held by the Queen and D of E, the options of a country house gifted by Charles upon their marriage, how her ‘dress allowance’ works……
This is clearly Charles’ opportunity to have more influence over at least one of his sons’ …and clever Camilla no doubt will encourage this all the way.
I agree. The references about the many “teas” was very illuminating. I believe Charles sees the benefit of a royal spouse willing to work and it certainly helps that she brings a bit of diversity to the mix.
I think Charles and Meghan might share some core interests. Social responsibility, organic food and farming, sustainability, etc.
Probably the main difference here is that William and Kate will actually in line to be future King/Queen and Harry/Meghan would fifth in line, so she won’t need as much training since she will NEVER be the Queen.
Elizabeth wasn’t supposed to ever be Queen, either.
I think part of it is Meghan has experience as an actress, but a lot of it is also that by the time she is officially in the family, she will be the wife of the 6th in line to the throne. Kate married the 2nd in line. At the time of W&K’s wedding, Eugenia was in Harry’s position (6th in line). Would anyone have had super high expectations of her spouse in regards to how they handle appearances? Kate is lazy and boring in my mind, but her role is going to be different as future queen.
They’re all required to act professionally and do the job -further down the line doesn’t matter. Go ask all the post-retirement age royals who are working hard, showing up and doing the job professionally, and are no where near the throne.
I think H&M have the best of both worlds. If they play their cards right, they get treated like Anne and Edward/Sophie. Do your engagements, go home to your estate, and have loads of private time out of the limelight because your kids will never be working royals.
Why do you think Harry’s children won’t be working royals, nota? As nieces and nephews of King William, wouldn’t they be expected to pull a lot of weight for the monarchy? They would be closest to the throne after William’s children, wouldn’t they, at least until George has children?
If Charles’s downsizing plan is real? That means they’re moving to a model where only the heir and immediate family are working royals. During Charles’s reign it will be Charles, Camilla, William, Kate, Harry, Megan. Nieces and nephews of Charles-as-king will not be working royals (Beatrice, Eugenie, Zara, Peter, Louise, James).
During William’s (if it ever gets that far), it would be PG Tips, CC, and maybe the youngest but not guaranteed.
Anne’s husbands have never been working royals, Edward and Sophie weren’t supposed to be. The core was supposed to be HM, PP, Charles, Diana, Anne, Andrew, Fergie with the elderly ones gradually retiring (Kent, Gloucester, Princess Alexandra).
Anne, Andrew, and Edward’s kids will not be working royals. Harry’s kids will not be. Nor would CC or youngest’s kids be working royals.
Harry is going to be son of a King, that was never in the cards for Eugenia. Big difference.
Yes but both Eugenie and Beatrice, with all their countless luxurious holidays and mingling with the jet set, have worked more than WK combined. Eugenie at least, the youngest has worked steadily. Beatrice not so much. But still did work on raising awareness on health issues, HIV, abandoned children, fundraising etc. They have an appalling sense of fashion but are well spoken and want to work. Charles cut them off because of his rift with Andrew and Fergie, well deserved I will say! But both B and E are more deserving than WK altogether!
I don’t love the way they keep throwing out the word actress and “perform” like Meghan is faking it or pretending. She did quite a bit of charity work and made public speeches and I think her new “role” is actually very well suited to her in the respect that she is confident and comfortable mingling and being personable with people and speaking publicly. She was one of those “celebrities” that kind of got that it was less about her/the art and more about the fans and giving them what they wanted, and its translating well for her now. she’s going to be good at the game I think.
Because royals are required to perform and some are very bad at it. Meghan will be better from the get go.
Meghan is a natural public figure due to her career background and personality. The learning curve will be shorter. I also think Meghan is much more aggressive and gung ho than waitey katie and thus will take risks and get ahead faster and be more popular (also more controversial)
I always thought the princess training was just an excuse for her to do the bare minimum. Here we are years are yrs later and she still does the bare minimum. Either you have it or don’t. Some people just aren’t great in public and that’s fine. Now will it be fine 20 or 30 yrs down the road when she has to step into queen consort role? Who knows. Maybe George will not be like his parents and will be successful by stepping into those public shoes by then.
With how things look now, I have no hope for George. He’s too young to have shown anything other what a happy healthy young boy does. Unfortunately by the time he will become an adult, most of the important hard working key figures in his life especially TQ and the DoE will have passed away. Charles would be a good example to follow but Charles himself complained about not spending time with his grandchildren. Bill is a bad example too, not to speak of Kate. Who would be a good teacher and example and adviser to George as he grows up? Big, big sigh.
But from whom will George (and Char) learn HOW to do the job? If Will and Kate aren’t stepping up to the plate sufficiently, it’s a no-go. Will the only hope would be that George bonds with Charles to learn the ins and outs of the job?
Kate had all that time and still she forgot to hem her skirts.
I loved Meghan’s outfit with the long skirt and boots of a few days ago.
Kate really is incredibly boring. Lovely to look at but that’s about it.
Meghan and Harry as a team are vibrant. Wills and Kate are not.
Will be interesting to see how this all plays out.
One thing I’ve also wondered about royal work (or whatever it’s called) is how much of it do we see? I always assumed that there was quite a bit of preparation that went into each public engagement, so we might see a couple of hours of smiling for the cameras, but we don’t see a lot of work picking the charity, discussion of the best way for the charity to have an impact, practicing speeches, studying the people they are meeting, etc. But I really have no idea. Is all the behind the scenes work done by other ppl so Kate (or whoever) is really just supposed to show up and smile? Or does a couple hours of public work really mean several days of behind the scenes work?
I think there is behind-the-scenes work. I’ve seen this on documentaries on various members of the royal family. Maybe how much behind-the-scenes work you do depends on how much you put into it. But in one of the documentaries on Diana and Charles, there was footage of them sitting down at a meeting. Whether this is interesting work, I have no idea, but it does seem like discussions have to take place to make sure mistakes don’t happen.
Whether Kate and William put in the kind of effort in meetings that Diana and Charles seemed to have done, I have no idea either.
Diana and Charles did seem like the type of people who get easily bored if they weren’t actually doing something during their day, I think. I personally can’t imagine doing nothing all day. I don’t know if I’d like the pressure of constantly having to look good, but to do nothing at all all day seems mind-numbing. I suppose Kate and William spend a lot of time….on exercise? They do both look fit, so I imagine a large portion of the day must be devoted to that.
There are many gyms open from 7am up until 11pm in my part of the world. And WK have a gym in KP. No excuse. Wake up at 5 am and fit your gym sessions around your work schedule, not the other way around. There are private instructors available with rates from EUR 100 per hour or more that will be at your door at 4:50 am to start your workout at 5am. In what world do working people work out from 7am to 7pm, commute included, except for lunch time? And eat lunch at their desk afterward?
Chisey, I think that it depends on the case. Let me imagine something on different scenarios.
The Duchess of Cambridge takes part at the event in London in the year 2017. At the minimum she will need a few hours to prepare with hair and make up and get dressed. I’d say 3 hours at most for that. She has nothing to do about security because the Met police is in charge of that. She gets to the event and it takes one hour. Previously she received a briefing with the description of the event, who she will meet. It shouldn’t take more than say 2 hours to get an idea.
1. The event is the opening of an art exhibition and takes two hours. One needs no steady prep to shake hands. If one learns to do it properly say in 2011 there is no need for more practice before this specific event. That’s a basics that she should have learned throughout her life so far too. Middle-class family, private education, Princess lessons. So far, shaking hands, smiling and saying hello and chitchat. No big deal for someone in her position. Maybe a few minutes for photos, it depends. Some prior prep before that to last a life time.
2. The Duchess reads a speech. Now there are two things: delivery of the speech clearly and in a way that it’s convincing to the audience to convey certain messages. Without distractions like flipping her hair. Making pauses and connecting to the audience through eye contact. Maybe starting with an icebreaker. Delivering the speech would take about 5 or 10 minutes at most. How long it would take for her to prepare? I don’t know. If she knows what she’s doing (having learned and practiced since 2011) it should take a few hours to rehearse. And deliver the message well. That would be the point.
The second thing is: has she researched and made the speech herself? With someone reviewing and correcting it. There are professional discourse/speech writers out there. A degree in Arts from St. Andrews does not necessarily mean that one would be able to do it right, not that it wouldn’t be expected that most graduates with good results are able to write a pretty good one. The audience are not all experts so no high degree of expertise is required. How long does it take to research and write a speech in Arts, a field in which the Duchess has a degree in? A light, descriptive piece. Not analytical. It used to take me about 20 hours for writing from scratch around 3000 words. In English as a foreign language. Yes, I did an international programme in English. That’s for grades and exams. To the Duchess? I don’t know. I am sure she does not do anything except for reading it a few times and practicing, well I don’t know for how long because seven years on she can’t even articulate her words.
And I could go on.
It depends on the royal. The charity does most of the work, then call in the royal to do their event. Some royals want more than a photo op and will write ask for detailed information about the charity + informal ie no media visits and others are contented to just do the photo ops and no more.
From the little that has leaked out, many are involved, but William and Kate are not involved at all. Their office might convene a meeting at KP or at charity HQ, but they only stay long enough for the photo ops and off they go. Yet their PR and CC will record their 10mins or less photo op as an engagement measured on a par with ones where the royal stayed for hours and had a proper discussion.
William is both lazy AND shameless that he admitted not reading his criff notes whilst on tour in Canada, to a charity he was visiting and was therefore surprised to be told by the charity that they had links to his mother’s Glasgow based charity. So much for honouring his mother!!!
Exactly, it is just a role for a professional actress and she will ‘perform with aplomb’. The compliments in that article are only for the way she ‘performed’ / the image she projected, and not for herself as a person. She will have to perform for the Royal Family, her personality won’t matter.
If Sofia can marry Carl Phillip and do well in the Swedish Royal Family then Meghan can definitely marry Harry and do well in the British Royal Family.
Jessica, CP and Sophia are not looking as loved up as they used to be, I give it 3 years before everything about that relationship goes south!
Kate is just so complicated.
I’m not a Kate apologist (at *all*) but I do kind of agree with what A Croatian said above, about starting to feel some empathy for her since Meghan has arrived on the scene.
From a gossip-reader’s POV, I’m loving all of the comparisons, etc. But as a human being, I feel a bit sorry for Kate because she simply doesn’t have the “It factor” that Meghan does and I think she will always be found lacking.
Yes, it’s true that she’s going to be Queen Consort and is already mother to a future king, but that isn’t really helpful when the media is inundating the world NOW with all of the competition-type articles.
I don’t know. I just think people are so different; some are stronger than others and some have better coping skills than others and Kate clearly struggles (as do I). I was also terrified of speaking in public, but had to for my job. So I practiced and got through it — but I didn’t have the cameras of the world on me, and people watching it on YouTube for years afterward and picking apart my every word and movement! Yes, Kate should have known this was part of the job she signed up for, but I think it is possible that in theory, she thought she could handle it — it convinced herself that she could — until it comes time to actually do it, and then she just freezes.
I also think it’s possible that Kate was more outgoing in her younger years but due to the stress of her current position, now suffers from anxiety. The ability to be super outgoing in some situations but severely anxious in others can co-exist in the same person (I’m living proof of this). JMO
I am far more a natural Kate than a Meghan. Introverted. Severe social anxiety, If I never had to make a public speech I would love it.
But I have to present all the time and I have learned to be competent at it, if not a total natural.
Kate doesn’t have to manufacture the “it” factor. She could go the Princess Anne route: work hard and be competent.
Kate could still up her game. There are professional directors and trainers who would kill to take her on as a client and the would be hugely helpful to her. Diana had to turn to Attenborough to get public speaking advice and he did wonders for her.
William should have done for Kate what Harry did for Meghan: sit her down, seriously, and say this is what will be required of you. Consider that carefully before you agree to take on the job.
Because it is as much a job as it is a marriage.
I think William did her a disservice because he did not explain this to her and in his attempts to shelter her, and his own belief in avoiding work as much as possible, he has put her in a position where 7 years later she is still unprepared for her job.
I also agree that she doesn’t need to be a perfect public speaker if she just grinds out the numbers like Princess Anne does.
I am pretty sure Harry is forcing Meghan on his family. I do not think they genuinely support his choice of a bride. Charles lack of enthusiasm about is son’s proposal was very telling.
I also think its instresting that a few blinds about her being disliked by Will, Kate, Charles, and the Queen came out as well. She is pals with Lainy and has leaked some stuff about Kate to her. I really dislike that about her.
Harry barely knows this woman. They have only been dating a year( and it was long distance dating BTW) and is rushing to marry this woman. I have a feeling they won’t make it to the wedding.
It doesn’t matter in the end. Kate will be the one wearing the Queens tiaras and jewels and Meghan will get the hand-me downs. She will never be as popular or liked as Kate.
Laughing out loud.
I am not sure why it’s hard to take any of this at face value. Harry loves her, both sides of his family are onboard and supportive, and she will have a minimal transition and training for the public aspects of the job, because she is “camera ready”.
There is no way ndication she is being forced on anyone.
I am not sure why it’s hard to take any of this at face value. Harry loves her, both sides of his family are onboard and supportive, and she will have a minimal transition and training for the public aspects of the job, because she is “camera ready”.
They have lived together for partial weeks for over a year.
There is no indication she is being forced on anyone.
Ok how do you know Meghan “leaked” info about Kate to Lainey? Also, what makes you think Meghan even wants to become Queen? Why are we putting her up against Kate anyways? Do we ever put Will up against Harry? Do we ever say Harry is jealous of Will because Will gets to become King? Come on now. I like Meghan and I think the royal family likes her too. There is no reason to believe they don’t. She isn’t beneath Harry and they seem to make a good match.
Pure fiction.
the only thing that rings true here is that meghan has a connection to lainey – via the mulroneys. jessica is meghan’s bff & ben works with lainey @ etalk.
doubt that there is any truth to meghan not being accepted by the royals tho
I think The Firm wants Harry to marry someone who is willing and able to do the job. Check.
They want Harry married and with family, either for his personal happiness or PR. Check.
Charles would be thrilled to gain a daughter-in-law who shares some of his interests, especially if he ends up getting to be part of these grandchildren’s lives (unlike being all but cut-off from W&K’s kids).
Royalty isn’t a popularity contest, and clearly the bloom is off the rose that is Kate Middleton for many. If royals are going to exist, people like it when royals show up and work. It doesn’t matter if they are boring (Mathilde and Philippe come to mind) as long as they show up.
All the royal jewels are hand-me-downs, so I doubt anyone is upset about who wears what sparkly rocks. Except Sophie and her disastrous wedding tiara, which was HM using items from Queen Victoria and thinking she could design tiaras. She cannot as evidenced by the three disasters she has created.
I don’t think Harry or Meghan care where they end up in the Order of Precedence. They’re getting the best of both worlds. Getting to be part of the Firm, hopefully doing good work, but not having to do the politics. Going home and getting loads of private time like Princess Anne. Plus from what was said in their engagement interview, it sounds like Charles might be having them focus on The Commonwealth as their specialty. Australia, Barbados, Belize, Santa Lucia, Canada, NZ. Not a bad gig at all.
Both Charles and Camilla (especially) said nice things about the engagement and Meghan becoming part of the family.
Harry made clear in the engagement interview that they never went more than two weeks without seeing each other, and spend loads of time together at KP and Windsor. As LAK has pointed out, there was a type of injunction against photographing her and Harry may have been picking her up out-of-sight of the media at the airport. They appear to have spent far, far more time together in the last 18 months than any of us might think.
@NASH
It’s very smart to pivot M&H to the Commonwealth; they’ll both do great there. So I guess they will be spending months at a time in Australia and Canada.
OH ! You must know them personally then?
For astrology folks: At the most basic level Meghan is a Leo and Kate is a Capricorn, & they seem to embody those archetypes. Kate will come into her own in her forties probably and will embody the monarchy. Meghan is the sun and thrives on public attention and affirmation. She projects warmth–is warm. Kate is Saturn and is associated with rules and restrictions and old age. Many Capricorn women are very insecure until they figure out their strengths, and that can come later in life. Cap women are the classic late bloomers and play the long game; everything Kate is vilified for is classic Capricorn behavior.
Just like Kate i’m a Capricorn too and I can definitely identify with those Capricorn traits that you have mentioned. I also see a lot of classic Capricorn traits in Kate too. I’m just hoping (more so for my sake) you are right about Cappies being late bloomers!
whatever,
Work hard & you’ll do well. Caps have to work hard to find “luck.”
If we’re going with astrology? Capricorns can also be known as self-centered, detached, snobby, apathetic, obsessed with status, and have a superiority (not inferiority) complex.
Silvia of Sweden, Princess Alexandra (both Capricorns). Sophie Wessex and Queen Mathilde (Cappy/Aqua cusps). None of those women waited until their mid-life to go out into the world and accomplish things, either on their own or in their royal roles.
The superiority vibe is a mask for inner doubt and an inferiority complex notasugarhere. I was trying to give Kate the benefit of the doubt. I said “many” Caps not “all.” I mean Sade, Twigs & Kate Moss were young successful Caps, so I’m aware.
Sometimes it is, like my brother the cappy. Other times, it is an ingrained sense of superiority, that they have the right to lord it over everyone.
Barack Obama is a Leo and Michelle is a Cap. I think Kate and Meghan will get along just fine.
Just want to address what some people have said about “Americans are subservient to no one!” in regards to curtseying, walking etiquette, and the like:
Uh, yeah, we are. From corporate etiquette towards those further up the hierarchy to our military (salutes render honour to those who outrank us, just one example) we have plenty of examples of “acknowledging higher rank.” We just don’t usually call it that. I’m sure Meghan knows her own worth, and that it in no way lessens her to show courtesy with a curtsy.
I hate the whole bowing thing but if Meghan takes BRF money then she should observe BRF courtesies. She can’t be above it if she’s willing to take the money.
I disagree. Soldiers salute to those who have EARNED higher rank through hard work and discipline. We don’t bow down to anyone just because of the uterus they came from. We got rid of that crap in 1787.
And I guess she has given up everything else – she might as well curtsy and give up her dignity.
During the interview, Meghan said something along the lines of Catherine being “wonderful.” I don’t get why it’s assumed, at this stage anyway, why they’d potentially dislike each other. Maybe years down the line, I could see a rivalry, but at present neither has said anything bad about the either.
Sure, she’s an actor, and that will help her perform princess duties. But we can all name actors who behave obnoxiously when not in front of a camera. Let’s give Meghan due credit for appearing to be smart, curious, happy and well spoken. I think she’s a bright light and a perfect companion for Harry. If it’s all an act she should get an Oscar.